Lightroom and Nikon ViewNX2 - Ouch !

[skippybangkok]

Been using ViewNX2 for a long time, not great but it serves its purpose. Was a bit buggy, so I took some time ( and many mistakes ) to figure out Lightroom..... and to my horror found out a design aspect of Lightroom is also in NX2

- I though-

when you edit a .NEF in NX2, the changes would be saved to the original .NEF. Never really checked, because i exported them to 8 MB JPEG's to put in share folder for facility. JPEG's we as adjusted.

-Reality-

i just relived that the save is not in the .NEF, the format save is in a catalog file ( for Lightroom ).... long and the short of it, if you loose the catalog file you worked on for 5 years, all your edits are gone.

-What i want-

i really do want to save the edits into the master file, so its there embedded in the pic. I assume i can export (as can save).... but what should the file format be ?

NX

-Tiff16

-Tiff8

(assume not JPEG).

Lightroom

-PSD, Tiff,DNg, original (assume NEF )

original NEF files are about 36MB each.

I have a few years worth of adjustments in NX2.....

Thanks

[FracturedRabbit]

And if you lose your NEF file, everything is gone too!

Lightroom never changes your original file, and this is a good thing. Whatever development changes you make in Lightroom doesn't actually change anything, the amended view of your image is just a preview of what an exported image would look like. This means you can go back to your original image at any time in Lightroom or any other program, and work on it from scratch. It means you can have multiple versions in Lightroom which in reality are still the single original image with multiple development previews. It means that your original file never has changes baked into it which you may later wish you had not done.

You have your original NEF files which you back up.

You have your Lightroom catalogue(s) which contain all your indexing and development changes; and you back those up as well.

And that's all you need!

If you want, you can export every single photo from Lightroom reflecting your current processing, as JPEG or a TIFF; but why bother? It will take up space and when tomorrow you change a development setting on a single photo, your exports will be out of date.

[skippybangkok]

Thanks

A "what if scenario":

If a new and better application from a different developer is available in five years , and if you cannot migrate your catalogue, I guess you're stuck with two applications unless you want to redo all your pictures all over again

Or if a new OS becomes available, maybe the old application becomes buggy - ouch

I understand the benefit of keeping your raw files in original, just really worries me that in 20 years from now due to a bug or problem or a change in applications, I might have to redo 20,000 files

That's the case, I guess I would be stuck with using Lightroom for the rest of my life?

Edited January 5, 2016 by skippybangkok

[skippybangkok]

Just did zoom in on mounted police arm badge....

1. Original cropped right half of pic

2. Arm zoom

3. left = jpeg max (11MB) right = TIFF 8 bit (32MB)

4. TIFF 16 bit

186MB

honestly ..... i don't see any significant pixel diff between the 11mb JPEG and the 186 MB TIFF

confused.

[rhythmworx]

I cant speak for viewnx2, but can for capturenx2.

Save an edited raw in capturenx2 everything gets saved with it undestructive, no worries, can export to Tiff or jpeg too and work in batches.

One thing with Photoshop and Lightroom V's capture nx2 is that the adobe software interprets the colours of NEFs incorrectly.

That's why I edit the basics in nx2 and then export to Tiff, open the Tiff in Adobe and then edit and save to jpeg.

Adobe is not as good at processing Nikon raw, tested it many times and its true, the colour changes even though it reports the same profile.

Do you save your raw 1st before exporting to the different format?

P.S the shots you posted above...the jpeg colours are different than the tiff.

Edited January 5, 2016 by rhythmworx

[skippybangkok]

Thanks Rytmworx

Colours look very very close to me..... what colours do you think is different ? Even size of squares are basically the same

I have Capture, but never used it. If Capture can mass process NEF into a TIFF, would be ok, but i would not want to be viewing and adjusting the same pic in 2 apps.... don't have that much time.

Edited January 6, 2016 by skippybangkok

[rhythmworx]

TBH the difference above is minimal and probably only visible at the pixel peeping level, the jpeg has slightly less saturation.

With a large amount of files like you have, what Fractured rabbit said makes more sense.

I think any option you choose has a certain lifespan.

Heres an article on DNG you might be interested in, just throwing another option in

http://petapixel.com/2015/12/08/dng-the-pros-cons-and-myths-of-the-adobe-raw-file-format/

[FracturedRabbit]

Thanks

A "what if scenario":

If a new and better application from a different developer is available in five years , and if you cannot migrate your catalogue, I guess you're stuck with two applications unless you want to redo all your pictures all over again

Or if a new OS becomes available, maybe the old application becomes buggy - ouch

I understand the benefit of keeping your raw files in original, just really worries me that in 20 years from now due to a bug or problem or a change in applications, I might have to redo 20,000 files

That's the case, I guess I would be stuck with using Lightroom for the rest of my life?

As I mentioned, you could always export your entire catalogue as new images, reflecting any changes you had made; and then import those into the new application.

[skippybangkok]

Cheers.... just read through the DNG file, interesting.... basically to me looks like another raw file, but maybe longer term more compatible / durable as SW moves on. Same as Raw - just exported the NEF file which was adjusted in Lightroom, and the DNG definately looks like the RAW, not the Adjusted one.

DNG File ( same as RAW)

The way it looked in Lightroom when exporting.

Thanks.... learning new things, never really had time to understand this stuff. Looks like the NX2 Viewer i will need to export into TIFF first.... maybe temp in 16 bit while converting to DNG / or light room

Edited January 6, 2016 by skippybangkok

[skippybangkok]

Al Humbra.... wonderful. removed some tourists first time tweaking a pic

Edited January 6, 2016 by skippybangkok

[Johntwo]

Pretty much everything covered in the previous posts but one thing I would add is to always keep a copy of your images and catalogue file on a spare hard drive. And regularly do backups

[vaultdweller0013]

honestly ..... i don't see any significant pixel diff between the 11mb JPEG and the 186 MB TIFF

confused.

One note is that you will not *see* and difference between 8-bit and 16-bit files, as your monitor will only display 8-bits per color at best (I am assuming you don't have a 10-bit monitor and FireGL/Quadro graphics card). However, there is still extra data in the 16-bit files which can come into play when processing further.

If these are "final" images that you will not process further, the only issue I can see with exporting to 16-bit TIFF and not keeping the RAW/NEF/DNG plus catalog file would be if you wanted to change the color space, but unless you get seriously into printing, that shouldn't come up. Even in this case, the visual impact will be small to none in a vast majority of pictures.

[skippybangkok]

honestly ..... i don't see any significant pixel diff between the 11mb JPEG and the 186 MB TIFF

confused.

One note is that you will not *see* and difference between 8-bit and 16-bit files, as your monitor will only display 8-bits per color at best (I am assuming you don't have a 10-bit monitor and FireGL/Quadro graphics card). However, there is still extra data in the 16-bit files which can come into play when processing further.

If these are "final" images that you will not process further, the only issue I can see with exporting to 16-bit TIFF and not keeping the RAW/NEF/DNG plus catalog file would be if you wanted to change the color space, but unless you get seriously into printing, that shouldn't come up. Even in this case, the visual impact will be small to none in a vast majority of pictures.

Cheers... Makes sense..... Like trying to see the quality of a 30mb pic on a standard screen ( without zooming in ).... Useless.

Generally I don't print anymore, very rare. Mainly view on screen, but am banal about keeping good quality / large format just in case. By accident, about 10 years back screwed something up, and pics prior to that are about 1mb size ( used to scan my slides taken on Fuji Velvia 50..... Wonderful experience )

[skippybangkok]

Next question ..... i have typically moved NEF to a back up drive as hard drive getting full. If move folder by folder, i guess need to save Lightroom catalog in that folder ?

[FracturedRabbit]

Next question ..... i have typically moved NEF to a back up drive as hard drive getting full. If move folder by folder, i guess need to save Lightroom catalog in that folder ?

No, in fact you get best performance if your LR catalogue is on a separate drive.

What you do:

1. Close LR

2. Move the photos to the back-up drive.

3. Open LR and the folders containing the photo will be greyed out in the library panel with a question mark on them.

4. Right click on the greyed out folders and choose the option "find missing folder".

5. Navigate to the directory where the photos are now stored and select.

6. LR will now be pointed to the photos in that location.

You can do this at any level in a hierarchy. For example I have just archived all my 2015 photos from my main drive to a network drive. The photos were held by date within folders, and all folders were within a 2015 folder. Moved them all to the other drive, and then in LR I only had to select "2015" in the hierarchy and then point to 2015 in the network drive, and thousands of photos were immediately repointed.

[skippybangkok]

Thx - will need some practice