Do they want farang retirees here?

[Cypress Hill]

If we choose to live here then we abide by the prevailing conditions....

We by and large have no sway where we come from so to move to a different country/culture and impose what WE feel we WANT is a wrong approach....

It's part of the trade off......"They" didn't invite ANY of us here.....In effect some are biting the hand that feeds (infastructure/services) us.....

Personally I am happy in my life here....I will take happiness and contentment to the bank any day.....Some are not (seemingly) happy unless demanding something/whining/expecting what they don't deserve-haven't earned.....

Goes back to Democules.....

Actually "they" did "invite us."

The Thai Tourists agents promote their country as a paradise for old white men to retire to and a total whore house for the young and dumb, if they are rich.

And they do treat us with disrespect starting with the bureaucrats at the embassies and consulates abroad. The government does nothing to protect the ex-patriots from abroad from lying, cheating, thieving cab drivers, cops and bureaucrats, con persons and freaks.

The attitude of the nation - as represented by the government - is like, "you came to us," so: "we owe you nothing; you don't get respect; you don't have any right to complain about being treated with less dignity than all humans owe to every person." This in a nation of Buddhists so enlightened and advanced, where everyone spends time in monasteries so they know all about karma.

Are you trying to say that because you volunteered therefore you deserve to get screwed - because you paid your money you have the right to remain silent and take whatever we choose to do to you??

I don't accept that reasoning.

Nobody really cares what you accept.

There is marketing out there for pretty much every product or service you can think of. It's up to the punter to decide whether he's being sold a deal of a lifetime or crock of shit.

Thailand is not a World Health Organisation-sanctioned retirement state. They don't assign a security guard/gofer to each retiree as he arrives with his suitcases to make sure he doesn't fall foul of the overcharging taxi driver or the light-fingered streetwalker.

No one's saying you deserve to get screwed but that, if you feel you ARE being screwed, you don't have to remain bent over a barrel.

All you have to do is get up, wipe yourself down, pull on your pants and go elsewhere.

What do you mean, "Nobody cares what I accept."?

Obviously some people cared about my opinions, as other people have quoted me - without adding cheap sarcasm as you did.

I didn't say that I expected a WHO-sanctioned retirement state - I said I expected respect. Something you can't can't understand.

Respect is earned; it's not automatically supplied as standard with a shiny new retirement visa/extension.

Why should they respect you?

Because you've decided to spend your "golden" years in their country?

[Naam]

Reading some of the things written here ,i wonder if i live in the same land as these people , my wife and i are always treated with respect by most people ,no problems at immegration ,always a smile , stopped for a traffic violation the police are polite , no dual pricing(ok Naam ?) although i know tourists get it ,but then they do most places in the world . could it be that i dont walk around in dirty shorts and a vest with my gut hanging out covered in tatts accompanied by a young woman with a skirt barely covering her butt and herself covered with a mass of tatts? but dress nicely speak politely and have a well educated wife who who is also polite, now if thats the case the way you are percieved and treated is the same most places in the world ,not just Thailand.

may i draw the attention of Your Imperial Highness to the fact that i defended and explained your "duel pricing"?

[sawadee1947]

thet don't want us here. Otherwise they would allow us to buy house/land to have a secured and safe life up to the end. They are only looking how to get our money. The best would be for them we would leave our money here and dissapear or die!

I am not sure why people get so hung up on the owning land/house thing.

If the Thai government decides that foreigners are not welcome, they are not going to give one tin shit about whether you own land or a house here. In fact, you would be out more, because now that investment you made would go to ???? when they ship you out.

On the flip side of this argument, I have never understood why people in other countries get so wound up when foreigners come in and buy up properties...what are they going to do, take it with them? The Japanese lost their asses buying up expensive properties in USA years ago when the real estate market subsequently regressed.

At the core, we do not own real estate, we rent it from the government...that is what our tax payments are, in effect.

I am not sure why people get so hung up on the owning land/house thing

If a Thai (e.g. the Thai prince) comes into my home country , he can buy whatever he wants. Land, houses, condos, aso. But the other way round we cannot.

Also a property you buy here you can't give to your kids later. So it's lost investment. You think it's a good feeling?

So you are restricted to buy a condo only. This you can give after you passed away to your kids... (in Vietnam you can buy for 100 years....)

I do not care what someone who emigrates to my country can do. It is irrelevant to what I can do in Thailand.

Property I (read: my wife) buy here will go to my Thai step-daughter...I am fine with that. I cannot leave it to my son in USA, but that is fine. I have assets in USA that will go to him when I am reduced to ashes. If he wants to follow in the old man's footsteps and come to Thailand he can do his own deal here.

What one can do in Vietnam is also irrelevant to this conversation.

thank you for your comment though it sounds quite rude

[sawadee1947]

thet don't want us here. Otherwise they would allow us to buy house/land to have a secured and safe life up to the end. They are only looking how to get our money. The best would be for them we would leave our money here and dissapear or die!

I am not sure why people get so hung up on the owning land/house thing.

If the Thai government decides that foreigners are not welcome, they are not going to give one tin shit about whether you own land or a house here. In fact, you would be out more, because now that investment you made would go to ???? when they ship you out.

On the flip side of this argument, I have never understood why people in other countries get so wound up when foreigners come in and buy up properties...what are they going to do, take it with them? The Japanese lost their asses buying up expensive properties in USA years ago when the real estate market subsequently regressed.

At the core, we do not own real estate, we rent it from the government...that is what our tax payments are, in effect.

I am not sure why people get so hung up on the owning land/house thing

If a Thai (e.g. the Thai prince) comes into my home country , he can buy whatever he wants. Land, houses, condos, aso. But the other way round we cannot.

Also a property you buy here you can't give to your kids later. So it's lost investment. You think it's a good feeling?

So you are restricted to buy a condo only. This you can give after you passed away to your kids... (in Vietnam you can buy for 100 years....)

It's easy to say Thais have the right to buy in our countries knowing most of them can't afford it.

There aren't that many Thai princes but there are plenty of British plumbers, American electricians, French carpenters and Australian bus drivers - many of whom can afford to buy assets in Thailand because of the exchange rate disparity.

The Thai government isn't here to give you a "good feeling" by letting you buy up real estate and land from under the noses of their own people.

Buy if you want but know the rules.

If you don't like those rules, then don't buy - go to Vietnam

ause of the exchacan afford to buy assets in Thailand becnge rate disparity.

No that's wrong. It's not because of disparity but because of our different system. We got a pension/fund by law what is unknown here. So we provide an income after 40 years of work and here they don't. In case they would have it here they would not need to spent life with 3-500 Baht/month.

But I admit there a different views to spend life. Here more laissez faire and there hard working 40 hrs/week.

[Loptr]

So much angst from the usual suspects... I am classified as a retiree in Thailand and have no problem with the process and procedures to stay in Thailand as long as I want... Is the process as streamlined and efficient as in the west, no, but it is effective... I would contest that most of you folks that complain about the requirements to maintain a valid visa in Thailand have never had to go through this process to live in another country, I have in many countries... Same same, no different except for the details in the fine print... I'll go ahead and say it, no matter how cliched it is, if you don't like it here and don't like the visa requirements, you should probably go back to where ever the hell you came from... No one is forcing you to stay...

[Cypress Hill]

It's easy to say Thais have the right to buy in our countries knowing most of them can't afford it.

There aren't that many Thai princes but there are plenty of British plumbers, American electricians, French carpenters and Australian bus drivers - many of whom can afford to buy assets in Thailand because of the exchange rate disparity.

The Thai government isn't here to give you a "good feeling" by letting you buy up real estate and land from under the noses of their own people.

Buy if you want but know the rules.

If you don't like those rules, then don't buy - go to Vietnam

ause of the exchacan afford to buy assets in Thailand becnge rate disparity.

No that's wrong. It's not because of disparity but because of our different system. We got a pension/fund by law what is unknown here. So we provide an income after 40 years of work and here they don't. In case they would have it here they would not need to spent life with 3-500 Baht/month.

But I admit there a different views to spend life. Here more laissez faire and there hard working 40 hrs/week.

No, it isn't wrong at all

My point is about affordability

It's got nothing to do with where the money comes from (eg employment or pension)

Most Thais can't even afford to COME to our homelands let alone earn enough to buy property there so it's pointless saying they have the right to do so as a way of justifying why the Thais should reciprocate.

We, however, can afford to buy quite a lot of real estate here by dint of our greater earning power/relative wealth, the rate of exchange between our currencies and theirs and the ease with which we can come here.

This is why foreigners - QUITE RIGHTLY - aren't allowed to buy land here because if they were, prices would be pushed even further out of the average Thai's reach than they are already.

[ericthai]

with all respect that may be more of a personal opinion rather than govt policy. Same as Ur treatment at immigration probably more a reflection of the individual or general work ethic of govt "service" depts. I have to say most at Khonkaen office brilliant and actually seem to enjoy their day.

The govt must have some policy or outlook towards retirees. It must boost the economy / modernise the locale in some areas and that seems to be what they want now.

Where I come from actions speak louder that words. Successive governments have done very little to get rid of the pointless bureaucracy and inefficient procedures that make life unpleasant for expats.

Sheryl in a recent post mentioned how it took her several days of travel and effort for each annual extension. Another poster said he was suddenly faced, after 10 years of married life here with loads of additional requirements for extension, including intrusive questioning into his sex life. When I did my last extension at Chaeng Wattana (which only took 7 hours of waiting), there was an elderly, very frail man in a wheelchair. He arrived after me, by which time the queue had built up even more. It's simply inhumane treatment and shows official contempt for the service users. If I had to point to improvements over the last ten years I can only think of a few that have benefited me: opening more provincial offices, appointment booking for extensions at Chaeng Wattana (which worked for less than a month before being scrapped), 90 day reporting online. No change in policy at all that I can bring to mind.

As for government policy, well they pour vast sums of money into the Tourist Authority of Thailand, which seems at best to be very ineffectual. They (the government) don't do anything to promote retirement in Thailand. (Compare with our neighbour next door with "Malaysia my second home", which includes a 10 year visa, allows property ownership, tax-free import of a car, a national ID card, part time working, tax free interest on bank accounts, and all required documentation can be provided in English.)

So, whilst retirees may well boost the economy, governmental xenophobia means that they don't want to promote long staying foreigners. In their minds the tourists who come for a fortnight and quickly dump all their cash here is what is wanted.

Malaysia is no different from Thailand. Sure they have my second home, but have you ever looked at the requirements? Under 50 you need almost 5 million in the bank for 3 months and just about 85,000B a month income. If over 50 you need to have almost 3 million in the bank and the same income and the income must becoming from an offshore source. Allot of the retired guys in Thailand have a hard time with the 800,000 thb requirement. So Malaysia is no option for them and also looking for rich expats to come and retire. I don't care what country it is they all want the tourist money.

As for immigration we all know Thai's hate change, they are set in their ways and dont like / want change. Thai's ignore problems thinking they will go away until it becomes too big and they are forced to do something. Same with immigration there are problems but they wont do anything and just ignore it because they don't like to address problems and don't like change until their is a big problem and then they will have the knee jerk over reaction. TIT!

[Antiparovian]

Another tiresome Thai bashing post. Do most TV posters despise the country they elected to live in?

[fang37]

They want farang retirees here. That is why there have made it attractive to relocate.

Of course, it ain't the full deal for all. I can tick most boxes.

Acquisition of land becomes a no issue - @ least for me. Purchase land in wife's name is OK by me but it took 10 years into the relationship to do so.

My only bitch is the annual extension for retirement visa in CNX. Super PITA! The requirement are OK - it is the time involved. Although Chiang Rai is closer & faster, we have no choice.

In summary, they don't really want any old farang here. They want farangs with $$$. If there was nothing for the Thai government, it would be illogical to offer any incentives.

[fang37]

They want farang retirees here. That is why they have made it attractive to relocate.

Of course, it ain't the full deal for all. I can tick most boxes.

Acquisition of land becomes a no issue - @ least for me. Purchase land in wife's name is OK by me but it took 10 years into the relationship to do so.

My only bitch is the annual extension for retirement visa in CNX. Super PITA! The requirement are OK - it is the time involved. Although Chiang Rai is closer & faster, we have no choice.

In summary, they don't really want ANY farang here. They want farangs with $$$. If there was nothing for the Thai government, it would be illogical to offer any incentives.

Edited September 7, 2015 by fang37

[Soutpeel]

Define and quantify "signifcant"

70 to 140 thousand in a populuation of 67 odd million is insignificant irrespective of the way you try and dress it up

I agree that was my point.

Thank you

Hello Mydee,

OK I take your point , however I will try to quantify .

First fact is that the last Thai census was taken in 2010 . That stated there were in excess of 200,000 retirees and foreigners on extended tourist visas etc . The ethnic Thai population within Thailand was 75% . The remaining 25% from Chinese 18% and other Asian countries .

Monetary calculations of contributions to the economy cannot be based simply on populus . E.G. a retired westerners income will probably exceed that of a Thai earner many times over . Also lets not forget the wealth of the Chinese .

Second fact is that 1% of the richest people own 50% of the global wealth . That analogy could be applicable here .The expat retiree could be out numbered by 100 million and my statement would probably still be accurate .

Finally I do appreciate your valid critique . It is good to know that some reader's digest the posts and are able to offer an area for debate .

Many thanks ,

Superal

Actually it was me who posed this question, make it 200k then, but give me the number how much does the average retiree contribute to the Thai economy ? most of your post is just flim flammery

[jmccarty]

Immigration here is a lot easier to deal with than any Thai embassy visa officer - anywhere. At least in my experience.

And I think local immigration want what is best for their part of the country. We live amongst them, some more alien than others to them. Some of them are nationalistic, some not. Isn't it the same in the West?

From what my inlaws from South East Asia tell me, they get hot and cold receptions in Canada and the US.

[Berkshire]

If we choose to live here then we abide by the prevailing conditions....

We by and large have no sway where we come from so to move to a different country/culture and impose what WE feel we WANT is a wrong approach....

It's part of the trade off......"They" didn't invite ANY of us here.....In effect some are biting the hand that feeds (infastructure/services) us.....

Personally I am happy in my life here....I will take happiness and contentment to the bank any day.....Some are not (seemingly) happy unless demanding something/whining/expecting what they don't deserve-haven't earned.....

Goes back to Democules.....

Actually "they" did "invite us."

The Thai Tourists agents promote their country as a paradise for old white men to retire to and a total whore house for the young and dumb, if they are rich.

And they do treat us with disrespect starting with the bureaucrats at the embassies and consulates abroad. The government does nothing to protect the ex-patriots from abroad from lying, cheating, thieving cab drivers, cops and bureaucrats, con persons and freaks.

The attitude of the nation - as represented by the government - is like, "you came to us," so: "we owe you nothing; you don't get respect; you don't have any right to complain about being treated with less dignity than all humans owe to every person." This in a nation of Buddhists so enlightened and advanced, where everyone spends time in monasteries so they know all about karma.

Are you trying to say that because you volunteered therefore you deserve to get screwed - because you paid your money you have the right to remain silent and take whatever we choose to do to you??

I don't accept that reasoning.

I don't think I've ever seen Thailand promoted in those terms. Do you have any examples?

It's amazing how some farangs constantly confuse tourists with long term expats. Thailand wants tourists. They actively promote Thailand for tourists. They have a government agency that is devoted to attracting tourists. As for long term expats...not so much. I have not seen such promotions either. Thailand is more tolerant than most western countries, but also want to discourage certain types of expats, e.g., criminals, deadbeats, perverts, or people who will be a burden to Thai society. Immigration policies were set up with that in mind. So either Mr. Kondiao is confused or he's being rather disingenuous.

[lostoday]

Define and quantify "signifcant"

70 to 140 thousand in a populuation of 67 odd million is insignificant irrespective of the way you try and dress it up

I agree that was my point.

Thank you

Hello Mydee,

OK I take your point , however I will try to quantify .

First fact is that the last Thai census was taken in 2010 . That stated there were in excess of 200,000 retirees and foreigners on extended tourist visas etc . The ethnic Thai population within Thailand was 75% . The remaining 25% from Chinese 18% and other Asian countries .

Monetary calculations of contributions to the economy cannot be based simply on populus . E.G. a retired westerners income will probably exceed that of a Thai earner many times over . Also lets not forget the wealth of the Chinese .

Second fact is that 1% of the richest people own 50% of the global wealth . That analogy could be applicable here .The expat retiree could be out numbered by 100 million and my statement would probably still be accurate .

Finally I do appreciate your valid critique . It is good to know that some reader's digest the posts and are able to offer an area for debate .

Many thanks ,

Superal

Actually it was me who posed this question, make it 200k then, but give me the number how much does the average retiree contribute to the Thai economy ? most of your post is just flim flammery

Since 100% of retirees money is from outside of Thailand 10 x multiplier @800,000 baht each that's about 45 billion USD per year.

[elviajero]

Define and quantify "signifcant"

70 to 140 thousand in a populuation of 67 odd million is insignificant irrespective of the way you try and dress it up

I agree that was my point.

Thank you

Hello Mydee,

OK I take your point , however I will try to quantify .

First fact is that the last Thai census was taken in 2010 . That stated there were in excess of 200,000 retirees and foreigners on extended tourist visas etc . The ethnic Thai population within Thailand was 75% . The remaining 25% from Chinese 18% and other Asian countries .

Monetary calculations of contributions to the economy cannot be based simply on populus . E.G. a retired westerners income will probably exceed that of a Thai earner many times over . Also lets not forget the wealth of the Chinese .

Second fact is that 1% of the richest people own 50% of the global wealth . That analogy could be applicable here .The expat retiree could be out numbered by 100 million and my statement would probably still be accurate .

Finally I do appreciate your valid critique . It is good to know that some reader's digest the posts and are able to offer an area for debate .

Many thanks ,

Superal

Actually it was me who posed this question, make it 200k then, but give me the number how much does the average retiree contribute to the Thai economy ? most of your post is just flim flammery

Since 100% of retirees money is from outside of Thailand 10 x multiplier @800,000 baht each that's about 45 billion USD per year.

A couple of things to consider in your dodgy calculation.

How many actual retirees are there? You can't count everyone on 'Retirement' extensions as some are fraudulent, working etc.

Why 800k? Thats the amount they need in the bank to get the extension and has no relevance to the amount they actually spend.

[Cypress Hill]

Define and quantify "signifcant"

70 to 140 thousand in a populuation of 67 odd million is insignificant irrespective of the way you try and dress it up

I agree that was my point.

Thank you

Hello Mydee,

OK I take your point , however I will try to quantify .

First fact is that the last Thai census was taken in 2010 . That stated there were in excess of 200,000 retirees and foreigners on extended tourist visas etc . The ethnic Thai population within Thailand was 75% . The remaining 25% from Chinese 18% and other Asian countries .

Monetary calculations of contributions to the economy cannot be based simply on populus . E.G. a retired westerners income will probably exceed that of a Thai earner many times over . Also lets not forget the wealth of the Chinese .

Second fact is that 1% of the richest people own 50% of the global wealth . That analogy could be applicable here .The expat retiree could be out numbered by 100 million and my statement would probably still be accurate .

Finally I do appreciate your valid critique . It is good to know that some reader's digest the posts and are able to offer an area for debate .

Many thanks ,

Superal

Actually it was me who posed this question, make it 200k then, but give me the number how much does the average retiree contribute to the Thai economy ? most of your post is just flim flammery

Since 100% of retirees money is from outside of Thailand 10 x multiplier @800,000 baht each that's about 45 billion USD per year.

.

You'll be lucky if retirees are worth even 1% of the value of tourism's contribution to the Thai economy.

Given the numbers I see surviving on Tesco food hall specials while limiting drinking time to happy hour, I don't there's anywhere near as much pensioner largesse going on as you seem to think there is

[lostoday]

Whatever. Take the number of retirees multiply it by the amount you think they spend and multiply that times 10 because none of the money comes from inside Thailand.

Whatever the amount is it is substantial; far more than any other group staying in Thailand and easy to calculate because they are not employed or those that are are too few to count.

Thailand knows how many are staying and I would imagine could get an accurate estimate by tracking a couple of thousand bank accounts which are also readily available.

If I was a banker at Bank of Bangkok I could give you a number plus or minus 5% with 99% accuracy.

If Thailand does not know it's because they don't want to spend the few bucks for the labor to perform the calculation.

[MaeJoMTB]

They seem to want foreign retirees because they keep the financial hurdles for retirement and marriage extensions relatively low, even though they have a very inefficient bureaucracy and have pointless reporting requirements etc.But they don't want to give foreigners permanent rights except for a very few because they have a fear of being swamped. Malaysia has a fantastic retirement visa but the financial hurdle is much higher.

Retirement finance =9x minimum wage.

Marriage finance = 5x minimum wage.

With less than 5% of employed staff in Chiang Mai beating the minimum wage,

Your and my definitions of 'low' seem different.

Relatively low compared to other countries and what they would expect to be expat living costs. Malaysia's retirement scheme requires about 10 times more cash than a Thai retirement extension. The UK requires 34 times as much from a Thai retiree.

What country uses the minimum wage as a basis for cash needed for a long-term visas? That is supposed to be basic subsistence for a local without much education who has free government healthcare. It would be more logical for them to use the minimum salary required for a work permit. On that basis retirement is 1.3x and marriage extension is .7x which works out an at average of 1x the income needed for citizens of most farang countries to get a WP.

The fact that they haven't raised these hurdles for about 20 years seems further evidence that they actually want foreigners to keep applying for these extensions.

For the UK you need 1.5x minimum wage for your wife to stay there.

Plus 600gpb for 3 years healthcare.

[Soutpeel]

Define and quantify "signifcant"

70 to 140 thousand in a populuation of 67 odd million is insignificant irrespective of the way you try and dress it up

I agree that was my point.

Thank you

Hello Mydee,

OK I take your point , however I will try to quantify .

First fact is that the last Thai census was taken in 2010 . That stated there were in excess of 200,000 retirees and foreigners on extended tourist visas etc . The ethnic Thai population within Thailand was 75% . The remaining 25% from Chinese 18% and other Asian countries .

Monetary calculations of contributions to the economy cannot be based simply on populus . E.G. a retired westerners income will probably exceed that of a Thai earner many times over . Also lets not forget the wealth of the Chinese .

Second fact is that 1% of the richest people own 50% of the global wealth . That analogy could be applicable here .The expat retiree could be out numbered by 100 million and my statement would probably still be accurate .

Finally I do appreciate your valid critique . It is good to know that some reader's digest the posts and are able to offer an area for debate .

Many thanks ,

Superal

Actually it was me who posed this question, make it 200k then, but give me the number how much does the average retiree contribute to the Thai economy ? most of your post is just flim flammery

Since 100% of retirees money is from outside of Thailand 10 x multiplier @800,000 baht each that's about 45 billion USD per year.

A couple of things to consider in your dodgy calculation.

How many actual retirees are there? You can't count everyone on 'Retirement' extensions as some are fraudulent, working etc.

Why 800k? Thats the amount they need in the bank to get the extension and has no relevance to the amount they actually spend.

Lets look at it this way, lets suppose they increased the 800k to 1million or 1.5 million how many couldnt meet that criteria ?

[mydee]

Define and quantify "signifcant"

70 to 140 thousand in a populuation of 67 odd million is insignificant irrespective of the way you try and dress it up

I agree that was my point.

Thank you

I saw your original point as being we made a huge contribution to the Thai economy.

Then it was pointed out that our contribution is bugger all in the grand scheme of things and you say that was your point exactly.

How is 'bugger all" the same as "significant"?

No the original paragraph was a quote from another poster. I don't think that the contribution of Western retirees is significant in economic terms say as a percentage of GDP as we both seem to agree. And to the other poster I am not about to put a precise figure on what constitutes significant, for example in some of the micro nations in the South Pacific repatriating retirees would make a significant to the economy.

I merely tried to get some rationality into the debate.

I must say that your post is one that is worthy of reply. Many others imply a senses of self entitlement. The reality is most retirees have at one stage made an decision to stay in Thailand, it may be based of a personal relationship or it may be economic or it may be both and in some cases it may have been an ill judged decision Most won't pay taxes here but believe that because the spend money here they are providing benefits to Thailand and should be honored. Why?

Firstly in many cases, individually their level spending is hardly likely to have a significant impact on Thailand especially the social security pensioners spending their dotage at happy hours or in cheap food marts.

Secondly, in general terms, an individuals level of spending may be beneficial or detrimental to an economy depending whether it is in an inflationary cycle or not. While I doubt this really impacts on the retiree brigade in general I hope it stops the " I spend therefore a Government owes me "- no government does

Thirdly on a more micro level spending may or may not be beneficial it can lead to distortions in local markets.

Finally retirees are tolerated in Thailand, and in a world where tolerance is becoming scarcer we should at least be thankful for that

[lostoday]

Define and quantify "signifcant"

70 to 140 thousand in a populuation of 67 odd million is insignificant irrespective of the way you try and dress it up

I agree that was my point.

Thank you

Hello Mydee,

OK I take your point , however I will try to quantify .

First fact is that the last Thai census was taken in 2010 . That stated there were in excess of 200,000 retirees and foreigners on extended tourist visas etc . The ethnic Thai population within Thailand was 75% . The remaining 25% from Chinese 18% and other Asian countries .

Monetary calculations of contributions to the economy cannot be based simply on populus . E.G. a retired westerners income will probably exceed that of a Thai earner many times over . Also lets not forget the wealth of the Chinese .

Second fact is that 1% of the richest people own 50% of the global wealth . That analogy could be applicable here .The expat retiree could be out numbered by 100 million and my statement would probably still be accurate .

Finally I do appreciate your valid critique . It is good to know that some reader's digest the posts and are able to offer an area for debate .

Many thanks ,

Superal

Actually it was me who posed this question, make it 200k then, but give me the number how much does the average retiree contribute to the Thai economy ? most of your post is just flim flammery

Since 100% of retirees money is from outside of Thailand 10 x multiplier @800,000 baht each that's about 45 billion USD per year.

A couple of things to consider in your dodgy calculation.

How many actual retirees are there? You can't count everyone on 'Retirement' extensions as some are fraudulent, working etc.

Why 800k? Thats the amount they need in the bank to get the extension and has no relevance to the amount they actually spend.

Lets look at it this way, lets suppose they increased the 800k to 1million or 1.5 million how many couldnt meet that criteria ?

Easy to figure. https://www.surveymonkey.com/mp/sample-size-calculator/

If the total retirees is 200,000 for an estimate on spending with a confidence level of 90% and a margin of error 5% either way you need a survey of 269 individuals.

I spend a million baht a year and every retired guy I know spends more than that.

Have JT design a survey and if he gets 269 responses it will be quite accurate.

Once the survey is completed figure the correct multiplier for new (outside of the country) money and calculate and divide by the GDP for the percent.

If all of the retirees are like me the total would be just a bit less than rice sales.

But I don't want to freak you guys out. Don't believe me. Do the numbers. And don't call me a liar until you do do the numbers. It is not difficult I gave you all the necessary information.

I know the answer because I have done the numbers but you would not believe me so do it yourselves.

[Cypress Hill]

So you and a couple of old wheezers you know spend a million baht a year (only £20,000; $30,000) and that means ALL retirees are spending the same or more?

If that's the case, why are all those visa "agents" inundated with requests from pensioners needing help meeting the 800K requirement.

[lostoday]

So you and a couple of old wheezers you know spend a million baht a year (only £20,000; $30,000) and that means ALL retirees are spending the same or more?

If that's the case, why are all those visa "agents" inundated with requests from pensioners needing help meeting the 800K requirement.

I don't know of any agents who get requests and I think it is a myth. But quit your complaining. If you want to know do the math. I did and I told you the results.

For your information I have a very active social life and belong to many organizations in Thailand and know thousands of retirees in my capacity of an adviser to certain segments of our retired population.

PM JT and ask him to do a survey if you want to know or do one yourself. Why do you care anyway? Why not just take my word for it? What difference does it make to you?

[Soutpeel]

So you and a couple of old wheezers you know spend a million baht a year (only £20,000; $30,000) and that means ALL retirees are spending the same or more?

If that's the case, why are all those visa "agents" inundated with requests from pensioners needing help meeting the 800K requirement.

I don't know of any agents who get requests and I think it is a myth. But quit your complaining. If you want to know do the math. I did and I told you the results.

For your information I have a very active social life and belong to many organizations in Thailand and know thousands of retirees in my capacity of an adviser to certain segments of our retired population.

PM JT and ask him to do a survey if you want to know or do one yourself. Why do you care anyway? Why not just take my word for it? What difference does it make to you?

Well actually the myth you refer to i have seen " advertised" by agents and further seen questions about said agents on TV, so it seems there appears to be some truth to the myth, further one would question the realibilty of any survey on TV of this kind as one would suspect many would lie anyway skewing any data anyway Edited September 9, 2015 by Soutpeel

[lostoday]

So you and a couple of old wheezers you know spend a million baht a year (only £20,000; $30,000) and that means ALL retirees are spending the same or more?

If that's the case, why are all those visa "agents" inundated with requests from pensioners needing help meeting the 800K requirement.

I don't know of any agents who get requests and I think it is a myth. But quit your complaining. If you want to know do the math. I did and I told you the results.

For your information I have a very active social life and belong to many organizations in Thailand and know thousands of retirees in my capacity of an adviser to certain segments of our retired population.

PM JT and ask him to do a survey if you want to know or do one yourself. Why do you care anyway? Why not just take my word for it? What difference does it make to you?

Well actually the myth you refer to i have seen " advertised" by agents and further seen questions about said agents on TV, so it seems there appears to be some truth to the myth, further one would question the realibilty of any survey on TV of this kind as one would suspect many would lie anyway skewing any data anyway

Why would an old guy lie in an anonymous internet survey? Maybe you are judging people by yourself but it's my experience as men age they don't give a darn what people think of them.

The confidence level of 90% and the plus or minus 5% accuracy takes into consideration the factors of reliability among others.

I would suggest that because the real data is available our younger Thai Visa members are hesitant to accept the reality of the nice place Thailand is for older gentlemen and the substantial contribution the older set makes to Thailand.

I would interpret a hesitation to attempt such a survey more fear than anything else and actually having to admit what a large economic influence the grey haired charmers are.

Edited September 9, 2015 by lostoday

[Cypress Hill]

So you and a couple of old wheezers you know spend a million baht a year (only £20,000; $30,000) and that means ALL retirees are spending the same or more?

If that's the case, why are all those visa "agents" inundated with requests from pensioners needing help meeting the 800K requirement.

I don't know of any agents who get requests and I think it is a myth. But quit your complaining. If you want to know do the math. I did and I told you the results.

For your information I have a very active social life and belong to many organizations in Thailand and know thousands of retirees in my capacity of an adviser to certain segments of our retired population.

PM JT and ask him to do a survey if you want to know or do one yourself. Why do you care anyway? Why not just take my word for it? What difference does it make to you?

You should change your username to "lostouch" - that's how severe these delusions of grandeur appear to any rational human.

I don't need to do the math - the daft $45 billion number you pulled out of your bottom in an earlier post told me all I need to know about what looks like your very tenuous grip on reality

[lostoday]

So you and a couple of old wheezers you know spend a million baht a year (only £20,000; $30,000) and that means ALL retirees are spending the same or more?

If that's the case, why are all those visa "agents" inundated with requests from pensioners needing help meeting the 800K requirement.

I don't know of any agents who get requests and I think it is a myth. But quit your complaining. If you want to know do the math. I did and I told you the results.

For your information I have a very active social life and belong to many organizations in Thailand and know thousands of retirees in my capacity of an adviser to certain segments of our retired population.

PM JT and ask him to do a survey if you want to know or do one yourself. Why do you care anyway? Why not just take my word for it? What difference does it make to you?

You should change your username to "lostouch" - that's how severe these delusions of grandeur appear to any rational human.

I don't need to do the math - the daft $45 billion number you pulled out of your bottom in an earlier post told me all I need to know about what looks like your very tenuous grip on reality

Like I said all bluster and no facts. I did the survey and the contribution of old guys to the Thai economy is close to 7% of GDP. You can call me names all you like. Kind of kindergarten though.

I can imagine an eight grade cypress hill telling the math teacher, "I don't need to do the math."

Call me a liar all you like but you offer nothing more than your highly suspect prejudiced opinion.

[Cypress Hill]

You should change your username to "lostouch" - that's how severe these delusions of grandeur appear to any rational human.

I don't need to do the math - the daft $45 billion number you pulled out of your bottom in an earlier post told me all I need to know about what looks like your very tenuous grip on reality

Like I said all bluster and no facts. I did the survey and the contribution of old guys to the Thai economy is close to 7% of GDP. You can call me names all you like. Kind of kindergarten though.

I can imagine an eight grade cypress hill telling the math teacher, "I don't need to do the math."

Call me a liar all you like but you offer nothing more than your highly suspect prejudiced opinion.

You'll have to point out the name I called you because I can't see it anywhere in my post but let's move on . . .

You should frame your last post because you'll be wanting to know why everyone takes you even less seriously than they do already

You're basically saying that old farang retirees'/guys' contribution to the Thai economy is close to 7% of Thailand's gross domestic product . . . slightly less than the ENTIRE tourism sector

MEDIC !!!

MEDIC !!!

Edited September 9, 2015 by Cypress Hill

[lostoday]

You should change your username to "lostouch" - that's how severe these delusions of grandeur appear to any rational human.

I don't need to do the math - the daft $45 billion number you pulled out of your bottom in an earlier post told me all I need to know about what looks like your very tenuous grip on reality

Like I said all bluster and no facts. I did the survey and the contribution of old guys to the Thai economy is close to 7% of GDP. You can call me names all you like. Kind of kindergarten though.

I can imagine an eight grade cypress hill telling the math teacher, "I don't need to do the math."

Call me a liar all you like but you offer nothing more than your highly suspect prejudiced opinion.

You'll have to point out the name I called you because I can't see it anywhere in my post but let's move on . . .

You should frame your last post because you'll be wanting to know why everyone takes you even less seriously than they do already

You're basically saying that old farang retirees'/guys' contribution to the Thai economy is close to 7% of Thailand's gross domestic product . . . slightly less than the ENTIRE tourism sector

MEDIC !!!

MEDIC !!!

Name calling, "you should change your username to "lostouch"

This time around instead of actually contributing anything to the content of the thread you called me crazy by writing, "MEDIC !!! MEDIC !!!"

Just another troll incapable of presenting any data to participate in a debate and only capable of name calling kindergarten antics.

Next you will attempt to continually insult me in hopes of getting the thread closed on account of bickering because you can't counter with opposing data.

I would really hope that your posts with the name calling as the main content will be removed and not let your troll behavior dominate the thread.

Edited September 9, 2015 by lostoday

[Cypress Hill]

Why should I get involved in the math to disprove your ridiculous assertions?

You might as well be saying that tourism accounts for 50% of Thai GDP