Koh Tao murders: 2 DNA profiles from alleged murder weapon do not match defendants' DNA

[Linky]

some of you i feel are being rather harsh on the Miller family . As a family member of a hideous crime , i for sure would want all the pertinent evidence brought to light .

now we all know that vast amounts of pertinent evidence had been lost , used up , and not make available for the defence , but the one thing in the power of the miller family was to be able to confirm one way of another that the broken phone was in fact David's .

The fact that this does not look great for one of the suspects is tricky , and you could almost suspect that the whole truth has not been divulged . in my mind at least i am drawn back to the running man , who seemingly held a phone at about the time he was looking for his clothes and guitar .

for those of you not in the know , i am well and truly in the not guilty camp , but we do know the lad is a petty thief , and bad at working out how to deal with a suspected crime scene accessory after the fact .

We dont even know he is a petty thief. He said he found it. Doesnt make him a thief, unless it can be proven otherwise.

[StealthEnergiser]

Koh Tao murders: hearings conclude with allegations of sexual abuse

Koh Samui Provincial Court in southern Thailand on Saturday concluded with the testimony of Win Zaw Htun (a.k.a. Wai Phyu), one of two Burmese migrants who stand accused of the murder of British tourists David Miller and Hannah Witheridge on the resort island of Koh Tao in Thailand last year.

According to Andy Hall, a British rights activist at the court, Win Zaw Htun claimed he was sexually abused by Thai police officers and forced to confess.

“Importantly, [Win Zaw Htun] yesterday pointed out in court, based on still video images, two of the police officers he alleges tortured/abused him,” he wrote online. “One is apparently a senior Thai police officer.”

http://www.dvb.no/news/koh-tao-murders-hearings-conclude-with-allegations-of-sexual-abuse-myanmar-burma/58079

[glenmohr]

Another troll post. Why don't you troll elsewhere. Nothing you say is factual

Nothing factual?

"Mr Waiyawuth said a quarter of the indicators from one of the suspects matched the partial profile but that did not mean he could be included as a suspect.

DNA experts agree that DNA profiling demands a 99.9999% accurate match."

I didn't find the article that cited the cross examination questions by the prosecution, although I had quoted it in a previous post of mine:

"The prosecution asked Mr Waiyawuth if the third, incomplete, profile could belong to one of the suspects. He replied that only a quarter of the indicators from one of the suspects matched the partial profile.

The prosecution said: “So his participation cannot be ruled out.”

Mr Waiyawith replied: “No, but he cannot be included either.”"

A partial match doesn't provide positive proof that the DNA recovered and that of suspect are the same person, it also means that such a result can't be used to support the claim that it proves the suspect is not the source of the DNA.

As I said before. Another troll post. Nothing you say is factual. Why don't you in polite language, go and bury yourself in Koh Tao diving school.

Aaaaaaaaah, you know too....................

Not sure that I can understand how a person with maybe more than just a financial interest in the proceedings can continue to brazenly participate without disclosing his/her personal connection to the events of this topic.

[lucky11]

Please refrain from calling me a troll simply because my version of events differs from yours.

Simply answer this question - how was it possible that David's phone was stolen from his pocket by Wei if, as they claimed, that they "never went anywhere near the crime scene" in fact they didn't even know that a rape and double murder had taken place on the beach that night if I recall rightly!!

Also, don't you think that the fact that they incriminated themselves by admitting that they violated Hannah's body carries a little bit of weight as to their guilt!!

If you can answer these two questions in a convincing manner then you may call me for trolling.

[Briggsy]

Thai authorities have a bad habit of twisting, misquoting or outright inventing statements from foreign sources. The rationale is that these foreign sources are more believable than the equivalent Thai institutions which says a lot.

This speaking (read : lying) on behalf of others is lapped up by the Thai press which usually relies heavily on govt. or police press statements.

This particular statement is confused and confusing. It is absolutely not clear what role the Miller family played, if any, and when any action was taken by them. But their name has been plastered into the headline and the opening paragraph to dramatically raise the credibility of the story. A lot more clarification is required here.

[Gweiloman]

Please refrain from calling me a troll simply because my version of events differs from yours.

Simply answer this question - how was it possible that David's phone was stolen from his pocket by Wei if, as they claimed, that they "never went anywhere near the crime scene" in fact they didn't even know that a rape and double murder had taken place on the beach that night if I recall rightly!!

Also, don't you think that the fact that they incriminated themselves by admitting that they violated Hannah's body carries a little bit of weight as to their guilt!!

If you can answer these two questions in a convincing manner then you may call me for trolling.

When was it ever said or proven that David's phone was stolen from his pocket by Wei? This statement of yours proves conclusively that you are trolling.

Have you ever been tortured into confessing something that is untrue? I'm sure you will say no. But that could mean either a) you have never been tortured or you did not break under torture. I will go for the former.

Trained military personnel has cracked under torture. What chance do two young lads have?

So I stand by my original post

[JLCrab]

Please refrain from calling me a troll simply because my version of events differs from yours.

Simply answer this question - how was it possible that David's phone was stolen from his pocket by Wei if, as they claimed, that they "never went anywhere near the crime scene" in fact they didn't even know that a rape and double murder had taken place on the beach that night if I recall rightly!!

Also, don't you think that the fact that they incriminated themselves by admitting that they violated Hannah's body carries a little bit of weight as to their guilt!!

If you can answer these two questions in a convincing manner then you may call me for trolling.

I will ask you again...The B2's DNA was not on the murder weapon....Others were...

Your thoughts.......?

The DNA most most likely to be on the hoe after nearly a year's time is that from the workers who used the hoe for extended periods of time prior to 14 SEP 2014. DNA from anyone who held the hoe for short periods of time might be less prevalent.

Edited October 12, 2015 by JLCrab

[fritzzz25]

As Andy has stated

"Today, Wai Phyo testified in court he found an iPhone on the beach around 4am in the morning on 15th Sep 2014. Wai Phyo's friend testified on Oct 14 2014 previously in a pre-trial hearing that he has smashed this phone up and dumped it behind his house after Wai Phyo found it and gave it to him as was worried whose it was and that it may be related for the murders. That's all that has come to light today. Wai Phyo testified today he didn't know whether the phone the prosecution and police have in their possession and which allegedly matches the IMEI of David Miller's phone (as confirmed only by the deceased's parents, although the prosecution claim the UK government confirmed this phone as David's phone but the UK government deny they ever confirmed such information to the Thai Government) is the phone he found in the early morning of 15th Sep 2014 whilst out alone looking for his guitar and clothes. Wai Phyo denied that he took the mobile phone from the same place where the bodies of the deceased were found. Hope that clears up what was discussed today in court."

Questions were raised, and this was the reply

"You jump to many conclusions when you were not in the court and didn't hear the full testimony, my friend. Wai Phyo testified today he found the phone but he didn't care much for it as it was no battery. He asked his friend however to charge it and when charged, found it was security locked. Wai Phyo then gave the phone to his friend to do as they wanted. When he asked about the phone, his friend said he had already smashed it and thrown it behind the house. His friend also testified the same as that on Oct 14th 2014."

Available to the public on a famous social media site. This can clear up some of the information that has been posted by the media.

[AGareth2]

No semen

no evidence of rape

one lad murdered the 2 victims for a phone?

Would anyone here take on DM armed with a hoe for his phone?

[balo]

boomerangutang, on 12 Oct 2015 - 03:06, said:boomerangutang, on 12 Oct 2015 - 03:06, said:

Could police have 'planted' the phone? Initially, they said the found phone belonged to Hannah, then they changed their story.

When the defendant (note: one defendant, not two) claims he found the phone on the beach, what time did that happen ....before the crime? after?

If he made that claim during torture, than it means absolutely nothing. He could admit to being The Pope under torture.

The worst the phone incident shows, is one of the defendants might be a petty thief who took something off a beach.

You need to read Andy Hall's facebook post which was reposted by StealthEnergiser a short while ago. Wai Phyo testified that he found the phone at around 4:00am on 15 September while he was out looking for his guitar and clothes.

While this doesn't look good for Wai Phyo, it is still only circumstantial evidence linking him to the murders. It doesn't in itself prove that he and Zaw Lin murdered Hannah Witheridge and David Miller. We should also consider the possibility that he is telling the truth when he says he came across the phone by accident.

I wonder what happened to the sunglasses he is also charged with stealing?

This is nothing new really , he found the phone by accident and took it home with him. It should not change the outcome of this case unless there is more evidence waiting to be revealed . He will not be charged with murder for stealing a phone.

[Darkknight666]

Please refrain from calling me a troll simply because my version of events differs from yours.

Simply answer this question - how was it possible that David's phone was stolen from his pocket by Wei if, as they claimed, that they "never went anywhere near the crime scene" in fact they didn't even know that a rape and double murder had taken place on the beach that night if I recall rightly!!

Also, don't you think that the fact that they incriminated themselves by admitting that they violated Hannah's body carries a little bit of weight as to their guilt!!

If you can answer these two questions in a convincing manner then you may call me for trolling.

I know this wasn't to me, but, I don't take their initial confession into account because it's been retracted and accusations of torture and even testimony states that the confessions were not given freely.. Knowing that they're in police custody, essentially at the Mercy of the RTP day and night after being tortured by the RTP I'm not sure they would say anything even if they knew exactly what happened.

I can't rule out that the Wei wasn't involved being that he was so close to the crime scene when the crime or bodies would have been seen by Wei for sure at 4am. I'm not so sure they're absolutely innocent. After saying all that, I do NOT think they're the prime assailants, they may have been near, they may have been ordered to help stage the scene, who knows really... But the investigation and behavior by RTP and the prosecution says to me there are assailants involved with tons of clout.... A lot of pull and those people, the headmans family or staff... Or both, killed David and Hannah.

If it were strictly the B2 all along this trial would look much much different. I believe whole heartedly the killer is either a VIP (dodo) or acted one behalf of a VIP.

The whole thing is making me quite sick.

[StealthEnergiser]

https://twitter.com/Atomicalandy/status/653459412602892288

[balo]

If Wei was at the scene and observed the murder , wouldnt it work in his favor to tell the court who he saw that night on the beach ?

If he is innocent and set free he will go back to Burma anyway so he shouldnt worry about his life will be in danger if he talks.

[beammeup]

OK so if I understand this correctly, the police compared semen found inside Hanna to these guys among many others and concluded a match, interrogated them and found them to be at the crime scene, and also found one of the victims phones. The police due to incompetence did not follow correct procedures and have botched up the DNA evidence. Now they have testified that at least one was in the area at 04:00. You guys all still think they are innocent?

[Dogmatix]

The only evidence the prosecution have linking the defendants to the rape charge is the police statements asserting that they found the defendants' DNA inside the rape victim. There is no evidence whatsoever that links the defendants to the murders. The prosecution's case must be that whoever committed the rape must have committed the murders as well - not necessarily the case but the best argument they can come with, since they were unable or unwilling to provide any forensic evidence specifically relating to the mirders and failed to even submit a murder weapon in David's case or explain how his wounds were caused.

So the most crucial evidence relies only on police say so. They refused to allow independent testing of this evidence, giving unconvincing excuses, and then refused to even provide documentation relating to chain of custody and the DNA match, apparently out of terror that an Australian expert was in Samui ready to testify on their documentation which they presumably didn't think likely to withstand scrutiny by a foreign professional. Hannah's clothes and other vital pieces of forensic evidence were deliberately withheld by police who also refused to allow the defense access to crime scene photographs giving an excuse that was obviously a lie. It also seems that evidence from Norwich coroner casts serious doubt on the police that Hannah was raped which would remove the central plank from the police and prosecution case completely.

Despite all of these setbacks the prosecution remains under considerable pressure to win its trumped up case in the 'national interests'. To show their bosses they are still making their KPIs, they pull one more stunt using help from their buddies in the British police and FCO. The latter cannot be seen to be helping directly again as they are in enough trouble for aiding and abetting a notoriously corrupt foreign police force in a death penalty case. But with covert help from British police and the FCO It proves easy enough to manipulate the distraught family of one of the victims again and the Thai Embassy in London is used for cover. It sounds spectacular in the sensationalist headlines but actually all they have is another piece of circumstantial evidence that we'll have been falsified anyway. It is obvious from the deeply suspicious timing that the prosecution had no intention of allowing any independent analysis of this evidence or allow the defence to comment on it.

[Darkknight666]

boomerangutang, on 12 Oct 2015 - 03:06, said:boomerangutang, on 12 Oct 2015 - 03:06, said:

Could police have 'planted' the phone? Initially, they said the found phone belonged to Hannah, then they changed their story.

When the defendant (note: one defendant, not two) claims he found the phone on the beach, what time did that happen ....before the crime? after?

If he made that claim during torture, than it means absolutely nothing. He could admit to being The Pope under torture.

The worst the phone incident shows, is one of the defendants might be a petty thief who took something off a beach.

You need to read Andy Hall's facebook post which was reposted by StealthEnergiser a short while ago. Wai Phyo testified that he found the phone at around 4:00am on 15 September while he was out looking for his guitar and clothes.

While this doesn't look good for Wai Phyo, it is still only circumstantial evidence linking him to the murders. It doesn't in itself prove that he and Zaw Lin murdered Hannah Witheridge and David Miller. We should also consider the possibility that he is telling the truth when he says he came across the phone by accident.

I wonder what happened to the sunglasses he is also charged with stealing?

This is nothing new really , he found the phone by accident and took it home with him. It should not change the outcome of this case unless there is more evidence waiting to be revealed . He will not be charged with murder for stealing a phone.

Well maybe not but in my eyes, after claiming they were asleep in their room all this time, Once on the stand he says he went back out for his shoes?, saw the phone but not the scene? I don't know man, I think the B2 have a pretty damn good idea what happened only they can't say anything. Don't forget, it would be easy as pie for RTP to "suicide" the B2 if they don't comply, and they've already been tortured and coerced. They most likely still fear for their lives, fear from a death penalty hanging over their heads and fear of being covertly murdered in police custody... I know I would do my best to get out of the situation alive. Then again, if Wei was a part in some way why wouldn't he confess to get a halved sentence? My guess is even if he wanted to he would be too scared of the consequences.

Mon Toovicien is the key to this puzzle, that man needs the screws out to his balls.... Figuratively speaking. He certainly is the closest thing to vulnerable in this case there is. Come on nail the guy RTP and get to the bottom of this.

Oh lastly, they're going the read the verdict on December 24th? Some timing, eh?

[stephenterry]

If Wei was at the scene and observed the murder , wouldnt it work in his favor to tell the court who he saw that night on the beach ?

If he is innocent and set free he will go back to Burma anyway so he shouldnt worry about his life will be in danger if he talks.

Balo, he will be stuck in jail until the verdict at the very least - plenty of time for any assailant to kill him. I am also not convinced Wei's testimony was totally complete, but no way could he implicate other more powerful Thais - self preservation is a powerful motivator in his position.

[deecee10]

It is pretty shocking to see what David Miller's family did yesterday.

It would be interesting to know exactly what their motivations are and exactly what they were told about the investigation and supposed evidence against the B2. Surely they can't believe the RTP's version 100%, anybody with even a smidgen of intelligence can see it makes zero sense.

The development about the phone does however shed some light on what time he supposedly went home. Surely some cctv could show his to be a lie or not. But as the trial is done i think that particular loose end will be used to finish him sadly.

A disgusting, shambolic excuse for a trial just got worse. Lord help us if we ever get in a similar situation here.

Give the family a little bit of credit...as they are more clued in than you will ever be. You're speculation is just that...speculation...some would call your speculation "arm chair quarterbacking".

And what do you call your speculation?

[Darkknight666]

If Wei was at the scene and observed the murder , wouldnt it work in his favor to tell the court who he saw that night on the beach ?

If he is innocent and set free he will go back to Burma anyway so he shouldnt worry about his life will be in danger if he talks.

That's what I think too.. BUT... They're in police custody and rocking the boat could get him killed. I can imagine that if the torture allegations are true the B2 are likely terrified of the police and what they can/will do to steer this case in their preferred direction.

[MockingJay]

British Family Intervenes In Thai Murders Trial

LONDON: -- David Miller's family take receipt of a package from the Thai Embassy in London which they claim contains vital evidence.

The family of British murder victim David Miller, who died on the Thai island of Koh Tao a year ago, have intervened in the trial to try and prove their son's phone was in the possession of one of the accused.

In a dramatic twist in the final two hours of testimony, the prosecution took receipt of a package from the Thai Embassy in London, which they said confirmed the unique IMEI number of a phone found near the lodgings of one of the accused Burmese migrant workers.

Wei Phyo, 22, has not denied finding a phone on the beach on the night of the murders.

He said he picked it out of the sand some distance from the murder scene and took it home but he could not open it as it was locked with a passcode.

"The next day we heard about the murders and we were worried it might belong to someone involved," he told the court.

"My friend smashed up the phone and threw it into the undergrowth behind our hut."

The confirmation of ownership of the broken phone adds to the considerable circumstantial evidence stacked against Wei Phyo and his friend Zaw Lin, also 22.

Full story: http://news.sky.com/story/1567511/british-family-intervenes-in-thai-murders-trial

-- sky NEWS 2015-10-12

If the Millers are so concerned for the court to find out the truth, why do they hand in circumstancial evidence and did not:

1) Enforce that the RTP or Scotland Yard collects, views and confiscates ALL (back then) available CCTV tapes including the ones from the jetty and the AC Bar?

2) Enforce that (if not Thai authorties, then at least) Scotland Yard took in Christopher Ware AND Sean McAnna, as well as all returning "friends" of Hannah and David for interrogation?

Just to name two things any logical thinking person would have done after seeing the whole case derail during the first days of the so-called "investigation"... Now they send a box that has to do something with David's telephone that was found in the jungle? Are they really that naive to still believe the B2 are guilty? F me, folks, but this is totally beyond me. Are these people blind? Yes, it was shocking they stated to be happy with the Thai led "investigation", but now they send over circumstancial evidence to prove the patsies had found David's phone? Monty Python is lame slapstick compared to this!!!!

Photo shows someone that I, if I were David's or Hannah's father, would have invited to my garage for some man to man talks... Look at his right hand.

Edited October 12, 2015 by MockingJay

[AleG]

"Mr Miller's family had apparently secured the IMEI number from David's computer"

So, was this done forensically with a software that ensures no alteration of the boot record of the computer? If one wants to bring computer evidence into a trial, they have to ensure the data has not been manipulated in any way. The way this is done is with digital forensic software like EnCase. It also has to show that the computer has not been booted up without EnCase attached to ensure data is intact. Again, no chain of evidence on this. AND no proof the the Met Police did this. Which they said they did not do because of it being a death penalty case.......

I can understand the family wants justice, but for them to say "oh hey, we found this on David's computer, here we wrote it down for you on a piece of paper can you make sure the court hears about it" TWO hours before the end of the trial.

"Something is rotten in the state of Denmark" - Shakespeare

The only rotten thing I see there is your insinuations that the Miller family fabricated the evidence.

[StealthEnergiser]

And here is how HARD it is to change the IMEI number of a phone.

http://firstposttech.blogspot.ca/2014/10/iphoneimeinumberchanger.html

"Why Should I Use It

You May Be Thinking That Why I Should Use Mobile Imei Number Changer. The Answer To Your Question Is That If You Change Your Mobile Imei Number Than You Can Unblock Your Phone If It Is Blocked By Your Operator.It Helps You If You Have A Stolen Phone... (or if you need to fabricate evidence in a murder trial)

If You Use This Software Than You Remain Safe.."

I also never realised it was so easy to change the IMEI Number good info.

[bamukloy]

He admitted he found A phone on the beach. He admitted he smashed A phone the next day. Can the prosecution PROVE beyond a reasonable doubt that the phone is the EXACT same one he handled. As you can see, one can change an IMEI number quite easily, and it isn't too hard to get phone parts for an iphone to piece one together to use as "evidence".

Unless they can bring in an engineer from Apple who can examine the phone to see if it has been electronically tampered with and say with EXACT certainty that nothing has been altered, I cannot see how this phone can be even be anything but a distraction.

Forget the phone...his own testimony of finding it "around 4am" IMO is the most alarming thing.

What's so alarming about it?

1. They originally said they left the beach and went to bed 2pm

2. Admittedly very drunk at home after 2am but get up again at 4 to look for shoes?? Errr

3.. So, at 4am they are wondering all over the place looking for shoes..but didnt stumble on the crime scene or see or hear anything or anybody?

how big is the place?

And just to add..the phone business..why the need to be paranoid and destroy abd hide it if you did nothing wrong?

Its like a guy innocently walking down the street, but when he sees a policeman approach he does a runner

Edited October 12, 2015 by bamukloy

[BritTim]

some of you i feel are being rather harsh on the Miller family . As a family member of a hideous crime , i for sure would want all the pertinent evidence brought to light .

now we all know that vast amounts of pertinent evidence had been lost , used up , and not make available for the defence , but the one thing in the power of the miller family was to be able to confirm one way of another that the broken phone was in fact David's .

The fact that this does not look great for one of the suspects is tricky , and you could almost suspect that the whole truth has not been divulged . in my mind at least i am drawn back to the running man , who seemingly held a phone at about the time he was looking for his clothes and guitar .

for those of you not in the know , i am well and truly in the not guilty camp , but we do know the lad is a petty thief , and bad at working out how to deal with a suspected crime scene accessory after the fact .

I agree that the Miller family have done nothing reprehensible.

The IMEI number provided by the RTP relates to a phone owned by David. Whether that IMEI number came from the broken phone is unproven. It might have come from David's phone reportedly unbroken and in the possession of the RTP after the murders and identified by Chris Ware.

In spite of the doubts, it must be admitted that the phone evidence is the best the prosecution have. Even based on their own testimony, what the Burmese kid was wrong. They admitted theft of a phone, and that they did it on the day of the murders. If the phone they "found" (and illegally kept without trying to find the owner) was not David's, this is a pretty big coincidence. If, indeed, it was David's phone, it probably places them at the scene during or after the murders. Being objective, I am not comfortable with their explanation.

[StealthEnergiser]

Regarding the phone in this clip at 2.55 you will see the police showing the broken phone to Chris Ware and it looks like he replies no.

I never realised until a few days ago when i found this clip that it was the broken phone they were showning him.

Some other posters may have known this already but I thought they showed him a good phone before.

Chris ware in this video

Edited October 12, 2015 by StealthEnergiser

[StealthEnergiser]

British Family Intervenes In Thai Murders Trial

LONDON: -- David Miller's family take receipt of a package from the Thai Embassy in London which they claim contains vital evidence.

The family of British murder victim David Miller, who died on the Thai island of Koh Tao a year ago, have intervened in the trial to try and prove their son's phone was in the possession of one of the accused.

In a dramatic twist in the final two hours of testimony, the prosecution took receipt of a package from the Thai Embassy in London, which they said confirmed the unique IMEI number of a phone found near the lodgings of one of the accused Burmese migrant workers.

Wei Phyo, 22, has not denied finding a phone on the beach on the night of the murders.

He said he picked it out of the sand some distance from the murder scene and took it home but he could not open it as it was locked with a passcode.

"The next day we heard about the murders and we were worried it might belong to someone involved," he told the court.

"My friend smashed up the phone and threw it into the undergrowth behind our hut."

The confirmation of ownership of the broken phone adds to the considerable circumstantial evidence stacked against Wei Phyo and his friend Zaw Lin, also 22.

Full story: http://news.sky.com/story/1567511/british-family-intervenes-in-thai-murders-trial

-- sky NEWS 2015-10-12

If the Millers are so concerned for the court to find out the truth, why do they hand in circumstancial evidence and did not:

1) Enforce that the RTP or Scotland Yard collects, views and confiscates ALL (back then) available CCTV tapes including the ones from the jetty and the AC Bar?

2) Enforce that (if not Thai authorties, then at least) Scotland Yard took in Christopher Ware AND Sean McAnna, as well as all returning "friends" of Hannah and David for interrogation?

Just to name two things any logical thinking person would have done after seeing the whole case derail during the first days of the so-called "investigation"... Now they send a box that has to do something with David's telephone that was found in the jungle? Are they really that naive to still believe the B2 are guilty? F me, folks, but this is totally beyond me. Are these people blind? Yes, it was shocking they stated to be happy with the Thai led "investigation", but now they send over circumstancial evidence to prove the patsies had found David's phone? Monty Python is lame slapstick compared to this!!!!

Photo shows someone that I, if I were David's or Hannah's father, would have invited to my garage for some man to man talks... Look at his right hand.

Chris Ware was cleared.

[webfact]

Accused Detail Torture in Final Testimony of Koh Tao Murders Trial
By Sasiwan Mokkhasen
Staff Reporter

SURAT THANI — The final testimony in the three-month trial of two men accused of double-murder on Koh Tao was heard yesterday as the accused took the stand to detail crude torture they allege was used to obtain false confessions.

On Saturday and Sunday, Zaw Lin and Wai Phyo, both 22-year-old men from Myanmar, described to the court physical and mental abuse by police looking to extract confessions that they murdered two British tourists in November 2014; confessions they retracted soon after they were made.

“A police officer came back into the room and flicked my genitalia very hard. I tried to protect myself but he pulled my legs apart. They also took photographs of me naked,” Wai Phyo said in court, according to The Guardian. “They also kicked me in the back, punched me and slapped me; threatened to chop off my arms and legs, and throw my body into the sea to feed the fish. They also said they would take me into another room and electrocute me.”

The trial was held in a provincial courtroom on nearby Koh Samui. The defense has until Oct. 26 to submit its closing statements. A verdict is expected Dec. 24, and the men face execution if convicted.

Defendant Zaw Lin said he was blindfolded and beaten by police, who threatened to kill him if he denied guilt. He previously told the court officers suffocated him with a plastic bag over his head until he passed out on numerous occasions.

Police officials have flatly denied torture was used to obtain the confessions.

Full story: http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1444633891


-- Khaosod English 2015-10-12

[StealthEnergiser]

[BritTim]

boomerangutang, on 12 Oct 2015 - 03:06, said:boomerangutang, on 12 Oct 2015 - 03:06, said:

Could police have 'planted' the phone? Initially, they said the found phone belonged to Hannah, then they changed their story.

When the defendant (note: one defendant, not two) claims he found the phone on the beach, what time did that happen ....before the crime? after?

If he made that claim during torture, than it means absolutely nothing. He could admit to being The Pope under torture.

The worst the phone incident shows, is one of the defendants might be a petty thief who took something off a beach.

You need to read Andy Hall's facebook post which was reposted by StealthEnergiser a short while ago. Wai Phyo testified that he found the phone at around 4:00am on 15 September while he was out looking for his guitar and clothes.

While this doesn't look good for Wai Phyo, it is still only circumstantial evidence linking him to the murders. It doesn't in itself prove that he and Zaw Lin murdered Hannah Witheridge and David Miller. We should also consider the possibility that he is telling the truth when he says he came across the phone by accident.

I wonder what happened to the sunglasses he is also charged with stealing?

Since Wai Phyo was looking for his clothes, it removes one of the objections to Wai Phyo being the running man. It is an admission that he changed his clothes. I still do not believe the Burmese kids guilty of the murders, but this has been by far the worst day for the defense.

[catsanddogs]

so we now know that Wei Phyo found a phone at 4am in the morning while out looking for clothes and his guitar

we also know that a phone was smashed and disposed of behind their residence

the above admitted by himself in court

also his clothes were indeed missing - who would take their clothes ??? which from pictures of the beach area if they did go for a swim they were never more than 10m from where they were sitting, didn't the guitar end up in AC bar ? how did it get there

something just doesn't sit right with all this

what smashed phone did the police have in the video (I assume before B2 were arrested) - the one they were showing to Friends of the victims during interview, was it this phone that was sent to Davids family ?

there is some serious confusion about this phone issue

how many phones were there

And to add to the confusion - Maung Maung said he went to the AC bar around 5am to look for his own guitar (and shoes?) which the B2 had previously stated they left there. So if true, Wei Phyo and Maung Maung were around the beach area between the hours of 4 and 5am which is not looking good. Maybe the Burmese men were forced to help with moving bodies as has already been touted and the phone was given to one of them as a thanks and shut up.