Thailand's 'F' word: Offensive or harmless?

[dick dasterdly]

Of course there's an 'us and them' mentality. Are you really naive enough to believe it could be any other way?

Some farangs waste time tying themselves in knots over whether the locals like or respect them. Life's too short.

Good to hear you agree that 'farang' is part of the 'us and them' mentality.

My post only pointed out that some here believe they are respected by the locals, and then wonder why the locals' children follow them around shouting 'farang farang'.

Edit - But obviously this does not indicate that there's anything derogatory about the term 'farang'.....

Edited April 13, 2016 by dick dasterdly

[SoiBiker]

You think the 'us and them' thing is unique to Thailand?

Where I'm from, we have a word for outsiders too. Sometimes it's derogatory, sometimes affectionate. Depends who you're talking about.

Seems pretty needy to expect everyone to like you, wherever on earth you might roam. Better just to concentrate on being yourself and hope for the best.

[dick dasterdly]

You think the 'us and them' thing is unique to Thailand?

Where I'm from, we have a word for outsiders too. Sometimes it's derogatory, sometimes affectionate. Depends who you're talking about.

Seems pretty needy to expect everyone to like you, wherever on earth you might roam. Better just to concentrate on being yourself and hope for the best.

Try answering the points raised rather than just making comments implying that anyone daring to raise these points are "needy/expecting everyone to like them" etc.

You argued that there is nothing wrong with the term 'farang' and then agreed its used as part of an 'us and then' mentality'.

Now you're resorting to implying that anyone who doesn't like being called 'farang' is slightly inadequate.

[SoiBiker]

My point is you're likely to run in to an us and them' situation anywhere you go. So your options are to stay home, or grow a thicker skin and realise that being one of 'them' isn't so bad, and doesn't automatically mean the locals dislike you.

[rogeroc]

Clearly a significant percentage of people find the word offensive. So why use an unnecessary word, especially as a Westerner aware that many other Westerners see it as negative. This borders on ignorance.

[SoiBiker]

Clearly a significant percentage of people find the word offensive. So why use an unnecessary word, especially as a Westerner aware that many other Westerners see it as negative. This borders on ignorance.

I'm not sure a handful of posters on a forum frequented by a minority group of aging expats constitutes a significant percentage of anything. I certainly don't think they have any right to redefine a word in somebody else's language.

[rogeroc]

You are the one so adamant that you understand the meaning of the word and the one so confident that it is not 'offensive'. I would also think much more likely that in general younger Westerners brought up in times (rightly or wrongly) of higher levels of 'political correctness' are more likely to disapprove of the word.

I don't understand your need to try and be derogatory to and categorise other Posters here

[SoiBiker]

Actually, I think 'younger westerners' are more likely to grasp the nuances of race relations in a way that tends to elude their elders - who often seem confused to the point where they don't even know what word to use to refer to black people, for example, and have concluded that any reference to a person's ethnicity must be somehow wrong.

[DrTuner]

Actually, I think 'younger westerners' are more likely to grasp the nuances of race relations in a way that tends to elude their elders - who often seem confused to the point where they don't even know what word to use to refer to black people, for example, and have concluded that any reference to a person's ethnicity must be somehow wrong.

The PC crowd seems to range from 25 to 35y old, mostly. I'm sure they'll grow out of it and the younger ones have another fad to follow. Sort of like the 40 something women who've grown out of the scourge of their age, feminism. These things blow over and get marginalized.

This will became mainstream instead:

Edited April 13, 2016 by DrTuner

[daboyz1]

You think the 'us and them' thing is unique to Thailand?

Where I'm from, we have a word for outsiders too. Sometimes it's derogatory, sometimes affectionate. Depends who you're talking about.

Seems pretty needy to expect everyone to like you, wherever on earth you might roam. Better just to concentrate on being yourself and hope for the best.

That was kinda my earlier point. Who cares.

If you spend all your time worrying about what others think of you, I suspect you'll be pretty unhappy.

[SoiBiker]

There's no PC 'fad'. The world has moved on. Accept it or be left behind.

Edited April 13, 2016 by SoiBiker

[LeeTheCelt]

OK Bule in Indonesia means albino, so not very nice.

My wife was doing an exam in the UK, to be able to serve alcohol, the woman conducting the test was a middle class thai, educated at one of the two top university's in Thailand, in conversation, I asked her was she married to a farang, she proceed to give me a tongue lashing, telling me to not use words that were derogatory & learn the meaning of words before I used them. She also said, only uneducated Thais would use such words,I didn't tell her that my wife worked for one of the biggest TV firms in Thailand & all her colleagues, all university educated, use the term, as I've spent time at the film ? studios.

So safe to say, I'm still none the wiser lol

[SoiBiker]

OK Bule in Indonesia means albino, so not very nice.

My wife was doing an exam in the UK, to be able to serve alcohol, the woman conducting the test was a middle class thai, educated at one of the two top university's in Thailand, in conversation, I asked her was she married to a farang, she proceed to give me a tongue lashing, telling me to not use words that were derogatory & learn the meaning of words before I used them. She also said, only uneducated Thais would use such words,I didn't tell her that my wife worked for one of the biggest TV firms in Thailand & all her colleagues, all university educated, use the term, as I've spent time at the film ? studios.

So safe to say, I'm still none the wiser lol

She must be married to one of those farangs who like to educate their wives.

[benalibina]

Clearly a significant percentage of people find the word offensive. So why use an unnecessary word, especially as a Westerner aware that many other Westerners see it as negative. This borders on ignorance.

I'm not sure a handful of posters on a forum frequented by a minority group of aging expats constitutes a significant percentage of anything. I certainly don't think they have any right to redefine a word in somebody else's language.

Correct they dont have that right.

To make somethings, again, clear.....

A foreigner refers to another foreigner as.....foreigner.

A thai refers to a foreigner as....khon tang chaat.

Everybody happy !

[DrTuner]

There's no PC 'fad'. The world has moved on. Accept it or be left behind.

Gee, I don't know. The lyrics of the PC version don't really rhyme with the beat of that nifty tune:

I said that I'm a ride for my <deleted> <deleted>,

Most likely I'm a die with my finger on the trigger

I've been grinding outside, all day with my <deleted>

And I ain't going in, unless I'm with my <deleted>

My <deleted>, my <deleted>

My <deleted>, my <deleted> (My <deleted> <deleted>!)

My <deleted>, my <deleted> (My <deleted>, my <deleted>)

My <deleted>, my <deleted>

I think I'll pass.

[villagefarang]

In all but the most formal of situations Thais refrain from calling people by their proper names. It simply isn't the way they typically communicate and once again they are not little brown Farangs. They have their own customs and traditions. They use nicknames and or a myriad of descriptive titles when referring to other people. Farang just happens to be one of those descriptive shorthand titles they use for convenience.

I hear people complain that new arrivals in their country should learn the language, laws and customs of their new country. Then they move to Thailand and again insist that the locals should learn their language, laws and customs. It just makes me laugh when I hear such arrogance and hypocrisy. Control your own behavior and work on improving your own language abilities because your efforts to control others isn't going anywhere.

[rijit]

Bottom line , people find it offensive. So that should be enough for the word to be fazed out. Where to start ? this site stopping.using It as name for one of its forums

Sent from my GT-I9000 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[SoiBiker]

Bottom line , people find it offensive. So that should be enough for the word to be fazed out. Where to start ? this site stopping.using It as name for one of its forums

Sent from my GT-I9000 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

You really think a handful of uppity farangs is reason enough to remove a word from the Thai language?

Don't be silly.

[rijit]

I prefer when u don't use put downs as a form of arguement, and.yeah I do expect cultures to realise its causing offence. And its should be led by supposedly refined westerners whose own societies have grown and benefited

from various cultural intergrations and have taken stances on such

Sent from my GT-I9000 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Edited April 13, 2016 by rijit

[balo]

good reply is to say "sapprot" back (pineapple) As they are calling you a fruit, reply in the same way, you will get a laugh from them

If your understanding of the Thai language is so limited to not know they can and do find it amusing, then all fool you.

Having lived here most of my life,I speak fluent Thai.

Do you just give this one word reply?

There are idioms with pine Apple that might be a clever response but you won't know them.

Dirty but they are laughing AT you.

Ever noticed how they never say khon fArang? They day khon jeen or khon yeepoon etc but always say farang mun when talking about a group of foreigners.

Ask a Thai who you can trust. ALL Thais say this, for example farang mun chawp ap daet. Foreigners IT likes Sun bathing.

If you don't believe this up to you. I have lived here 30 years btw.Thais racism is heard through their language. Many times I've heard things when they thought I couldn't hear or understand.

Thank you for any understanding of this subject . But people do call me Khun xxxx , when they know me well or in business. Or if they write me a letter .

I feel respected by the people who knows me , strangers can call me farang as much as they like.

[rogeroc]

In all but the most formal of situations Thais refrain from calling people by their proper names. It simply isn't the way they typically communicate and once again they are not little brown Farangs. They have their own customs and traditions. They use nicknames and or a myriad of descriptive titles when referring to other people. Farang just happens to be one of those descriptive shorthand titles they use for convenience.

I hear people complain that new arrivals in their country should learn the language, laws and customs of their new country. Then they move to Thailand and again insist that the locals should learn their language, laws and customs. It just makes me laugh when I hear such arrogance and hypocrisy. Control your own behavior and work on improving your own language abilities because your efforts to control others isn't going anywhere.

VF - The opening article is a reasoned piece of writing about this ongoing debate. Your second paragraph virtually suggests that anybody who disagrees about the use of the word 'Farang' is pig headed and ignorant and needs to learn more about Thailand, i am sure this is far away from the truth and distracts from a sensible debate. A few paragraphs later you go on to click the 'like' button for a glib response from a serial troll on this site.

From the best evidence i can amass i am inclined to think that the word 'Farang' is more akin to the word 'n.....' than to the word black person. If this is the case then i think it's usage should be given more consideration by Westerners and Thai alike. I think in time the word wlll follow the same route as 'n......' but i doubt i will still be alive.

[rogeroc]

Bottom line , people find it offensive. So that should be enough for the word to be fazed out. Where to start ? this site stopping.using It as name for one of its forums

Rijit - I concur with you and i assume that what actually makes a word offensive is exactly that, when a significant number of people believe it to be so.

[Johnniey]

Having lived here most of my life,I speak fluent Thai.

Do you just give this one word reply?

There are idioms with pine Apple that might be a clever response but you won't know them.

Dirty but they are laughing AT you.

Ever noticed how they never say khon fArang? They day khon jeen or khon yeepoon etc but always say farang mun when talking about a group of foreigners.

Ask a Thai who you can trust. ALL Thais say this, for example farang mun chawp ap daet. Foreigners IT likes Sun bathing.

If you don't believe this up to you. I have lived here 30 years btw.Thais racism is heard through their language. Many times I've heard things when they thought I couldn't hear or understand.

Thank you for any understanding of this subject . But people do call me Khun xxxx , when they know me well or in business. Or if they write me a letter .

I feel respected by the people who knows me , strangers can call me farang as much as they like.

Khun is a term of respect. "Khon" is not, it just means person. Sawan chan 7 is correct though - Thais say Khon in front of many nationalities but not in front of farang. I've also lived here for decades and the term farang has become derogatory. Just the same way as negro did in the US.

There are some of us willing to stand up for our rights now but sadly those tourists and usually newly arrived retirees bend over and say stupid things like "saparot" or even refer themselves as farang which really annoys me. I think they do it because it is one of the handful of words they know in Thai.

[dazzz]

I got called a racist by some red faced, teary eyed student type in the UK once for referring to migrants as "these people".

Would we prefer Thailand to become as PC as it has in the west.

Personally, I've got bigger things to worry about than what some folk call me.

Do you actually understand what a forum is? It is to chat and discus things about thailand . I think the word is obscene but it does not worry or bother me . You have and the rest of the idoits on here have to stop assuming everytime a person answers a post it upsets them . Somebody asked a question on this forum and people give their opinions but it does not mean they are concerned about it.

If you have bigger things to worry about why have you spent so much time reading this thread instead of sorting your bigger things out

[Berkshire]

Clearly a significant percentage of people find the word offensive. So why use an unnecessary word, especially as a Westerner aware that many other Westerners see it as negative. This borders on ignorance.

I'm not sure a handful of posters on a forum frequented by a minority group of aging expats constitutes a significant percentage of anything. I certainly don't think they have any right to redefine a word in somebody else's language.

Correct they dont have that right.

To make somethings, again, clear.....

A foreigner refers to another foreigner as.....foreigner.

A thai refers to a foreigner as....khon tang chaat.

Everybody happy !

Nope. In time, the overly sensitive types will be offended by the term khon tang chaat...guaranteed. There's no pleasing them.

[Berkshire]

I prefer when u don't use put downs as a form of arguement, and.yeah I do expect cultures to realise its causing offence. And its should be led by supposedly refined westerners whose own societies have grown and benefited

from various cultural intergrations and have taken stances on such

Sent from my GT-I9000 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

But the culture is not "causing offense"....except among a tiny minority of the seriously ignorant. Look, I've personally met literally hundreds of farangs in Thailand. I've yet to come across even one who is offended by the term "farang." This nonsense only seems to occur in cyberspace from anonymous keyboard warriors. You guys should seriously get a life.

[SoiBiker]

Clearly a significant percentage of people find the word offensive. So why use an unnecessary word, especially as a Westerner aware that many other Westerners see it as negative. This borders on ignorance.

I'm not sure a handful of posters on a forum frequented by a minority group of aging expats constitutes a significant percentage of anything. I certainly don't think they have any right to redefine a word in somebody else's language.

Correct they dont have that right.

To make somethings, again, clear.....

A foreigner refers to another foreigner as.....foreigner.

A thai refers to a foreigner as....khon tang chaat.

Everybody happy !

Nope. In time, the overly sensitive types will be offended by the term khon tang chaat...guaranteed. There's no pleasing them.

Probably. Some of them already get upset about immigration forms calling them am alien.

[villagefarang]

In all but the most formal of situations Thais refrain from calling people by their proper names. It simply isn't the way they typically communicate and once again they are not little brown Farangs. They have their own customs and traditions. They use nicknames and or a myriad of descriptive titles when referring to other people. Farang just happens to be one of those descriptive shorthand titles they use for convenience.

I hear people complain that new arrivals in their country should learn the language, laws and customs of their new country. Then they move to Thailand and again insist that the locals should learn their language, laws and customs. It just makes me laugh when I hear such arrogance and hypocrisy. Control your own behavior and work on improving your own language abilities because your efforts to control others isn't going anywhere.

VF - The opening article is a reasoned piece of writing about this ongoing debate. Your second paragraph virtually suggests that anybody who disagrees about the use of the word 'Farang' is pig headed and ignorant and needs to learn more about Thailand, i am sure this is far away from the truth and distracts from a sensible debate. A few paragraphs later you go on to click the 'like' button for a glib response from a serial troll on this site.

From the best evidence i can amass i am inclined to think that the word 'Farang' is more akin to the word 'n.....' than to the word black person. If this is the case then i think it's usage should be given more consideration by Westerners and Thai alike. I think in time the word wlll follow the same route as 'n......' but i doubt i will still be alive.

"pig headed and ignorant and needs to learn more about Thailand" Well you said it, I didn't. I would like to think that if people learned more about Thailand and learned the language things might improve but then again I am a dreamer.

[Agent Sumo]

The word for foreigner in Thai is คนต่างชาติ (Khon Tang Chart)

The word ฝรั่ง (Farang) refers only to Caucasian foreigners

Does everyone in your country use the word "foreigner" to describe someone who isn't a native?

Didn't think so

Why, then, would anyone expect all Thais would use the correct word for foreigner in their language?

Maybe you don't understand the word "vernacular"

[Agent Sumo]

I prefer when u don't use put downs as a form of arguement, and.yeah I do expect cultures to realise its causing offence. And its should be led by supposedly refined westerners whose own societies have grown and benefited

from various cultural intergrations and have taken stances on such

Sent from my GT-I9000 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

So having breathed a sigh of relief for having escaped the tyranny of political correctness in the West, you're here campaigning for its application to a word that most Westerners find completely inoffensive?

Go find something to do with your life, for God's sake