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Posted

Trump proposals risk deepening GOP rift on immigration
By JULIE PACE and BILL BARROW

WASHINGTON (AP) — Donald Trump has exposed anew the deep rift inside the Republican Party on immigration, a break between its past and the country's future the party itself has said it must bridge if the GOP ever hopes to win back the White House.

As they headed into the 2016 election, Republicans thought they had a strategy for moving past their immigration woes. Outlined in a so-called "autopsy" of 2012 nominee Mitt Romney's loss to President Barack Obama, it called for passing "comprehensive immigration reform" — shorthand for resolving the status of the estimated 11 million people living in the country illegally.

Those plans ran aground in the GOP-controlled House, falling victim to the passionate opposition among conservatives to anything they deem "amnesty" for such immigrants.

Some Republicans then hoped candidates with more moderate positions on immigration — such as Jeb Bush, the Spanish-speaking former Florida governor, or Sen. Marco Rubio, a Miami native and son of Cuban parents — would rise during the 2016 campaign and boost the party's appeal to Hispanic voters.

Instead, it's Trump — with his call to deport everyone living in the U.S. illegally and eliminate birthright citizenship — who has surged to the top of the summertime polls, reinforcing the lasting power of white, conservative voters who the GOP has courted for decades and continue to dominate the party's presidential primaries.

"Donald Trump is telling the truth and people don't always like that," Donald Kidd, a 73-year-old retired pipe welder from Mobile, Alabama, said at a weekend rally for Trump.

Kidd added that Trump was "like George Wallace," the former Alabama governor and presidential candidate known for his outspoken conservative rhetoric and segregationist views.

Trump's growing support appears to have pushed some of his rivals to match his hard-line positions on immigration. Texas Sen. Ted Cruz and Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker quickly echoed Trump's call for ending birthright citizenship. While Walker later backed off, Cruz has refused to join with those who criticized Trump after he called immigrants from Mexico rapists and criminals.

On Thursday, the two candidates announced plans to appear together at a rally next month in Washington.

"Other campaigns should look at incorporating what he's saying," said South Carolina Rep. Jeff Duncan, who represents the most Republican congressional district in the early voting state. He said he doesn't know how Trump's proposals are playing with Hispanics, but said his message "resonates with average Americans."

Trump mixes his boasts on immigration, including his pledge to build a "beautiful" wall on the nation's Southern border to stop illegal crossings, with talk about how he'll focus on jobs if elected president, which would be a boon for minorities who endure higher rates of unemployment. But Ferrel Guillory, a longtime political observer at the University of North Carolina, said it is rhetoric that nonetheless "signals to white voters, especially through the immigration issue."

The billionaire businessman has frequently referred to his supporters as the "silent majority," a phrase used by Richard Nixon as part of his "Southern strategy" to bolster support from working class white voters in the 1968 and 1972 elections. At a news conference in South Carolina on Thursday, Trump brushed aside questions about the term's loaded history.

"I'm just bringing it to modern day," he said, arguing that his backers are "a silent majority in this country that feels abused, that feels forgotten, that feels mistreated ... that wants the country to have victories again."

For decades, Republicans sank their presidential hopes into winning over white working- and middle-class voters. But as the country grows increasingly diverse, winning the majority of white voters — which may yield victories in the GOP primaries — is no longer enough to power a candidate to success in the general election.

That was the stark lesson for Republicans in 2012. GOP nominee Mitt Romney won 59 percent of the white vote in the general election, but garnered just 27 percent from Hispanics, 26 percent from Asians and 6 percent from black voters.

It was the worst performance from a Republican candidate among Hispanic voters in a decade, and Obama swept every competitive state in the nation save North Carolina.

That's undoubtedly why Hillary Rodham Clinton, the front-runner for the Democratic nomination, has argued that there's little difference between Trump and the other GOP candidates on immigration. And why Bush, who is married to a Mexican woman and famously said Republican candidates for president must be willing to risk losing in the primaries if they hope to win in the general election, has been among his sharpest critics.

"He's appealing to people's angst and their anger," Bush said this week. "I want to solve problems so we can fix this and turn immigration into what it's always been — an economic driver for our country."
___

Barrow reported from Greenville, South Carolina.

aplogo.jpg
-- (c) Associated Press 2015-08-28

Posted

This is just a huge racist farce. They say they don't like illegal immigration but the fact is they don't like anyone who's not white. Proof is plenty when a naturalized US Citizen gets told to leave the country he belongs to on live TV.

People don't seem to understand that people who might look/ speak different might actually have one of these:

U.S.-passport.jpg

Green_Card.jpg

Ann Coulter is starting to say all immigration is bad: http://www.salon.com/2015/06/02/ann_coulter_goes_full_nativist_illegal_immigrants_aren%E2%80%99t_the_problem_%E2%80%94_all_immigrants_are/

Even if it is legal:

immi1.jpg

And this is starting to get dangerous like people are actually talking about ethnic cleansing. America has long been a beacon of light in the world.. the next election will truly tell if we're still going to be that beacon of light or be like Nazi Germany with Trump being The Fuhrer. He's already got the endorsement of the white supremacists.

Posted (edited)

The Donald.

Good for business.

In Trump pinatas!

Whacking Donald Trump with a stick is big business in San Francisco.

You can do it for $14 to the small Trump, or $20 if you splurge for the large Trump. The stick costs $3 extra, and you really need a proper stick, customers say, to bust Trump to smithereens.

Those are the economics — a field said to be Trump’s specialty — in the red-hot business of selling Donald Trump piñatas.

http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Donald-Trump-is-a-pi-ata-he-s-just-made-6469625.php#photo-8543503

Edited by Jingthing
Posted (edited)

This is just a huge racist farce.

What a load of nonsense. The problem is with people who have entered the country ILLEGALLY. It has nothing to do with race. The truth is that is should have been done decades ago.

Most countries around the world seek highly skilled foreign entrepreneurs and immigrants with funding from venture capital firms or investment groups for a start-up business - not just anyone who can sneak in.

Edited by Ulysses G.
Posted

"...that wants the country to have victories again"

What on earth is he talking about? All the wars the US has started or entered and lost of couldn't win? Is he suggesting the US go to war?

What other "victories" does a country have?

Posted

Bringing ethnic issues into the U.S. Immigration debate could very well put the questionable ties of the George Bush' father and grandfather to financing Nazi Germany.

See http://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/sep/25/usa.secondworldwar.

That would tie the family into the U.S. investment banks who provided financial shelter for Thyssen (financier of Hitlers re-arming of Germany). More tantalising are Bush's links to the Consolidated Silesian Steel Company (CSSC), based in mineral rich Silesia on the German-Polish border. During the war, the company made use of Nazi slave labour from the concentration camps, including Auschwitz.

Posted (edited)

Bringing ethnic issues into the U.S. Immigration debate could very well put the questionable ties of the George Bush' father and grandfather to financing Nazi Germany.

I don't think so. In America, we don;t put much stock in conspiracy theories and sons don't bear the sins of the father.

Edited by Ulysses G.
Posted (edited)

This is just a huge racist farce. They say they don't like illegal immigration but the fact is they don't like anyone who's not white. Proof is plenty when a naturalized US Citizen gets told to leave the country he belongs to on live TV.

snip---

And this is starting to get dangerous like people are actually talking about ethnic cleansing. America has long been a beacon of light in the world.. the next election will truly tell if we're still going to be that beacon of light or be like Nazi Germany with Trump being The Fuhrer. He's already got the endorsement of the white supremacists.

Ramos is a parasite, a real piece of crap constantly couching activism as journalism and like all things regarding this racist invasion of the US lately, the mix of victim and aggression is shocking. Ramos has an American passport... and a Mexican passport as well. He has made numerous disparaging remarks over the year that clearly paint his as a racist. How you can manage that by excluding it says more about how people search for reinforcing delusion than your honest presentation of a concern. Ramos is a liar. Ramos is an opportunist. Ramos' deep positions are entirely based upon his spanish heritage. This is necessarily racist. There has not been one single interview or public statement ever found where he conceded even one intellectual inch toward constructive debate about whether immigration has any negative impact at all. Not a fair broker.

One thing is clear, the path Ramos asserts is status quo and status quo will be dissolution. The status quo regards criminals. Criminals should be rounded up and deported if one, two, or ten million. If you would have an ethic of a country of law, have it. If not, stop the pretense. As the link below suggests courts do currently assert that having entered the country illegally one is a criminal. Tolerance for criminals is aiding and abetting. Ramos is a piece of feces. Mark Levin addresses this point directly-

Para 6 http://journaltimes.com/news/news-state-wi/court-second-amendment-also-covers-those-in-us-illegally/article_855ef023-9c26-507e-abb4-8835a3024b7a.html

Edited by arjunadawn
Posted

Point taken about the sins of the grandfather? . But for some unfathomable reason, I can't shake off a conviction that the US of A doesn't need another Bush. Grandfather, father and brother - and always, that very close connection to the Saudi royal family. I am weary of this family's propensity for wars, which have bankrupted the country. The only way to make America great again is to (I) stop pouring money into wars, (ii) stop being strong-armed by Israel into paying it obscene amounts of money and (iii) start creating jobs, especially by repatriating skilled jobs which have gone overseas, (iv) rewrite/simplify the Tax regulations, making it easier for small businesses to start up and survive and above all, grant annual work permits but not citizenship to illegal immigrants, who can provide sponsorship by an American employer citizen. A flawed set of proposals, I'm sure, as I haven't had my morning bj yet.

Posted

This is just a huge racist farce.

What a load of nonsense. The problem is with people who have entered the country ILLEGALLY. It has nothing to do with race. The truth is that is should have been done decades ago.

Most countries around the world seek highly skilled foreign entrepreneurs and immigrants with funding from venture capital firms or investment groups for a start-up business - not just anyone who can sneak in.

ROFLMAO how deluded you are.

Since the last amnesty which was 1986 (29 years ago), there are 11 million illegals. Compared to that there have been 43 million legal immigrants. Who do you think the Trump supporters are threatened by? Illegals who they pay to do cheap labor on their home or legal immigrants who actually have a basis to stay in the United States forever, have a family and move into neighborhoods that were all white before based on their income which is high because they have legal status.

And yes we do seek highly skilled foreign entrepeneurs.. as my graph showed above.

BTW this election is already decided..

How will African Americans vote? Not for a racist Trump.

How will Hispanics and Asians vote? Not for Trump or Bush

How will women vote? Not for someone who doesn't want to spend money on women's issues.

How will milennials vote? We live in the iphone age. Before the iphone came out, the GOP had a huge advantage of neighborhoods, churches, fear. Now voters (especially younger voters) are much better informed and have news and information sent to their smart phones. They're not catching the news on Fox News.

We live in a different world than we did in 2004 (pre-iphone) when there was a chance a Bush could squeak out a win.

Now it's more of will the GOP lose a squeaker or by a landslide?

Posted (edited)

This is just a huge racist farce.

What a load of nonsense. The problem is with people who have entered the country ILLEGALLY. It has nothing to do with race. The truth is that is should have been done decades ago.

Most countries around the world seek highly skilled foreign entrepreneurs and immigrants with funding from venture capital firms or investment groups for a start-up business - not just anyone who can sneak in.

ROFLMAO how deluded you are.

Since the last amnesty which was 1986 (29 years ago), there are 11 million illegals. Compared to that there have been 43 million legal immigrants. Who do you think the Trump supporters are threatened by? Illegals who they pay to do cheap labor on their home or legal immigrants who actually have a basis to stay in the United States forever, have a family and move into neighborhoods that were all white before based on their income which is high because they have legal status.

And yes we do seek highly skilled foreign entrepeneurs.. as my graph showed above.

BTW this election is already decided..

How will African Americans vote? Not for a racist Trump.

How will Hispanics and Asians vote? Not for Trump or Bush

How will women vote? Not for someone who doesn't want to spend money on women's issues.

How will milennials vote? We live in the iphone age. Before the iphone came out, the GOP had a huge advantage of neighborhoods, churches, fear. Now voters (especially younger voters) are much better informed and have news and information sent to their smart phones. They're not catching the news on Fox News.

We live in a different world than we did in 2004 (pre-iphone) when there was a chance a Bush could squeak out a win.

Now it's more of will the GOP lose a squeaker or by a landslide?

You forgot, too, there's less chance of a hanging chad to inch a Bush or Trump over the line.

Not that it could get that close!

Edited by Seastallion
Posted

This is just a huge racist farce. They say they don't like illegal immigration but the fact is they don't like anyone who's not white. Proof is plenty when a naturalized US Citizen gets told to leave the country he belongs to on live TV.

People don't seem to understand that people who might look/ speak different might actually have one of these:

U.S.-passport.jpg

Green_Card.jpg

Ann Coulter is starting to say all immigration is bad: http://www.salon.com/2015/06/02/ann_coulter_goes_full_nativist_illegal_immigrants_aren%E2%80%99t_the_problem_%E2%80%94_all_immigrants_are/

Even if it is legal:

immi1.jpg

And this is starting to get dangerous like people are actually talking about ethnic cleansing. America has long been a beacon of light in the world.. the next election will truly tell if we're still going to be that beacon of light or be like Nazi Germany with Trump being The Fuhrer. He's already got the endorsement of the white supremacists.

No worries on this front. The GOP will talk this subject to death shout to the rooftops and then some. They will keep talking and doing nothing because they want the Hispanic vote. Their approach is throw some crumbs to everyone but do not rock the boat. Beacon of light hmm this is slowly being smothered by the shear number of illegals coming and then sponsoring their family who will contribute what? Anybody can have an American passport if they flash enough cash. Don't worry about problems if the Donald becomes president. He will have his big business "handlers" those whose money far surpasses his. In the end just another puppet in a long line of puppets. JFK had the right ideas and tried to rock the "establishment boat" and look where that got him and his brother. You talk about Thailand finding the criminal to fit the crime? America can go one better.

Posted

Point taken about the sins of the grandfather? . But for some unfathomable reason, I can't shake off a conviction that the US of A doesn't need another Bush. Grandfather, father and brother - and always, that very close connection to the Saudi royal family. I am weary of this family's propensity for wars, which have bankrupted the country. The only way to make America great again is to (I) stop pouring money into wars, (ii) stop being strong-armed by Israel into paying it obscene amounts of money and (iii) start creating jobs, especially by repatriating skilled jobs which have gone overseas, (iv) rewrite/simplify the Tax regulations, making it easier for small businesses to start up and survive and above all, grant annual work permits but not citizenship to illegal immigrants, who can provide sponsorship by an American employer citizen. A flawed set of proposals, I'm sure, as I haven't had my morning bj yet.

Don't forget to brush, floss and gargle afterwards.

Posted

Point taken about the sins of the grandfather? . But for some unfathomable reason, I can't shake off a conviction that the US of A doesn't need another Bush. Grandfather, father and brother - and always, that very close connection to the Saudi royal family. I am weary of this family's propensity for wars, which have bankrupted the country. The only way to make America great again is to (I) stop pouring money into wars, (ii) stop being strong-armed by Israel into paying it obscene amounts of money and (iii) start creating jobs, especially by repatriating skilled jobs which have gone overseas, (iv) rewrite/simplify the Tax regulations, making it easier for small businesses to start up and survive and above all, grant annual work permits but not citizenship to illegal immigrants, who can provide sponsorship by an American employer citizen. A flawed set of proposals, I'm sure, as I haven't had my morning bj yet.

"stop being strong-armed by Israel into paying it obscene amounts of money"

Some of your points have merit. Your point about Israel...not so much.

The fiscal year 2015 foreign aid to Israel is set at $3.1 Billion.

The US federal expenditures for fiscal 2015 are set at $3.90 Trillion.

Israel constitutes 0.0007948% of the total US government expenditures for 2015.

If the truth was really known, I imagine flying the Obama family around the world for the past few years costs the US government more than that.

Enforcing current immigration laws and protecting the borders would go much farther along in making the US great again.

Posted

Quote: "don't forget to brush, floss and gargle afterwards".

Comedy gold

ha ha...thank you.

I even surprise myself some days!!

Posted (edited)

10455293_1019482774742800_35659700707791

The fact is, 40 years ago, those would have been white or black people in the background, doing those jobs, and making more money for it.

Edited by beechguy
Posted

This is just a huge racist farce.

What a load of nonsense. The problem is with people who have entered the country ILLEGALLY. It has nothing to do with race. The truth is that is should have been done decades ago.

Most countries around the world seek highly skilled foreign entrepreneurs and immigrants with funding from venture capital firms or investment groups for a start-up business - not just anyone who can sneak in.

ROFLMAO how deluded you are.

Since the last amnesty which was 1986 (29 years ago), there are 11 million illegals. Compared to that there have been 43 million legal immigrants. Who do you think the Trump supporters are threatened by? Illegals who they pay to do cheap labor on their home or legal immigrants who actually have a basis to stay in the United States forever, have a family and move into neighborhoods that were all white before based on their income which is high because they have legal status.

And yes we do seek highly skilled foreign entrepeneurs.. as my graph showed above.

BTW this election is already decided..

How will African Americans vote? Not for a racist Trump.

How will Hispanics and Asians vote? Not for Trump or Bush

How will women vote? Not for someone who doesn't want to spend money on women's issues.

How will milennials vote? We live in the iphone age. Before the iphone came out, the GOP had a huge advantage of neighborhoods, churches, fear. Now voters (especially younger voters) are much better informed and have news and information sent to their smart phones. They're not catching the news on Fox News.

We live in a different world than we did in 2004 (pre-iphone) when there was a chance a Bush could squeak out a win.

Now it's more of will the GOP lose a squeaker or by a landslide?

Your election conclusions are probably correct. In medicine there is something called an agonal heartbeat. It is a random electric current giving the appearance of life when biological death has already happened. Perhaps this Trump fiasco is no more than America's agonal heartbeat, a last dying hope that something... anything that hearkens to values, honor, law, and meaning come to pass- that a leader that actually presents who stops the inexorable slide to Statism and despotism.

Posted

Although much of what Trump says is racist, xenophobic and irrational, his No.1 common sense argument is that successive presidents have failed to address the immigration issue, they have simply paid lip service to it. He seems pretty genuine in his belief that he could have some impact on the situation for better or worse. I think if Obama hadn't been such as anti-climax, American's wouldn't be listening to Trump with such hope.

Posted

Donald Trump is hitting a nerve. Since Reagan signed the amnesty bill, no president and no congress has done anything but give lip service to the illegal immigration problem. Like it or not, at the community level, illegal immigration has cost the taxpayers lots of money. Schools have hired extra people to deal with students who don't speak English, schools are now paying for breakfast and lunch programs because low income families don't seem to properly feed their children. Programs in art, music, and shop classes have been cancelled because of shortage of funds. Go into any emergency room and one is overwhelmed by the number of hispanics waiting for treatment for non emergency ailments because they get a free ride there. The very fabric of American society has been changed by the massive influx of immigrants who because of their numbers no longer have to assimilate into American society. Go to parts of Los Angeles and you might think you were in some Latin American country. Our political leaders have failed to act and it all had to do with politics not what is right or wrong. California gives drivers licenses to illegals and has sanctuary cities where they don't report illegals who have committed crimes to the Immigration Service. The failure to act has polarized society. Some say that the liberals want all the illegals given amnesty because they see them as a future voting base. Some on the right feel the USA is just opening up the flood gates. Some suggest the big business wants the cheap labor but this is a curiosity to me. I don't really see a shortage of labor in this country and big business certainly does not go around hiring illegals at the Home Depot with few skills.

With that being said, I don't believe for a minute that 11 million people will ever be deported, nor do I believe it is necessarily the right thing to do after all this time as most now have children who were born here, know nothing of the birth place of their parents, and are not at fault for the situation. I am not necessarily in favor of breaking up families. However, the one thing that must be done is to stop further illegal immigration before anything else, and this seems to be a major stumbling block between liberals and conservatives. Democrats and Republicans seem to be fighting over what comes first. Since giving amnesty in 1986 Congress has not fixed the problem, then in my mind dealing with the illegals here comes second to stopping the influx. If that takes a wall then so be it. If that takes more enforcement on the border, fine. It all provides jobs at any rate. Next, do away with the anchor baby situation. That is a difficult proposition as this would require a constitutional amendment. Third, any illegal immigrant found guilty of a serious misdemeanor or felony serves time and gets deported, no exceptions. If one has come to the US illegally he/she has no right to break the law and stay, family or not. Get them out of here. Fourth, no public social services until they become legal residents. If they came here because the situation was so bad where they are from, they will somehow survive without public assistance. It's their problem, not the taxpayer. Exception is schooling for the kids. Fifth, all illegals must register and begin the process of becoming legal, pay substantial fines to cover government costs and show they have lived here without breaking laws. Sixth, once determined they may remain they are ineligible for citizenship for at least 10 years from the time they become legal, NOT when they entered the country. Seventh, anyone found to be illegal after a certain date to be set by congress, is automatically deported, no extenuating circumstances, no exceptions. Finally, issue a national identity card to all persons, one color for citizens, one color for legal residents, etc. This serves multiple purposes in that it determines who has the right to work in the US and who has the right to vote. That would also end all the ridiculous arguments about voting rights and lack of access to the polls that some claim is a problem.

This is what the congress should be debating. Most Americans see no reason to give instant recognition and all the benefits that come with it to people who have broken the law and entered the country illegally. It seems only the liberal political want to do this. Most people would accept and orderly process for dealing with those already here illegally. One only has to look at the situation in Europe to see what can happen in America. Thousands of migrants camping at Calais in hope of entering the UK, illegally. Thousands of migrants crossing to Greece and Italy hoping to make their way to northern Europe to the more prosperous countries. The European migrant crisis is real and while Angela Merkel can give speeches about not tolerating threats against migrants, the citizens of Germany are seeing the problems associated with a complete change in the structure of their society. Things like the riots in Paris a few years back will only increase if huge levels of migrants are allowed to illegally flood a country. The last thing I want to see in Europe or the cities in the US is a Balkanization along ethnic lines. Immigrants must assimilate not create ghettos for themselves which end up dividing a community. That's why Trump is hitting a nerve when he says build the wall. 29 years have passed since Reagan signed the amnesty bill in 1986. Many ask why haven't we solved this issue by now. Donald Trump wants to solve it. First things first. Sure the rhetoric is harsh but the people know the problem will not get solved by the politicians currently in office. Donald Trump I would guess, realistically knows that deporting 11 million is next to impossible, but political rhetoric is just what we are seeing. Question is if he was to get elected could he stop the illegal immigration problem in the US?

Posted (edited)

Whatever.coffee1.gif

Congratulations. With a federal expenditure of $3.9 Trillion and assuming your figures are correct that total compensation to Israel amounts to $6.5 Billion in 2015, you have successfully identified where 14.6 hours of this years budget will be spent.

Now try and find somebody that really cares and can do anything about it.

Back on topic, Trump is right about the illegal immigrants.

Edited by chuckd
Posted

Back on topic, Trump is right about the illegal immigrants.

Have you ever thought of solving the problem by going at the SOURCE? aka the people wanting to hire illegals. They create the demand of cheap labor, cheap prostitutes, cheap drugs.

Nah. No way. Just can't do that.

Why? Well for one most of those people are white males.

You know, the single demographic most attacked in todays liberal society.

Can't argue against stupid.

Posted

Trump's the kinda guy, if he saw an hispanic driving through the neighborhood without a lawnmower in the back of his pick-up truck, he would call the cops.

Meanwhile, US authorities just approved allowing 8,000 Syrians to gain residency during upcoming months.

Illegal immigration to the US is a stickler issue with many facets. There is no magic wand solution, as Trump would have us believe. The underlying issue which no politician has the guts to address: is overpopulation. Same for immigration problems in Europe and, to a lesser degree, SE Asia. When there are too many people for the carrying capacity of the region, then people will move to places where they think they have a better chance of survival. It's Darwinism of sorts. Look at where migrants come from: 99% are desperate to leave places which are either sand (instead of soil), few trees, or flooded (like Bangladesh). The few resources those regions had, decades/centuries ago, are nearly gone, while population #'s of one species has skyrocketed.

Posted

Although much of what Trump says is racist, xenophobic and irrational, his No.1 common sense argument is that successive presidents have failed to address the immigration issue, they have simply paid lip service to it. He seems pretty genuine in his belief that he could have some impact on the situation for better or worse. I think if Obama hadn't been such as anti-climax, American's wouldn't be listening to Trump with such hope.

The only reason "successive presidents have failed to address the immigration issue" is because there are no easy solutions. Duh! No one is offering reasonable or sensible solutions at the moment, including Trump. Crazy ideas that are impossible/impractical to implement but get a lot of applause at political rallies are not solutions.

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