One-third of Australian pensioners live in poverty: OECD report

[mpa]

What is the poverty line down under compared to EU/US standards?

I visited Sydney recently.

As I explored the city for about 2 months, I can surely say that even social housing there seemed way better than our dumpholes.

[Thaidream]

According to figures I could find on the Internet the Poverty Rates are as follows

Australia 13.9%

United States: 14.5 %

United Kingdom 33%

I find the UK figure if accurate shocking. (source was BBC)

[NeverSure]

Deleted.

Edited January 7, 2016 by NeverSure

[Flanno]

Yeah, around my area in Sydney the aged pensioners are doing it so tough most of them can only afford to play the pokies 5 days a week. It beats me how they fill their time in the other 2 days a week. Many of them live in subsidised Housing Commission units, many never worked or saved for their senior years but they are the first to whine when the government when the government wants to tighten up benefits eligibility. The amount of money being wasted on gambling by pensioners must be staggering. If it's not pokies then it's Powerball or Keno.

By the way, I receive a part aged pension. I worked, saved, live in a one bed unit and put most of my money into superannuation. I could have blown the money same as many others but chose to do 'the right thing'. Now the government has changed the means test and as of 1/1/2017 myself and many others will lose the pension completely. I'm not complaining about it but it makes me sick to the stomach when I hear all the whining going on from those on the dole, DSP or age pension as to how 'tough' it is.

[mpa]

Confirmed that!

Looks like Im generalizing but I saw pokies addicts, aged pensioners actually -more than once- complaining about gov benefits, all car owners as I talked with most of them!

Is it true that they stop all your pension contributions if you are wealthy enough?

Edited January 7, 2016 by mpa

[jeffreysearch]

Just to say .. i know a few people who had to change their lives because of the last 2 Stockmarket crashes.... so i wouldnt be too confident about relying on Super for security in the future ... the way the World economy is going.. and the way the Central banks have distorted everything... a third crash is looking `Ominous.. so really at the end of the day ..... Governments have made too many promises to people for the future .... now they are running out of money .... Socialism :-) other peoples money .

Why call them Pensioners?....They are Senior Citizens, and deserve a little respect...Some of who, have done a lot for Australia over their lifetime...

Yea ,,,They built the Country ,,,and what happen,, The government let them down. Because a lot of them have no Super they are Poor Senior Citizens!

[simple1]

Yes i am on a aged pension in Australia.

And boy it is bloody hard to survive.

Especially if you do not own your own residence.

Australia give MILLIONS away in over seas aid to some countries who HATE us and BURN our flag.

Should be stopped and given to the Senior Citizens who made this ONCE great country.

I worked ALL my life and paid my taxes, not like the dole bludgers and the unmarried mothers who have 6 kids to 6 different fathers.

And not to mention the Refugees, both legal and illegal.

Our Governments are weak as piss.

I think it is time for say a LIBERAL ALLIANCE PARTY or AUSTRALIA FIRST PARTY to clean up the mess we are in.

It's nonsense to link foreign aid, refugee support etc etc to Age Pension payments, any reduction in cost to the annual budget would be used to reduce federal debt or fund other federal programs, but not Age Pension increases. Have you ever heard a single politician firmly stating in a manifesto they will increase Age Pension funding by reducing the cost of aid and so on - just BS baffles brains.

Up to you if you wish to throw away your vote for the fledgling political parties you mention - right wing jingoistic fools who who have no chance in governing Oz.

[neverdie]

Yes i am on a aged pension in Australia.

And boy it is bloody hard to survive.

Especially if you do not own your own residence.

Australia give MILLIONS away in over seas aid to some countries who HATE us and BURN our flag.

Should be stopped and given to the Senior Citizens who made this ONCE great country.

I worked ALL my life and paid my taxes, not like the dole bludgers and the unmarried mothers who have 6 kids to 6 different fathers.

And not to mention the Refugees, both legal and illegal.

Our Governments are weak as piss.

I think it is time for say a LIBERAL ALLIANCE PARTY or AUSTRALIA FIRST PARTY to clean up the mess we are in.

It's nonsense to link foreign aid, refugee support etc etc to Age Pension payments, any reduction in cost to the annual budget would be used to reduce federal debt or fund other federal programs, but not Age Pension increases. Have you ever heard a single politician firmly stating in a manifesto they will increase Age Pension funding by reducing the cost of aid and so on - just BS baffles brains.

Up to you if you wish to throw away your vote for the fledgling political parties you mention - right wing jingoistic fools who who have no chance in governing Oz.

It's a good point you raise.

Voting for dysfunctional parties never achieves much.

Look at all the poor fools that voted for that fat, useless, incompetent self absorbed bum sniffing a.hole clive palmer. How could anyone initially vote for this idiot without seeing he was simply in things for himself and of course he's fcuked everything he's touched. .....it's a circus, but not a funny one.

[Ace of Pop]

If there was no Alians there would still be the equivalent to do unpleasant work.Old Bob will have that job soon with yer pinko politicoes

[SgtRock]

Thaidream, on 07 Jan 2016 - 20:32, said:

Welcome to the brave new world called globalization except its not really global. The wealthy in Australia, Uk, America, Canada decided that we can't make anything anymore so they moved their manufacturing base to other countries. Those countries copied our technology and then exported it back to us and our governments gave tax breaks to the companies that went offshore. Now we provide call centers and pay people minimum wage while our people get poorer the countries that stole our technology get richer. The bankers and lawyers and accountants all love it because they don't care who they represent. The I Phone designed in America is actually made in China- look a the prices they charge. Somebodies making a killing .None of this is sustainable in the long run. The One Percent cannot continue to hold the 99 Per Cent hostage much longer. This will be a World Revolution and capitalism as we know it now will be no more. A man with a long beard and flowing hair predicted over 2000 years ago that the poor would inherit the Earth. Bring it on...

Nailed it squarely on the head.

[rosst]

Well...what do you expect when a Single, Unemployed, Dole Bludger gets $100 per week MORE than a person(pensioner) who has paid taxes all their life, to make it possible.....

It costs $50K per year per Refugee, to maintain them....But they pay Pensioners a base of less than $20K...shameful hey?

WHO made the Money available for this to be paid to refugees?.....Tax Paying Australians. Why arent they considered FIRST, then whats left over can go to Refugees....

Ask any Australian Pensioner when they last ate a "T" Bone Steak...

How do you know the pensioner paid "taxes all their life"? Most of the people living in poverty at pension age, were living in poverty before pension age. What do you think happens to long term layabouts, drunks, petty criminals etc. once they reach a certain age? They are transferred from social assistance to state pension rolls. If many pensioners are impoverished, there is a reason: It is called not having prepared for their old age when they were younger. The question you should be asking is why do so many Australians abandon their elderly? Is it a culture of reaping what you sowed? Those elderly have kids. Where are they?

I don't like the willy nilly acceptance of refugees either. Unfortunately, Australians are not willing to do certain jobs. Have a look at who is working in the hospitals and elder care homes cleaning the piss and crap off the patients. it's not good ole Mabel or Bob is it?

Oh boy, from your position of plenty, your caring, understanding and concern for your fellow man leaves me stunned.

Leaving aside the illegal immigrant economic refugees and their impact on the economy, the income of Australia has been dramatically reduced by the policies of our Federal Governments over a couple of generations.

From a country that was almost self sufficient in Agriculture, minerals and energy, with a vibrant manufacturing sector, we are now reduced to a minerals supplier to a depressed global market.

The reduced income did not stop the grandiose spending and warmongering which have cost us dearly leaving our economy in tatters.

The people being spoken of came from a different age and may for many reasons been unable to provide for their old age. They expected to be looked after the way the previous generation was but we can no longer afford it. The cost of basic home services like water gas electricity and Council rates accounts for a huge proportion of their meager income.

God help the poor bastards.

[soalbundy]

Yes i am on a aged pension in Australia.

And boy it is bloody hard to survive.

Especially if you do not own your own residence.

Australia give MILLIONS away in over seas aid to some countries who HATE us and BURN our flag.

Should be stopped and given to the Senior Citizens who made this ONCE great country.

I worked ALL my life and paid my taxes, not like the dole bludgers and the unmarried mothers who have 6 kids to 6 different fathers.

And not to mention the Refugees, both legal and illegal.

Our Governments are weak as piss.

I think it is time for say a LIBERAL ALLIANCE PARTY or AUSTRALIA FIRST PARTY to clean up the mess we are in.

It's nonsense to link foreign aid, refugee support etc etc to Age Pension payments, any reduction in cost to the annual budget would be used to reduce federal debt or fund other federal programs, but not Age Pension increases. Have you ever heard a single politician firmly stating in a manifesto they will increase Age Pension funding by reducing the cost of aid and so on - just BS baffles brains.

Up to you if you wish to throw away your vote for the fledgling political parties you mention - right wing jingoistic fools who who have no chance in governing Oz.

It's a good point you raise.

Voting for dysfunctional parties never achieves much.

Look at all the poor fools that voted for that fat, useless, incompetent self absorbed bum sniffing a.hole clive palmer. How could anyone initially vote for this idiot without seeing he was simply in things for himself and of course he's fcuked everything he's touched. .....it's a circus, but not a funny one.

Admit it, you don't like Clive Palmer much do you?

[OldSalty]

Don't try to hijack the topic, this is not about Clive Palmer or any other singled out politician, it is all about old age poverty and low pension payments in Australia, one of the richest countries in the developed world. Thank you

[thaibeachlovers]

So why every body complains about Australian pensions? You get your pension

move to Thailand because it's cheaper to live who the hell pays for your pension?

Working people who work now and how much pension do you get from Thailand ?

Not a cent and how many Thai people get pension ?

Sorry but that is just a lot of BS. People live here now because it is more affordable for them to live here instead in their home countries where the rents are just too high, more than 70% of their pension plus costs for heating and higher food expenses, All these people want is a decent income in their old age. I do not get a pension from Thailand and I do not want one, because I never worked here. But why is he Australian Pension means tested, those who saved all their lives do not get it and that is unfair, I am not stopping Thailand from having a social security system. Our living here pays for a lot of wages and bills, so that Thai families can survive, so please get your facts right and do not give me that BS.

All those that have too much money to get a pension should have a big splurge- overseas trips, gambling, carousing- spend it all ( well not all- hide some under the mattress ) and go on the pension. The sprogs won't like it, but they can go earn their own money.

[thaibeachlovers]

Well...what do you expect when a Single, Unemployed, Dole Bludger gets $100 per week MORE than a person(pensioner) who has paid taxes all their life, to make it possible.....

It costs $50K per year per Refugee, to maintain them....But they pay Pensioners a base of less than $20K...shameful hey?

WHO made the Money available for this to be paid to refugees?.....Tax Paying Australians. Why arent they considered FIRST, then whats left over can go to Refugees....

Ask any Australian Pensioner when they last ate a "T" Bone Steak...

How do you know the pensioner paid "taxes all their life"? Most of the people living in poverty at pension age, were living in poverty before pension age. What do you think happens to long term layabouts, drunks, petty criminals etc. once they reach a certain age? They are transferred from social assistance to state pension rolls. If many pensioners are impoverished, there is a reason: It is called not having prepared for their old age when they were younger. The question you should be asking is why do so many Australians abandon their elderly? Is it a culture of reaping what you sowed? Those elderly have kids. Where are they?

I don't like the willy nilly acceptance of refugees either. Unfortunately, Australians are not willing to do certain jobs. Have a look at who is working in the hospitals and elder care homes cleaning the piss and crap off the patients. it's not good ole Mabel or Bob is it?

Oh boy, from your position of plenty, your caring, understanding and concern for your fellow man leaves me stunned.

Leaving aside the illegal immigrant economic refugees and their impact on the economy, the income of Australia has been dramatically reduced by the policies of our Federal Governments over a couple of generations.

From a country that was almost self sufficient in Agriculture, minerals and energy, with a vibrant manufacturing sector, we are now reduced to a minerals supplier to a depressed global market.

The reduced income did not stop the grandiose spending and warmongering which have cost us dearly leaving our economy in tatters.

The people being spoken of came from a different age and may for many reasons been unable to provide for their old age. They expected to be looked after the way the previous generation was but we can no longer afford it. The cost of basic home services like water gas electricity and Council rates accounts for a huge proportion of their meager income.

God help the poor bastards.

Given that many are ex servicemen, will they sit quietly waiting to die?

[Cats4ever]

The methodology of this survey is a little questionable. It is a percentage of aged people who get less than 50% of the mean income. That is mean, not average. Australia has a fairly high average wage, so this has an effect on the result. I don't doubt that a lot of pensioners are a bit tight for dough. There are others who are fairly comfortable. As for means testing; it has always been so. Tax would have to have been at a much higher level to pay to all. Your choice (Europe is facing that problem now). Be careful of stupid information circulating in emails and I would suggest that talk back radio is pitched at non thinking dills, predominantly.

Think things through and resist the urge to be an umbrage taker.

[weegee]

You wait...When i am Prime Minister of Australia, things will change....Dont you just worry about that. (humour in there that only OLD Aussies would understand).

Flat rate Tax for everyone no exceptions = Old age pensions for everyone no exceptions.

wasnt that was put to these Seniors when they were young and working....The Flat rate was about 7% and believe it or not the tax is still being collected today

Edited January 8, 2016 by weegee

[neverdie]

Don't try to hijack the topic, this is not about Clive Palmer or any other singled out politician, it is all about old age poverty and low pension payments in Australia, one of the richest countries in the developed world. Thank you

No hijack intended at all.

As far as being one of the richest countries in the developed world, It would seem there's more debt than wealth. Australia is in for some really hard time, if old age pensioners think it's tough now they better fasten their seat belts, me thinks.

[papayasalad]

if you worked all your life thinking you will get a nice retirement, sorry to tell you but your are a deluded idiot with pink glass.

we know all that this is based on a pyramid scheme.

Gov will tell you it's not, that the money taken from your pay cheque is smartly invested on the stock market, 401k crap... .. ahahah it's even worse. when market crash, your pension go dodo unless the print more money to save your posteriors.

in fact the only one who profit are the one who do nothing, and suck your money by claiming refuge.

in 5 years, I think pensions won't exist anymore. only public soup and bridges as a shelter.

my questions is why to work and why to save? our corrupt governments don't give a rat ass about their citizen.

Edited January 8, 2016 by papayasalad

[connda]

No duh. Eugenics Western style.

[neverdie]

You wait...When i am Prime Minister of Australia, things will change....Dont you just worry about that. (humour in there that only OLD Aussies would understand).

Flat rate Tax for everyone no exceptions = Old age pensions for everyone no exceptions.

wasnt that was put to these Seniors when they were young and working....The Flat rate was about 7% and believe it or not the tax is still being collected today

You will be assinated

[weegee]

The are literally Billions of Dollars frozen in Compulsory Super....Political Partys have been trying to find a way of getting their hands on that for ages now....

When they succeed, which they eventually will....and nothing is left to pay the elderly or anyone else ...What then?

They will have given it away to every Tom Dick and Harry Country that has a bad luck story...THEN....The youngins will wish they had of taken care of their elderly properly and listened to what they had to say...Experience thoughout your life will eventually teach you that....

[Seastallion]

The methodology of this survey is a little questionable. It is a percentage of aged people who get less than 50% of the mean income. That is mean, not average. Australia has a fairly high average wage, so this has an effect on the result. I don't doubt that a lot of pensioners are a bit tight for dough. There are others who are fairly comfortable. As for means testing; it has always been so. Tax would have to have been at a much higher level to pay to all. Your choice (Europe is facing that problem now). Be careful of stupid information circulating in emails and I would suggest that talk back radio is pitched at non thinking dills, predominantly.

Think things through and resist the urge to be an umbrage taker.

The mean is the average. No difference.

[steve654]

Just read that report and it states that a single person can only claim about $22,000 in pension. In Canada, unless you are a government worker or union, max I think is around $13,000, so in my books, aussies are really doing quite fine.

[weegee]

Just read that report and it states that a single person can only claim about $22,000 in pension. In Canada, unless you are a government worker or union, max I think is around $13,000, so in my books, aussies are really doing quite fine.

Not sure if that is right or not...BUT...I know of a Husband & Wife (Thai) who are living in Canada and receiving around $2K per month....They are very happy. They never want to return to Thailand.....

But this is about Australian Pensioners (Senior Citizens) some of who were in one job all their life and done what was asked of them.

Police Force in Aus never got big Salaries years ago, neither did Firemen, Ambulance, and many other essential Jobs in Government Employment...

They are now Pensioners who thought they would be looked after, when their turn came to retire....sadly what they did to bring Australia forward, has been pushed aside....Not rewarded.

[simple1]

Just read that report and it states that a single person can only claim about $22,000 in pension. In Canada, unless you are a government worker or union, max I think is around $13,000, so in my books, aussies are really doing quite fine.

Not sure if that is right or not...BUT...I know of a Husband & Wife (Thai) who are living in Canada and receiving around $2K per month....They are very happy. They never want to return to Thailand.....

But this is about Australian Pensioners (Senior Citizens) some of who were in one job all their life and done what was asked of them.

Police Force in Aus never got big Salaries years ago, neither did Firemen, Ambulance, and many other essential Jobs in Government Employment...

They are now Pensioners who thought they would be looked after, when their turn came to retire....sadly what they did to bring Australia forward, has been pushed aside....Not rewarded.

I use to work in IT sales to QLD government departments. The retirement payments policy has been changed, but until the defined benefits change staff would receive a pension annual equivalent of their annual salary averaged by the last two years of employment; when the ex employee died their partner would receive the pension payment until they passed away. A very generous policy.

As an example current pension contribution policy for QLD police is the QSuper superannuation scheme with 18% employer superannuation contributions and 6% employee contributions, again fairly generous

Edited January 8, 2016 by simple1

[BB24]

The methodology of this survey is a little questionable. It is a percentage of aged people who get less than 50% of the mean income. That is mean, not average. Australia has a fairly high average wage, so this has an effect on the result. I don't doubt that a lot of pensioners are a bit tight for dough. There are others who are fairly comfortable. As for means testing; it has always been so. Tax would have to have been at a much higher level to pay to all. Your choice (Europe is facing that problem now). Be careful of stupid information circulating in emails and I would suggest that talk back radio is pitched at non thinking dills, predominantly.

Think things through and resist the urge to be an umbrage taker.

The mean is the average. No difference.

There are times when the average is not the mean. To refer to the sum of all values divided by the total number of values, what you have is called the average. In mathematics there are different "averages" or "means" - the average number as calculated above is more properly called the arithmetic mean. However, meteorologists record the "mean daily temperature" as being the sum of the high temperature and the low temperature divided by 2. And mean and average can also be very different things when used by a Statistician. The average (or arithmetic mean) of 20, 20, 20, 70, 90, 120, 120 is 51.42 - but the mean is 70. Most statiticians refer to the mean as the mid point in a range of numbers - meaning there is an equal number above and equal number below the mean value in any list of numbers - but technically (mathematically) that is the median value. The point being that if you have a lot of low numbers and a lot of much higher numbers, the mean of that list will always be above the average. Did the people making this list use the mean or the arithmetic mean - my bet is they used the mean. Having had some involvement in this area, I always found that when a statistician used mean, they were really using the median - they know exactly what the term 'average' is and therefore they only use average when they calculate the arithmetic mean. When they calculate the median they use the term mean - because many people dont know what median means (they often think it is a typo or means medium).

[soalbundy]

Well...what do you expect when a Single, Unemployed, Dole Bludger gets $100 per week MORE than a person(pensioner) who has paid taxes all their life, to make it possible.....

It costs $50K per year per Refugee, to maintain them....But they pay Pensioners a base of less than $20K...shameful hey?

WHO made the Money available for this to be paid to refugees?.....Tax Paying Australians. Why arent they considered FIRST, then whats left over can go to Refugees....

Ask any Australian Pensioner when they last ate a "T" Bone Steak...

How do you know the pensioner paid "taxes all their life"? Most of the people living in poverty at pension age, were living in poverty before pension age. What do you think happens to long term layabouts, drunks, petty criminals etc. once they reach a certain age? They are transferred from social assistance to state pension rolls. If many pensioners are impoverished, there is a reason: It is called not having prepared for their old age when they were younger. The question you should be asking is why do so many Australians abandon their elderly? Is it a culture of reaping what you sowed? Those elderly have kids. Where are they?

I don't like the willy nilly acceptance of refugees either. Unfortunately, Australians are not willing to do certain jobs. Have a look at who is working in the hospitals and elder care homes cleaning the piss and crap off the patients. it's not good ole Mabel or Bob is it?

Oh boy, from your position of plenty, your caring, understanding and concern for your fellow man leaves me stunned.

Leaving aside the illegal immigrant economic refugees and their impact on the economy, the income of Australia has been dramatically reduced by the policies of our Federal Governments over a couple of generations.

From a country that was almost self sufficient in Agriculture, minerals and energy, with a vibrant manufacturing sector, we are now reduced to a minerals supplier to a depressed global market.

The reduced income did not stop the grandiose spending and warmongering which have cost us dearly leaving our economy in tatters.

The people being spoken of came from a different age and may for many reasons been unable to provide for their old age. They expected to be looked after the way the previous generation was but we can no longer afford it. The cost of basic home services like water gas electricity and Council rates accounts for a huge proportion of their meager income.

God help the poor bastards.

Given that many are ex servicemen, will they sit quietly waiting to die?

After a certain it becomes a sort of hobby

[oldsailor35]

Well...what do you expect when a Single, Unemployed, Dole Bludger gets $100 per week MORE than a person(pensioner) who has paid taxes all their life, to make it possible.....

It costs $50K per year per Refugee, to maintain them....But they pay Pensioners a base of less than $20K...shameful hey?

WHO made the Money available for this to be paid to refugees?.....Tax Paying Australians. Why arent they considered FIRST, then whats left over can go to Refugees....

Ask any Australian Pensioner when they last ate a "T" Bone Steak...

How do you know the pensioner paid "taxes all their life"? Most of the people living in poverty at pension age, were living in poverty before pension age. What do you think happens to long term layabouts, drunks, petty criminals etc. once they reach a certain age? They are transferred from social assistance to state pension rolls. If many pensioners are impoverished, there is a reason: It is called not having prepared for their old age when they were younger. The question you should be asking is why do so many Australians abandon their elderly? Is it a culture of reaping what you sowed? Those elderly have kids. Where are they?

I don't like the willy nilly acceptance of refugees either. Unfortunately, Australians are not willing to do certain jobs. Have a look at who is working in the hospitals and elder care homes cleaning the piss and crap off the patients. it's not good ole Mabel or Bob is it?

I just hate smug persons like yourself ! Many things happen along the way. Most of us have worked all our lives, it was an Australian trait. I was well provided, but due to matrimonial problems am now left to exist on my o/a pension and believe me it is bloody tough. In the end i have had to move to Thailand to manage, but the Aust govt have deducted my medical subsidy and there is no National Health system here. Dole bludgers in Australia get everything in fact far more than i do and have probably paid in sweet FA.

[oldsailor35]

Why call them Pensioners?....They are Senior Citizens, and deserve a little respect...Some of who, have done a lot for Australia over their lifetime...

Yea ,,,They built the Country ,,,and what happen,, The government let them down. Because a lot of them have no Super they are Poor Senior Citizens!

For most of us it was too late for super annuation.