Electric shower.

[Gandtee]

I have a Whirlpool WH-173 shower. It's getting on a bit but has been hardly used due to the water pressure not being strong enough for a decent shower. That has been rectified by now having mains water. It works OK except that the ELB light does not come on, but the ELB works OK, and It seems that it does not heat up on the high heat settings. Any tips before I try to find a repairer. Any suggestions gratefully received.

[steven100]

Go buy a new unit .... Panasonic or similar. By the time you get it repaired the cost will add up and you can buy new cheap these days.

[stoneyboy]

I have a Whirlpool WH-173 shower. It's getting on a bit but has been hardly used due to the water pressure not being strong enough for a decent shower. That has been rectified by now having mains water. It works OK except that the ELB light does not come on, but the ELB works OK, and It seems that it does not heat up on the high heat settings. Any tips before I try to find a repairer. Any suggestions gratefully received.

Firstly how many KWs is the unit,many of the lower KW units don't heat the water sufficiently especially in the cooler months when water temperatures are lower due to cooler nights etc.

All my showers are 6kw and heat sufficiently even with the colder water from my storage tanks due to overnight temperatures up here of 14/17degrees.

I made the mistake some years ago of buying a 2500 baht Panasonic shower,it was 3kw and rarely heated the water to a comfortable temperature,I had to adjust the flow of water going into the unit to make it nearly hot.

[lopburi3]

Be very careful - I had several old Whirlpool models and the ELB was a manual connection to the actual breaker and could become corroded and fail to trip the breaker. Newer models corrected that issue but not sure which you have.

As said probably better to just buy a new unit - heating units become smaller over time with scale build up and they never had very good flow - the new Panasonic models that are often available for about 2,500 baht are much better quality in my view (have several) - they are all plastic and waterproof as well as ground and ELB protected - but the water flow also seems to be much better than other models (and still able to heat water OK). In the mountains you might want a higher wattage unit but here in Bangkok 3.5kw units work well for all but a few days of the year - and easy enough to lower flow on those days. But my water tans are above ground so might be colder if below ground storage.

[steven100]

I have a Whirlpool WH-173 shower. It's getting on a bit but has been hardly used due to the water pressure not being strong enough for a decent shower. That has been rectified by now having mains water. It works OK except that the ELB light does not come on, but the ELB works OK, and It seems that it does not heat up on the high heat settings. Any tips before I try to find a repairer. Any suggestions gratefully received.

Firstly how many KWs is the unit,many of the lower KW units don't heat the water sufficiently especially in the cooler months when water temperatures are lower due to cooler nights etc.

All my showers are 6kw and heat sufficiently even with the colder water from my storage tanks due to overnight temperatures up here of 14/17degrees.

I made the mistake some years ago of buying a 2500 baht Panasonic shower,it was 3kw and rarely heated the water to a comfortable temperature,I had to adjust the flow of water going into the unit to make it nearly hot.

hmmmm ... that can happen but most units will give hot water without adjusting the flow to get it hotter ( I know what you mean as a hotel I stayed in was the same )

I have heard some 3kw units work good and others don't ... or get a 4.5 kw unit .

Toshiba Water Heater WH-4511E 4500 Watt

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[Gandtee]

Thankyou gentlemen for your views on this. A new one seems to be the answer.

[Crossy]

If you go over 4.5kW check the wiring and breaker are adequately sized.

4.5kW will just be OK on 2.5mm² cable and a 20A breaker, if the existing wiring is smaller then it will need replacing. If you're going to the trouble of changing the wiring install 4mm² and a 30A breaker to be future-proof.

[howto]

@Crossy "4.5kW will just be OK on 2.5mm² cable" (for 30 minutes)

What are the assumptions:

- 230 v incoming and

- electric shower on max?

What if the incoming is only 200v?

[Crossy]

@Crossy "4.5kW will just be OK on 2.5mm² cable" (for 30 minutes)

What are the assumptions:

- 230 v incoming and

- electric shower on max?

What if the incoming is only 200v?

Assumptions:-

Shower is rated at 220V, supply is 220V, heater on maximum. So 4.5kW will draw 4500/220 = 20.45A

Heater is a (fairly) constant resistance of 10.8 Ohms.

If the supply is at the high end (242V) then the current will be 22.4A, if at the low end (198V) current will be 18.3A.

Neither will cause any problem to a 20A breaker or 2.5mm² cable, both will carry a 10% overload pretty well forever. One should de-rate the cable if it's installed in high ambient areas but in reality it won't be a problem.

As I noted earlier, if re-wiring one should go bigger, 4mm² cable and 32A breaker.

EDIT It may be interesting for the non-technical to note that when the supply is 242V the heater will produce 5,400 Watts, but whilst the supply is 198V the heater will only develop 3,600 Watts.

[Forkinhades]

[RichCor]

@Crossy "4.5kW will just be OK on 2.5mm² cable" (for 30 minutes)

What are the assumptions:

Assumptions:-

[...]

Neither will cause any problem to a 20A breaker or 2.5mm² cable, both will carry a 10% overload pretty well forever. One should de-rate the cable if it's installed in high ambient areas but in reality it won't be a problem.

As I noted earlier, if re-wiring one should go bigger, 4mm² cable and 32A breaker.

I think it's been stated before that 2.5mm² is rated at 20A but that's in free air.

At 20A even in free air it does get toasty so it's pretty common practice to derate it to 16A.

As Crossy wrote, high ambient areas also come into play. If the current wire run includes sharp bends, painted thermoplastic oversheath (PVC), long distances, or animals wanting to built (not to code) flammable nests incorporating your wire then a pesky 70°C limit for the wire has to be maintained by restricting the maximum load.

[Crossy]

Indeed ^^^.

I certainly wouldn't go over 4.5kW on 2.5 and nothing bigger than a 20A breaker.

Bangkok Cable rate their 2.5mm² VAF and VAF-G at 23A surface mounted, it certainly gets warm at that and becomes quite bendy, but nothing like hot enough to cause anything to burn.

In reality 20A for the period of a shower (even my wife's showering) isn't going to cause a fire even if your critters build a nest.

NOT recommended but I've run 2.5mm² VAF in free air at 30+A (providing power during the floods), pretty warm but not hot enough to cause any discolouration of the sheath.

[Chuckles78]

What about using a boiler? I have one installed and have hot water in the entire house with no electrics in my bathrooms.

[lopburi3]

And for most that would require a re-plumbing of there entire home - and most homes here do not need an extra source of heat in there walls/floors getting water to the point or use - also believe many people do have other needs for electric in there bathrooms - exhaust fans/lights/hair dryer/toothbrush/waterpik for a few. But agree it is an option for some.

[JohanB]

What about using a boiler? I have one installed and have hot water in the entire house with no electrics in my bathrooms.

I did that too in 2009.

2kitchens & 4bathrooms with a total of 11 hot/cold taps and showers. Works perfectly with only a central 2KW 120 litres Steinel boiler. Takes less than 10 Amp from our weak mains supply (long feeding lines)

Of course I alredy had put in PEX (from Sweden) hot water tubes when building and prepaired for central hot water from a boiler or sun collectors.

I have seen some orange flexible high quality plastic hot water tubes lately here in Thailand, that seems perfect for DIY-plumbing.

[Concerned Muti]

Hello. How can I buy an electric shower online for my so please? I live in the UK. Thanks for your help. He is in Bangkok.

[Crossy]

Lazada is a good bet, but he'll have to arrange safe installation.

 

HomePro may do online sales and arrange installation, worth a look.

[sometimewoodworker]

On 5/14/2018 at 5:27 PM, Crossy said:

Lazada is a good bet, but he'll have to arrange safe installation.

 

HomePro may do online sales and arrange installation, worth a look.

They do online sales HomePro, I don't know about install.