Democrat party rejects Thai referendum question

[JAG]

W

The Democrat party has demanded the Election Commission to show its courage

So says the man who directed the Army fire on unarned protesters, bystanders and journalists in the 2010 protests against his government.

So says the man who applauded the PDRC blockade of voting polls.

So says the man who couldn't work as a responsible MP within the framework of the 2007 Constitution.

If Abhisit had courage he wouldn't be constrained by the NCPO restrictions on freedom of expression.

But he knows better not to "bite the hand that feeds him."

And so does the EC.

In fairness, I suspect the decision to open fire in the 2010 protests was not referred to Abhisit. He may have been Prime Minister, but I doubt if the military consulted him, or would have taken a blind bit of notice of him.

That may be true but his silence was deafening which is why I'm surprised he acknowledged, by his use of the 'D' word, the reality that is now upon Thailand

Oh I think he was told/advised to keep silent, otherwise he would have been replaced. He was being pragmatic, if somewhat dishonorable.

Now perhaps he has decided to speak out and hang the consequences. Perhaps he fell of his horse en route to spend Songkran in the Thai equivalent of Damascus?

Or more sensibly, maybe he has done his appreciation, and concluded that this business is going to have such a messy conclusion that the only way he can hope for a political future when the dust settles and the blood and snot has been washed away is to be on the record as opposing the charter?

Edited April 11, 2016 by JAG

[MZurf]

W

The Democrat party has demanded the Election Commission to show its courage

So says the man who directed the Army fire on unarned protesters, bystanders and journalists in the 2010 protests against his government.

So says the man who applauded the PDRC blockade of voting polls.

So says the man who couldn't work as a responsible MP within the framework of the 2007 Constitution.

If Abhisit had courage he wouldn't be constrained by the NCPO restrictions on freedom of expression.

But he knows better not to "bite the hand that feeds him."

And so does the EC.

In fairness, I suspect the decision to open fire in the 2010 protests was not referred to Abhisit. He may have been Prime Minister, but I doubt if the military consulted him, or would have taken a blind bit of notice of him.

That may be true but his silence was deafening which is why I'm surprised he acknowledged, by his use of the 'D' word, the reality that is now upon Thailand

Oh I think he was told/advised to keep silent, otherwise he would have been replaced. He was being pragmatic, if somewhat dishonorable.

Now perhaps he has decided to speak out and hang the consequences. Perhaps he fell of his horse en route to spend Songkran in the Thai equivalent of Damascus?

Or more sensibly, maybe he has done his appreciation, and concluded that this business is going to have such a messy conclusion that the only way he can hope for a political future when the dust settles and the blood and snot has been washed away is to be on the record as opposing the charter?

Indeed. As the Thaitanic heads with full speed towards the iceberg expect more passengers to jump ship.

[kimamey]

The Democrat party has demanded the Election Commission to show its courage

So says the man who directed the Army fire on unarned protesters, bystanders and journalists in the 2010 protests against his government.

So says the man who applauded the PDRC blockade of voting polls.

So says the man who couldn't work as a responsible MP within the framework of the 2007 Constitution.

If Abhisit had courage he wouldn't be constrained by the NCPO restrictions on freedom of expression.

But he knows better not to "bite the hand that feeds him."

And so does the EC.

"So says the man who directed the Army fire on unarned protesters, bystanders and journalists in the 2010 protests against his government."

Where did you get that information from?

"So says the man who applauded the PDRC blockade of voting polls."

There's some truth in that.

"So says the man who couldn't work as a responsible MP within the framework of the 2007 Constitution."

I'm not sure what you mean by that so I can't comment.

"If Abhisit had courage he wouldn't be constrained by the NCPO restrictions on freedom of expression."

He's openly given the opinion of the Democrats which isn't positive. I'm sure there's more he might want to say but the army are in charge and have guns and there are lots of them.

I'm sure you'll let us all know when Thaksin arrives in the country to give everyone his unfettered opinions on behalf of the PTP.

As for "the hand that feeds him" poisons him would be more accurate.

Edited April 11, 2016 by kimamey

[kimamey]

"The country doesn't need to choose between dictatorship and corruption" Abhisit

This is the very first time I have had any respect for Abhisit but, on this occasion, credit where credit is due he has actually spoken up and long may it continue. Now let him condemn the detention camps, lack of press freedom and encourage free debate.

Agree 100 %. I have always regarded him as a somewhat spinless tool who is pretty clueless about what's going on in Thailand outside of Bangkok. He is, of course, absolutely correct in his statements and I wonder if the cantankerous one will ship him off to the south for some much needed attitude adjustment.

The old elite is starting to turn on each other and it's beautiful to watch!

To be fair to him I believe he publicly disagreed with the previous coup and the draft 2007 constitution. They only accepted it as rejection meant the military would choose it's own charter. Whether that was a good move is debatable but certainly be never seemed to just support the military whatever they do.

I would imagine he sees the army as a disaster for him and the Democrats. Every time they stage a coup and take power it's suggested that the Democrats want it because they can't win elections but want power. If they wanted that they would have a better chance offering more than Thaksin's party. I assume they don't because it's not sustainable.

The army's actions during the 2010 demonstrations didn't help him either. He was blamed for ordering soldiers to shoot protestors which he clearly didn't. The PTP refused to consider the army's part in it so they seemed to support the military themselves even after they vowed to seek justice. Even Robert Amsterdam's expert witness said the army weren't following their orders.

He and the Democrats were making good attempts at challenging the PTP government in parliament particularly over the rice scheme.

I noticed in the months leading to the coup that several places near me in Isaan were no longer displaying the Thaksin calendars as they had been.

The coup, or more accurately the conduct of the military authorities since the coup will have done damage to his reputation and possibly pushed many people back towards Thaksin and his main quest for an amnesty instead of the more moderate members of the PTP and Democrats who might have a chance of taking the country forward.

Hardly surprising the people are being pushed back towards Thaksin with this fellow and his army mates as the alternative.

If the army are his mates I'd hate for him to meet his enemies.

[dominique355]

actually if the dems, thaksin, reds and ptp dont like it maybe there is something good in there that will stop all of them from doing all their crap as per usual, interesting.

so you prefer the military crap?

Crap is crap, no matter where it comes from.

I have been looking for something good in this Constitution .... still looking .... still looking

Let me know when you found it.

[greenchair]

"The country doesn't need to choose between dictatorship and corruption" Abhisit

This is the very first time I have had any respect for Abhisit but, on this occasion, credit where credit is due he has actually spoken up and long may it continue. Now let him condemn the detention camps, lack of press freedom and encourage free debate.

I agree, he has finally realised that taking a back seat, letting the pt take all the punishments and fight this alone, will not only be the end of pt, but the end of his party under his leadership. The end of independence of all parties. If his party won the election, The likelihood of him being voted in by the senate is zero to nothing. He must find his backbone and make a stand,without that nasty ole Suthep, he might just win an election.

[toybits]

So will Mark get a 10 year prison sentence? The PM just threatened to give politicians who criticize the referendum a 10 year prison sentence.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/909541-pm-threatens-10-year-prison-sentence-for-politicians-who-criticize-referendum/

Edited April 11, 2016 by toybits

[Baerboxer]

All this "he's not a bad bloke, decent chap really' coming out, just because he uses the D word and makes some criticism is laughable.

He comes from a very very wealthy family and was fortunate enough to attend one of the top and most expensive private schools followed by one of the top universities.

He leads the party that is owned by and looks after the interests of the very wealthy, the elites and the "old families". What did he ever do to push through the real reforms in education, justice system, fight corruption, stimulate free competition and improve the prospects of the vast majority of Thais? The odd subsidy perhaps? But nothing that really changed the status quo.

Is he rejecting this out of a new found conviction and thirst for real change? Or just wanting the status quo back with a nice place for himself and his mates?

Time will tell but to me, just another Thai politician who plays the game in the laid down framework and won't do anything to radical to upset the apple cart.

Abhisit and the Dems; Thaksin and PTP; their political allies who regularly change sides to suit; the Junta leaders - none have so far put forward details of any really meaningful reforms let alone plans and implementations. The usual chit chat with little real action. The musical chairs continues but the players don't change.

[leeneeds]

We will see how much money is spread come election time,

last time you could get 1500 baht for a tuk tuk load of people bringing

them to vote, each where offered 300-500 to vote for red,

being offered 300 -500 for yellow at the same election

plenty people made money short term,

what will be offered in 2017

you take the money and or take free adjustment classes.

I know what my local thai people will do.

[baboon]

We will see how much money is spread come election time,

last time you could get 1500 baht for a tuk tuk load of people bringing

them to vote, each where offered 300-500 to vote for red,

being offered 300 -500 for yellow at the same election

plenty people made money short term,

what will be offered in 2017

you take the money and or take free adjustment classes.

I know what my local thai people will do.

Very nice, but do you have anything to say on the actual topic?

[leeneeds]

We will see how much money is spread come election time,

last time you could get 1500 baht for a tuk tuk load of people bringing

them to vote, each where offered 300-500 to vote for red,

being offered 300 -500 for yellow at the same election

plenty people made money short term,

what will be offered in 2017

you take the money and or take free adjustment classes.

I know what my local thai people will do.

Very nice, but do you have anything to say on the actual topic?

Thank you for your enquiry as to the subject matter, I stated at the beginning of the thread that Infinity is still taking place with this subject, to which if i was reading into the subject, that has been going on way longer than i have been a member of TVF, nothing has changed, the people have not changed the same old biased politics is still current, none willing to give ground , now the PM has and is falling into the same hole,(of a guarantee) so unless something outstanding is forth coming in the next election and Thailand does make way for the people , i stand by my thread as nothing has or will have changed.

[Srikcir]

The Democrat party has demanded the Election Commission to show its courage

So says the man who directed the Army fire on unarned protesters, bystanders and journalists in the 2010 protests against his government.

So says the man who applauded the PDRC blockade of voting polls.

So says the man who couldn't work as a responsible MP within the framework of the 2007 Constitution.

If Abhisit had courage he wouldn't be constrained by the NCPO restrictions on freedom of expression.

But he knows better not to "bite the hand that feeds him."

And so does the EC.

In fairness, I suspect the decision to open fire in the 2010 protests was not referred to Abhisit. He may have been Prime Minister, but I doubt if the military consulted him, or would have taken a blind bit of notice of him.

The military was very aware of PM Abhisit:

In the charge of malfeasance and abuse of power against Mr Abhisit and Suthep that resulted in murder and attempted murder in the 2010 military crackdown on the red-shirt, the Appeals Court reasoned that Mr Abhisit and Suthep issued the crackdown order in capacity as prime minister and deputy prime minister in charge of the Centre for the Resolution of the Emergency Situation.

Mr. Abhisit himself said the generals acted as middlemen between those in power, including him, and officials who were carrying out the operations. Prayut was one of the generals acting as a middleman. Small world isn't?

[pedro01]

"The country doesn't need to choose between dictatorship and corruption" Abhisit

This is the very first time I have had any respect for Abhisit but, on this occasion, credit where credit is due he has actually spoken up and long may it continue. Now let him condemn the detention camps, lack of press freedom and encourage free debate.

Agree 100 %. I have always regarded him as a somewhat spinless tool who is pretty clueless about what's going on in Thailand outside of Bangkok. He is, of course, absolutely correct in his statements and I wonder if the cantankerous one will ship him off to the south for some much needed attitude adjustment.

The old elite is starting to turn on each other and it's beautiful to watch!

Abhisit is the leader of a corrupt political party.

He chose Suthep as his deputy when he was PM.

Abhisit is very much part if the probkem when it comes to nepotism and corruption in Thailand.

[pedro01]

Anyone else noticed that Google has selected ads from the clothing firm 'Banana Republic' for display in this thread?

Shurely shome mishtake?

Edited April 11, 2016 by pedro01

[pedro01]

All this "he's not a bad bloke, decent chap really' coming out, just because he uses the D word and makes some criticism is laughable.

He comes from a very very wealthy family and was fortunate enough to attend one of the top and most expensive private schools followed by one of the top universities.

He leads the party that is owned by and looks after the interests of the very wealthy, the elites and the "old families". What did he ever do to push through the real reforms in education, justice system, fight corruption, stimulate free competition and improve the prospects of the vast majority of Thais? The odd subsidy perhaps? But nothing that really changed the status quo.

Is he rejecting this out of a new found conviction and thirst for real change? Or just wanting the status quo back with a nice place for himself and his mates?

Time will tell but to me, just another Thai politician who plays the game in the laid down framework and won't do anything to radical to upset the apple cart.

Abhisit and the Dems; Thaksin and PTP; their political allies who regularly change sides to suit; the Junta leaders - none have so far put forward details of any really meaningful reforms let alone plans and implementations. The usual chit chat with little real action. The musical chairs continues but the players don't change.

Agreed 100%

Democrats and PTP are 2 sides of the same corrupt coin.

In my opinion if both parties object to the charter - then that is a positive.

[kimamey]

All this "he's not a bad bloke, decent chap really' coming out, just because he uses the D word and makes some criticism is laughable.

He comes from a very very wealthy family and was fortunate enough to attend one of the top and most expensive private schools followed by one of the top universities.

He leads the party that is owned by and looks after the interests of the very wealthy, the elites and the "old families". What did he ever do to push through the real reforms in education, justice system, fight corruption, stimulate free competition and improve the prospects of the vast majority of Thais? The odd subsidy perhaps? But nothing that really changed the status quo.

Is he rejecting this out of a new found conviction and thirst for real change? Or just wanting the status quo back with a nice place for himself and his mates?

Time will tell but to me, just another Thai politician who plays the game in the laid down framework and won't do anything to radical to upset the apple cart.

Abhisit and the Dems; Thaksin and PTP; their political allies who regularly change sides to suit; the Junta leaders - none have so far put forward details of any really meaningful reforms let alone plans and implementations. The usual chit chat with little real action. The musical chairs continues but the players don't change.

I don't think his family was always very very wealthy. He was born in the UK and originally lived in a 2 bedroom flat at 32 Marondale Avenue, Wallsend, Newcastle upon Tyne. Check it out on Google maps. I don't know how to send a link on android. I've tried to attach a picture of it. If it works it's the door on the side in the centre. I don't know if it was upstairs or down.

The picture didn't work but it's opposite the side road that's also called Marondale Avenue. You can see the general wealth of the area.

Edited April 11, 2016 by kimamey

[Wilsonandson]

All this "he's not a bad bloke, decent chap really' coming out, just because he uses the D word and makes some criticism is laughable.

He comes from a very very wealthy family and was fortunate enough to attend one of the top and most expensive private schools followed by one of the top universities.

He leads the party that is owned by and looks after the interests of the very wealthy, the elites and the "old families". What did he ever do to push through the real reforms in education, justice system, fight corruption, stimulate free competition and improve the prospects of the vast majority of Thais? The odd subsidy perhaps? But nothing that really changed the status quo.

Is he rejecting this out of a new found conviction and thirst for real change? Or just wanting the status quo back with a nice place for himself and his mates?

Time will tell but to me, just another Thai politician who plays the game in the laid down framework and won't do anything to radical to upset the apple cart.

Abhisit and the Dems; Thaksin and PTP; their political allies who regularly change sides to suit; the Junta leaders - none have so far put forward details of any really meaningful reforms let alone plans and implementations. The usual chit chat with little real action. The musical chairs continues but the players don't change.

I don't think his family was always very very wealthy. He was born in the UK and originally lived in a 2 bedroom flat at 32 Marondale Avenue, Wallsend, Newcastle upon Tyne. Check it out on Google maps. I don't know how to send a link on android. I've tried to attach a picture of it. If it works it's the door on the side in the centre. I don't know if it was upstairs or down.

The picture didn't work but it's opposite the side road that's also called Marondale Avenue. You can see the general wealth of the area.

That's a nice house!

Has a park nearby, nice schools, perfect place to bring up me bairn's. Howay man! We gannin' doon Morrisons to beat the queue? The bairn's ganna bubble if there's nee pop left.

[JAG]

Newcastle on Tyne....that's up near Scotland isn't it?

Awfully long way from Somerset.

[bkkcanuck8]

The Democrat party has demanded the Election Commission to show its courage

So says the man who directed the Army fire on unarned protesters, bystanders and journalists in the 2010 protests against his government.

So says the man who applauded the PDRC blockade of voting polls.

So says the man who couldn't work as a responsible MP within the framework of the 2007 Constitution.

If Abhisit had courage he wouldn't be constrained by the NCPO restrictions on freedom of expression.

But he knows better not to "bite the hand that feeds him."

And so does the EC.

In fairness, I suspect the decision to open fire in the 2010 protests was not referred to Abhisit. He may have been Prime Minister, but I doubt if the military consulted him, or would have taken a blind bit of notice of him.

For each of the parties you have to look not just at the face of the party but where the power resides. Abhisit may have been PM, but he was junior to Suthep. I doubt Abhisit would have given the order, but I could not say the same for Suthep.

I think Abhisit is being honest, and he is also being careful to pick and choose when to speak up and when to be quiet. There is a balance that has to be maintained even by him if he wants to continue to be able to be in that position - push the military too far right now and even he would be re-educated.

[wordchild]

he won a scholarship to study at Eton, so a big chunk of the costs would have been covered by this. His family are certainly not poor (doctors with royal connections) but nor are they one of the mega rich Thai families.

Edited April 11, 2016 by wordchild

[bkkcanuck8]

All this "he's not a bad bloke, decent chap really' coming out, just because he uses the D word and makes some criticism is laughable.

He comes from a very very wealthy family and was fortunate enough to attend one of the top and most expensive private schools followed by one of the top universities.

He leads the party that is owned by and looks after the interests of the very wealthy, the elites and the "old families". What did he ever do to push through the real reforms in education, justice system, fight corruption, stimulate free competition and improve the prospects of the vast majority of Thais? The odd subsidy perhaps? But nothing that really changed the status quo.

Is he rejecting this out of a new found conviction and thirst for real change? Or just wanting the status quo back with a nice place for himself and his mates?

Time will tell but to me, just another Thai politician who plays the game in the laid down framework and won't do anything to radical to upset the apple cart.

Abhisit and the Dems; Thaksin and PTP; their political allies who regularly change sides to suit; the Junta leaders - none have so far put forward details of any really meaningful reforms let alone plans and implementations. The usual chit chat with little real action. The musical chairs continues but the players don't change.

Agreed 100%

Democrats and PTP are 2 sides of the same corrupt coin.

In my opinion if both parties object to the charter - then that is a positive.

And the rather well off military officers making up the NLA are honest brokers? I don't think Canada has that much wealth held by ex-military men -- the salary that they are paid would not allow it.

Little girls in Issan are told they should marry either a police officer or military officer - because they can support them better..... I wonder why?

Edited April 11, 2016 by bkkcanuck8

[kimamey]

All this "he's not a bad bloke, decent chap really' coming out, just because he uses the D word and makes some criticism is laughable.

He comes from a very very wealthy family and was fortunate enough to attend one of the top and most expensive private schools followed by one of the top universities.

He leads the party that is owned by and looks after the interests of the very wealthy, the elites and the "old families". What did he ever do to push through the real reforms in education, justice system, fight corruption, stimulate free competition and improve the prospects of the vast majority of Thais? The odd subsidy perhaps? But nothing that really changed the status quo.

Is he rejecting this out of a new found conviction and thirst for real change? Or just wanting the status quo back with a nice place for himself and his mates?

Time will tell but to me, just another Thai politician who plays the game in the laid down framework and won't do anything to radical to upset the apple cart.

Abhisit and the Dems; Thaksin and PTP; their political allies who regularly change sides to suit; the Junta leaders - none have so far put forward details of any really meaningful reforms let alone plans and implementations. The usual chit chat with little real action. The musical chairs continues but the players don't change.

I don't think his family was always very very wealthy. He was born in the UK and originally lived in a 2 bedroom flat at 32 Marondale Avenue, Wallsend, Newcastle upon Tyne. Check it out on Google maps. I don't know how to send a link on android. I've tried to attach a picture of it. If it works it's the door on the side in the centre. I don't know if it was upstairs or down.

The picture didn't work but it's opposite the side road that's also called Marondale Avenue. You can see the general wealth of the area.

That's a nice house!

Has a park nearby, nice schools, perfect place to bring up me bairn's. Howay man! We gannin' doon Morrisons to beat the queue? The bairn's ganna bubble if there's nee pop left.

Yes not a bad house but not the right one as far as I know.

[Wilsonandson]

All this "he's not a bad bloke, decent chap really' coming out, just because he uses the D word and makes some criticism is laughable.

He comes from a very very wealthy family and was fortunate enough to attend one of the top and most expensive private schools followed by one of the top universities.

He leads the party that is owned by and looks after the interests of the very wealthy, the elites and the "old families". What did he ever do to push through the real reforms in education, justice system, fight corruption, stimulate free competition and improve the prospects of the vast majority of Thais? The odd subsidy perhaps? But nothing that really changed the status quo.

Is he rejecting this out of a new found conviction and thirst for real change? Or just wanting the status quo back with a nice place for himself and his mates?

Time will tell but to me, just another Thai politician who plays the game in the laid down framework and won't do anything to radical to upset the apple cart.

Abhisit and the Dems; Thaksin and PTP; their political allies who regularly change sides to suit; the Junta leaders - none have so far put forward details of any really meaningful reforms let alone plans and implementations. The usual chit chat with little real action. The musical chairs continues but the players don't change.

I don't think his family was always very very wealthy. He was born in the UK and originally lived in a 2 bedroom flat at 32 Marondale Avenue, Wallsend, Newcastle upon Tyne. Check it out on Google maps. I don't know how to send a link on android. I've tried to attach a picture of it. If it works it's the door on the side in the centre. I don't know if it was upstairs or down.

The picture didn't work but it's opposite the side road that's also called Marondale Avenue. You can see the general wealth of the area.

That's a nice house!

Has a park nearby, nice schools, perfect place to bring up me bairn's. Howay man! We gannin' doon Morrisons to beat the queue? The bairn's ganna bubble if there's nee pop left.

Yes not a bad house but not the right one as far as I know.

This it?

[LomSak27]

Ahh the Democratic Party You have to love these guys!

They narrowly avoided having to take a stand on an ISSUE Mother of God, say it aint so