Italian man killed in a head on collision in Samui

[dabhand]

Not cowardice, the driver probably had no idea who he hit. Who was at fault, we don't know.

Many times at the scene of an accident it is very dangerous for the driver who survived to stay.

He left his vehicle, which is 99.99% registered to his name and the officers will see him at his house.

This is true for all nations, the safety of the surviving driver.

In virtually ALL countries it is a serious offence to leave the scene of an accident.

Not in Thailand.. Although I believe you are supposed to report to the nearest police station.

Worked for a time in Kelantan, Malaysia back in the 90's. Attended a briefing from senior transport department officials on issues connected with driving rules and regulations.

Their clear recommendation was that, in the event of being involved in a traffic accident with the local population our staff should make all efforts to leave the scene and head for the nearest police station. The rationale being that staying could lead to some degree of retribution being made against any strangers involved in the accident - even stopping at the accident site was considered dangerous, particularly if first on the scene. Cases of innocent parties being killed in such circumstances was not unknown.

I personally was involved in a minor incident, when travelling though a small village, where a motorbike came across the road without looking, seen me very late and by taking avoiding action, fell over in the middle of the road. I had seen the final part in my rear view mirror and also saw a few bystanders head for the road. Luckily there was a police station a few 100 yards up the road so headed straight there. Explained the situation to the policemen and he told me to wait in the station and headed out to the accident scene. He came back a few minutes later (seemed a lot longer!) and told me there was limited damage to the bike and just a few scratches to the old guy riding the bike. He had a quick look for any damage to my car - found none (although I did find a small dent afterwards). Then told me all was OK and I was fine to go. If I had stopped...........?

A lot of the comments here suggest that 'one size fits all' and that is definitely not the case. Make yourself aware of the local situation and act accordingly.

RIP to the Italian guy.

[evadgib]

1) Dashcams should be mandatory for anyone living here.

2) Samui rescue & all hospital numbers should be all phones in the same group. Language is a separate issue but you get my drift.

A good place to start is http://www.siamdir.com (see 'health' and 'public services' on the right)

HTH

RIP to the deceased.

[timendres]

seeing the nature of the damage, and the fact that the impact was high speed, I bet the truck turned in front of the bike.

[timendres]

Not cowardice, the driver probably had no idea who he hit. Who was at fault, we don't know.

Many times at the scene of an accident it is very dangerous for the driver who survived to stay.

He left his vehicle, which is 99.99% registered to his name and the officers will see him at his house.

This is true for all nations, the safety of the surviving driver.

It is an offence in most countries to leave the scene of an accident. In Australia it is also an offence for witnesses to leave the scene before police arrive. They can also be charged for neglect if they don't offer assistance to the injured. Just here in this male dominated, gutless society does this happen on a daily basis. Man up Thailand & stop hiding behind mommas skirt.

In the US, you will be sued for sure if you attempt to assist the injured in any way unless you are a licensed doctor or nurse. Even just pulling them off a busy road could land you in court. Some States have enacted good samaritan laws to try to protect those who try to assist, but the lawyers still go after them.

[Sviss Geez]

...obviously the truck is on the wrong side of the road....let's see what b.s. excuse the driver comes up with this time...

How about swerving in order to try to avoid the collision?

[Sviss Geez]

Not cowardice, the driver probably had no idea who he hit. Who was at fault, we don't know.

Many times at the scene of an accident it is very dangerous for the driver who survived to stay.

He left his vehicle, which is 99.99% registered to his name and the officers will see him at his house.

This is true for all nations, the safety of the surviving driver.

What a load of crap you have written , it is an offence to leave the scene of an accident no matter where in the world you live and looking at the position of the vehicle it is clear to see it is on the wrong side of the road, by the way it was reported that the deceased and bike were some 40 meters from the stationary vehicle which shows the force the deceased must have been hit by. I have lived on Samui for many years this sort of incident is getting more common it is no longer a safe place on Samui roads but no one seems to do anything about it R.I.P to the deceased and condolences to his family I hope they find the person who was driving the vehicle to leave the accident in my view is an act of cowardice

With the greatest of respect, in some countries it is normal to leave the scene of an accident as soon as possible and no one would take legal action against you if you did. In all countries where I have lived, it is perfectly legal and advisable to leave the scene of an accident when you need urgent medical attention. Another is if you have reason to be concerned for your personal safety. In one African country I know, you should leave the scene of an accident even if you were only the passenger in a vehicle for your personal safety. In some countries, you are advised as a foreigner not to stop at the scene of an accident as it will be assumed that you were in some way involved.

We know nothing about the circumstances of this accident other than it involved a truck and a motorbike driven by the now dead Italian.

You should have quit when you were behind. This is nothing to do with respect but your intelligence or lack of.... If you have nothing intelligent to say best to say nothing!

Like you just did, you mean?

[CarolJadzia]

seeing the nature of the damage, and the fact that the impact was high speed, I bet the truck turned in front of the bike.

That does not figure, the damage is to the front of the vehicle. If it had turned in front of the rider then the impact would be to the side.

I would surmise that the vehicle crossed onto the other side of the road in typical Thai style - against the flow.

The bike rider was unable to deal with the surprise situation and hit the car head on.

'Takes two to tangle'

But there is not enough information here to get a true picture.

I would suggest there is nowhere on the Samui ring road that there is a safe enough stretch to do the speed that would cause that amount of damage to the vehicle.

But there are shops all over Samui that will happily hire a hire powered big bike to anyone stupid enough to leave their passport.

[spidermike007]

How very sad. RIP. I see cars and trucks racing and screaming down the streets always, overtaking on the wrong side of the road and even around bends just to get to their destination a few seconds faster.

Every time I go out on my bike, I can guarantee that I will need to take evasive action at some point, be it a crazy driver, someone opening their car door or exiting a road/driveway without looking, a rabid attacking dog, a snake, power lines falling down, holes in the road.... etc

The roads department's solution? Paint some lines, or install a water fountain in the middle of a circle.

And the police refuse to engage in any sort of traffic safety campaign, even though they are well aware of the numbers of deaths and injuries. And the local, state, and federal authorities refuse to engage, and allow the carnage to continue, on a daily basis. This is perhaps the greatest single failure, in the long and storied history of the lack of governance on Samui. All of that blood is on their hands, as many, many things could have been done, and should have been done to protect the local people and the tourists who are being slaughtered on those roads. It is a killing field. The numbers are staggering. Does anyone take notice, who is in a position of authority? Does the super lazy mayor do anything about this enormous problem? No.

My friend who was hit by an oncoming bike the other night is still in a coma, after an operation on her brain. We all heard about the Italian man who was killed two nights ago, by a truck who fled the scene. Well, that is happening daily, we just don't always hear about it. The situation on Samui is a tragedy, and an emergency that is not being addressed by anybody. Drive with tremendous caution, as few places on earth have as many drivers with both a lack of talent and a complete disregard for safety. One of the biggest offenders is the jungle cruise jeeps. If they are not driving off the side of mountains, they are taking out drivers on the Ring Road, with their excessive speeds. I have another friend who was hit by one of their drivers. He ended up in the hospital for two weeks, with a cracked skull. The driver did not even stop. He was thrown 40 meters in the air, and the driver did not stop. And he was told if he wanted to pursue a claim against this criminal organization he would be killed.

And since no deterrent exists on the island, they all continue to drive like madmen. It is a dream situation, for the ambulance operators and the hospitals. It is their perfect storm.

[CarolJadzia]

I do agree with most of what you say Spidermike, I hope your friend comes out of the coma soon.

but it is not fair to say the Police are not interested. I have discussed bringing Advanced Rider Training with Police Officers in Maenam and they are very interested in learning. The one thing missing from the equation is funding. I am a fully qualified British Motorcycle Instructor Trainer with 30 years experience who would love to start a training school on the island. But what incentive is there for people to come to me for training?

In the UK everyone must pass a complete a basic motorcycle riding competence training course before being allowed on the road, then there is a stepped three part driving test that requires training to be undertaken to get to the required standard. The Thai Driving Test is at the level we expect from novices on day one. The average novice will take five days training to get to British Test Standards.

But someone with no experience on a motorcycle can jump on a hire bike, even a high powered big bike and ride off around the Island just as long as they foolishly leave their passport.

There are other problems like Thai Culture not wanting to confront people and also dangers, many police officers are wary of the standard practices used by western Police Officers. They lack the support and training required and are not well paid like many Western Police officers are. Would you risk you life for minimum wage when the vehicle you stop could have an armed criminal inside? Ok that's at the extreme end but unfortunately it also does happen.

The problem is everyone is waiting for a miracle cure but it is not coming soon. The only answer is to take a lesson out of Buddhism and start looking to self. Lead by example, learn defensive riding skills, work with the Thai's you know to try and improve things. Wear proper protective riding gear - not just something that looks like a push bike helmet and flip-flops!

Thailand can change, I come from the country that originated the Rockers and Cafe Racers of the 60's, my father was one. I have been part of taking UK training and testing from just being able to demonstrate you can ride round the block, to where it is today. Not that we are sitting back on our laurels, the UK roads still see three deaths a day ( compared to the 30+ in Thailand) and we will continue working to reduce that. Which leads me to new thinking.

Recently there has been much research into how the human brain works, we now have a far better understanding of how accidents happen. e.g. A common comment when a car pulls out is "sorry mate I did not see you", we now understand motion camouflage so we can lesson the chances of it happening. Incidentally this is where the Thai government has been given bad advice - some safety bod thought it was a good idea to separate bikes from other vehicles hence the motorcycle lanes in Phuket which actually increase the danger to Riders not lessen it.

We can improve road safety in Thailand but it's for everyone to do it themselves.

No Surprise / No Accident

[PoorSucker]

Would you risk you life for minimum wage when the vehicle you stop could have an armed criminal inside?

Last year a friend of mine in the RTP got shot after trying to disarm a yabba man at the PTP station in lake road in Chaweng.

[CarolJadzia]

Would you risk you life for minimum wage when the vehicle you stop could have an armed criminal inside?

Last year a friend of mine in the RTP got shot after trying to disarm a yabba man at the PTP station in lake road in Chaweng.

I so wish it was not that way but unfortunately TiT!

It can change but not in standard Western ways.

There are old issues with hierarchy as well

To create change we have to change core attitudes by working with the current ways to improve things.

Tell a Thai he is wrong and he will ignore you. Show a Thai a better way and he will copy you.

[mcfish]

Not cowardice, the driver probably had no idea who he hit. Who was at fault, we don't know.

Many times at the scene of an accident it is very dangerous for the driver who survived to stay.

He left his vehicle, which is 99.99% registered to his name and the officers will see him at his house.

This is true for all nations, the safety of the surviving driver.

Really? a Thai is going to get beaten by a mob of Thais because he killed a farang?

[NCC1701A]

...obviously the truck is on the wrong side of the road....let's see what b.s. excuse the driver comes up with this time...

he lost control on the ice...

[evadgib]

Would you risk you life for minimum wage when the vehicle you stop could have an armed criminal inside?

Last year a friend of mine in the RTP got shot after trying to disarm a yabba man at the PTP station in lake road in Chaweng.

I so wish it was not that way but unfortunately TiT!

It can change but not in standard Western ways.

There are old issues with hierarchy as well

To create change we have to change core attitudes by working with the current ways to improve things.

Tell a Thai he is wrong and he will ignore you. Show a Thai a better way and he will copy you.

I nearly took the 'like' back upon realizing your PIF (Public Information Film) showed driver/pax weren't wearing seatbelts & the Policeman didn't have a chin strap or suitable protection

[CarolJadzia]

I nearly took the 'like' back upon realizing your PIF (Public Information Film) showed driver/pax weren't wearing seatbelts & the Policeman didn't have a chin strap or suitable protection

Yes but I also hope you noticed how old the clip was and that it's reference was more towards the 'Mai pen rai' attitude shown by the people who considered themselves a higher class. This is still very evident today. Only now they drive big 4x4 pickups.

[Rooo]

1) Dashcams should be mandatory for anyone living here.

2) Samui rescue & all hospital numbers should be all phones in the same group. Language is a separate issue but you get my drift.

A good place to start is http://www.siamdir.com (see 'health' and 'public services' on the right)

HTH

RIP to the deceased.

Hospitals & rescue also here:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/98300-important-faqs-for-the-islands-samui-phangan-tao/#entry4285432

[pork]

the roads on those islands are deadly must be careful and always wear a helmet , this young fella was probly speeding by the look of that dent he made.

[nod]

How very sad. RIP. I see cars and trucks racing and screaming down the streets always, overtaking on the wrong side of the road and even around bends just to get to their destination a few seconds faster.

Every time I go out on my bike, I can guarantee that I will need to take evasive action at some point, be it a crazy driver, someone opening their car door or exiting a road/driveway without looking, a rabid attacking dog, a snake, power lines falling down, holes in the road.... etc

The roads department's solution? Paint some lines, or install a water fountain in the middle of a circle.

And the police refuse to engage in any sort of traffic safety campaign, even though they are well aware of the numbers of deaths and injuries. And the local, state, and federal authorities refuse to engage, and allow the carnage to continue, on a daily basis. This is perhaps the greatest single failure, in the long and storied history of the lack of governance on Samui. All of that blood is on their hands, as many, many things could have been done, and should have been done to protect the local people and the tourists who are being slaughtered on those roads. It is a killing field. The numbers are staggering. Does anyone take notice, who is in a position of authority? Does the super lazy mayor do anything about this enormous problem? No.

My friend who was hit by an oncoming bike the other night is still in a coma, after an operation on her brain. We all heard about the Italian man who was killed two nights ago, by a truck who fled the scene. Well, that is happening daily, we just don't always hear about it. The situation on Samui is a tragedy, and an emergency that is not being addressed by anybody. Drive with tremendous caution, as few places on earth have as many drivers with both a lack of talent and a complete disregard for safety. One of the biggest offenders is the jungle cruise jeeps. If they are not driving off the side of mountains, they are taking out drivers on the Ring Road, with their excessive speeds. I have another friend who was hit by one of their drivers. He ended up in the hospital for two weeks, with a cracked skull. The driver did not even stop. He was thrown 40 meters in the air, and the driver did not stop. And he was told if he wanted to pursue a claim against this criminal organization he would be killed.

And since no deterrent exists on the island, they all continue to drive like madmen. It is a dream situation, for the ambulance operators and the hospitals. It is their perfect storm.

"40 meters in the air" !!!

If so, he was incredibly lucky to survive !

That's nearly the height of two and a half coconut trees ! ( Tall ones !)

I sincerely trust he is feeling a lot better now.

Agree about the jungle safari jeeps, they are a real menace !!

[spidermike007]

How very sad. RIP. I see cars and trucks racing and screaming down the streets always, overtaking on the wrong side of the road and even around bends just to get to their destination a few seconds faster.

Every time I go out on my bike, I can guarantee that I will need to take evasive action at some point, be it a crazy driver, someone opening their car door or exiting a road/driveway without looking, a rabid attacking dog, a snake, power lines falling down, holes in the road.... etc

The roads department's solution? Paint some lines, or install a water fountain in the middle of a circle.

And the police refuse to engage in any sort of traffic safety campaign, even though they are well aware of the numbers of deaths and injuries. And the local, state, and federal authorities refuse to engage, and allow the carnage to continue, on a daily basis. This is perhaps the greatest single failure, in the long and storied history of the lack of governance on Samui. All of that blood is on their hands, as many, many things could have been done, and should have been done to protect the local people and the tourists who are being slaughtered on those roads. It is a killing field. The numbers are staggering. Does anyone take notice, who is in a position of authority? Does the super lazy mayor do anything about this enormous problem? No.

My friend who was hit by an oncoming bike the other night is still in a coma, after an operation on her brain. We all heard about the Italian man who was killed two nights ago, by a truck who fled the scene. Well, that is happening daily, we just don't always hear about it. The situation on Samui is a tragedy, and an emergency that is not being addressed by anybody. Drive with tremendous caution, as few places on earth have as many drivers with both a lack of talent and a complete disregard for safety. One of the biggest offenders is the jungle cruise jeeps. If they are not driving off the side of mountains, they are taking out drivers on the Ring Road, with their excessive speeds. I have another friend who was hit by one of their drivers. He ended up in the hospital for two weeks, with a cracked skull. The driver did not even stop. He was thrown 40 meters in the air, and the driver did not stop. And he was told if he wanted to pursue a claim against this criminal organization he would be killed.

And since no deterrent exists on the island, they all continue to drive like madmen. It is a dream situation, for the ambulance operators and the hospitals. It is their perfect storm.

"40 meters in the air" !!!

If so, he was incredibly lucky to survive !

That's nearly the height of two and a half coconut trees ! ( Tall ones !)

I sincerely trust he is feeling a lot better now.

Agree about the jungle safari jeeps, they are a real menace !!

Meant he was propelled 40 meters forward in the air, not 40 meters high. Yes, he was lucky he survived. His skull cracked, and they thought he might lose some of his facilities, but he seems to be regaining them slowly.

The jungle jeeps are perhaps the biggest single threat. Plus the concrete trucks, and the bikes being driven by unlicensed 12 year olds, and the boy bike racers, and the taxis, and the SUV's, all being driven by both locals and foreigners who cannot possibly reach their destination fast enough. There are so many hazards on the roads of Samui one cannot list them all. And what is the honorable Mayor Ramnate doing to improve traffic safety on the island, on his guard? Nothing. That is basically what he does. Nothing.

[Basil B]

Not cowardice, the driver probably had no idea who he hit. Who was at fault, we don't know.

Many times at the scene of an accident it is very dangerous for the driver who survived to stay.

He left his vehicle, which is 99.99% registered to his name and the officers will see him at his house.

This is true for all nations, the safety of the surviving driver.

In virtually ALL countries it is a serious offence to leave the scene of an accident.

Not in Thailand.. Although I believe you are supposed to report to the nearest police station.

There was a serious boating/diver accident a few months back on Koh Tao where the boat skipper was alleged to have run away... reading many different accounts of the story I understand he went and hid until the police arrived because there was a lynch mob who wanted to take the law into their own hands.

Clearly when you are in serious accident and you are waiting for the police to arrive with a lot of people around shouting at you, questioning you, telling you different, calling you a murderer, calling you a lire... one will be pretty confused about what happened when the police come to getting a statement.

[spidermike007]

Not cowardice, the driver probably had no idea who he hit. Who was at fault, we don't know.

Many times at the scene of an accident it is very dangerous for the driver who survived to stay.

He left his vehicle, which is 99.99% registered to his name and the officers will see him at his house.

This is true for all nations, the safety of the surviving driver.

In virtually ALL countries it is a serious offence to leave the scene of an accident.

Not in Thailand.. Although I believe you are supposed to report to the nearest police station.

There was a serious boating/diver accident a few months back on Koh Tao where the boat skipper was alleged to have run away... reading many different accounts of the story I understand he went and hid until the police arrived because there was a lynch mob who wanted to take the law into their own hands.

Clearly when you are in serious accident and you are waiting for the police to arrive with a lot of people around shouting at you, questioning you, telling you different, calling you a murderer, calling you a lire... one will be pretty confused about what happened when the police come to getting a statement.

We all appreciate you defending the hit and run culprit. He probably does too.

[Basil B]

I was not defending him, I was just pointing out why sometimes it is not wise to hang a round at the scene of an accident...

[optad]

...

The problem is everyone is waiting for a miracle cure but it is not coming soon. The only answer is to take a lesson out of Buddhism and start looking to self.

This is a critical part of the bigger problem not the 'answer' in Thailand.

Achieving solutions to so many social problems in Thailand where the 'up to you' ethos is reinforced by a permissive application of their Buddhist philosophy accounts for much of the social lassitude responsible for pain and infringement on other peoples rights.

'Look to self' is an idealistic and fanciful spiritual state most Thais or even most Buddhist just do not achieve. I understand what you are saying but it flies in the face of the numbers on the street, the manner Buddhism is interpreted and then employed and the lack of any sense of 'others' even after the journey to understand self.

Pragmatically, it can be a license to be responsible only to oneself and to the exclusion of the common weal and that is said with regret.

[Briggsy]

Is the truck clamped?

[uksomchai]

The one OFF I have had on my bike was caused by a Frenchman walking up to the kerb, looking to his left and upon seeing nothing coming stepped straight into my path. I have also witnessed many times European and American people set off and drive away on the wrong side of the road, which to them is the right side.

It isn't always the fault of the Thai driver as much as Farangs like to think it is.

[CarolJadzia]

...

The problem is everyone is waiting for a miracle cure but it is not coming soon. The only answer is to take a lesson out of Buddhism and start looking to self.

This is a critical part of the bigger problem not the 'answer' in Thailand.

Achieving solutions to so many social problems in Thailand where the 'up to you' ethos is reinforced by a permissive application of their Buddhist philosophy accounts for much of the social lassitude responsible for pain and infringement on other peoples rights.

'Look to self' is an idealistic and fanciful spiritual state most Thais or even most Buddhist just do not achieve. I understand what you are saying but it flies in the face of the numbers on the street, the manner Buddhism is interpreted and then employed and the lack of any sense of 'others' even after the journey to understand self.

Pragmatically, it can be a license to be responsible only to oneself and to the exclusion of the common weal and that is said with regret.

I understand your point, but my reference was more aimed at the new thinking behind 'No Surprise / No Accident'

The idea is to change the way we use the roads to account for the ways of other road users. More pro-active than reactive.

E.G. 'Sorry Mate I Didn't See You' accidents happen all over the world. The current standard practice is to blame the car drivers for not seeing bike riders.

Our way is to work out why they do not see us and change how we approach junctions so that they have a better chance of seeing us.

I don't want to rely on others doing the expected thing as so often they do not, especially in Thailand.