Overstay for 3 years but flying out during last week of April

[kovaltech]

1.No chance of that.

2. He will be banned from entering. Once on overstay having proof of an injury will do no good because it is possible to get extensions based upon illness or injury.

3. I don't think there will be any exceptions.

Having a new passport will not hide the banning. They will do a name and date of birth search that will reveal the banning.

My only suggestion is that he should leave and then return prior to March 20th.

Thank you all for your valuable suggestions. Just out of curiosity, I want to know when in UK if changes his name legally and get new passport on new name and when he enters bangkok airport, can the immigration at bangkok airport will be able to trace his record? (my pologies if my question is not accurate)

Years ago I heard this discussed at the xxxxx embassy in Bangkok. The consular officer was explaining that pretty much all countries have records of old name/new name on various government databases and for a simple and good reason.

If they did not have these old/new records then any wanted murderers, sex offenders, terrorists (not suggesting your husband fits these descriptors) could escape very easily.

The consular guy said this is all fully recorded in the immigration database his country uses and is in the international passport database, as soon the the incoming or outgoing immigration officer swipes the barcode on the new passport both old and new names and full details appear on screen which prompts a lot further checking before the person is allowed to proceed.

Is Thailand up to date with all this?

Yes, Thailand is up to date..

Further, they do put all your data now, from the arriving card, immediatly in the computer... Their database is up to date...

[cracker1]

Your husband should leave early March before new severe penalty's take effect.

You say he had medical reasons for the overstay but those needed to be attended to at that time, with letters from Medical staff that would have allowed extensions to his Visa. Probably to late now ?

[saakura]

He has had a medical emergency for 3yrs due to which he could not extend his stay legally or depart. Maybe he has still not recovered which is why his wife is posting on his behalf and her grasp of english is also to be complimented.

Edited February 6, 2016 by saakura

[sunnyjim5]

He has had a medical emergency for 3yrs due to which he could not extend his stay legally or depart. Maybe he has still not recovered which is why his wife is posting on his behalf and her grasp of english is also to be complimented.

The stay could easily have been extended by his wife had she obtained the necessary documentation from the Doctor/hospital.

Many hospitals also have patient liaison officers who will provide assistance with visa issues if asked.

[FritsSikkink]

no excuses for illness, you as his wife could have completed his obligations at Immigration, but lets move on, and forget that.

What happens if you all travel to the UK, then he cannot get a Visa for Thailand as he is blacklisted, and you cannot stay in the UK, this

could happen, then you have to return to Thailand and apply for a Spouse Visa, but your husband has to have savings or a salary of

so much to even start the application.

Suggest a visit to the Embassy or Consulate to get an Emergency travel Document, then fly out of Thailand now, with the 20,000baht

overstay fee, get a visa in a neighboring country and come back, at least he will be legally here, then wait for his new passport and

then fly to the UK for a holiday.

I think it is Bhat 50,000 not 20

you think wrong

[hobobo]

overstay is overstay, which ever way you look at it .... 3 yrs is a long time , he will probably be blacklisted and treated as an other overstayer .... I doubt he'll be allowed back for some time ....

Poor kids, growing up without a father. Why don't they (the fathers) think of their real responsibilities first? Maybe too busy down the boozer?

[Scouse123]

It just seems extremely difficult to accept and sympathise with the guy when she is saying the overstay is 3 years plus.

How can anybody be completely incapacitated and unable to get their affairs in order for this length of time??

Seems a stretch.

I have had friends with serious illnesses who have had operations at famous hospitals in the city and immigration have been more than happy to help and even had designated areas and officers sat at desks in Bumrungrad hospital once upon a time. The losers here unfortunately could be the poor wife and children.

[maoro2013]

I don't know how any country, with the exception of where the name change was done, would have any idea about the change of name. If this was the case then every name change done anywhere would have to be transmitted to every other country. I'm sure this is extremely unlikely.

[louse1953]

1.No chance of that.

2. He will be banned from entering. Once on overstay having proof of an injury will do no good because it is possible to get extensions based upon illness or injury.

3. I don't think there will be any exceptions.

Having a new passport will not hide the banning. They will do a name and date of birth search that will reveal the banning.

My only suggestion is that he should leave and then return prior to March 20th.

Thank you all for your valuable suggestions. Just out of curiosity, I want to know when in UK if changes his name legally and get new passport on new name and when he enters bangkok airport, can the immigration at bangkok airport will be able to trace his record? (my pologies if my question is not accurate)

Your pretty savvy Kanok,knowing the ins and outs of scams.It would probably work,but why can't your dearly beloved,pay the 20k baht,fly out and back.Would you have to change your last name again to suit your parteners.

[louse1953]

He has had a medical emergency for 3yrs due to which he could not extend his stay legally or depart. Maybe he has still not recovered which is why his wife is posting on his behalf and her grasp of english is also to be complimented.

If he is unwell maybe the airline will not let him fly.

[Fairynuff]

A few days overstay I can understand, I've done it myself. A few weeks possibly on medical grounds. Beyond that I can't see any reason for doing it and I find it hard to be sympathetic.

[BritTim]

I don't know how any country, with the exception of where the name change was done, would have any idea about the change of name. If this was the case then every name change done anywhere would have to be transmitted to every other country. I'm sure this is extremely unlikely.

Have you noticed that photographs are now taken of you by immigration, and combined with information from your biometric passport? While not 100%, the first time a new passport is used, the immigration computer will (in addition to verifying the photo against the biometric data) also look for matches with previous passports. A change of name may not be sufficient without plastic surgery.

[Badbanker]

At the moment biometric identification is not in place, however it is planned along with fingerprinting.

Yes the present photo database could be used and compared when you enter and it would make a problem for a number of people!

[bark]

If they do finger printing in Thailand; all the guys from Africa will need to cut off both hands.

[ardokano]

1.No chance of that.

2. He will be banned from entering. Once on overstay having proof of an injury will do no good because it is possible to get extensions based upon illness or injury.

3. I don't think there will be any exceptions.

Having a new passport will not hide the banning. They will do a name and date of birth search that will reveal the banning.

My only suggestion is that he should leave and then return prior to March 20th.

Thank you all for your valuable suggestions. Just out of curiosity, I want to know when in UK if changes his name legally and get new passport on new name and when he enters bangkok airport, can the immigration at bangkok airport will be able to trace his record? (my pologies if my question is not accurate)

Years ago I heard this discussed at the xxxxx embassy in Bangkok. The consular officer was explaining that pretty much all countries have records of old name/new name on various government databases and for a simple and good reason.

If they did not have these old/new records then any wanted murderers, sex offenders, terrorists (not suggesting your husband fits these descriptors) could escape very easily.

The consular guy said this is all fully recorded in the immigration database his country uses and is in the international passport database, as soon the the incoming or outgoing immigration officer swipes the barcode on the new passport both old and new names and full details appear on screen which prompts a lot further checking before the person is allowed to proceed.

Is Thailand up to date with all this?

"international passport database"

What is this?

So funny who allow keep its data?

Barcode its repet information in passport for easy used.

Not have any previose information.

In Application Tgai Visa have any paragraph about previose banned o change name?

When banned or departured have any paper signatured about get information if try entry its be crime case?

If all tgis is not have.

So with New Name it big chance get entry. And even can indificate with previose name its only depatrured.

[bkkcanuck8]

1.No chance of that.

2. He will be banned from entering. Once on overstay having proof of an injury will do no good because it is possible to get extensions based upon illness or injury.

3. I don't think there will be any exceptions.

Having a new passport will not hide the banning. They will do a name and date of birth search that will reveal the banning.

My only suggestion is that he should leave and then return prior to March 20th.

Thank you all for your valuable suggestions. Just out of curiosity, I want to know when in UK if changes his name legally and get new passport on new name and when he enters bangkok airport, can the immigration at bangkok airport will be able to trace his record? (my pologies if my question is not accurate)

Years ago I heard this discussed at the xxxxx embassy in Bangkok. The consular officer was explaining that pretty much all countries have records of old name/new name on various government databases and for a simple and good reason.

If they did not have these old/new records then any wanted murderers, sex offenders, terrorists (not suggesting your husband fits these descriptors) could escape very easily.

The consular guy said this is all fully recorded in the immigration database his country uses and is in the international passport database, as soon the the incoming or outgoing immigration officer swipes the barcode on the new passport both old and new names and full details appear on screen which prompts a lot further checking before the person is allowed to proceed.

Is Thailand up to date with all this?

"international passport database"

What is this?

So funny who allow keep its data?

Barcode its repet information in passport for easy used.

Not have any previose information.

In Application Tgai Visa have any paragraph about previose banned o change name?

When banned or departured have any paper signatured about get information if try entry its be crime case?

If all tgis is not have.

So with New Name it big chance get entry. And even can indificate with previose name its only depatrured.

When I had my last passport stolen (replaced early), the information linking the old passport to the new one was printed on the first page "notes" page after the identification page. This contained name on the last page - last passport id number - and reason for it's replacement. It probably would not be contained in the ePassport section.

Since it is not the job of the passport office to shield those with criminal records in other countries from the authorities -- it would not surprise me that if you had your passport changed because of a name changed they (some countries) would include that information for continuity sake .... i.e. include a reason for passport replacement.

I am not saying they would (though they probably would if they had thought it through) -- but relying on the fact that a name change would simply "fix" the situation without contacting ones own passport office for clarification - to be potentially risky.

Many countries ASK if you have entered under a prior name, and if they have knowledge of a name change they will record that information in their database. If you lie to immigration, in many countries you are committing a felony with potential serious consequences.

More and more countries are also moving to biometric collection (fingerprints, facial recognition [error prone and potentially too slow for anything but criminal tracking]) - which will help close any holes outstanding. I know the US has it, Japan has it etc. Canadians are typically exempt from US fingerprint scanners - because of bilateral agreements giving full access to the RCMP fingerprint as well as other police / intelligence things like "wants/warrants" etc.

I do not believe there is a massive database of all passports by any international organization. There are sometimes bilateral agreements giving countries access to it (but I doubt Thailand would have access to the UK one). There is however a STLD database from Interpol that is used to track lost and stolen passports -- which maybe is getting confused for some massive - contain all billions of passport type database.

I do have sympathy for the lady that posted here and their family even though I might have doubts that this may be in large part have been preventable by the husband/father. I hope that the person is able to travel by March 20th -- since I doubt that they will take medical documents as an excuse for two reasons: They are likely not to have any nuanced exceptions at the beginning, and even if they did they would likely take the complete 3 year history into account not just the event itself.

Edited February 7, 2016 by bkkcanuck8

[ardokano]

When I had my last passport stolen (replaced early), the information linking the old passport to the new one was printed on the first page "notes" page after the identification page. This contained name on the last page - last passport id number - and reason for it's replacement. It probably would not be contained in the ePassport section.

Since it is not the job of the passport office to shield those with criminal records in other countries from the authorities -- it would not surprise me that if you had your passport changed because of a name changed they (some countries) would include that information for continuity sake .... i.e. include a reason for passport replacement.

I am not saying they would (though they probably would if they had thought it through) -- but relying on the fact that a name change would simply "fix" the situation without contacting ones own passport office for clarification - to be potentially risky.

Many countries ASK if you have entered under a prior name, and if they have knowledge of a name change they will record that information in their database. If you lie to immigration, in many countries you are committing a felony with potential serious consequences.

More and more countries are also moving to biometric collection (fingerprints, facial recognition [error prone and potentially too slow for anything but criminal tracking]) - which will help close any holes outstanding. I know the US has it, Japan has it etc. Canadians are typically exempt from US fingerprint scanners - because of bilateral agreements giving full access to the RCMP fingerprint as well as other police / intelligence things like "wants/warrants" etc.

I do not believe there is a massive database of all passports by any international organization. There are sometimes bilateral agreements giving countries access to it (but I doubt Thailand would have access to the UK one). There is however a STLD database from Interpol that is used to track lost and stolen passports -- which maybe is getting confused for some massive - contain all billions of passport type database.

I do have sympathy for the lady that posted here and their family even though I might have doubts that this may be in large part have been preventable by the husband/father. I hope that the person is able to travel by March 20th -- since I doubt that they will take medical documents as an excuse for two reasons: They are likely not to have any nuanced exceptions at the beginning, and even if they did they would likely take the complete 3 year history into account not just the event itself.

Yes now it be sad time and nore country be police country.

Yes some country have note about change passport.

But whe change name its not change passport. Its change name on ID too.

But its still do not changed tax number or some ID number.

Some coutry print it in passport.

So number passport and name can changed but ID cant.

But not many country Immigration use indificatio from ID.

And black list its not big deal.

In imigration use name and seurname. Data BD. Another thinks it

depends on how suspicious people at a particular immigration officer.

And ofcouse biometric information can easy indification.

So if have biometric have in black list and in passport yes .

But another way...

And Thailand Imigration i do not remember ask about changed name or about banned in any applycation.

So only departured if indification.

PS

I do not think its Good Idea change Name for OP husband. And I hope be fine get out before 20 march.

[BritTim]

At the moment biometric identification is not in place, however it is planned along with fingerprinting.

Yes the present photo database could be used and compared when you enter and it would make a problem for a number of people!

For a quick check against people who are blacklisted, just the date of birth may be sufficient to narrow potential matches to a handful. I assume the numbers currently blacklisted are only a few thousand (doubtless soon to increase) and exact date of birth matches with people on the blacklist, combined perhaps with height, could quickly present a few photos for manual comparison by the IO. I do not think this would be a difficult programming exercise. Do you know if this is currently done?

[smedly]

no excuses for illness, you as his wife could have completed his obligations at Immigration, but lets move on, and forget that.

What happens if you all travel to the UK, then he cannot get a Visa for Thailand as he is blacklisted, and you cannot stay in the UK, this

could happen, then you have to return to Thailand and apply for a Spouse Visa, but your husband has to have savings or a salary of

so much to even start the application.

Suggest a visit to the Embassy or Consulate to get an Emergency travel Document, then fly out of Thailand now, with the 20,000baht

overstay fee, get a visa in a neighboring country and come back, at least he will be legally here, then wait for his new passport and

then fly to the UK for a holiday.

This is spot on, the only thing I would change is about the ETD, instead of getting an ETD apply right now of a UK passport, will have in 2 weeks, keep the old passport to travel with - go across the border before March 20th pay OS fine and return

[English_M_in_Bkk]

If he doesn't have the passport the original entry stamp was in, he needs to show a police report stating it was lost/stolen, or a letter from the embassy saying they have cancelled it.

Immigration at the airport will not transfer the stamp to the new/temporary passport unless he has this, and will not let him leave.

Edited February 8, 2016 by English_M_in_Bkk

[MobileContent]

Overstayer from next month will have to take a finger scan according to Immigration HQ (Source: Sakon Nakhon Immigration Chief). The System comes from Singapore

[djlest]

yes its no big deal - simply LEAVE NOW and come back in after paying your friendly customs officers... PS leave a tip...

[Scouse123]

Overstayer from next month will have to take a finger scan according to Immigration HQ (Source: Sakon Nakhon Immigration Chief). The System comes from Singapore

It's a woman, the boss up there at Sakon Nakhon, isn't it, or it was!

Why would they be involved in finger printing overstay?

They get some from Laos but I would have thought the foreigners going there would be for extensions, you wouldn't go there for overstay, would you?

I thought it would be the nearest international crossing point or airport? Sorry, I am asking out of curiosity!

Edited February 8, 2016 by Scouse123

[bkkcanuck8]

Overstayer from next month will have to take a finger scan according to Immigration HQ (Source: Sakon Nakhon Immigration Chief). The System comes from Singapore

It's a woman, the boss up there at Sakon Nakhon, isn't it, or it was!

Why would they be involved in finger printing overstay?

They get some from Laos but I would have thought the foreigners going there would be for extensions, you wouldn't go there for overstay, would you?

I thought it would be the nearest international crossing point or airport? Sorry, I am asking out of curiosity!

Fingerprint overstay for enforcement of blacklist. The question is whether they will fingerprint all or those over 3 months. Since they will be using it for entry, I suspect they will be fingerprinting all - including those that were already inside when the fingerprint scanners became operational.

[Scouse123]

Overstayer from next month will have to take a finger scan according to Immigration HQ (Source: Sakon Nakhon Immigration Chief). The System comes from Singapore

It's a woman, the boss up there at Sakon Nakhon, isn't it, or it was!

Why would they be involved in finger printing overstay?

They get some from Laos but I would have thought the foreigners going there would be for extensions, you wouldn't go there for overstay, would you?

I thought it would be the nearest international crossing point or airport? Sorry, I am asking out of curiosity!

Fingerprint overstay for enforcement of blacklist. The question is whether they will fingerprint all or those over 3 months. Since they will be using it for entry, I suspect they will be fingerprinting all - including those that were already inside when the fingerprint scanners became operational.

But, Sakon Nakhon immigration is not a point of entry or exit to Thailand. So why would they want to scan fingerprints?

My point is you go there for an extension or a 90 day report. You do not go there to enter or leave Thailand. There must be something I am missing as to the purpose of this so called fingerprint scan. I would have thought the only places requiring these are ports of entry and exit to the Kingdom.

[mngmn]

Overstayer from next month will have to take a finger scan according to Immigration HQ (Source: Sakon Nakhon Immigration Chief). The System comes from Singapore

It's a woman, the boss up there at Sakon Nakhon, isn't it, or it was!

Why would they be involved in finger printing overstay?

They get some from Laos but I would have thought the foreigners going there would be for extensions, you wouldn't go there for overstay, would you?

I thought it would be the nearest international crossing point or airport? Sorry, I am asking out of curiosity!

Fingerprint overstay for enforcement of blacklist. The question is whether they will fingerprint all or those over 3 months. Since they will be using it for entry, I suspect they will be fingerprinting all - including those that were already inside when the fingerprint scanners became operational.

Don't get too excited about fingerprinting. The FBI's Integrated Automated Fingerprint Identification System (IAFIS) takes 27 minutes to search 70 million fingerprints and identify potential matches.

The main use of fingerprinting at borders is for identification purposes, not for matching individual fingerprints to a fingerprint database. The fingerprints collected may well be matched at some later date to identify criminals entering the country etc but current technology would not permit this to take place in real time at the point of entry.

If you have ever seen a fingerprint search on CSI you get the idea.

Edited February 9, 2016 by mngmn

[BritTim]

Overstayer from next month will have to take a finger scan according to Immigration HQ (Source: Sakon Nakhon Immigration Chief). The System comes from Singapore

It's a woman, the boss up there at Sakon Nakhon, isn't it, or it was!

Why would they be involved in finger printing overstay?

They get some from Laos but I would have thought the foreigners going there would be for extensions, you wouldn't go there for overstay, would you?

I thought it would be the nearest international crossing point or airport? Sorry, I am asking out of curiosity!

Fingerprint overstay for enforcement of blacklist. The question is whether they will fingerprint all or those over 3 months. Since they will be using it for entry, I suspect they will be fingerprinting all - including those that were already inside when the fingerprint scanners became operational.

Don't get too excited about fingerprinting. The FBI's Integrated Automated Fingerprint Identification System (IAFIS) takes 27 minutes to search 70 million fingerprints and identify potential matches.

The main use of fingerprinting at borders is for identification purposes, not for matching individual fingerprints to a fingerprint database. The fingerprints collected may well be matched at some later date to identify criminals entering the country etc but current technology would not permit this to take place in real time at the point of entry.

If you have ever seen a fingerprint search on CSI you get the idea.

The FBI's Integrated Automated Fingerprint Identification System (IAFIS) takes 27 minutes to search 70 million fingerprints and identify potential matches.

They probably are mainly interested in looking for a match against those on the blacklist. Although there may be quite a few overstayers who could end up on the blacklist, I think the numbers will remain well under 70 million. If 70 million comparisons take 27 minutes, then 70,000 comparisons could be done in 1.62 seconds.

[Scouse123]

And you think Thailand is capable of this technology and maintaining that level of care and diligence?

People can still walk across the porous borders from Myanmar, Laos and Cambodia if they choose that route but some here are implying entering Thailand is going to be as hi tech as the insides of an i phone.

I do not believe for one second that fingerprint scanners are going to be used at the moment for anything other than another layer of checks to identify the passport with the holder as another poster stated. I also think the vast majority on here, including myself, don't have a clue as to the present capabilities of what these immigration checks are for.I do know, as fast as these changes are implemented the real big criminals will have an answer if they really wish to enter the Kingdom.

This famous blacklist some are all constantly talking about. How many do you think are actually on it and how many samples of their fingerprints do you think they already have gathered efficiently and put in a database?? I have heard plenty about fingerprint scans coming into force from as far back as 2005, but still haven't seen any. The ones at Poipet and the Siem Reap airports break down regularly and then they simply wave you through.I was once told by an Embassy official , in passing, that the photograph system at the airport was a new type of facial recognition system! .......I believed it for about two visits!

On another note,how many honestly believe that guys who are blacklisted for overstays and nonsense, who by and large are people ' chasing sex ' or those who can't make it in their own countries, can be bothered to go back home and go through the ball-ache of changing their names, bank accounts, utility bills, registering with all different local and national authorities etc just for a few weeks in Thailand? Yes, there might be a few, but I would say the minority not the majority. They will simply go to Philippines, Cambodia,Laos etc I have noticed a lot of Bangkok and Pattaya expats now drifting towards Siem Reap and they stand out a mile from the general tourists of Siem Reap.

The way some talk, you would think Thailand was the Holy Grail of tourism and it isn't.

[mngmn]

Don't get too excited about fingerprinting. The FBI's Integrated Automated Fingerprint Identification System (IAFIS) takes 27 minutes to search 70 million fingerprints and identify potential matches.

The main use of fingerprinting at borders is for identification purposes, not for matching individual fingerprints to a fingerprint database. The fingerprints collected may well be matched at some later date to identify criminals entering the country etc but current technology would not permit this to take place in real time at the point of entry.

If you have ever seen a fingerprint search on CSI you get the idea.

The FBI's Integrated Automated Fingerprint Identification System (IAFIS) takes 27 minutes to search 70 million fingerprints and identify potential matches.

They probably are mainly interested in looking for a match against those on the blacklist. Although there may be quite a few overstayers who could end up on the blacklist, I think the numbers will remain well under 70 million. If 70 million comparisons take 27 minutes, then 70,000 comparisons could be done in 1.62 seconds.

1.62 seconds perhaps and always assuming that Thai immigration has enough budget to devote the same supercomputers the FBI uses to the task.

By all means worry about it, if it makes your day go better, but keep in mind that even though today's technology seems very powerful and there are still some limitations.

Edited February 9, 2016 by mngmn

[Maestro]

Don't get too excited about fingerprinting. The FBI's Integrated Automated Fingerprint Identification System (IAFIS) takes 27 minutes to search 70 million fingerprints and identify potential matches.

The main use of fingerprinting at borders is for identification purposes, not for matching individual fingerprints to a fingerprint database. The fingerprints collected may well be matched at some later date to identify criminals entering the country etc but current technology would not permit this to take place in real time at the point of entry.

If you have ever seen a fingerprint search on CSI you get the idea.

The simplest use of fingerprint matching at the border entry point would probably be to match the print or prints taken at the border with those on the passport chip (although somebody wrote in another topic that no fingerprints are stored on his chip)

Of course, this would only be confirmation that the person presenting the passport is the same as the person to whom the passport was issued and would not reveal details of a previous passport used by the same person.