Leaving after a decade.

[4MyEgo]

7 hours ago, DennisF said:

I am neither an apologist nor a knocker, I love the country and the Thai people I know.

 

On saying that, I feel really uncomfortable here now, unwelcome and unwanted by the 

current government as it gets more and more restrictive, oppressive and appears to bring in new legislation and requirements, 

almost on a daily basis, that makes life here untenable for me.

 

I will sell up and leave at the end of September.

 

Is anyone else feeling this kind of pressure?

 

My intention is to return in 5 years or so as I feel  a lot will have happened by then to make

Thailand welcoming again.

 

That is my hope anyhow, otherwise it might just have to be Vietnam.

 

For what it's worth, I totally understand what your saying about the government (any government) for that matter, in my opinion governments changed the ball game over the last decade, could it be that Thailand is just catching up. 

 

Personally I have never felt welcomed here in Thailand, with as many a smile that greets me, I am realistic about how Thai's are towards aliens/falangs, calls us what you will, and I am sure heaps will disagree with my comment, moving right along.

 

I can't speak for what your feeling as I am only a new comer her, having moved here in November after carefully (as carefully) as possible planning my retirement over the past 10 years, however it sounds to me as if you have had enough, and when you have had enough, you do as you say, you move forward to do what you think will make you happy, your a big boy, you think things through, you plan things and you put them into action.

 

I am certain that you know that governments are not there to make us or any of their puppets feel welcome, they are all for themselves in my opinion, and as soon as you opt to leave your place of origin they do there best to stick it to you tax wise, I will spare you the details as I am sure you know of that 1st hand.

 

Ending a beautiful relationship has got to hurt, if it was as beautiful as you say it was, not doubting you, I would be thinking about trying to make it work e.g. I would walk to the other side of the world to keep mine as beautiful as it is, and yes I know it takes two.  

 

Vietnam sounds like a plan, the UK in its current state from what I read sounds like a nightmare, perhaps Europe, if Vietnam doesn't work out, you sound financial, so choice shouldn't be too hard.

 

I wish you all the best, in particular with reigniting your flame, hope to hear from you on this post in 5 years when you return, if you return, but don't expect it to be any different, it is what it is, "the land of smiles"

[rogeroc]

16 minutes ago, bazza40 said:

 

So move to somewhere so you can drink to your heart's content in the wee small hours. Possibly most of us don't find Thailand's bar  hours overly restrictive. OK, you're not an alcoholic. Are you an insomniac?

 

Well that is exactly what this thread is about, moving somewhere, else hence my comments which were far from limited to the bar scene. I am personally saddened that i need to consider moving elsewhere as i think potentially Thailand has so much to offer.

 

I can relate to the OP and think insults in this thread such as whingeing Pom are inappropriate and like your comment about me being an alcoholic are not very intelligent.

 

 

[Suradit69]

Quote

 

 I feel really uncomfortable here now, unwelcome and unwanted by the 

current government as it gets more and more restrictive, oppressive and appears to bring in new legislation and requirements, almost on a daily basis, that makes life here untenable for me.

 

 

I've been here longer than a decade and don't feel oppressed or restricted.

 

If I were to return to the US (where I haven't lived for 40 years) the political/governmental situation there is hardly an oasis of democratic nirvana anyway. 

[1FinickyOne]

Hi Rog - 

 

Well, isn't this all part of the continuing process of life? You make your decisions on where to live based on what you like to do and what is available... I love my occasional trips into CM but the bars being closed does not mater to me... As to the soldiers, I guess maybe there are a few more out and around, though I don't take notice and definitely do not find them intrusive or threatening... Actually some have come running to help me when they saw me lifting things too heavy for me... they are always kindly and polite here... I guess most countries are having debates on immigrants, and restrictions may happen. I have never been asked for my passport and don't even carry it with me - my Thai DL does fine, but if I had to, it would not make me think any less of Thailand... 

 

Where I live there are no traffic jams... you may get stuck for 100 seconds at a red light, but the world is not going to be perfect.

 

If the points you make are important to you, then they are certainly valid in your decision making. Thailand is surely not the only retirement spot in the world. I hope you find one that suits you better... good luck.

[bazza40]

7 minutes ago, rogeroc said:

 

Well that is exactly what this thread is about, moving somewhere, else hence my comments which were far from limited to the bar scene. I am personally saddened that i need to consider moving elsewhere as i think potentially Thailand has so much to offer.

 

I can relate to the OP and think insults in this thread such as whingeing Pom are inappropriate and like your comment about me being an alcoholic are not very intelligent.

 

 

I've encountered many whinging Poms over the years, so to me it's not an insult - merely a classification.

I suspect you are offended by the alcoholic comment because it's a bit close to the bone. When you are out drinking at night, how many drinks do you have, and how many non-alcohol days in the week do you have?

[Seraphina]

Hi DennisF, I wish you a great deal of luck in pursuing your decision. I suspect it hasn't been easy. Your decision seems to be on the heels of the end of a relationship... and this may have somewhat coloured your recent perceptions, so the advice that one poster gave you (to put your stuff in storage in case you return) may well turn out to be pragmatic.

 

I confess to having lived and worked in a fair few countries (Germany, Australia, Hong Kong, Singapore, Malaysia, China, UAE, Qatar and Egypt and so on); my latest stint was in France which I detested for some years, not because I didn't like the people or the language (though the food was particularly disappointing!), but because I found so few people in this environment who shared the same basic life values as me or with whom I could actually hold a reasonable conversation about subjects that mattered to me.  

 

I do not share the same value system as the French government (pretentious, bigoted and unable to face the major problems of immigrants from former African colonies among other matters), nor could I admire the French work value system (quoi?). I knew it was time to leave.  Nevertheless, I was also mindful that having lived outside the UK for nigh on 30 years, I am virtually an expatriate in exile. I suspect it would be almost impossible for me to re-adjust to the weather, the prices, the language used nowadays, the behaviour of the youth nowadays and even the generation before me. I don't think I could even get a job there anymore...!

 

As a professional psych, I know that you will have told your former clients that contentment boils down to coming to terms with/having coping strategies to handle your circumstances. Since all countries and cultures have their problems, perhaps it's more pertinent to ask yourself: do you WANT to come to terms with the problems of living in Thailand? This approach may well prove to be a more sound basis for such an important decision about your future. Whichever you choose, I wish you a great deal of luck in adjusting!

[rogeroc]

20 minutes ago, bazza40 said:

I've encountered many whinging Poms over the years, so to me it's not an insult - merely a classification.

I suspect you are offended by the alcoholic comment because it's a bit close to the bone. When you are out drinking at night, how many drinks do you have, and how many non-alcohol days in the week do you have?

 

Can you not see that i found it offensive because it was simply rude, unnecessary, completely unfounded, unintelligent and pointless.

[Berkshire]

1 hour ago, DennisF said:

 What a ridiculous assumption.

 

I have had Thai gfs and spent enormous amounts of cash and never regreted 1 baht.

 

Thats because I am grown up.

 

I dont have to make excuses about this bunch of uneducated no hope and no idea cretins who dish

out daily verbal  diarrhea.

 

I also see the effect it has on my Thai friends, both small business owners and ministry employees of a high level.

 

This administration has adversely affected the whole of the Thai population, apart from their friends.

 

So YES that affects me directly as I see people I care about suffer.

 

Clear?

 

Well we wouldn't be making assumptions if you'd just be honest and tell us the real reasons you're leaving!  I too have Thai friends and none are suffering as you suggest.  In fact, I have more than a few Thai friends who like what the current government is doing (although they're concern that the gov may stay on too long).  Look, there are things the US gov is doing that I don't like.  But they're not the reason I left America.  After 6 pages, you still haven't come clean as to the real reason you're leaving.

[DerringDo]

Wow lots of judgemental claptrap going on in this thread.

 

Good luck on finding greener pastures OP. 

[MissAndry]

26 minutes ago, Seraphina said:

 

Nevertheless, I was also mindful that having lived outside the UK for nigh on 30 years, I am virtually an expatriate in exile. I suspect it would be almost impossible for me to re-adjust to the weather, the prices, the language used nowadays, the behaviour of the youth nowadays and even the generation before me. I don't think I could even get a job there anymore...!

 

You are wrong on almost every assumption.

Apart from housing and running a car, prices in the UK are fine if you cook yourself and eat in. Everyone where I lived in London were very polite and helpful to older people. Generally interacting with people in London was a far nicer experience than interacting with Thais.  Shop assistants very polite and helpful unlike here in Chiang Mai.

Edited August 23, 2016 by MissAndry

[daveAustin]

7 hours ago, DennisF said:

I am most certainly not a whinging pom!!  Having lived in Aussie land for a few years, I too found them a pain in the butt!

 

How did you manage that? I went a couple of times and couldn't wait to escape to New Zealand... on the politeness/class scale, I expect one could liken it going from Russia to Switzerland . The aussies are quick on their winging pom routine but I have never come across a more whiny bunch.

 

I still like it, but Thailand really has changed, esp since 2000 ish. A five-year break will do the world of good. Suggest fitting in a couple years in the UK to see how long you can put up with normalcy and tailgaters.

[Scotwight]

7 minutes ago, Berkshire said:

 

Well we wouldn't be making assumptions if you'd just be honest and tell us the real reasons you're leaving!  I too have Thai friends and none are suffering as you suggest.  In fact, I have more than a few Thai friends who like what the current government is doing (although they're concern that the gov may stay on too long).  Look, there are things the US gov is doing that I don't like.  But they're not the reason I left America.  After 6 pages, you still haven't come clean as to the real reason you're leaving.

He is leaving Thailand because some Thai acquaintances he has briefly met don't like the current government.  Kind of like me saying I left America because my barber didn't like Bill Clinton. 

[daveAustin]

Seraphina, you would be surprised at the prices (esp groceries, cars and mobiles), the level of service and how easygoing most people are. Jobs can be a hassle with big gaps in CVs.

[jesimps]

8 hours ago, Scotwight said:

Bets, that nothing negative has happened to you as a result of the new government.  I could be wrong and you are not just another whinging pom.  I'm interested really since nothing negative has happened to me outside of reading Thai Visa in the past two years.  Since it takes many straws to break a camels back it should be easy for you to list ten things the new government has done to you on a daily basis that made life untenable for you.

Maybe, like me, he sees the junta turning the screws on a daily basis. You have to be a fanboy or ignoramus to deny it. I agree with what the OP says and would do the same if I wasn't married to a Thai.

It's only a matter of time before the paranoia is ratcheted up against the farang. 

 

[fiddlehead]

A traveler came to the gates of a new city and asked the gatekeeper, "What kind of people live here?"

The gatekeeper answered with a question of his own, "What kind of people lived in the city you just came from?"

The traveler replied, "They were mostly a cantankerous lot, greedy and self-centered."

The gatekeeper answered, "I expect you will find the people here just the same."

Soon after, another traveler met the gatekeeper and asked the same question.  Again the gatekeeper asked, "How did you find the residents of the city you visited last?"

The traveler answered enthusiastically, "They were warm and hospitable; truly a fine group of people."

The gatekeeper responded, "I expect you will find these folk just the same."

[bazza40]

29 minutes ago, rogeroc said:

 

Can you not see that i found it offensive because it was simply rude, unnecessary, completely unfounded, unintelligent and pointless.

Having said all that, I find it interesting you were not prepared to disclose your daily/weekly consumption pattern.

 

This thread seems to attract quite a few hothouse flowers.

[Franky Bear]

1 minute ago, bazza40 said:

Having said all that, I find it interesting you were not prepared to disclose your daily/weekly consumption pattern.

 

This thread seems to attract quite a few hothouse flowers.

WH=hat does it matter <deleted>

[bazza40]

2 minutes ago, Franky Bear said:

WH=hat does it matter <deleted>

If you want to double-team me with rogeroc,  I suggest you bring something more coherent.

[jesimps]

22 minutes ago, DerringDo said:

Wow lots of judgemental claptrap going on in this thread.

 

Good luck on finding greener pastures OP. 

Yes, the fanboys are out in force.

The question you have to ask is,

if everyone on here had the choice of somewhere to settle, how many would choose a country under junta control?

You've made a good decision imo.

 

[jesimps]

21 minutes ago, Scotwight said:

He is leaving Thailand because some Thai acquaintances he has briefly met don't like the current government.  Kind of like me saying I left America because my barber didn't like Bill Clinton. 

You're making this up as you go along. 

 

 

[oxo1947]

I have lived here nearly 20 years----find things are easier--there was no retirement (as people call it) Visa then---you had to leave the country every 90 days, and now the people complain about walking down the road just to get a 90 day stamp....which you will all be doing on the internet soon anyway.

You could not renew your Visa for a year--Inside of Thailand---another journey to another country that had a Visa friendly consulate.--more expense.

 

Of course Thailand's changed in 20 years, its got a lot more affluent--a lot more industrial. Has a lot more tourist crowding places out. But of course you have to blame the current government for all the misery that has been poured on you & is making life so hard you have to leave. Would you just post a short list say 5-6 things that have made your life here absoloutly  unlivable in the last few years. Not the silly stuff like people don't smile at me as much as they used to. There not as friendly...

 

Then after that....Please just pack your bag and just go------------

 

 

[bartender100]

I just returned to the UK after 6 years in Thailand, very happy , but i did have a very good job waiting for me, i will probably work for 4 years then finally go back to Thailand , but loving some of the things in the UK, peace and quiet being the main one, nice fresh north sea fish, can't wait for the Herring season soon. I will also take some nice trips to Europe for a change, I am single so can do what i want

[Berkshire]

12 minutes ago, jesimps said:

Yes, the fanboys are out in force.

The question you have to ask is,

if everyone on here had the choice of somewhere to settle, how many would choose a country under junta control?

You've made a good decision imo.

 

 

Perhaps you can articulate as to how the "junta control" has changed your life in Thailand.  The OP seems unable or unwilling.

[MissAndry]

6 minutes ago, Berkshire said:

 

Perhaps you can articulate as to how the "junta control" has changed your life in Thailand.  The OP seems unable or unwilling.

Closed all the bars in CM at midnight.

Army checkpoints, and armed soldiers raiding night spots.

Burmese working on the sly in markets being arrested and deported all around Chiang Mai.

Corruption at CM immigration increased tenfold.

Many of the Thai population are following their new leaders dislike of white foreigners.

 

Do I need to find more?

Edited August 23, 2016 by MissAndry

[Thaidream]

I shall give you my two cents. Thailand is definitely not the same as I first encountered it 50 years ago but where is. In addition, I am not the same. On both accounts some things are better and some are worse. It is our perception of those things that either gives us pleasure or pause. IMO Thais are still basically the same people they always were but many of us couldn't discern what tht was.

-Thais always wear a mask hiding their true feelings and the longer we are here the more we are able to unmask them- sometimes what we see is not what we like and at other times it is great.

-Thais worry about their future jut like us- but they most often keep it to themselves or suppress their feelings- a difficult concept in a relationship.

- The cost of living is much higher for both Thais and Foreigners making both of our lives more stressful

-It is not the government per se that bothers people- it is what the government may or may not do that creates uncertainty

-The internet and social media have placed before us more of a cross section of the good, the bad and the ugly- where in the past we only were aware of the good.

-Thailand does not have that fun feeling like before because more people are poor, stressed out  and we have also grown up.

-There is no real anti foreigner feeling but as Thailand starts to enforce laws some people are having adjustment problems. The days of living dangerously are coming to an end.

 

In my mind it is still a good place to live but we have to let live.  Based upon what I see in my birth country of America- I have no desire to return and miss very few things. Thailand has and will always be my home but it is not for everyone.  I wish the OP well and I hope he finds his peace whether in the UK, Thailand or somewhere else.

[mcfish]

 

Perhaps you can articulate as to how the "junta control" has changed your life in Thailand.  The OP seems unable or unwilling.

It's unfortunate that the bashers have pushed the weak over the edge. One poster comes to mind his handle is "shirtless" and he is brutal in attacking the regime, usually the first to post on a thread.. However what the Sheepal following him don't realize is he lives nice and safe from reporisal in Cambodia... whilst the rest attack from inside the borders, keyboard warriors, naive enough to believe their I P address is somewhow a secret

Idiots..



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[sanuk711]

18 minutes ago, MissAndry said:

Closed all the bars in CM at midnight.

Army checkpoints, and armed soldiers raiding night spots.

Burmese working on the sly in markets being arrested and deported all around Chiang Mai.

Corruption at CM immigration increased tenfold.

Many of the Thai population are following their new leaders dislike of white foreigners.

 

Do I need to find more?

.

Oh please do say more--------

1 & 2---I am sorry that you are missing out on having a good time at the girlie bars after midnight....however these laws where brought in way before the so called Junta.....Just that fat white envelopes made the people who are suppose to enforce them ignore them.

3--Burmese working illegally in Thailand----well I never saw that under any of the other governments------

4--Corruption in Thailand.....yes well that was defiantly something new that the government brought in when they took over......

5-- Many of the Thai population are following their new leaders dislike of white foreigners. Of course you will now post some links on how the new leader has stated that he hates white foreign people.....after that I think you can go and take your meds.

 

Oh sorry your about to find more---yes please carry on find more--most entertaining ........

[hdkane]

I totally understand feeling a grind here, especially in regard to not having equal protection under the law...knowing that someone could kill me and simply apologize for the incident actually governs some of my behavior here...and promotes unhealthy isolation at times

 

still, I think some people here offer quite sound advice...to take a break, rather than a drastic and permanent move...who knows...you could be depressed, as one member suggested...in which case, you would simply take your problems and outlook with you...I'm sorry you feel this way, but good luck in sorting things out...

[bazza40]

9 minutes ago, MissAndry said:

Closed all the bars in CM at midnight.

Army checkpoints, and armed soldiers raiding night spots.

Burmese working on the sly in markets being arrested and deported all around Chiang Mai.

Corruption at CM immigration increased tenfold.

Many of the Thai population are following their new leaders dislike of white foreigners.

 

Do I need to find more?

Midnight closure of bars is not important to me, possibly to some.

I travel from Chiang Mai to Chiang Rai regularly, and don't see any change in checkpoints. Admittedly I wouldn't see raids on nightspots, because I'm not there.

So you have a head count based on personal observation of the Burmese being arrested?

What quantitative measure do you have that corruption at CM immigration has increased tenfold?

Based on my observations, many of the Thai population in the North openly mock the new leader's television monologues.

No, you don't need to find more. Just some meaningful data to substantiate your rather wild allegations.

 

 

[Gary A]

I'm not Thai so I tend to ignore politics unlike some of the Thai Visa experts. Before the coup, I remember, not fondly, roadblocks and demonstrations.  Since the general took over, all those problems have disappeared. Life in the boonies suits me. In the past twentyfive years, I spent five years working in Kalifornia.  I couldn't wait to get back here. I think you are in for a shock. The world has changed and unfortunately not for the better. Good luck with your change of scenery. It may work out well for you.