Where/How to find teaching english job without TEFL/TESOL

[calbear09]

Hello all,

First post here. Recently returned from Chiang Rai after spending a month teaching English as a few primary schools and to monks at a Buddhist temple. I was often thrown out there by myself and although challenging, I got enjoyed it and got a lot of positive feedback and am hoping to return as a contract teacher. I am hoping to land a job without TEFL/TESOL certification.

[tonray]

Where are you located ?

Do you have a degree ?

You cannot work legally without a degree but of course you can easily find work in a language school or via an agency under contract. Schools will not likely hire you directly unless you can qualify for a work permit (degree holder).

TEFL is immaterial and not required legally anywhere.

[blackcab]

Would you want somebody completely unqualified teaching your children?

Don't worry. If the teaching thing doesn't work out you can be a doctor next.

[theguyfromanotherforum]

Anywhere because TEFL is not required to teach,

A university degree is, however.

[calbear09]

Thanks for the replies. I have a University degree. However, many of the jobs I have looked at are asking for TEFL certificate...Anyone have experience going through an agency?

[tonray]

Thanks for the replies. I have a University degree. However, many of the jobs I have looked at are asking for TEFL certificate...Anyone have experience going through an agency?

While a TEFL is not a legal requirement, many schools prefer a TEFL school grad especially when hiring via an agency. Something about having a bit of teaching techniques / education experience. Perhaps you can convince someone that your month in Chiang Rai is a substitute for that experience.

A TEFL only takes a month of your time ...why fight the tide ?

You can of course call any agency and ask if they will place you, but with or without TEFL the agency jobs are generally in government schools and are pretty much standard government school fare.

I have worked via an agency before. It is ok..but always preferable not to.

[Franky Bear]

A months course and you can be part of developing a childs education.

This is nothing short of criminal.

[Inn Between]

A months course and you can be part of developing a childs education.

This is nothing short of criminal.

But some people say the way Thai English teachers with 4-year degrees do their job in nothing short of criminal, so what can we do?

BTW, it seems a university degree is not required for a work permit. I worked with a guy at a university who didn't have a full degree but definitely got a work permit.

[Franky Bear]

A months course and you can be part of developing a childs education.

This is nothing short of criminal.

But some people say the way Thai English teachers with 4-year degrees do their job in nothing short of criminal, so what can we do?

BTW, it seems a university degree is not required for a work permit. I worked with a guy at a university who didn't have a full degree but definitely got a work permit.

They're Thai. They are exempt, although i know what you mean. The whole "No one fails" because of...yes...that thing that has held this country back decades"face" means teaches and educational institutions don't look like they can't do their jobs.

[Happy Grumpy]

You can type, why not become a computer programmer?

Same as being able to speak, and thus becoming a language teacher.

[Inn Between]

You can type, why not become a computer programmer?

Same as being able to speak, and thus becoming a language teacher.

Of course, the ability to type is important in becoming a programmer and the ability to speak is important in becoming a teacher. Obviously, neither ability in itself is qualification for those jobs. Nevertheless, there are crappy programmers and dismal teachers who obviously hate their jobs but have all the official qualifications. I've seen my share of teaching staff who started with no real experience but had a flare for it and quickly became excellent and dedicated teachers, and that has reminded me well not to put much weight on a diploma.

[Franky Bear]

You can type, why not become a computer programmer?

Same as being able to speak, and thus becoming a language teacher.

Of course, the ability to type is important in becoming a programmer and the ability to speak is important in becoming a teacher. Obviously, neither ability in itself is qualification for those jobs. Nevertheless, there are crappy programmers and dismal teachers who obviously hate their jobs but have all the official qualifications. I've seen my share of teaching staff who started with no real experience but had a flare for it and quickly became excellent and dedicated teachers, and that has reminded me well not to put much weight on a diploma.

JUST WOW!!!

One of the best/worse deflections ever.

What about the kids they "taught" before they got to this amazing standard that will now mean Harvard will be head hunting them?

[tonray]

You can type, why not become a computer programmer?

Same as being able to speak, and thus becoming a language teacher.

Of course, the ability to type is important in becoming a programmer and the ability to speak is important in becoming a teacher. Obviously, neither ability in itself is qualification for those jobs. Nevertheless, there are crappy programmers and dismal teachers who obviously hate their jobs but have all the official qualifications. I've seen my share of teaching staff who started with no real experience but had a flare for it and quickly became excellent and dedicated teachers, and that has reminded me well not to put much weight on a diploma.

JUST WOW!!!

One of the best/worse deflections ever.

What about the kids they "taught" before they got to this amazing standard that will now mean Harvard will be head hunting them?

They became computer programmers !

[Franky Bear]

They became computer programmers !

One HUGE money...like the Teachers on here proclaim they are.....

[tonray]

A months course and you can be part of developing a childs education.

This is nothing short of criminal.

You miss the point entirely if you have never taught in the Thai school system.

Native English Speakers are not hired to teach English ...they are hired to facilitate English conversation among the students by having someone who uses proper pronunciation and grammar in the classroom. The TEFL does not train you to teach English...it helps you work out the basics of class lesson structure so you can be effective in facilitating that conversation.

[tomwct]

I agree, if your not qualified to be a Teacher, try and become a Doctor or a Nurse!

[Franky Bear]

A months course and you can be part of developing a childs education.

This is nothing short of criminal.

You miss the point entirely if you have never taught in the Thai school system.

Native English Speakers are not hired to teach English ...they are hired to facilitate English conversation among the students by having someone who uses proper pronunciation and grammar in the classroom. The TEFL does not train you to teach English...it helps you work out the basics of class lesson structure so you can be effective in facilitating that conversation.

No i don't. I'm a father. If someone if employed as an English teacher...they are an english teacher.

[Inn Between]

You can type, why not become a computer programmer?

Same as being able to speak, and thus becoming a language teacher.

Of course, the ability to type is important in becoming a programmer and the ability to speak is important in becoming a teacher. Obviously, neither ability in itself is qualification for those jobs. Nevertheless, there are crappy programmers and dismal teachers who obviously hate their jobs but have all the official qualifications. I've seen my share of teaching staff who started with no real experience but had a flare for it and quickly became excellent and dedicated teachers, and that has reminded me well not to put much weight on a diploma.

JUST WOW!!!

One of the best/worse deflections ever.

What about the kids they "taught" before they got to this amazing standard that will now mean Harvard will be head hunting them?

Where did I say they were incompetent out of the gate? That's just your incorrect assumption. It's actually not that difficult for an intelligent person with good language skills to understand and execute an English lesson plan with a bit of guidance. Many of these teachers were almost instantly doing a very capable job. before they rose to the "amazing standards" you refer to, although I can't see where I used such a foolish exaggeration.

[Franky Bear]

You can type, why not become a computer programmer?

Same as being able to speak, and thus becoming a language teacher.

Of course, the ability to type is important in becoming a programmer and the ability to speak is important in becoming a teacher. Obviously, neither ability in itself is qualification for those jobs. Nevertheless, there are crappy programmers and dismal teachers who obviously hate their jobs but have all the official qualifications. I've seen my share of teaching staff who started with no real experience but had a flare for it and quickly became excellent and dedicated teachers, and that has reminded me well not to put much weight on a diploma.

JUST WOW!!!

One of the best/worse deflections ever.

What about the kids they "taught" before they got to this amazing standard that will now mean Harvard will be head hunting them?

Where did I say they were incompetent out of the gate? That's just your incorrect assumption. It's actually not that difficult for an intelligent person with good language skills to understand and execute an English lesson plan with a bit of guidance. Many of these teaches were almost instantly doing a very capable job. before they rose to the "amazing standards" you refer to, although I can't see where I used such a foolish exaggeration.

More crap..

It's wrong on so many levels

[tonray]

A months course and you can be part of developing a childs education.

This is nothing short of criminal.

You miss the point entirely if you have never taught in the Thai school system.

Native English Speakers are not hired to teach English ...they are hired to facilitate English conversation among the students by having someone who uses proper pronunciation and grammar in the classroom. The TEFL does not train you to teach English...it helps you work out the basics of class lesson structure so you can be effective in facilitating that conversation.

No i don't. I'm a father. If someone if employed as an English teacher...they are an english teacher.

Ok...keep your absurd notions. Maybe get out into the world and see how things really work.

[Inn Between]

Of course, the ability to type is important in becoming a programmer and the ability to speak is important in becoming a teacher. Obviously, neither ability in itself is qualification for those jobs. Nevertheless, there are crappy programmers and dismal teachers who obviously hate their jobs but have all the official qualifications. I've seen my share of teaching staff who started with no real experience but had a flare for it and quickly became excellent and dedicated teachers, and that has reminded me well not to put much weight on a diploma.

JUST WOW!!!

One of the best/worse deflections ever.

What about the kids they "taught" before they got to this amazing standard that will now mean Harvard will be head hunting them?

Where did I say they were incompetent out of the gate? That's just your incorrect assumption. It's actually not that difficult for an intelligent person with good language skills to understand and execute an English lesson plan with a bit of guidance. Many of these teaches were almost instantly doing a very capable job. before they rose to the "amazing standards" you refer to, although I can't see where I used such a foolish exaggeration.

More crap..

It's wrong on so many levels

Well, there ya go. Some of us relay our actual experiences and reasons to make a point, but I guess it's much better just to label things as crap and wrong without making the effort of intelligent communication. That's always a winning approach. Looks like you WON AGAIN !!!

[Franky Bear]

Well, there ya go. Some of us relay our actual experiences and reasons to make a point, but I guess it's much better just to label things as crap and wrong without making the effort of intelligent communication. That's always a winning approach. Looks like you WON AGAIN !!!

Won what?

I'm stooping to your level.

People know what you people are, don;t worry.

[Inn Between]

Well, there ya go. Some of us relay our actual experiences and reasons to make a point, but I guess it's much better just to label things as crap and wrong without making the effort of intelligent communication. That's always a winning approach. Looks like you WON AGAIN !!!

Won what?

I'm stooping to your level.

People know what you people are, don;t worry.

Not really sure, Franky

And never stoop to my level! BTW, is that the one where I try to use reasoning and experience to reinforce my points rather than just hollow statements?

But as long as people know what people we are, they won't worry. Good you're here to tell them what people we are -- whatever that is.

[Inn Between]

Ok...keep your absurd notions. Maybe get out into the world and see how things really work.

102'nd country visited this year mate.

You people always have some sort of waffle to try and deflect the fact you are frauds taking advantage of a country with lax regulations for your own gain in a trade that should be very heavily regulated.

You don't fool any of us.

I've got to be fair, Franky. I replied to this one saying that you've had 147 days to do this when in fact it's 207 days, and that would give you 2 days in each country (rather than only 1.225) to get your deep understanding of their cultures (minus travel time and customs clearance of course -- but we'll give you credit for the customs time as that can give some insight into the ways of a country).

So anyway, what was your favourite?

[Baerboxer]

A months course and you can be part of developing a childs education.

This is nothing short of criminal.

You miss the point entirely if you have never taught in the Thai school system.

Native English Speakers are not hired to teach English ...they are hired to facilitate English conversation among the students by having someone who uses proper pronunciation and grammar in the classroom. The TEFL does not train you to teach English...it helps you work out the basics of class lesson structure so you can be effective in facilitating that conversation.

Do you think being a native English speaker automatically means they have an understanding of English grammar, have clear correct diction and pronounce all their words correctly, and can somehow simply morph into being a teacher, with no qualification or experience?

If you do a TEFL course, it should contain modules on grammar as well as speaking English correctly, planning and delivering lessons and also teaching skills. If it doesn't ask for your money back or better still find a better course before you pay.

Look at the OP's post. I wouldn't want him/her teaching my children.

[tonray]

A months course and you can be part of developing a childs education.

This is nothing short of criminal.

You miss the point entirely if you have never taught in the Thai school system.

Native English Speakers are not hired to teach English ...they are hired to facilitate English conversation among the students by having someone who uses proper pronunciation and grammar in the classroom. The TEFL does not train you to teach English...it helps you work out the basics of class lesson structure so you can be effective in facilitating that conversation.

Do you think being a native English speaker automatically means they have an understanding of English grammar, have clear correct diction and pronounce all their words correctly, and can somehow simply morph into being a teacher, with no qualification or experience?

If you do a TEFL course, it should contain modules on grammar as well as speaking English correctly, planning and delivering lessons and also teaching skills. If it doesn't ask for your money back or better still find a better course before you pay.

Look at the OP's post. I wouldn't want him/her teaching my children.

TEFL courses do indeed have those modules.

Being a native English speaker does not guarantee that one uses proper grammar and diction....BUT....the school has the right to not employ those that don't. It's called a job interview. Don't get your shorts all bunched up in a knot over nothing.

[calbear09]

You use textbooks and workbooks to teach from. I wasn't an Education major (in fact I went to an Ivy league school which doesn't even offer education/teaching) as a major.

I was a volunteer english teacher for only two months without a formal teaching background and received a lot of positive feedback from the directors/teachers of the schools I went to.

Teaching especially at the primary school level is about having patience and presenting material in a way that is engaging (implementing games and activities into the lesson plan). For example having students draw out a picture of their family when teaching them the words brother, sister, mother, father.

[calbear09]

A months course and you can be part of developing a childs education.

This is nothing short of criminal.

You miss the point entirely if you have never taught in the Thai school system.

Native English Speakers are not hired to teach English ...they are hired to facilitate English conversation among the students by having someone who uses proper pronunciation and grammar in the classroom. The TEFL does not train you to teach English...it helps you work out the basics of class lesson structure so you can be effective in facilitating that conversation.

Do you think being a native English speaker automatically means they have an understanding of English grammar, have clear correct diction and pronounce all their words correctly, and can somehow simply morph into being a teacher, with no qualification or experience?

If you do a TEFL course, it should contain modules on grammar as well as speaking English correctly, planning and delivering lessons and also teaching skills. If it doesn't ask for your money back or better still find a better course before you pay.

Look at the OP's post. I wouldn't want him/her teaching my children.

Well I hope you aren't in Thailand with children. There are a ton of teachers teaching English in a situation similar to mine.

[thairay]

Teaching English AS a few primary schools.......I GOT enjoyed it???? Are you sure that English is your subject?

[Loaded]

come on now children, behave yourselves.