Mali hotel attacked by gunmen in Bamako

[lopburi3]

French forces are present in country and en route from current reports.

It will be a bloodbath

Later reports are no French troops currently in country - but a force now on way - but UN force is present and local army has been clearing hotel.

[NeverSure]

CNN is already worried about a backlash against muslims and the siege has just begun.

Backlash against Muslims? How am I supposed to tell the good from the bad? On those occasions when I see them I back off and make sure my "heat" is in place. Then I clear out of the area as soon as I can.

If nothing else, these Muslims need a new PR firm because what they are doing so far makes my hair stand on end. Because I can't know if I or those with me are in danger I simply go on high alert until we clear the area.

Is this supposed to be my fault somehow?

Cheers.

[chiang mai]

CNN is already worried about a backlash against muslims and the siege has just begun.

Backlash against Muslims? How am I supposed to tell the good from the bad? On those occasions when I see them I back off and make sure my "heat" is in place. Then I clear out of the area as soon as I can.

If nothing else, these Muslims need a new PR firm because what they are doing so far makes my hair stand on end. Because I can't know if I or those with me are in danger I simply go on high alert until we clear the area.

Is this supposed to be my fault somehow?

Cheers.

Do you do the same with Christians, Buddhists and Jews, no, I thought not!

[NeverSure]

Backlash against Muslims? How am I supposed to tell the good from the bad? On those occasions when I see them I back off and make sure my "heat" is in place. Then I clear out of the area as soon as I can.

If nothing else, these Muslims need a new PR firm because what they are doing so far makes my hair stand on end. Because I can't know if I or those with me are in danger I simply go on high alert until we clear the area.

Is this supposed to be my fault somehow?

Cheers.

Do you do the same with Christians, Buddhists and Jews, no, I thought not!

What a comment. I hope you weren't taking an IQ test there. I don't recall any of the groups you mention blowing up an airliner over Egypt or killing a ton of people in Paris recently.

Go ahead and have your dreams.

Cheers.

[Steely Dan]

They have released hostages who are able to demonstrate they are Muslims.

Religion of peace!

But how can that be if the terrorists have nothing to do with Islam?

[micmichd]

Aren't the borders of Mali a colonial relict?

[Credo]

Aren't the borders of Mali a colonial relict?

Probably, but that doesn't have much to do with Islam now, does it?

[Jonathan Fairfield]

LATEST

Gunmen attack hotel in Mali's capital, killing at least 20
BABA AHMED, Associated Press

BAMAKO, Mali (AP) — Heavily armed Islamic extremists seized dozens of hostages Friday at a Radisson hotel, but Malian troops, backed by U.S. and French special forces, swarmed in to retake the building and free many of the terrified captives. At least 20 people, including one American, were killed along with two gunmen during the more than seven-hour siege, a Malian military commander said.

An extremist group led by former al-Qaida commander Moktar Belmoktar claimed responsibility for the attack in the former French colony, and many in France saw it as a new assault on their country's interests a week after the Paris attacks.

While French President Francois Hollande did not link the violence at the Radisson Blu hotel with last week's bloodshed in Paris, he declared that France would stand by the West African country.

"Once again, terrorists want to make their barbaric presence felt everywhere, where they can kill, where they can massacre. So we should once again show our solidarity with our ally, Mali," he said.

Gunfire continued throughout the day at the hotel, which is popular with airline crews and other foreigners doing business in the capital of Bamako, but the shooting had stopped after dark.

Officials would not confirm that the entire complex had been secured by nightfall, although the only activity was firefighters carrying bodies to waiting ambulances.

Malian state television said late Friday night that the government had announced a 10-day state of emergency beginning at midnight as well as a three-day period of national mourning beginning Monday.

Army Cmdr. Modibo Nama Traore said late Friday that 20 people had been killed, including an official with Mali's gendarmerie. In addition, he said five people were injured including two police officers.

The U.S. State Department said one American was among the dead, though it did not identify the victim out of respect for the family.

Though Traore had earlier said as many as 10 attackers were involved, he said Friday night that there may have been only two gunmen, both of whom were killed. A police officer at the hotel displayed photos of the two dead gunmen, their bodies riddled with bullets.

The siege began when assailants shouting "God is great!" in Arabic burst into the complex and opened fire on the hotel guards, Traore said earlier on Friday. An employee who identified himself as Tamba Diarra said by phone amid the attack that the militants used grenades.

About 170 guests and employees were initially taken hostage, but some apparently escaped or hid in the sprawling, cream-and-pink hotel that has 190 rooms and a spa, outdoor pool and ballroom. They included visitors from France, Belgium, Germany, China, India, Canada, Ivory Coast and Turkey.

"It was more like a real terrorist attack," said U.N. Mission spokesman Olivier Salgado. "The intention was clearly to kill, not to necessarily have people being hostage."

Traore said 126 people had been escorted to safety, and that at least one guest reported the attackers instructed him to recite verses from the Quran as proof of his Muslim faith before he was allowed to leave.

As people ran for their lives along a dirt road, troops in full combat gear pointed the way to safety, sometimes escorting them with a protective arm around the shoulder. Local TV showed heavily armed troops in what appeared to be a lobby.

Monique Kouame Affoue Ekonde of Ivory Coast said she and six other people, including a Turkish woman, were escorted out by security forces as the gunmen rushed toward the fifth or sixth floor. Ekonde said she had been "in a state of shock."

Malian special forces went "floor by floor" to free hostages, Traore said.

U.S. special forces assisted, said Col. Mark Cheadle of the U.S. Army's Africa Command. At least six Americans were evacuated from the hotel, Cheadle said. U.S. officials were trying to verify the location of all American citizens in Mali.

National Security Council spokesman Ned Price praised the bravery of the Malian, French, U.N. and U.S. security personnel who responded, adding that Washington was prepared to assist Mali's government as it investigates "this tragic terrorist attack."

A unit of French soldiers was sent to Bamako in support of Malian security forces, the French Defense Ministry said. About 40 special police forces also played a supporting role, France's national gendarme service said.

The U.N. mission sent security reinforcements and medical aid to the scene, said U.N. deputy spokesman Farhan Haq. A few U.N. staff were in the hotel but they got out safely, he added.

Reflecting the chaos surrounding the siege, various death tolls were reported during the day. French Foreign Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian said 19 people died — 18 in the hotel and one Malian soldier killed in the fighting.

A U.N. official had earlier said initial reports put the number of dead at 27, but that different casualty figures have been reported and the organization is working with authorities to get an exact total. The official spoke on condition of anonymity because the operation was still ongoing.

Throughout the siege, officials in various countries from Europe to Asia sought to find out whether their citizens staying at the hotel were safe.

Chinese state broadcaster CCTV, citing its diplomats in Mali, reported about 10 Chinese citizens took shelter in their rooms, and all were safe.

Also reported safe were 12 members of an Air France flight crew and five from Turkish Airlines. All 20 guests from India were evacuated as well, said Vikas Swarup, spokesman for India's Foreign Ministry.

The attack was perceived by many in France, particularly in the government, as a new attack on its interests.

An extremist group that two years ago split from al-Qaida's North Africa branch and led by Moktar Belmoktar claimed responsibility in a recorded statement carried by Al-Jazeera. The group said it wanted fighters freed from Mali's prisons and a halt on attacks against northern Malians.

The group, known as the Mourabitounes, was formed in 2013 after Belmoktar left al-Qaida in the Islamic Maghreb and joined with a Malian militant group. The statement said the Mourabitounes had attacked in coordination with the "Sahara Emirate" affiliated with al-Qaida.

The French military operation in Mali in 2013 against Islamic extremists who were holding the northern half of the country was the first of several foreign interventions that Hollande launched as president. Those interventions have prompted increased threats against France and its interests from extremist groups ranging from al-Qaida's North African arm to the Islamic State group.

French news websites and all-news TV networks immediately switched from nearly nonstop coverage of the Paris attacks investigation and aftermath to the Bamako siege.

Jens David Ohlin, an international law expert at Cornell University, said France has "invested so much military energy in pushing the Islamic rebels out of Mali."

"While Mali might not have the same emotional significance to the French as Paris does, it is certainly an important part of the French military strategy," he added.

Northern Mali remains insecure and militant attacks have extended farther south this year, including Bamako. In March, masked gunmen shot up a Bamako restaurant popular with foreigners, killing five people.

France has 3,500 troops operating in Mali and four other countries in the Sahel region as part of a five-nation counterterrorism operation.

The Netherlands also has troops working with the U.N. mission. According to the Dutch Defense Ministry, about 450 of its personnel are involved in the mission. Most of the Dutch force is based in Gao, but there are a few officers at the U.N. mission headquarters in Bamako.

___

Associated Press writers Harouna Traore in Bamako, Robbie Corey-Boulet in Abidjan, Ivory Coast, Edith M. Lederer at the United Nations, Sylvie Corbet and Nicolas Vaux-Montagny in Paris, Christopher Bodeen in Beijing and Christopher Torchia in Johannesburg contributed to this report.

-- (c) Associated Press 2015-11-21

[micmichd]

Aren't the borders of Mali a colonial relict?

Probably, but that doesn't have much to do with Islam now, does it?

No, but many will start blaming Islam again. Because the Tuaregs happen to be Muslims.

[impulse]

Meanwhile, 99.9% of the Muslim population of the world got on with their everyday lives today, just like you and me.

Despicable attacks on humanity? Absolutely. Nobody here is cheering for the Islamists. But keep it in perspective.

Just like not many folks are cheering for the ultra right wing Christians called the KKK, who can justify just about any acts against "the mud people" with biblical verse. The other 99.9% of Christians are getting on with their everyday lives without dragging black folks behind pickup trucks.

[Thorgal]

Aren't the borders of Mali a colonial relict?

Geology doesn't follow geography...but some radical religions follow geology...

Edited November 21, 2015 by Thorgal

[jacky54]

some hostages, including those able to recite verses of the Koran, are being freed.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-34877069

Where can I get a copy?

They should start with the one: "There shall be no compulsion in religion."

2:256 Quran

That was written by the liar early on in his conquest career, later suras of the kill all unbelievers variety over ride it, although apologists love to quote it

[Linky]

Backlash against Muslims? How am I supposed to tell the good from the bad? On those occasions when I see them I back off and make sure my "heat" is in place. Then I clear out of the area as soon as I can.

If nothing else, these Muslims need a new PR firm because what they are doing so far makes my hair stand on end. Because I can't know if I or those with me are in danger I simply go on high alert until we clear the area.

Is this supposed to be my fault somehow?

Cheers.

Do you do the same with Christians, Buddhists and Jews, no, I thought not!

What a comment. I hope you weren't taking an IQ test there. I don't recall any of the groups you mention blowing up an airliner over Egypt or killing a ton of people in Paris recently.

Go ahead and have your dreams.

Cheers.

Speaking of IQ tests. How do you know if you or anyone is in danger from a muslim, how would you know a person is muslim by looking at them?

[SOTIRIOS]

...considering its recent history who are people still going there for holidays...

[Steely Dan]

...considering its recent history who are people still going there for holidays...

Indeed, if everyone just stayed at home they could be murdered, raped, threatened or taken hostage in their own local high streets. And by people representing the same ideology that is currently murdering on religious grounds in Mali.

[Linky]

Backlash against Muslims? How am I supposed to tell the good from the bad? On those occasions when I see them I back off and make sure my "heat" is in place. Then I clear out of the area as soon as I can.

If nothing else, these Muslims need a new PR firm because what they are doing so far makes my hair stand on end. Because I can't know if I or those with me are in danger I simply go on high alert until we clear the area.

Is this supposed to be my fault somehow?

Cheers.

Do you do the same with Christians, Buddhists and Jews, no, I thought not!

What a comment. I hope you weren't taking an IQ test there. I don't recall any of the groups you mention blowing up an airliner over Egypt or killing a ton of people in Paris recently.

Go ahead and have your dreams.

Cheers.

Speaking of IQ tests. How do you know if you or anyone is in danger from a muslim, how would you know a person is muslim by looking at them?

Lol..that's an easy one


Angry Muslim Mob Rally.jpg

You do realise not all arabs are muslim, and not all muslims are arab. So in reality you are not identifying muslims by faith, which would make the person a bigot. Instead identifying by race, so a racist.

[micmichd]

Aren't the borders of Mali a colonial relict?

Geology doesn't follow geography...but some radical religions follow geology...

ImageUploadedByThaivisa Connect1448081165.735273.jpg

Now take a look at the population density in Europe, then you get the demand side. And you don't need any religion at all.

[jacky54]

Meanwhile, 99.9% of the Muslim population of the world got on with their everyday lives today, just like you and me.

But unlike you and me they ALL believe in a Koran most of them do not understand, and follow a murdering peadophile, hence the results

[HenryB]

Europe, England Russia America and China had no to kill about 200 million people in the last 100 years that looked like them

I afraid they will have no trouble good and bad Muslims in the 100 years.

It is easier to kill ones that do not look like you

[impulse]

Meanwhile, 99.9% of the Muslim population of the world got on with their everyday lives today, just like you and me.

But unlike you and me they ALL believe in a Koran most of them do not understand, and follow a murdering peadophile, hence the results

You read the Bible lately? Full of genocidal heroes, murderers, slaves and stonings. And those are the good guys...

Every religion has its wackos and hijackers who chase land, power and money by invoking the name of their God. Always have. You can't rile up a whole army to pursue riches for me me me (and my entourage) But make it about God or family or home and hearth, and they'll fight and die so you can get rich and powerful. It's not really about the religion.

99.9% of them are just living ordinary lives.

Edited November 21, 2015 by impulse

[chuckd]

Meanwhile, 99.9% of the Muslim population of the world got on with their everyday lives today, just like you and me.

But unlike you and me they ALL believe in a Koran most of them do not understand, and follow a murdering peadophile, hence the results

You read the Bible lately? Full of genocidal heroes, murderers, slaves and stonings. And those are the good guys...

Every religion has its wackos and hijackers who chase land, power and money by invoking the name of their God. Always have. You can't rile up a whole army to pursue riches for me me me (and my entourage) But make it about God or family or home and hearth, and they'll fight and die so you can get rich and powerful. It's not really about the religion.

99.9% of them are just living ordinary lives.

Using your 99.9%^ estimation as those Muslims that are living ordinary lives. you would seem to believe only .001% are living other than ordinary lives.

If, as many of us expect, that .001% is forming an army, they will be an army 1,520,000 strong.

Now recall what atrocities only 8 of them performed in Paris on Friday the 13th.

Edited November 21, 2015 by chuckd

[Jingthing]

I am not buying a culture where supporting death for apostasy, death for homosexuality, death for adultery, etc. etc. is considered MAINSTREAM is really very "ordinary" in the MODERN context. I realize minorities in some other religions share some similar horrific belief systems, but at much smaller percentages.

It really doesn't help the credibility of any argument to not just concede that there indeed is something very different about Islamic culture compared to all other major world religions in this MODERN era. A large portion of it is stuck in the dark ages. That's obviously true. Denying that is not helpful.

I do agree that obviously the majority of Muslim people in the world just want to get on with their lives which are centered around family and economic concerns, but again, to deny the backwardness of the mainstream beliefs of so many Muslims is not the root of a lot of the Islamist terrorism we see, again, what is the benefit in denial?

Edited November 21, 2015 by Jingthing

[impulse]

You read the Bible lately? Full of genocidal heroes, murderers, slaves and stonings. And those are the good guys...

Every religion has its wackos and hijackers who chase land, power and money by invoking the name of their God. Always have. You can't rile up a whole army to pursue riches for me me me (and my entourage) But make it about God or family or home and hearth, and they'll fight and die so you can get rich and powerful. It's not really about the religion.

99.9% of them are just living ordinary lives.

Using your 99.9%^ estimation as those Muslims that are living ordinary lives. you would seem to believe only .001% are living other than ordinary lives.

If, as many of us expect, that .001% is forming an army, they will be an army 1,520,000 strong.

Now recall what atrocities only 8 of them performed in Paris on Friday the 13th.

Your math is wrong, but let's look at the logic anyway.

Yes, even 0.1% is a lot of bad guys.

But I can't think of a more sure fire way to make the problem orders of magnitude worse than to indiscriminately punish (abuse, piss-off, bomb, kill, alienate...) the other 99.9+% and turn even more of them to "the dark side". That's exactly what the bad guys are hoping for.

Edited November 21, 2015 by impulse

[Jingthing]

I agree the bad guys do want to foment division and Islamophobia. But there are extremes on either end. I think the Obama administration refusing to acknowledge the Islamist Jihadist nature of the Islamist Jihadist terrorism we are seeing is just stupid. It is not condemning all Muslim people to call it what it is.

Edited November 21, 2015 by Jingthing

[chuckd]

You read the Bible lately? Full of genocidal heroes, murderers, slaves and stonings. And those are the good guys...

Every religion has its wackos and hijackers who chase land, power and money by invoking the name of their God. Always have. You can't rile up a whole army to pursue riches for me me me (and my entourage) But make it about God or family or home and hearth, and they'll fight and die so you can get rich and powerful. It's not really about the religion.

99.9% of them are just living ordinary lives.

Using your 99.9%^ estimation as those Muslims that are living ordinary lives. you would seem to believe only .001% are living other than ordinary lives.

If, as many of us expect, that .001% is forming an army, they will be an army 1,520,000 strong.

Now recall what atrocities only 8 of them performed in Paris on Friday the 13th.

Your math is wrong, but let's look at the logic anyway.

Yes, even 0.1% is a lot of bad guys.

But I can't think of a more sure fire way to make the problem orders of magnitude worse than to indiscriminately punish (abuse, piss-off, bomb, kill, alienate...) the other 99.9+% and turn even more of them to "the dark side". That's exactly what the bad guys are hoping for.

"Your math is wrong, but let's look at the logic anyway."

Maybe I don't know how to calculate percentages so please permit me to walk you through my process and you tell me where i went wrong.

Using a base figure of 1,520,000,000 estimated Muslims in the world and trying to arrive at your estimate of 99.9% of them living ordinary lives, I would take the number 1,520,000,000 and multiply that number by a factor of .999 using my Casio calculator.

I just performed that very function on my Casio calculator and the answer came up with...1,518,480,000 Muslims living normal lives.

I then took the total population of Muslims figure of 1.52 Billion and multiplied that by a factor of ,001. The result is, yet again, 1,520,000 Muslims NOT living ordinary lives.

To prove my point further to myself, I took the figure ,999 and added the figure of .001 to it. My Casio calculator came up with the marvelous answer of...1.00.

Please show me where my figures went astray.

Back to your point of " indiscriminately punish (abuse, piss-off, bomb, kill, alienate...", it seems to me that a group of people that can go ballistic and attempt to murder others because of a drawing or cartoon are going to be sufficiently aroused to take offense at anything.

Perhaps the world should stop walking on egg shells when it comes to the Muslim world.

[tomacht8]

As a book was written around 1400 years ago.
1400 years ago there was no internet, no telephone, no newspapers, no cars, no airplanes, no television, no sewers, no drinking water system.
In this stone age the people knew nothing from there neighbors, of the existence of other continents and believed the world was flat.
And this outdated book incites people still until today to kill each other. That is sick.

[uptheos]

CNN is already worried about a backlash against muslims and the siege has just begun.

I think Andy Coopy et al should be more concerned about being in Times Square NYE.

[impulse]

To prove my point further to myself, I took the figure ,999 and added the figure of .001 to it. My Casio calculator came up with the marvelous answer of...1.00.

Please show me where my figures went astray.

Perhaps the world should stop walking on egg shells when it comes to the Muslim world.

99.9% + 0.001% = 99.901%

99.9% + 0.1% = 100%.

And I'm against walking on eggshells around Muslims, too. But I'm even more against bombing the 99.9% that didn't attack anyone. (Or calling them collateral damage)

Every time we do, we increase the number who hate us enough to pick up a gun or a bomb to terrorize us. Not much use in killing the bad ones if it just creates a dozen more to take their place. Don't get me wrong- I'm all for killing the bad ones.

[Scott]

A post violating Fair Use Policy has been removed. You may only quote the first three sentences of an article and then a link to the remainder.

[uptheos]

A post violating Fair Use Policy has been removed. You may only quote the first three sentences of an article and then a link to the remainder.

Sorry about that Scott, a lot of people can't access The Daily Mail.