Exit Strategy from Thailand

[nikmar]

Youve voiced some of my concerns as well. I worry for my son's future.

Good luck to you mate.

[big carl]

The problems in Thailand for people looking to get out usually come about not because they are frightened or scared of the political situation,violence on the streets or numerous other daily problems such as driving conditions that one doesn't often encounter in the west.

They usually look to escape the country for the better of their families and young children,no one does not need to feel paranoid about looking after or wanting a better life for their family.

As stated if you have an endless supply of money and can afford to send your children to top international schools and ensure you have health care and live and work/stay in Thailand legally it offers you a very attractive lifestyle.

If you are on the bones of your arse and have no recourse to decent education,health care and numerous other services coupled with a disliking of the current political situation and behaviour of your hosts why not up sticks and leave.

Remember there are those who don't have the safety net to be able to relocate at the drop of a hat.

Good luck to the OP

I am now back in the UK and believe for my daughter at least it's the best thing we ever did.

I like your post. I for the most part feel they are paranoid. How ever when it comes to children's education that is a different ball game and I agree with people moving out of the country to get a better education for them.

The media capitalizes on the negative. It does so where ever you go and you will eventually find the same problems you do here. Thailand is in the process of change. In my opinion it is getting better. It will take time. The PM himself says it will take 20 years to bring unity to Thailand. It is a sad thing that so much of the disunity comes from out side the country but in time that problem will die. In the ten year span I am very familiar with I feel safer than ever before. Before I felt safe but there was certain areas to stay away from due to political violence. Now it is like any other country there is just certain areas you stay away from that has nothing to do with politics.

Reminds me of an old story about a fellow moving into a new town. He asks an older resident what it is like. The old timer says what was it like where you came from. He replies it was very bad. Lots of crime dirty streets rude people not a nice place to live. The old timer says well that is what you will find here.

Another fellow moves into town and asks the same old timer what it is like here and the old timer says what was it like where you lived before. The fellow answers him by saying it was a wonderful place to live people were friendly the streets were clean they had beautiful parks, Very little crime. The old timer answers him by telling him well that is what you will find here.

Edited April 30, 2016 by big carl

[berybert]

The problems in Thailand for people looking to get out usually come about not because they are frightened or scared of the political situation,violence on the streets or numerous other daily problems such as driving conditions that one doesn't often encounter in the west.

They usually look to escape the country for the better of their families and young children,no one does not need to feel paranoid about looking after or wanting a better life for their family.

As stated if you have an endless supply of money and can afford to send your children to top international schools and ensure you have health care and live and work/stay in Thailand legally it offers you a very attractive lifestyle.

If you are on the bones of your arse and have no recourse to decent education,health care and numerous other services coupled with a disliking of the current political situation and behaviour of your hosts why not up sticks and leave.

Remember there are those who don't have the safety net to be able to relocate at the drop of a hat.

Good luck to the OP

I am now back in the UK and believe for my daughter at least it's the best thing we ever did.

I have no one to worry about other than myself but I was being a bit concerned about the violence on the streets, bad driving etc. So like you I made the decision to return to the UK.

Since coming back I realize Thailand is no worse and probably somewhat better than the UK regards street violence. Tho no one does bad driving like the Thai's.

I can honestly say I never once felt threatened living in Bangkok nor the many occasions I spent in Pattaya. Then again I am not the sort of person who would go out looking for trouble.

Reading my local paper and the daily news papers I would say there are far more stories of people being murdered, stabbed and beaten in any given week than there are in Thailand.

As for police corruption I detest what the RTP did on Koh Tao. But I don't think its any worse than the British police did regarding the Hillsborough disaster when they tried to cover up the fact they were responsible for the deaths of 96 people. Instead trying to blame it on the people who were dying.

I have no doubt police forces the world over have plenty of skeletons they want to keep hidden well away from the public.

So I don't believe Thailand is less safe than many Western countries.

In fact I am now expecting to arrive back in Thailand before the years end.

[Diplomatico]

For as long as I've known Thailand, there have always been problems of one kind or another. Most of them had no real effects on me.

Even when the reds were burning Bangkok, in nonthaburi you wouldn't have known.

The floods were a pain but not the end of the world.

The tsunami was a disaster of epic proportions. Lucky to survive that one.

Is Thailand in meltdown? Maybe or maybe not. Only time will tell.

I left Thailand for years ago for saudi Arabia for purely financial reasons. Live on an army base here. Me, wife, and kids like it here. Very relaxed. No plans to return till retirement.

#Wow.

[FritsSikkink]

We have, quite reluctantly, decided to leave for a while. As I have written elsewhere we have already sent the children to France. Inconvenient because of schools/education/ cost are hardly the words. We are lucky we could do that.. We thought we would try and "hang on" and see what happens. I am fairly up to the minute through Thai TV/Social Media/Newspapers and magazines. However when my wife who is a deep dyed racist, nationalist Thai (though she is not Thai more Vietnamese and Phu Thai) started to say she was scared at what is happening and might happen and she was far too scared to go to Bangkok that started to put a different perspective on things. We live in a very multicultural/multiracial/multilingual part of Thailand, but also one where Bangkok is not popular and where the memories of the communist insurgency are alive and well. Quite a lot of resentment, too, at rich Bangkok folk buying land.

However it is what she sees as a rising tide of violence linked to drugs and poverty as well as a curious subservience, as she puts it of "free Thais" to yet another strong arm autocracy, that has really swung the balance. The children were very happy to be "packed off". She has lived in Issan all her life, except to go to University in BKK. Her whole extended family is here. It is a real wrench. I am a digital nomad and can live anywhere. She is of the opinion that both I and the children who are luk khreung are in danger from drugs and violence and racism, let alone lamentable education.

I am not going into politics here. But!!. She foresees big trouble.Increasing poverty and debt, increasing violence and "control measures", maybe increased climate and agricultural problems.She thinks the police/military rivalry maybe insoluble and also the royalist/democratic divide She thinks the problem of Islam in France and the UK is by comparison a small problem!

It is a bore. It means closing businesses, shutting up houses, all the palaver of relocation. I have lived here after all for decades. We have looked at Vietnam/Cambodia/The Phllippines/even Malaysia ,China, Indonesia and Singapore but we think we will go to Europe, And sure the countries there have their problems with drugs/unemployment/education but there is an absence of the impression of suppressed violence that prevails here. And the "Nanny "states keep producing legislation and the taxes and employment laws are stifling and we will miss the climate; however no point in being dead because you like the beach or the pool!

Are we paranoid/stupid?

yes, both

[JLCrab]

I know of a young Thai girl who won a Thai government scholarship to study at university in UK. She won an English language reading & comprehension competition with English as her second language versus the UK native English-speaking students of the same age so -- while she may be the exception -- don't say it can't be done.

[bermondburi]

For as long as I've known Thailand, there have always been problems of one kind or another. Most of them had no real effects on me.

Even when the reds were burning Bangkok, in nonthaburi you wouldn't have known.

The floods were a pain but not the end of the world.

The tsunami was a disaster of epic proportions. Lucky to survive that one.

Is Thailand in meltdown? Maybe or maybe not. Only time will tell.

I left Thailand for years ago for saudi Arabia for purely financial reasons. Live on an army base here. Me, wife, and kids like it here. Very relaxed. No plans to return till retirement.

#Wow.

Why wow?

[GuestHouse]

The OP and his wife are making their decision for themselves and their children.

And as they say, having children changes everything.

So we can expect single foreign men living in Thailand to have a different view.

My best wishes to the OP and his family for the future.

[roamer]

The OP and his wife are making their decision for themselves and their children.

And as they say, having children changes everything.

So we can expect single foreign men living in Thailand to have a different view.

My best wishes to the OP and his family for the future.

As many have said, putting everything else aside regarding Thailand, it is education that is the big driver for you. We made the same choice 12 years ago and it worked for us and our daughter. Over a similar period of time it is possible that Thailand would have become a basket case, recovered from being a basket case, progressed slowly, hosting UN peacekeeping forces, who knows?

Nothing is forever, when the kids education is finished you decide whether or not to return.

My concerns would be more about getting my kids an education in what is essentially a "dead" language in so many fields, business, science etc, French is definately in decline in it's international useage, I see many French graduates in stiff competition to do higher education courses at English speaking universities.

[BudRight]

You can talk yourself into believing the sky is about to fall pretty much anywhere.

[Ricardo]

I was concerned when I saw the discord & violence in 2005-6, and again the rising political-thuggery and Burn-Bangkok riots in 2010, followed by the anti-Amnesty protest in 2013 & the election-blocking in 2014.

By now I'm more used to it all ... don't much like it, but don't see it as having too much to do with me, or my families' life here.

Do I have a exit-strategy, Hell Yes !

Just like I would have, if I were still living in Europe these days, immigration-problems & economic-troubles (Brexit & global slowdown ?) and the risk of ISIS dirty-bombs or suicide-attacks.

But my planned exit would be to Thailand, and away from Europe, I think the OP is over-reacting to local short-term problems, and anyone who came here expecting the upcoming transition not to be a tense or difficult time, was not thinking far enough ahead.

"Stay Calm, And Carry On", like it says on the T-shirts !

[chrisinth]

I know of a young Thai girl who won a Thai government scholarship to study at university in UK. She won an English language reading & comprehension competition with English as her second language versus the UK native English-speaking students of the same age so -- while she may be the exception -- don't say it can't be done.

I hear that Eastern Europeans, African, Middle Eastern, Turks, etc in the UK have trouble with their 'r/s ' & 'p's' as well.

But well done to the girl for winning her reading & comprehension in a far away country............................

[Craig krup]

Think back to the 60's in the UK. Mods v Rockers. Weekly gang fights. Yet most bystanders were not harmed or involved. So, this is not a modern thing with gangs.

Well, I think it's very hard to understand the past. I recently read "City of Gangs" by Andrew Davies - all about Glasgow in the twenties and thirties - and I didn't know what I thought I knew. The wee b*******s were getting tiny fines and short sentences for killing people. I'd believed all the "...Peterhead prison, and that was a death sentence.." stuff. Talking to my uncles produced endless stories of violence, with sudden revelations about apparently respectable local figures: "Tommy f*****g C****y? I knew him when he was running aboot wi' a hatchet".

People would get tankings from mods and rockers all the time. Tom Jones had a cracking big broken nose before he was famous, thanks to a headbutt. I spoke to a cop who'd policed the Welsh valleys in the 80's and he told me that the major recreation of the locals was knocking Friar Tuck out of each other. Joe Pieri's excellent book about the Glasgow police - "The Big Men" - reveals the truth about policing a tough European city.

It's quite crap everywhere most of the time.

[Craig krup]

Since coming back I realize Thailand is no worse and probably somewhat better than the UK regards street violence. Tho no one does bad driving like the Thai's.

As for police corruption I detest what the RTP did on Koh Tao. But I don't think its any worse than the British police did regarding the Hillsborough disaster when they tried to cover up the fact they were responsible for the deaths of 96 people. Instead trying to blame it on the people

In Dumfries and Galloway last year - rural South West Scotland - the local top cop was in the paper saying that the violence situation was completely ridiculous. If I recall correctly, he said the assault rate was 1/148 for the entire population. When you think of all the people who are very unlikely to be assaulted it means that every twenty year old who goes to buy chips does three two minute rounds while they're waiting.

Hillsborough? There's a distinction between police misconduct and the cause of the deaths. I'll leave it at that. Or nearly - if a copper lies at 1530 that doesn't mean that I didn't riot at 1450.

[laolover88]

I very much appreciate people's comments. Thank you. We are actually going, in the first place, to France, not the UK. . I know there are people who say France will be a Muslim country by 2050 and I probably would not vote for that. The children say they want to go to Canada, which seems extraordinarily intelligent. I shall miss SE Asia a lot.!! However, who knows. It may all turn out quite differently from what we expect!

[losworld]

Interesting observations you have made. I tend to agree the shit will hit the fan shortly. As one poster suggested VN may be the place.

[mark131v]

Me and my family made the same decision and left Thailand in January after 5 years living there. We are lucky the wife and daughter both have British passports and have lived in the UK before and I have a good job which allows me to go where I want to earn a living but we have kept the house and cars in Thailand

To be honest if it wasn't for the missus wanting to keep a base there I would have sold the lot as I think the country is a basket case and getting worse by the day, I also dont particulary want to put a single baht back into the corrupt xenophobic mess that Thailand has become. Both myself the missus and our 6 year old sprog have no regrets about leaving and we know we have done the right thing

Education wise we had the daughter in an International School from the age of 3 from kindergarden to year 1, she is now in our local primary school which is rated outstanding by Offsted and she initially struggled even with 3 years private schooling!!! she is a bright kid too so it puts Thailand schools even the pricey ones into perspective when she is struggling at the basics in a free state school. Now she is thriving and doing extra gymnastics and extra swimming lessons and the there are loads of options to do stuff that simply don't exist in Thailand or if they do they are done to a crap standard

I will keep visiting Thailand for holidays as we have friends and family there but I do not miss a single thing about it. Getting back to a proper well run country is like a breath of fresh air. No more BiB trying to scam money and I get to ride down the road without feeling the urge to kill every other person on the road due to their ignorance and retarded habits, no more mai mees or other bullshit answers and people are genuinely nicer and not constantly trying to rob me my only regret is I did not do it sooner....

Edited April 30, 2016 by mark131v

[JLCrab]

Reading on ThaiVisa, it seems most any family who leaves Thailand with their young child or children finds that, while the kid struggled in Thailand, they are now top honors/honours in whatever country to which they have relocated. Or as per Fran Lebowitz:

I never met anyone who didn't have a very smart child. What happens to these children, you wonder, when they reach adulthood?

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/f/franlebowi397818.html

Edited April 30, 2016 by JLCrab

[BudRight]

If your happy in your life then you think happy thoughts.. if not.. then you think everything is bad and wrong and the Thai are out to get us.

Think happy thoughts? Are you <deleted> serious? HAHAHAHAHAHA

[whiterussian]

Costs so far to get my exit plan going from Chiang Mai

- prep for spouse visa app - language test/tb x 2/nok air/document + translations - £600+

- failed spouse visa application - £1200
- failed tourist visa - £130

- ticket back to Blighty to start my 6 months prior income needed - £800
- mid-way return to Thailand to see wife and Brit/Thai sprog - £700
- 2nd successful visa application (in 5 month's time) - £2000
- 3 tickets from Thailand to UK - £2000?
-----------------------------

£7500

South of France would be perfect as digital nomad, envious! The UK hasn't really changed since I left 10 years ago... apart from weird contactless debit cards and robotic checkouts in shops... still an endless rat race to gain a bigger pile of bricks before you die.

Edited April 30, 2016 by whiterussian

[AlexRich]

Costs so far to get my exit plan going from Chiang Mai

- prep for spouse visa app - language test/tb x 2/nok air/document + translations - £600+

- failed spouse visa application - £1200

- failed tourist visa - £130

- ticket back to Blighty to start my 6 months prior income needed - £800

- mid-way return to Thailand to see wife and Brit/Thai sprog - £700

- 2nd successful visa application (in 5 month's time) - £2000

- 3 tickets from Thailand to UK - £2000?

-----------------------------

£7500

South of France would be perfect as digital nomad, envious! The UK hasn't really changed since I left 10 years ago... apart from weird contactless debit cards and robotic checkouts in shops... still an endless rat race to gain a bigger pile of bricks before you die.

You mentioned something above that surprised me. I'm guessing you've been married for a while? Why would your wife's visa application be rejected?

[mark131v]

Reading on ThaiVisa, it seems most any family who leaves Thailand with their young child or children finds that, while the kid struggled in Thailand, they are now top honors/honours in whatever country to which they have relocated. Or as per Fran Lebowitz:

I never met anyone who didn't have a very smart child. What happens to these children, you wonder, when they reach adulthood?

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/f/franlebowi397818.html

My kid never struggled with Thailand she found it very easy especially as the discipline part of education was a bit lacking...

The biggest part of the dilemma people face when they leave is uprooting their family speaking from experience which I know can be rare with a lot of the know it all's on TV it has been a very good decision for us

I don't think my sprog will ever set the world on fire as she is too busy having a laugh and enjoying herself but you never know, she now has the option to get good at gymnastics or another sport which is something she would not have had before and what cannot be denied is she now has the opportunity to get a proper well respected education, up to her if she takes it or not but we have done our bit so all good really....

Edited May 1, 2016 by mark131v

[whiterussian]

You mentioned something above that surprised me. I'm guessing you've been married for a while? Why would your wife's visa application be rejected?

You have to earn £18,600 pa equiv, for the prior six month to application. My business was online and without errrr... the right paperwork. (turnover £40k+)

Anyway - appeal takes 8 months, so now jumping through the UK hoops to get £18.6 salary on the books in the UK - not waiting for the appeal. Got to get my kid 4 year old into school here asap - he's getting too smart! Shame they don't have a tick box for a Thai/Brit child and a special visa to allow us to come to the UK and 'do my time' before application... but we all know they're b'stards. It's in the public eye here now - eg: newspaper stories of an American wife here for 10 years with a child and Brit husband that they want to deport for not making the right tax bracket!

Of course once you've applied for a spouse visa and failed, it's almost impossible to get a tourist visa for your partner...

Would prefer to go to S.France, S.Europe but maybe down the line.

I don't foresee calamity in Thailand, I think it'll just grind down as the rest of the world goes the sh** and less money and attention is paid to Thailand. I just got too annoyed at the stupid people in my village, awful struggles for cash by any means necessary. Does seem to be increasing... Ugly. I'd probably stay if I could insulate my child via good schooling, and assured trips abroad to show him the real world - but got 5 years of hoops to jump through in Blighty (that or £64,000 cash)

Edited May 1, 2016 by whiterussian

[AlexRich]

You mentioned something above that surprised me. I'm guessing you've been married for a while? Why would your wife's visa application be rejected?

You have to earn £18,600 pa equiv, for the prior six month to application. My business was online and without errrr... the right paperwork. (turnover £40k+)

Anyway - appeal takes 8 months, so now jumping through the UK hoops to get £18.6 salary on the books in the UK - not waiting for the appeal. Got to get my kid 4 year old into school here asap - he's getting too smart! Shame they don't have a tick box for a Thai/Brit child and a special visa to allow us to come to the UK and 'do my time' before application... but we all know they're b'stards. It's in the public eye here now - eg: newspaper stories of an American wife here for 10 years with a child and Brit husband that they want to deport for not making the right tax bracket!

Of course once you've applied for a spouse visa and failed, it's almost impossible to get a tourist visa for your partner...

Would prefer to go to S.France, S.Europe but maybe down the line.

I don't foresee calamity in Thailand, I think it'll just grind down as the rest of the world goes the sh** and less money and attention is paid to Thailand. I just got too annoyed at the stupid people in my village, awful struggles for cash by any means necessary. Does seem to be increasing... Ugly. I'd probably stay if I could insulate my child via good schooling, and assured trips abroad to show him the real world - but got 5 years of hoops to jump through in Blighty (that or £64,000 cash)

Thank you. As a Brit myself I didn't realise that there was a financial requirement. Seems pretty ridiculous given the fact that you are married with a young child? But in any case I agree that your 4 year old will obtain a better education in the UK, and if he can speak/write Thai and English that might afford him opportunities in the future. Thanks for explaining, all the very best of luck with your move.

[farang000999]

Reading on ThaiVisa, it seems most any family who leaves Thailand with their young child or children finds that, while the kid struggled in Thailand, they are now top honors/honours in whatever country to which they have relocated. Or as per Fran Lebowitz:

I never met anyone who didn't have a very smart child. What happens to these children, you wonder, when they reach adulthood?

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/f/franlebowi397818.html

This explains why rich Thais refuse to send their children abroad for their education and why Thai university degrees are held in such high esteem internationally.

[laolover88]

I remain very ambivalent about the whole thing! We tried extremely hard to make sure that the children were tri-lingual English French and Thai and tri-cultural. I always thought, and still do that with a western education and the languages they would probably be able to make much better lives in Thailand. Easier to open businesses, easier to buy land and houses etc. I have had to acknowledge two things. Thais don't like luk khreungs however well they speak, read and write the Thai language and the children sensing this would rather fight for success in life in cultures that are more diverse. While I am sitting here agonising over whether we are doing the right thing they are delighted. They say : who cares about Thai culture? There is not any. Korean films and fashion are more creative, as is UK fashion, Japanese teen culture is more vibrant, Thailand is a backwater. Hurrah!!

Edited May 2, 2016 by laolover88

[AlexRich]

I remain very ambivalent about the whole thing! We tried extremely hard to make sure that the children were tri-lingual English French and Thai and tri-cultural. I always thought, and still do that with a western education and the languages they would probably be able to make much better lives in Thailand. Easier to open businesses, easier to buy land and houses etc. I have had to acknowledge two things. Thais don't like luk khreungs however well they speak, read and write the Thai language and the children sensing this would rather fight for success in life in cultures that are more diverse. While I am sitting here agonising over whether we are doing the right thing they are delighted. They say : who cares about Thai culture? There is not any. Korean films and fashion are more creative, as is UK fashion, Japanese teen culture is more vibrant, Thailand is a backwater. Hurrah!!

Ha ha ... that made me laugh. So, I guess you are doing the right thing, and it's a real bonus that your kids are happy.

My only point about Thai/English proficiency is that western multinationals pay good salaries to expats who work here. A western educated Thai speaker might be attractive to them. But given what you've just said, they'd be happy somewhere else.

[aneliane]

Newsflash: Europe is way worse off than Thailand in terms of future.

- Hidden poverty that could lead to civil war:

Spanish women are now so poor that they resort to sell their hair which is unheard of.

French butchers are regularly victims of arm robberies, people are just hungry they rob butcheries instead of banks.

In England women cannot afford sanitary pads and tampons anymore and use newspapers instead.

Sales of cat/dog food are plummeting people cannot just afford petfood anymore.

- Banks are about to collapse: Signs such as

. negative interests - you now have to pay to keep you money in the bank, which is unheard of.

.Banks now refuse you to withdraw "big" amounts like 5000 Euros even if you have it,

500 Euros note was taken out yesterday to prevent people from using cash,

Like they did in Argentina and Greece, the banks will shut down and they will run away with our cash and mayhem, will follow.

- Increased risk of Civil war because of Immigration which is still pouring in huge numbers

Sweden and Germany attitude is changing and despite the multiculturalism propaganda, people are vastly against it, especially after the Cologne and Ikea events.

Raise of right wings parties in Austria, UK Britain First, France National Front, Germany pegida etc

500 ISIS soldiers are now infiltrated in Europe ready to plan attack

- 3rd world war is coming

Putin was clearly a CIA target with Panama Papers.

Missiles are in place in Europe all around Russia

Nuclear weapons are now in the hands of ISIS.

[thai3]

Your wife is wise. Thailand isnt a place to raise children. if they arent Thai of course.

Not a place to raise them if they are Thai, unless you can afford to send them to the very best Schools like Pattana. Government Schools seem to kill off all that's best about the kids here, and they are not stupid, it's the Schools that turn them into dis interested phone zombies, cheats and truants.

[stevenl]

Newsflash: Europe is way worse off than Thailand in terms of future.

- Hidden poverty that could lead to civil war:

Spanish women are now so poor that they resort to sell their hair which is unheard of.

French butchers are regularly victims of arm robberies, people are just hungry they rob butcheries instead of banks.

In England women cannot afford sanitary pads and tampons anymore and use newspapers instead.

Sales of cat/dog food are plummeting people cannot just afford petfood anymore.

- Banks are about to collapse: Signs such as

. negative interests - you now have to pay to keep you money in the bank, which is unheard of.

.Banks now refuse you to withdraw "big" amounts like 5000 Euros even if you have it,

500 Euros note was taken out yesterday to prevent people from using cash,

Like they did in Argentina and Greece, the banks will shut down and they will run away with our cash and mayhem, will follow.

- Increased risk of Civil war because of Immigration which is still pouring in huge numbers

Sweden and Germany attitude is changing and despite the multiculturalism propaganda, people are vastly against it, especially after the Cologne and Ikea events.

Raise of right wings parties in Austria, UK Britain First, France National Front, Germany pegida etc

500 ISIS soldiers are now infiltrated in Europe ready to plan attack

- 3rd world war is coming

Putin was clearly a CIA target with Panama Papers.

Missiles are in place in Europe all around Russia

Nuclear weapons are now in the hands of ISIS.

Congratulations on the post with the most nonsense claims so far this year.