Have I turned into a Chiang Mai snob?

[FolkGuitar]

I don't think there is too much value in the opinions of those folks who form their opinions of others based on the clothing worn. That really is rather shallow.

[chingmai331]

Shallow? Here on TV? Hard to believe.

[pgrahmm]

20150702_104749.jpg

Sitting at the barbers I found this quote in a magazine from a interview of a famous author.....Fits right along with this topic......

Many expats look/act and dress as slobs......

Since the picture has dissappeared 3 times, here is the quote. It was an interesting interview....

"The white men stumbling around Bangkok look like HOMELESS REFUGEES in cargo shorts and flip flops; while the Koreans swan about in Gucci suita and get all the respect"

Granted, we're talking about the "big city" now but the bottom line is the truth.....Especially in a country steeped in the tier system & is conscientious of hoq they deport themselves......

Yes - some are happy dressed slobbishly.....And NO - it is Not unususal or wrong for them to be judged by/taken for their appearance - without a word spoken....

You don't see Thais en mass walking around town that way - or even the vendors over a hot grill......

That by itself should be a big clue.....

[northernjohn]

If it was in a privat hospital in Bangkok they would expect you to dress properly , so why not in Chiang Mai ?

Because Chiang Mai is more for living in.

[Gandonsi]

I think it's called having respect for your appearance. Maybe you've been away from the UK for far too long but there's many people here who dress horribly, the worst case offenders being older folk who wear baggy clothes that barely fit them. The youth are just a tiny bit better but will wear horrible hoodies and baggy jeans (or worst, skinny jeans).

I'm in my mid 20's, I wear slim/straight fitting jeans and a plain casual long sleeved shirt, no effort and yet it looks good, I use this combination everywhere even in hot countries but then again, I am used to really hot weather so maybe I can get away with it whilst some of you guys will have no option but to wear sandals, vests and shorts to avoid spontaneous combustion lol.

I also find it pays not to dress like a tourist in foreign countries. Being part Mediterranean, I can go to many countries and even get mistaken for being a native.

[daoyai]

20150702_104749.jpg

Sitting at the barbers I found this quote in a magazine from a interview of a famous author.....Fits right along with this topic......

Many expats look/act and dress as slobs......

Since the picture has dissappeared 3 times, here is the quote. It was an interesting interview....

"The white men stumbling around Bangkok look like HOMELESS REFUGEES in cargo shorts and flip flops; while the Koreans swan about in Gucci suita and get all the respect"

Granted, we're talking about the "big city" now but the bottom line is the truth.....Especially in a country steeped in the tier system & is conscientious of hoq they deport themselves......

Yes - some are happy dressed slobbishly.....And NO - it is Not unususal or wrong for them to be judged by/taken for their appearance - without a word spoken....

You don't see Thais en mass walking around town that way - or even the vendors over a hot grill......

That by itself should be a big clue.....

Dude you really do have a fetish about this as revealed in past threads (pun) on this subject. ... not wrong to be "judged" for wearing cargo shorts? "without a word spoken" no less.... have you not learned that brand of respect is worthless? You really respect someone for their attire? People respect me (or not) for my polite attitude, humility and possibly my acheivments.

[pgrahmm]

20150702_104749.jpg

Sitting at the barbers I found this quote in a magazine from a interview of a famous author.....Fits right along with this topic......

Many expats look/act and dress as slobs......

Since the picture has dissappeared 3 times, here is the quote. It was an interesting interview....

"The white men stumbling around Bangkok look like HOMELESS REFUGEES in cargo shorts and flip flops; while the Koreans swan about in Gucci suita and get all the respect"

Granted, we're talking about the "big city" now but the bottom line is the truth.....Especially in a country steeped in the tier system & is conscientious of hoq they deport themselves......

Yes - some are happy dressed slobbishly.....And NO - it is Not unususal or wrong for them to be judged by/taken for their appearance - without a word spoken....

You don't see Thais en mass walking around town that way - or even the vendors over a hot grill......

That by itself should be a big clue.....

Dude you really do have a fetish about this as revealed in past threads (pun) on this subject. ... not wrong to be "judged" for wearing cargo shorts? "without a word spoken" no less.... have you not learned that brand of respect is worthless? You really respect someone for their attire? People respect me (or not) for my polite attitude, humility and possibly my acheivments.

I see no problem with cargo shorts....They offer the utility of carrying stuff - wear them quite often myself out and about.....That quote was from a notable author.....

Some people see the unkempt - unwashed/poor hygene - unshaved - rumpled Chang wife beater look as good to go - that's up to them.....

I don't dress that way - either at home or out and about.....

But - when out and about I'm a quiet but friendly person ..... I may look at someone's deportment and thing OMG but never show it & don't disregard them out of hand.....

But I do dress casually smart as does my family and I guess it shows....We were walking into a mall awhile ago & a guy pouring sweat but about my size - a little shorter and belly wider stopped me and asked - embarrassed bar type girl in tow "do you have a suit I can use that I get married in?"

Felt bad for both of them and wished them much happiness.....

Don't have a fetish - we just dress in a comfortable presentable manner → and always found it appreciated here....

Even my IL's - dress like farm workers when on their farm.....But they dress smartly when away from it - even just into town.....It's the Thai way....

[richard_smith237]

Some Westerners dislike seeing other Westerners dressed as slobs because they worry that Thai's may tar all Westerners with the same brush.

Fortunately, for the most part the majority of Thai's judge us independently.

Comfortable & Casual in Sandles, Shorts and a Shirt / T-Shirt / Polo-Shirt are not the same as dressing like a slob.

A Vest / Singlet is never really appropriate beyond the beach...

If you wear a Vest / Singlet in the town you are being judged as a slob, as someone who doesn't care what impression you give off.

If you are someone who doesn't care what impression you give off, its probable that you don't have many genuine friendships / relationships. It's possible that you are tripping over your own ignorance and making life more difficult without even knowing it.

That said: Some Westerners Over Dress and clearly try too hard... Comfortable, Casual and Clean is generally good enough and appropriate for many occasions in Thailand.

[Mapguy]

It's easier to not care when your young.

Many foreigners 'let themselves go' over here as we all know. Or they were 'never there' in the first place.

It's pretty natural to detest someone with hairy pits, bo or unruly pubes. When your young it's just easier to laugh it off. Try getting back into the mindset of being younger and see it through the eyes of a teenager and you'll get a kick of how much better you feel.

I actually shave my pits and pubes, legs and whole body below the neck regularly with my electric shaver. I also shave my crack using a mirror and nose and ear hair, balls the whole enchilada. 'm completely smooth afterwards. I did have some problems nicking my balls even with the face shaver so you really need to be careful down there. Never use a blade razor.

I feel cleaner, younger and more attractive this way. When i see dudes or ladies with hairy legs, backs and arm hair i always say to myself why don't they shave that crap off already? Why do they want to look like a lower animal rather then a human?

I guess some people just like the 'ape' look. I'm a 'chimp'

More information than we really need to know!!

[claffey]

It's about respecting the country and culture that you live in. Would respectable Thai people show up to a dental appointment in a vest? No, so westerners shouldn't either...

[MrBrilliant]

I dress like a right scruff. Shorts, knackered Reebs, Iron Maiden (or other) T Shirt, hair down to my arse.....but somehow I get plenty of nice remarks from the crumpet here....

[FolkGuitar]

I keep checking the regulations, but I can't seem to find the one that says I'm supposed to judge anyone... based on anything.

It's not my place to judge others. It's not their place to judge me. Certainly not based on the clothing I wear.

I've 'earned' the respect of the people I care about, those with whom I interact daily, based on who I am, how I behave, and how I treat others.

THAT is the only sort of respect I care to earn, not that I have good taste in clothing...

[richard_smith237]

I keep checking the regulations, but I can't seem to find the one that says I'm supposed to judge anyone... based on anything.

It's not my place to judge others. It's not their place to judge me. Certainly not based on the clothing I wear.

I've 'earned' the respect of the people I care about, those with whom I interact daily, based on who I am, how I behave, and how I treat others.

THAT is the only sort of respect I care to earn, not that I have good taste in clothing...

And THAT is the kind of attitude which strangers pick up on and may well treat you without respect.

That said, I'm sure you are the sort of person who is well balanced enough not to wear singlet / vest in a restaurant etc unless you are at the beach.

This topic is not about 'shorts and T-shirt' it is about 'skanky shorts and Vests' in inappropriate locations and passing judgement on such people.

Some people in Thailand dress dirtily, with unwashed clothes, vest in a restaurant rather than the beach etc... this type of appearance makes it difficult for most people not to judge.

Without realising we all judge a book by its cover, regardless of how we think we think we make automatic judgements, our education teaches us not to act with prejudice based on these initial judgements and opinions because they may well be wrong.

However, if someone is dressed in a manner I and many around me would consider inappropriate I'd consider his attitude to be somewhat antisocial, I'd be more inclined to steer clear, others may be more inclined not to be as helpful as they otherwise would be.

It would be wrong to completely 'cut off' such people from society, but life lessons have taught us all to trust our instincts, and those people who show quite openly in their scrubby and inappropriate clothing that they don't care what others think of them may well be judged with equal disregard.

Of course, many will pick holes in the comments above - but those of a well balanced mind will get the general gist - Those who go out of their way to prove their independence and non conformity will find holes in anything anyone writes on this topic.

[finy]

It's usually the middle-class who care about status because they're jealous of rich people. Rich people and poor people don't care what others think of them.

I can tell you why I wear what I want and don't shave unless I have to: years in the air force having to iron dress shirts and trousers every day + getting sent to the hairdressers because someone thinks my hair is too long + getting charged if you don't shave perfectly lol

And there are lots of ex sas in Thailand, so maybe they feel the same way as me.

It can't be that your old because I don't care what the younger crowd wear.

I call BS and ignorance on this statment.....Many of us had to wear suits to the workplace.....It's not a matter of what you had to wear before - even as a follower in a military service.....Sounds more like you were treated like a child if true.....But saying the very rich or the poor slobs don't care???? Ignorant.....I've known both and people from all extremes and find your rationalization incorrect.....

Sorry but you're wrong, and you're embellishing in an attempt to support your point.

Not sure why people do this.

Also noticed you don't mind cargo shorts, but wife beaters are not okay. So anything you wear is fine, and anything you don't wear isn't good enough. That tells us all we need to know.

[finy]

I would go topless on the islands, vest in hot city, jeans + tee in the UK, and designer clothes on a night out in NYC.

Some people are forgetting we're all living in Thailand. Lol

We're all the great unwashed to people back home, so never forget that.

And we all get different reactions based on more than what we wear. If you look like a cont, people will assume you're a cont. they won't respect you because you're wearing dress pants and a shirt.

[FolkGuitar]

I keep checking the regulations, but I can't seem to find the one that says I'm supposed to judge anyone... based on anything.

It's not my place to judge others. It's not their place to judge me. Certainly not based on the clothing I wear.

I've 'earned' the respect of the people I care about, those with whom I interact daily, based on who I am, how I behave, and how I treat others.

THAT is the only sort of respect I care to earn, not that I have good taste in clothing...

And THAT is the kind of attitude which strangers pick up on and may well treat you without respect.

That said, I'm sure you are the sort of person who is well balanced enough not to wear singlet / vest in a restaurant etc unless you are at the beach.

That is true. I would not wear a singlet to a nice restaurant unless I was at the beach. I wouldn't feel comfortable in it. But then, I don't wear singlets at all.

But it is also true that I don't consider the judgement of strangers to be important in my life.

While I was involved in a working environment, it 'may' have had some impact. In fact, I was requested by one of the administrators of the University that employed me not to wear motorcycle leathers (or ride a motorcycle, for that matter,) to school, and that I should wear a suit and tie and either drive a car or take public transportation. He said "a professor in our university should dress correctly and travel in the proper vehicle." I denied that request... and continued to teach at that university for another 12 years, until I moved to Thailand. The reason I was able to continue (while wearing motorcycle leathers and traveling by motorcycle) was that the smarter administrators decided that what I wore wasn't as important as how I taught my classes. Not everyone in the world is as foolish as that first administrator, although it's obvious that there certainly are plenty.

You don't gain 'real' respect by your clothing. You gain it by your actions. That is the sort of respect that counts.

[LarryBird]

Hi Joe, ChiengMaiJoe, I wanted to point you towards a couple of recent posts where you said that criticizing people's clothing was immature.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/826384-my-first-stand-up-argument-in-thailand-when-shopping/page-4#entry9429684

and here:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/826384-my-first-stand-up-argument-in-thailand-when-shopping/page-6#entry9432155

Cheers, LB

Anyway, I agree with you in your change of heart.

[richard_smith237]

I keep checking the regulations, but I can't seem to find the one that says I'm supposed to judge anyone... based on anything.

It's not my place to judge others. It's not their place to judge me. Certainly not based on the clothing I wear.

I've 'earned' the respect of the people I care about, those with whom I interact daily, based on who I am, how I behave, and how I treat others.

THAT is the only sort of respect I care to earn, not that I have good taste in clothing...

And THAT is the kind of attitude which strangers pick up on and may well treat you without respect.

That said, I'm sure you are the sort of person who is well balanced enough not to wear singlet / vest in a restaurant etc unless you are at the beach.

That is true. I would not wear a singlet to a nice restaurant unless I was at the beach. I wouldn't feel comfortable in it. But then, I don't wear singlets at all.

But it is also true that I don't consider the judgement of strangers to be important in my life.

While I was involved in a working environment, it 'may' have had some impact. In fact, I was requested by one of the administrators of the University that employed me not to wear motorcycle leathers (or ride a motorcycle, for that matter,) to school, and that I should wear a suit and tie and either drive a car or take public transportation. He said "a professor in our university should dress correctly and travel in the proper vehicle." I denied that request... and continued to teach at that university for another 12 years, until I moved to Thailand. The reason I was able to continue (while wearing motorcycle leathers and traveling by motorcycle) was that the smarter administrators decided that what I wore wasn't as important as how I taught my classes. Not everyone in the world is as foolish as that first administrator, although it's obvious that there certainly are plenty.

You don't gain 'real' respect by your clothing. You gain it by your actions. That is the sort of respect that counts.

You won't find many people who disagree with this last statement of yours...

That said, life simply becomes 'easier' when those who do judge a book by its cover do so favourably.... We don't need to fit in 'boxes' but being presentable goes a long way to being treated with an open mind from those strangers whom we meet in a daily activities.

So, I also don't consider the judgement of strangers to be important in my life, however, I recognise that in a country such as Thailand things can be and often are easier when we've made it easier for others to see us in a respectful light.

Teaching in Motorcycle leathers.... You'd have been the 'cool' teacher in many Schools, Colleges and Universities across the UK !

[pgrahmm]

It's usually the middle-class who care about status because they're jealous of rich people. Rich people and poor people don't care what others think of them.

I can tell you why I wear what I want and don't shave unless I have to: years in the air force having to iron dress shirts and trousers every day + getting sent to the hairdressers because someone thinks my hair is too long + getting charged if you don't shave perfectly lol

And there are lots of ex sas in Thailand, so maybe they feel the same way as me.

It can't be that your old because I don't care what the younger crowd wear.

I call BS and ignorance on this statment.....Many of us had to wear suits to the workplace.....It's not a matter of what you had to wear before - even as a follower in a military service.....Sounds more like you were treated like a child if true.....But saying the very rich or the poor slobs don't care???? Ignorant.....I've known both and people from all extremes and find your rationalization incorrect.....

Sorry but you're wrong, and you're embellishing in an attempt to support your point.

Not sure why people do this.

Also noticed you don't mind cargo shorts, but wife beaters are not okay. So anything you wear is fine, and anything you don't wear isn't good enough. That tells us all we need to know.

Didn't embellish anything....If you want to walk around looking like an ungroomed badly dressed slob you have every right to.....

Your statements about the rich/poor walking around dressed poorly because they will look like sh;t because they want to is garbage while your trying to validate your view.....Rationalizing is not a healthy thing - but it's all some people have to work with.....You rationalize you can dress any way you like now that your no longer in the service and nobody can tell you what to do anymore.....But you signed up for the service knowing your dress code obligations but evidently those higher had to instruct and send you to uphold your own obligation.....A discipline you should of handled yourself - but didn't based on your own rationalization as to why you dress/groom yourself as you do.....You espoused a very flawed argument.....Dress any way you like - - question → would you like to see your women walking around groomed and dressed the same way you represent yourself.....

They could claim they were raised properly and went through military sevice but enjoy walking around dressed and looking like an ungroomed slob.....The rationalization should work both ways for you.....

[FolkGuitar]

I keep checking the regulations, but I can't seem to find the one that says I'm supposed to judge anyone... based on anything.

It's not my place to judge others. It's not their place to judge me. Certainly not based on the clothing I wear.

I've 'earned' the respect of the people I care about, those with whom I interact daily, based on who I am, how I behave, and how I treat others.

THAT is the only sort of respect I care to earn, not that I have good taste in clothing...

And THAT is the kind of attitude which strangers pick up on and may well treat you without respect.

That said, I'm sure you are the sort of person who is well balanced enough not to wear singlet / vest in a restaurant etc unless you are at the beach.

That is true. I would not wear a singlet to a nice restaurant unless I was at the beach. I wouldn't feel comfortable in it. But then, I don't wear singlets at all.

But it is also true that I don't consider the judgement of strangers to be important in my life.

While I was involved in a working environment, it 'may' have had some impact. In fact, I was requested by one of the administrators of the University that employed me not to wear motorcycle leathers (or ride a motorcycle, for that matter,) to school, and that I should wear a suit and tie and either drive a car or take public transportation. He said "a professor in our university should dress correctly and travel in the proper vehicle." I denied that request... and continued to teach at that university for another 12 years, until I moved to Thailand. The reason I was able to continue (while wearing motorcycle leathers and traveling by motorcycle) was that the smarter administrators decided that what I wore wasn't as important as how I taught my classes. Not everyone in the world is as foolish as that first administrator, although it's obvious that there certainly are plenty.

You don't gain 'real' respect by your clothing. You gain it by your actions. That is the sort of respect that counts.

You won't find many people who disagree with this last statement of yours...

That said, life simply becomes 'easier' when those who do judge a book by its cover do so favourably.... We don't need to fit in 'boxes' but being presentable goes a long way to being treated with an open mind from those strangers whom we meet in a daily activities.

So, I also don't consider the judgement of strangers to be important in my life, however, I recognise that in a country such as Thailand things can be and often are easier when we've made it easier for others to see us in a respectful light.

Teaching in Motorcycle leathers.... You'd have been the 'cool' teacher in many Schools, Colleges and Universities across the UK !

Just imagine what it was in a large Japanese university! LOL!

There is no question that wearing what others consider 'appropriate dress' will grease the wheels in many different situations, especially when one is involved in a work environment. With that environment in mind, 'appropriate dress' takes on many different meanings. In fact-to-face sales, it will make or break a career. In many situations, it will certainly enhance 'first impressions.' Even the color of a tie takes on major proportions in certain fields. And anyone involved in these sorts of environments MUST remain cognoscente of the fact in order to get in the door.

... and then there's retirement. And the "I simply don't give a shit" attitude. And it's obvious that sooo many do not! So perhaps it behooves us to find a different criteria to adapt when looking at others in the same environment. As in ' hey, let's not let our old preconceived notions govern the way we look at things today. We're not in the same ballgame any more.'

[finy]

Your statements about the rich/poor walking around dressed poorly because they will look like sh;t because they want to is garbage while your trying to validate your view.....Rationalizing is not a healthy thing - but it's all some people have to work with.....You rationalize you can dress any way you like now that your no longer in the service and nobody can tell you what to do anymore.....But you signed up for the service knowing your dress code obligations but evidently those higher had to instruct and send you to uphold your own obligation.....A discipline you should of handled yourself - but didn't based on your own rationalization as to why you dress/groom yourself as you do.....You espoused a very flawed argument.....Dress any way you like - - question → would you like to see your women walking around groomed and dressed the same way you represent yourself.....

They could claim they were raised properly and went through military sevice but enjoy walking around dressed and looking like an ungroomed slob.....The rationalization should work both ways for you.....

Didn't say they want to look like crap, it's just they don't care as much about what other people think of them.

And I loved Perth, where they walk about in bikinis in the CBD. Much prefer a down to earth girl rather than a high maintenance one, but different strokes.

Thank you, I will continue to look like a slob.

[FolkGuitar]

Didn't embellish anything....If you want to walk around looking like an ungroomed badly dressed slob you have every right to.....

Your statements about the rich/poor walking around dressed poorly because they will look like sh;t because they want to is garbage while your trying to validate your view.....Rationalizing is not a healthy thing - but it's all some people have to work with.....You rationalize you can dress any way you like now that your no longer in the service and nobody can tell you what to do anymore.....But you signed up for the service knowing your dress code obligations but evidently those higher had to instruct and send you to uphold your own obligation.....A discipline you should of handled yourself - but didn't based on your own rationalization as to why you dress/groom yourself as you do.....You espoused a very flawed argument.....Dress any way you like - - question → would you like to see your women walking around groomed and dressed the same way you represent yourself.....

They could claim they were raised properly and went through military sevice but enjoy walking around dressed and looking like an ungroomed slob.....The rationalization should work both ways for you.....

Without getting too deeply into it, approximately how much time do you spend each day judging other people?

[pgrahmm]

Didn't embellish anything....If you want to walk around looking like an ungroomed badly dressed slob you have every right to.....

Your statements about the rich/poor walking around dressed poorly because they will look like sh;t because they want to is garbage while your trying to validate your view.....Rationalizing is not a healthy thing - but it's all some people have to work with.....You rationalize you can dress any way you like now that your no longer in the service and nobody can tell you what to do anymore.....But you signed up for the service knowing your dress code obligations but evidently those higher had to instruct and send you to uphold your own obligation.....A discipline you should of handled yourself - but didn't based on your own rationalization as to why you dress/groom yourself as you do.....You espoused a very flawed argument.....Dress any way you like - - question → would you like to see your women walking around groomed and dressed the same way you represent yourself.....

They could claim they were raised properly and went through military sevice but enjoy walking around dressed and looking like an ungroomed slob.....The rationalization should work both ways for you.....

Without getting too deeply into it, approximately how much time do you spend each day judging other people?

In reality - not many....right now listening to my daughters playing the flute and ukelele learning new songs.....The days revolve around family for the most part.....

[finy]

Embellishing again to avoid telling the truth.

Sigh

[chiang mai]

Didn't embellish anything....If you want to walk around looking like an ungroomed badly dressed slob you have every right to.....

Your statements about the rich/poor walking around dressed poorly because they will look like sh;t because they want to is garbage while your trying to validate your view.....Rationalizing is not a healthy thing - but it's all some people have to work with.....You rationalize you can dress any way you like now that your no longer in the service and nobody can tell you what to do anymore.....But you signed up for the service knowing your dress code obligations but evidently those higher had to instruct and send you to uphold your own obligation.....A discipline you should of handled yourself - but didn't based on your own rationalization as to why you dress/groom yourself as you do.....You espoused a very flawed argument.....Dress any way you like - - question → would you like to see your women walking around groomed and dressed the same way you represent yourself.....

They could claim they were raised properly and went through military sevice but enjoy walking around dressed and looking like an ungroomed slob.....The rationalization should work both ways for you.....

Without getting too deeply into it, approximately how much time do you spend each day judging other people?

In reality - not many....right now listening to my daughters playing the flute and ukelele learning new songs.....The days revolve around family for the most part.....

I agree totally, far too many residents, tourists and posters simply don't get the concept of what "acceptable" anything in their own country means, let alone what it means in Thailand.

[Chiengmaijoe]

Hi Joe, ChiengMaiJoe, I wanted to point you towards a couple of recent posts where you said that criticizing people's clothing was immature.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/826384-my-first-stand-up-argument-in-thailand-when-shopping/page-4#entry9429684

and here:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/826384-my-first-stand-up-argument-in-thailand-when-shopping/page-6#entry9432155

Cheers, LB

Anyway, I agree with you in your change of heart.

For some really weird reason you introduced the topic of sleeveless shirts into a totally different discussion and anyway, the point I was making was totally different to the one raised here. I'm amazed that you remembered what I said and went to the trouble of digging it up. I'm not quite sure what to make of that.

By the way, my topic title did have a question mark in it. I was questioning my views. Looking at it now, I don't necessarily think I have had a change of heart. On the whole I don't judge people by what they wear. I know a few top guys that so happen to wear singlets/vests most of the time and although I don't like their choice of clothing and may well prefer them to dress up just a little bit, it doesn't change my opinion of them.

I would just say that I have concluded, like many others here, that there are times and places that wearing a sleeveless vest is not appropriate and possibly a visit to a dentists or a hospital might just be one of those occasions. I may be odd, but I think it shows a lack of respect for the doctors/dentists and formally dressed staff at such places.

Sometimes how I dress is not a matter of how I want to dress, but more to do with what I am doing and where I am going. Rather than it being about what I want or how I want people to perceive me it is sometimes about dressing politely as a matter of respect to others. I hang around my house in just a per of shorts most of the time, but if the vicar calls I would probably put a shirt on.

[pgrahmm]

I think enough people have posted enough different thoughts/viewpoints and ideas....

Some surprising - some predictable - some desperate enough to stalk other posters prior posts for the sake of winning/starting an argument as opposed to having a dialog or discussion gleaned from ideas from this thread.......

Maybe some learned - most probably did not - but some valid points were brought to the table.....

Probably a good time to put it to bed as it's only going to go downhill from here.....

[finy]

Now lets all strip down to our underwear and get on the buckets.

[Chiengmaijoe]

I don't want to be pedantic, but I think you will find that dentists are not doctors.

Has anyone ever noticed how, whenever someone starts a sentence with "I don't want to be ........ but ....", they invariably are whatever they didn't want to be. The only exception I know to that is when someone starts a sentence with "I don't want to be funny but ... ", which is always, without exception, followed by something that could never, ever, even remotely, be considered funny. A good example would be something like "I don't want to be funny but, I think they all deserved to die"!

Just an observation.

[FolkGuitar]

I don't want to be pedantic, but I think you will find that dentists are not doctors.

Has anyone ever noticed how, whenever someone starts a sentence with "I don't want to be ........ but ....", they invariably are whatever they didn't want to be. The only exception I know to that is when someone starts a sentence with "I don't want to be funny but ... ", which is always, without exception, followed by something that could never, ever, even remotely, be considered funny. A good example would be something like "I don't want to be funny but, I think they all deserved to die"!

Just an observation.

It's actually worse than that. It often turns out that they are incorrect in the information they are offering, as is the case here.

Although in some countries, dentists are addressed as Mister, as are physicians in some countries as well, they 'can' both be 'doctors.' A dentist may have a DDS degree (Doctor of Dental Surgery,) or a Ph.D in Dentistry, both of which merit the title 'Doctor.' There are librarians who have the title Doctor (DLS - Doctor of Library Science,) School Administrators (Doctor of Education Administration,) Lawyers have an J.D. (Juris Doctor) or a Doctor of Juridical Science. Of course Doctor of Business Administration, .... the list is absolutely endless. You can get a doctorate in almost every academic field. And with that, you are entitled to be addressed as 'Doctor.' It's only cultural differences that would cause a physician or dentist to be addressed as Mister.