Dr Thon offers tips on how to protect oneself from box jellyfish attacks

[cumgranosalum]

A more efficient solution would be to stop overfishing the offshore waters. Sharks and especially sea turtles eat jellyfish. Unfortuatelyrying to explain natural predation as a means of controlling pests is not something Thais understand.

No that's not true. Obviously the gulf is virtually devoid of fish, but the issue of stingers and fish eatin' em is not relevant. Stingers exist.

Stinger are part of the bio-system.....changes in that can cause changes in their population, changes in climate can also cause changes in population..

As yet it is not known for sure if the population is on the increase or whether it is simply an increase in numbers of people in the water and better reporting......the box jelly's "territory" has always included coastal Thailand.

One of the main predators for grown jellyfish is turtles...whether or not this has any significance on the Box Jelly population I don't know for sure......but these animals (Box Jellies) spawn in estuaries that are nurseries for young fish that would prey on them...unfortunately these populations are dwindling do to destruction of mangroves - this maty well cause an imbalance in Box Jelly/predator ratios, thus allowing more to enter the sea around the coastline.

[Basil B]

Box jellyfish are amongst the deadliest creatures known to man. I had always wondered why there was only ever a mention about them being present in parts of coastal northern Australia, to the point that especially during the summer wet season most beaches north of about Broome in Western Australia all the way down to roughly the Tropic of Capricorn coast on the east coast near Rockhampton was off-limits to swimmers.

And strangely I always wondered why one could still swim in most of nearby Indonesia and that the box jellyfish wouldn't migrate there? Or was it a case of differences in wildlife protection? Or different attitudes towards protecting people (e.g. in Indonesia they don't care if you get stung so it's up to you to take the risk, whereas in Australia you are obliged to follow the directions of the authorities).

Then I started hearing about box jellyfish being a problem in Hawaii, for example at the famous Waikiki beach. Yet most of the time, it seems safe to swim there. Because one does not hear about the presence of box jellyfish safety nets there.

Or is the threat of box jellyfish so much greater in northern Australian waters than in Hawaii that can explain that?

Now for the first time ever, I am reading that in fact, box jellyfish are present in Thai waters. Yet one doesn't hear much news of deaths, which you would normally expect in a developing country to be far greater than in a developed country like Australia. Not to mention the relatively large population that lives along the coast of affected Thai waters.

Case in point - a species of cobra snake of only moderate toxicity is found in Myanmar (and Thailand) and is the cause of dozens of deaths annually, particularly amongst rice planters during the monsoon season. Yet the far more deadlier fierce snake found in parts of the south-eastern deserts of Australia has not caused one human fatality to date, largely due to the distribution of that snake being outside of human population areas. The poor ambulance system coupled with rural poverty and lack of anti-venom are perhaps the principal reasons behind the spate of deaths that occur in Myanmar due to the bite of this cobra annually, compared to the west, where these are not issues.

The box jellyfish I believe has caused around 70 deaths in Australia to date, since the early 1900s. Why does one not hear about hundreds of deaths in that time, in Thailand? Or is it simply a case of the statistics not being publicly available? Please if someone has statistics for box jellyfish fatalities in Thailand, as well as the overall prevelance in Thai waters I'd like to see it. Articles can also be in Thai (I am fluent in Thai).

First reports of Box Jelly migrating to Thai Waters dates back to 2008...

To my knowledge there have been two deaths on Koh Phangan in two years...

[Sviss Geez]

A more efficient solution would be to stop overfishing the offshore waters. Sharks and especially sea turtles eat jellyfish. Unfortuatelyrying to explain natural predation as a means of controlling pests is not something Thais understand.

No that's not true. Obviously the gulf is virtually devoid of fish, but the issue of stingers and fish eatin' em is not relevant. Stingers exist.

"Obviously the gulf is virtually devoid of fish..."

Neither is that true. Obviously.

[Basil B]

Sorry to cross post but I feel this is very appropriate here:

Having read read shocky's post in http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/845146-box-jellyfish-sting-kills-woman-in-koh-pha-ngan/?p=9691569

I note:

I feel very bad for her best friend that went with her on that trip and was with her in the ambulance when she died in her arms. This is a terrible tragedy...

I ask one question do Thai Ambulances not carry ventilators and AED's (automated external defibrillator)?

the point is you do not expect a person who put in an ambulance alive without major trauma to be DOA if the ambulance is carrying an ventilator and AED.

[cumgranosalum]

Box jellyfish are amongst the deadliest creatures known to man. I had always wondered why there was only ever a mention about them being present in parts of coastal northern Australia, to the point that especially during the summer wet season most beaches north of about Broome in Western Australia all the way down to roughly the Tropic of Capricorn coast on the east coast near Rockhampton was off-limits to swimmers.

And strangely I always wondered why one could still swim in most of nearby Indonesia and that the box jellyfish wouldn't migrate there? Or was it a case of differences in wildlife protection? Or different attitudes towards protecting people (e.g. in Indonesia they don't care if you get stung so it's up to you to take the risk, whereas in Australia you are obliged to follow the directions of the authorities).

Then I started hearing about box jellyfish being a problem in Hawaii, for example at the famous Waikiki beach. Yet most of the time, it seems safe to swim there. Because one does not hear about the presence of box jellyfish safety nets there.

Or is the threat of box jellyfish so much greater in northern Australian waters than in Hawaii that can explain that?

Now for the first time ever, I am reading that in fact, box jellyfish are present in Thai waters. Yet one doesn't hear much news of deaths, which you would normally expect in a developing country to be far greater than in a developed country like Australia. Not to mention the relatively large population that lives along the coast of affected Thai waters.

Case in point - a species of cobra snake of only moderate toxicity is found in Myanmar (and Thailand) and is the cause of dozens of deaths annually, particularly amongst rice planters during the monsoon season. Yet the far more deadlier fierce snake found in parts of the south-eastern deserts of Australia has not caused one human fatality to date, largely due to the distribution of that snake being outside of human population areas. The poor ambulance system coupled with rural poverty and lack of anti-venom are perhaps the principal reasons behind the spate of deaths that occur in Myanmar due to the bite of this cobra annually, compared to the west, where these are not issues.

The box jellyfish I believe has caused around 70 deaths in Australia to date, since the early 1900s. Why does one not hear about hundreds of deaths in that time, in Thailand? Or is it simply a case of the statistics not being publicly available? Please if someone has statistics for box jellyfish fatalities in Thailand, as well as the overall prevelance in Thai waters I'd like to see it. Articles can also be in Thai (I am fluent in Thai).

First reports of Box Jelly migrating to Thai Waters dates back to 2008...

To my knowledge there have been two deaths on Koh Phangan in two years...

No - the box jelly has ALWAYS lived in these waters

THere are also several species - some of which are deadly......I would check and see if the Hawaii species is the same as the Aussie one and then if the environment is the same....which of course it isn't - so there are a myriad reasons for differences in population size and occurrence of incidents.

[cumgranosalum]

Sorry to cross post but I feel this is very appropriate here:

Having read read shocky's post in http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/845146-box-jellyfish-sting-kills-woman-in-koh-pha-ngan/?p=9691569

I note:

I feel very bad for her best friend that went with her on that trip and was with her in the ambulance when she died in her arms. This is a terrible tragedy...

I ask one question do Thai Ambulances not carry ventilators and AED's (automated external defibrillator)?

the point is you do not expect a person who put in an ambulance alive without major trauma to be DOA if the ambulance is carrying an ventilator and AED.

There is no central standard ambulance system in Thailand they carry what they like......- this is one of the reasons you should avoid their healthcare system

[cumgranosalum]

A lot of the confusion around this is because of the different species. However vinegar seems to be the most effective and ice seems to be ok for minor stings to relieve pain and if there are no stingers. First advice is best...don't swim and if you do wear a stinger suit but I cannot see either of those bits of advice being followed here in Thailand by Tourists or locals.

I think it is pertinent that most "locals" when they go in the water are fully clothed.....

[CrummyJuggler]

Swim in your street clothes like the locals do. Wear your jeans into the surf. Now i understand.

[cumgranosalum]

Box jellyfish are amongst the deadliest creatures known to man. I had always wondered why there was only ever a mention about them being present in parts of coastal northern Australia, to the point that especially during the summer wet season most beaches north of about Broome in Western Australia all the way down to roughly the Tropic of Capricorn coast on the east coast near Rockhampton was off-limits to swimmers.

And strangely I always wondered why one could still swim in most of nearby Indonesia and that the box jellyfish wouldn't migrate there? Or was it a case of differences in wildlife protection? Or different attitudes towards protecting people (e.g. in Indonesia they don't care if you get stung so it's up to you to take the risk, whereas in Australia you are obliged to follow the directions of the authorities).

Then I started hearing about box jellyfish being a problem in Hawaii, for example at the famous Waikiki beach. Yet most of the time, it seems safe to swim there. Because one does not hear about the presence of box jellyfish safety nets there.

Or is the threat of box jellyfish so much greater in northern Australian waters than in Hawaii that can explain that?

Now for the first time ever, I am reading that in fact, box jellyfish are present in Thai waters. Yet one doesn't hear much news of deaths, which you would normally expect in a developing country to be far greater than in a developed country like Australia. Not to mention the relatively large population that lives along the coast of affected Thai waters.

Case in point - a species of cobra snake of only moderate toxicity is found in Myanmar (and Thailand) and is the cause of dozens of deaths annually, particularly amongst rice planters during the monsoon season. Yet the far more deadlier fierce snake found in parts of the south-eastern deserts of Australia has not caused one human fatality to date, largely due to the distribution of that snake being outside of human population areas. The poor ambulance system coupled with rural poverty and lack of anti-venom are perhaps the principal reasons behind the spate of deaths that occur in Myanmar due to the bite of this cobra annually, compared to the west, where these are not issues.

The box jellyfish I believe has caused around 70 deaths in Australia to date, since the early 1900s. Why does one not hear about hundreds of deaths in that time, in Thailand? Or is it simply a case of the statistics not being publicly available? Please if someone has statistics for box jellyfish fatalities in Thailand, as well as the overall prevelance in Thai waters I'd like to see it. Articles can also be in Thai (I am fluent in Thai).

think the actual number of snake bites in Oz and Thailand are either the same or the same per capita - the difference is the speed and effectiveness of treatement.

THi8s also my have a bearing in cases of Jellyfish - the notable lack of emergency services in Thailand.

[CALSinCM]

Four years of college and Masters degree and a Doctoral degree, and this 'expert' comes up with exactly what someone with an IQ over 60 should know. Check where you're gonna swim, especially if you can get a look from above, such as a pier, and if in any doubt at all - don't swim in the water, and if you really want to swim, suit up - 3mm wet suit should be sufficient, you just don't want exposed skin. And 'attack'? That makes it sound like a tiger, alligator, or other predators with higher level brains where humans may be considered prey and actually targeted. More like an unfortunate meeting with an animal that has stinging tentacles to kill and eat fish. You're swimming in it's natural habitat, you meet, it does what it's built to do - sting. It's not like a box jellyfish has much in the way of a brain. More like a nervous system set on autopilot.

[CALSinCM]

Box jellyfish are amongst the deadliest creatures known to man. I had always wondered why there was only ever a mention about them being present in parts of coastal northern Australia, to the point that especially during the summer wet season most beaches north of about Broome in Western Australia all the way down to roughly the Tropic of Capricorn coast on the east coast near Rockhampton was off-limits to swimmers.

And strangely I always wondered why one could still swim in most of nearby Indonesia and that the box jellyfish wouldn't migrate there? Or was it a case of differences in wildlife protection? Or different attitudes towards protecting people (e.g. in Indonesia they don't care if you get stung so it's up to you to take the risk, whereas in Australia you are obliged to follow the directions of the authorities).

Then I started hearing about box jellyfish being a problem in Hawaii, for example at the famous Waikiki beach. Yet most of the time, it seems safe to swim there. Because one does not hear about the presence of box jellyfish safety nets there.

Or is the threat of box jellyfish so much greater in northern Australian waters than in Hawaii that can explain that?

Now for the first time ever, I am reading that in fact, box jellyfish are present in Thai waters. Yet one doesn't hear much news of deaths, which you would normally expect in a developing country to be far greater than in a developed country like Australia. Not to mention the relatively large population that lives along the coast of affected Thai waters.

Case in point - a species of cobra snake of only moderate toxicity is found in Myanmar (and Thailand) and is the cause of dozens of deaths annually, particularly amongst rice planters during the monsoon season. Yet the far more deadlier fierce snake found in parts of the south-eastern deserts of Australia has not caused one human fatality to date, largely due to the distribution of that snake being outside of human population areas. The poor ambulance system coupled with rural poverty and lack of anti-venom are perhaps the principal reasons behind the spate of deaths that occur in Myanmar due to the bite of this cobra annually, compared to the west, where these are not issues.

The box jellyfish I believe has caused around 70 deaths in Australia to date, since the early 1900s. Why does one not hear about hundreds of deaths in that time, in Thailand? Or is it simply a case of the statistics not being publicly available? Please if someone has statistics for box jellyfish fatalities in Thailand, as well as the overall prevelance in Thai waters I'd like to see it. Articles can also be in Thai (I am fluent in Thai).

What would you be more concerned about?

1. Swimming in the sea and being killed by a box jellyfish; or

2. Using any form of ground transportation in Thailand (car, bus, train, bike, motorcycle, walk) and being killed in an accident.

I think I'll enjoy my swim.

[bboy]

Cheers doc. Lifesaver ledge. I wouldn't have thought to shout for help or get to a hospital asap. PHD-doctorate-in-common-sense-lad

[jasonsamui55]

Where have been confirmed sightings/attacks in Thailand? Koh Phangan? Koh Samui? Others? And the article says to avoid rainy season. When specifically is the start and end of rainy season on Samui and Phangan? I've heard many dates saying from May to November or September to November. I know the dates would be different than in Bangkok or most of the rest of the mainland.

[mojorison]

A more efficient solution would be to stop overfishing the offshore waters. Sharks and especially sea turtles eat jellyfish. Unfortuatelyrying to explain natural predation as a means of controlling pests is not something Thais understand.

No that's not true. Obviously the gulf is virtually devoid of fish, but the issue of stingers and fish eatin' em is not relevant. Stingers exist.

Stinger are part of the bio-system.....changes in that can cause changes in their population, changes in climate can also cause changes in population..

As yet it is not known for sure if the population is on the increase or whether it is simply an increase in numbers of people in the water and better reporting......the box jelly's "territory" has always included coastal Thailand.

One of the main predators for grown jellyfish is turtles...whether or not this has any significance on the Box Jelly population I don't know for sure......but these animals (Box Jellies) spawn in estuaries that are nurseries for young fish that would prey on them...unfortunately these populations are dwindling do to destruction of mangroves - this maty well cause an imbalance in Box Jelly/predator ratios, thus allowing more to enter the sea around the coastline.

Yes I understand what you are saying, my point was along the lines that on the far north coast (QLD) of Oz, there are millions of Irakanji, box jellies and blue bottles, and the seas are teeming with sharks, turtles, sea mammals, fish, and crocodiles. They will exist in waters regardless of predation. The presence in Thailand of box jellies, has been known for years, however they are more of an anomaly than a regular occurrence, and therefore little is documented of their lifestyle. Is their habitat and migration/predation system changing as the earth melts down? Probably, I'd have no idea. But if someone asks me if it safe to swim, I tell them that it is a million to one chance. I can recall 4 people dying in the past 30 years.

[mojorison]

Where have been confirmed sightings/attacks in Thailand? Koh Phangan? Koh Samui? Others? And the article says to avoid rainy season. When specifically is the start and end of rainy season on Samui and Phangan? I've heard many dates saying from May to November or September to November. I know the dates would be different than in Bangkok or most of the rest of the mainland.

The raIny season starts in October and runs through to New year. There is 6 weeks of heavy monsoonal weather in this 3 month period. The peak monsoonal tide is in late December. In a regular year, new years is fine, however it can rain deep into January.

[jasonsamui55]

Thanks. Is that for Samui and Phangan?

Last year in Samui it rained non stop for the entire period of mid-September until late November, and then by around the 3rd week of November, all the rains stopped and there was nothing for several weeks and hardly any rain at all from late November until April.

When you say The peak monsoonal tide is in late December., is that the time that is most likely to have these box jellyfish?

[PETERTHEEATER]

So, box jellyfish are aggressive and attack without provocation?

[mojorison]

Thanks. Is that for Samui and Phangan?

Last year in Samui it rained non stop for the entire period of mid-September until late November, and then by around the 3rd week of November, all the rains stopped and there was nothing for several weeks and hardly any rain at all from late November until April.

When you say The peak monsoonal tide is in late December., is that the time that is most likely to have these box jellyfish?

Yeah the last 3 years have been very dry, with hardly any rain falling in the 3rd month of monsoon, hence the droughts we've been having. The peak tides are on the 2 or 3 days before the new moon, where the water will rise to about 1.9 meters (measured from Nathon I think? October about 1.85m, November about 1.87m and December about 1.9m))above the lowest of the low mark (which I reckon is about now). So there is no accurate appraisal that can be made of their presence other than saying that it is very rare, and anomalous. Someone died a few days ago, the other 3 people (Italian or french kid, and perhaps a Dutch woman and a Moroccan (?) women from about 10 years ago) so seasonally this event and the other 3 could not have occurred at 2 such completely opposed times seasonally. (Now we have the extreme low tide, Xmas, the opposite)... so who is to know. The only total solution is full cover up in the sea, swimming pool, or don't swim. But it is literally one in a million. I think it is probably shrewd not to swim at the same beach, at the same time on the same night, or nights around it. And of course, in Hadrin on the night after there was a single A4 hand scrawled sign saying you might want to be careful. I don't know, don't have the answer, but I'm concerned a bit because it is on my doorstep.

[ozyjon]

As an avid surfer, from a very young age, we nippers

approached the surf in Australia cautiously, we studied

the wave patterns, counted the wave sets, located the

rip and lastly before jumping into the surf i would walk

up and down the beach looking at the sand looking for

blue bottles, any jellyfish, if i saw anything i would not

enter the water, i have experienced the pain it hurts.

[boomerangutang]

well, at least we don't have electric eels or that other Amazonian: a tiny fish that darts up a man's pee pee hole and lodges in there. Ouch.

[limbos]

So, box jellyfish are aggressive and attack without provocation?

Box jelly fish are not aggressive and they do not attack. You may end up being entangled in their tentacles though.

By no means do box jelly fish attack however!

[Felt 35]

Dr Thon’s basic advice is to refrain from swimming in the sea during the rainy season and if it is resistible swim where there are waves and to cover oneself with body swimsuit or stinger suit which is very expensive.

Once attacked by a box jellyfish, shout for help and do not wave away the creatures with your hands which will result to more contacts with the creatures’ tentacles. Walk slowly out of the spot where one was attacked and head for the beach as quickly as possible.

Check the wounds to see if they look like burns, then rush to the nearest hospital quickly. But while waiting to be sent to a hospital, splash water on the body or limbs where they were attacked with sea water until the poisonous stings are removed.

Do not apply fresh water, urine, alcohol or liquor to the areas attacked by the creatures as the poison will spread and worsen.

If the poisonous stings are removed, the pains will subside in 5-10 minutes after which apply ice on the wounds. Serious symptoms normally happen during the first ten minutes after an attack after which there is little chance of death, said Dr Thon.

eh..... are they serious..............Chironex fleckeri one species of box jelly........ an untreated victim may die in two to five minutes........

[wow64]

The best thing to do is pee/wee on someone who has been stung by a box jelly fish.. Also pee on their friends also.

Sent from my c64

[limbos]

Where have been confirmed sightings/attacks in Thailand? Koh Phangan? Koh Samui? Others? And the article says to avoid rainy season. When specifically is the start and end of rainy season on Samui and Phangan? I've heard many dates saying from May to November or September to November. I know the dates would be different than in Bangkok or most of the rest of the mainland.

Confirmed sightings have been observed at Khao Lak, Phuket, Krabi, Koh Lanta and Koh Racha Yai at the Andaman side (including Langkawi in Malaysia).

The Gulf had confirmed sightings on Koh Samui, Koh Phangan, Koh Tao, Hua Hin, Chaam, Pattaya and koh Mak.

Fatalities have been at Koh Lanta, Koh Phangan, Koh Samui and Chaam.

Recorded sightings in Thailand go back to the 1990's and very likely the box jelly fish have been around for much longer, although documentation is not available.

The attached picture is already a few years old but still valid;

[limbos]

The best thing to do is pee/wee on someone who has been stung by a box jelly fish.. Also pee on their friends also.

Sent from my c64

That's complete nonsense with respect to box jelly fish stings and is strongly advised against doing this in case of a box jelly fish sting. Use of vinegar is advised!

[casualbiker]

The best thing to do is pee/wee on someone who has been stung by a box jelly fish.. Also pee on their friends also.

Sent from my c64

That's complete nonsense with respect to box jelly fish stings and is strongly advised against doing this in case of a box jelly fish sting. Use of vinegar is advised!

Wow64, was joking. The last sentence should have given it away!!!

[balo]

I am surprised Dr. Thon never heard of vinegar ? Cleaning the wound with seawater I guess is the next best thing but vinegar is more efficient.

[casualbiker]

I am surprised Dr. Thon never heard of vinegar ? Cleaning the wound with seawater I guess is the next best thing but vinegar is more efficient.

He's heard of it but knows damn well that the municipality in charge of the beaches can't be arsed!

[Exsexyman]

Dr Thon, vice dean, faculty of fisheries, Kasetsart University basic advice is to refrain from swimming, no shit!

What he actually said was "refrain from swimming during the rainy season', and if you have to " swim where there are waves and cover yourself with body or stinger suit'. All common sense advice i think. But of course leaving these clarifications out enabled you to indulge in your daily fix of Thai bashing didn't it? Carry on making a fool of yourself, it gives plenty of us on here a good laugh!

[cumgranosalum]

The best thing to do is pee/wee on someone who has been stung by a box jelly fish.. Also pee on their friends also.

Sent from my c64

That's complete nonsense with respect to box jelly fish stings and is strongly advised against doing this in case of a box jelly fish sting. Use of vinegar is advised!

On their friends the vinegar works? Think I will stick to peeing on them.. It's scientifically proven.

Sent from my c64

Peeing DOES NOT WORK on Box Jellies and could increase the likelihood of death.