SURVEY: Is Philippine's President Duterte a help or a hindrance to the Philippines?

[tuky]

Tropo, unfortunately all those news reports get their information from one source, that being numbeo.

 

When I checked, 800 people had contributed to the crime and safety stats for Davao. 800 out of 6 billion people. 

I bet most of those 800 are all Davaowinians paid or asked to contribute by the Duterte camp in preparation for his presidential push.

 

If you search the scientific safest cities list Davao doesnt even come close to being in the top 50.

 

Attached is a screenshot showing Davao not even in the top 20 in numbeo now days and that is when filtering for just the region.

It was all an election ploy. But one that worked very well. Most Davaowinians (Or whatever they call themselves) totally believe theat Davao city is the safest city in the world, because du30 told them.

 

Well, there is something wrong with the forum, I cant upload anything.

 

[DipStick]

This from the BBC

 

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-37370848

 

this thug is a serious train derailment waiting to happen. What's the expression ? You can fool some of the people some of the time , but you can never fool everyone all of the time 

[tropo]

12 hours ago, Britphils said:

Picking up on various points made.

 

The birth rate is declining and has been for a few years. This will be improved greatly as Duterte is implementing the policy of free contraceptives for the poor.

 

health budget reduced by 25%. This ignores the fact that all gambling revenue (big business here) is being directed to healthcare. Overal health spending will increase.

 

President's office budget increased from 2.8 billion peso to 20 billion peso. 15 billion of this is a one off to pay for the ASEAN conference next year. This money will be allocated to other departments as required. 

 

Duterte has not asked US troops to leave. He has asked a hundred or so US special forces to leave the combat area as they are high value targets. There will be considerably more US troops in the Philippines next year under the new agreement.

 

From someone who lives here I can tell you life in my poor area is already getting better. From a murder a month in our area to zero. Armed holdups were common. Not one now. Police don't ask for bribes. Government officials dare not be corrupt. No late night karaoke! 

 

2 police have been charged with murder, 300 under investigation. 303 people charged with "vigilante" killings. 10 police, 5 military killed in shootouts. If the killings are extra-judicial executions those figures are strange.

 

No opposition killed or arrested, (though allies of Duterte have been publicly named by him as drug offenders), no journalists killed (132 were killed over previous years), no suppression of a highly critical media, no removal of rights. Public protests allowed. If this is a dictatorship it is an unusual one.

Same in our area, in the "deep jungles" of Leyte (where Duterte was born). Life is improving. No killings have been reported - more health care and aid for poor people, and a huge difference in Phil Health coverage - saved me a lot of money over the last 2 months. They are holding drug rehab sessions at the city gym, including exercise programs.

 

 

 

[tropo]

7 hours ago, DipStick said:

As someone else has mentioned, his daughter is the mayor of Davao , whilst his son Paolo is the vice mayor, are they elected ?, or is this Filipino nepotism at its best.

anyhow the headlines in today's PDI newspaper makes interesting reading, . Paolo has been outed as a drug user ! And this from one of his security people who also confesses be a hit man !

this could be a very interesting topic to keep watching.

They were elected by popular vote. Mayoral elections all over PI are held on the presidential election year. It's not surprising they won the vote, is it? Duterte is extremely popular in Davao and the people obviously want to keep the legacy going considering the great job he has done.

 

This is unlike the mayoral elections in our area on Leyte. The mayoral candidates were handing out money to buy votes. I doubt the Dutertes needed to bribe voters.

 

What a lot of people may not know is that Ferdinand Marcos Junior nearly won the vice presidential vote. There must have been some vote tampering going on as I was watching the tallies during the counting process. Marcos was ahead, and in the hours before full count the numbers mysteriously started going in the opposite direction, giving Maria Robredo the win by a very small margin. 34.6% Marcos, Robredo 35.1%. A margin of just over 200,000 votes out of 14 million.

 

If I had to hazard a guess as to the future, the most likely scenario is that Duterte won't make 6 years either due to medical problems or death, assassination or impeachment and resignation, in which case Robredo will become president. Unlike in the US where vice presidents are running mates, the vice president in the Philippines runs independently. Robredo is very anti-Duterte. Vice presidents can run for 2 terms (12 years).

 

Worries about his family members taking over are far fetched IMO. It's far more likely that Ferdinand Marcos Jr. would win the next election.

[Britphils]

On today's star witness mentioned above. I watched it. 

 

A very credible sounding witness with lots of details but then things started unravelling.

 

De Lima stated years ago she would get evidence on Duterte and destroy him. The witness stated he provided this evidence in 2014. De Lima would have known of it as she was Justice Secretary and this was a high profile situation. Yet she did not use it against him when he was a mayor and so relatively easily removed. She did not use it against him when he was a candidate. Why now?

 

He gave this evidence to the CHR in 2014 but the Ombudsman and the Commission on Human Rights did an investigation in 2015 and could find no evidence.

 

He went into the witness protection programme in 2014 but has yet to sign an affadavit of his allegations. The Dept of Justice would not support him, including a monthly allowance, all this time with no affadavit.

 

He claims he was involved in the murder of the bodyguards of a political rival of Duterte but that politician's son has said no bodyguards were ever killed.

 

He claims he was involved in the murder of a man who seems to have been murdered after he went into the witness protection programme (this one I have not confirmed)

 

He claims involvement in the murder of Duterte's sister's lover. She says he was not murdered.

 

Two days ago Duterte said the Liberal Party were planning to impeach him (the infamous plan B talked about since before the election). Yesterday they said they had no plans to do this and would not do this. Today they called for his impeachment.

 

I believe the witness was involved in something but there are way too many odd things about his testimony. 

 

As to Duterte' son being involved in drugs, that really is laughable. 

[tropo]

2 hours ago, tuky said:

Tropo, unfortunately all those news reports get their information from one source, that being numbeo.

 

When I checked, 800 people had contributed to the crime and safety stats for Davao. 800 out of 6 billion people. 

I bet most of those 800 are all Davaowinians paid or asked to contribute by the Duterte camp in preparation for his presidential push.

 

If you search the scientific safest cities list Davao doesnt even come close to being in the top 50.

 

Attached is a screenshot showing Davao not even in the top 20 in numbeo now days and that is when filtering for just the region.

It was all an election ploy. But one that worked very well. Most Davaowinians (Or whatever they call themselves) totally believe theat Davao city is the safest city in the world, because du30 told them.

 

Well, there is something wrong with the forum, I cant upload anything.

 

I haven't gone into the details of the poll. I'd be a amazed if ANY city in the Philippines made the top 100 in the world (how many cities are there in the world? - thousands!).

 

These polls were published a year before elections, so I don't understand your "election ploy" suggestion. At that time Duterte wasn't even considering running for president and the mayoral elections were a year away, and I don't think he needed fake pole results to get the win anyway, if they are indeed fake.

 

It might be worth mentioning that Davao is the biggest city in the Philippines outside the NCR. A city of around 1.5 million, nearly twice the population of Cebu City. It's no small, insignificant backwater.

 

 

 

 

Edited September 15, 2016 by tropo

[Britphils]

I forgot something else.

 

He was asked if he knew about the rivalry/hatred between Duterte and De Lima. He said no, he did not have a television or a cell phone. Could be the only person in the Philippines.

 

Asked who invited him to give testimony he was unclear, implied he just decided to turn up. Asked who brought him to the hearing he would not say.

[tuky]

22 minutes ago, tropo said:

I haven't gone into the details of the poll. I'd be a amazed if ANY city in the Philippines made the top 100 in the world (how many cities are there in the world? - thousands!).

 

These polls were published a year before elections, so I don't understand your "election ploy" suggestion. At that time Duterte wasn't even considering running for president and the mayoral elections were a year away, and I don't think he needed fake pole results to get the win anyway, if they are indeed fake.

 

It might be worth mentioning that Davao is the biggest city in the Philippines outside the NCR. A city of around 1.5 million, nearly twice the population of Cebu City. It's no small, insignificant backwater.

 

 

 

 

Agreed. Davao is also the biggest in area, Davao itself is huge in land mass.

 

Regarding the other matter.

It is just my opinion. 

I formed it due to low amount of responders that bumped Davao to the top of the list.

 

As for the timeframe, I have trouble accepting that du30 didnt have a plan in place for a presidential run a long time ago.

12 plus months ago he was saying he wouldnt enter the race, then slowly it became he wouldnt enter the race unless it was clear everyone wanted him to, then last minute he put himself forward. I think it was a very smart way of garnering support.

Show the country that Davao is the safest city in the world, but he wont run for president, hold off until the locals are practicaly begging for him to run for office.

Which is exactly what happened. Sounds like a clever marketing ploy to me, I am sure you agree that is a very possible scenario. The guy might be a rogue, a monster even but one thing he is not is stupid.

Lets not forget he only won 38% of the vote.

 

No matter what, at the end of the day what you said earlier is the only true thing here. We are sitting here watching all this unfold, how interesting it will be to see what happens.

[tropo]

1 hour ago, tuky said:

Agreed. Davao is also the biggest in area, Davao itself is huge in land mass.

 

Regarding the other matter.

It is just my opinion. 

I formed it due to low amount of responders that bumped Davao to the top of the list.

 

As for the timeframe, I have trouble accepting that du30 didnt have a plan in place for a presidential run a long time ago.

12 plus months ago he was saying he wouldnt enter the race, then slowly it became he wouldnt enter the race unless it was clear everyone wanted him to, then last minute he put himself forward. I think it was a very smart way of garnering support.

Show the country that Davao is the safest city in the world, but he wont run for president, hold off until the locals are practicaly begging for him to run for office.

Which is exactly what happened. Sounds like a clever marketing ploy to me, I am sure you agree that is a very possible scenario. The guy might be a rogue, a monster even but one thing he is not is stupid.

Lets not forget he only won 38% of the vote.

 

No matter what, at the end of the day what you said earlier is the only true thing here. We are sitting here watching all this unfold, how interesting it will be to see what happens.

I think there was another big factor in his win. He's only the second Cebuano to become president, ever... last one left office in 1946 (Osmeña)... and Duterte is well connected with the whole of the Visayan/Mindanao region, having lived in both areas (Leyte, Cebu City, Davao). A high profile candidate from the south has been a long time coming. 

 

It's hard for non-Cebuano speaking Filipinos to understand (most seem blissfully ignorant of this), but there's a lot of anti-Cebuano sentiment in the Philippines. Northerners (native Tagalog speakers) constantly poke fun at them whenever they speak. My Bisayan speaking wife constantly deals with this whenever we visit Manila, and it p*sses me off too. They consider them lessor Filipinos. They were constantly poking fun at Duterte's speech leading up to the election. He speaks a Cebuano/Tagalog/English mix that isn't too pleasant for the stuck up native Tagalog speaking crowd. I also believe people in the South are tougher/stronger and more stubborn in general. 

 

With this region (Visaya-Mindanao) boasting 40% of the nation's population, and a huge Visayan-Mindanao population (poor working class) in the NCR, and with a high profile candidate to back, I believe this is a huge factor in his win. Many would have voted for him just because he's one of their own. I would venture to say that voting turnout in the south would have been in record numbers too.

 

You have to be a Bisayan/Cebuano speaker to "get" his humour. My wife laughs at his jokes while others are horrified. They have a unique kind of humour that the Northerners can't grasp, and neither can I half of the time. A good example of this were his comments about the Australian missionary who was raped and murdered. My wife didn't find his remarks offensive, while I, and most of the rest of the world were horrified.

 

There's my theory.

Edited September 15, 2016 by tropo

[Opl]

-> Tropo, do you mean something like " dark humour"  ?....  like Charlie hebdo's ?  

[tropo]

33 minutes ago, Opl said:

-> Tropo, do you mean something like " dark humour"  ?....  like Charlie hebdo's ?  

Although you're probably only being facetious...

 

No, it's Cebuano humour, and even that would has its own regional flavours. Every language and culture has their own humour, often misunderstood by outsiders. I'm sure many of us don't get Thai humour and all it's regional variations... same thing over there. I remember one time I witnessed an incident (in Australia) where an American was getting extremely angry toward an Australian, who was only joking in an Australian way. Even English speaking countries where most speak the same language can have this problem so you can imagine the problems that can occur when people in the same country speak different languages.

 

A native Tagalog speaker cannot understand a Cebuano speaker, BUT, most Cebuano speakers can at least understand Tagalog. Believe it or not, Cebuano speakers usually prefer speaking English over Tagalog.

 

Now that he's the President of the whole of the Philippines, he has to consider a more generic way to get his points across. The Philippines has some 120 to 175 languages, depending on the method of classification. That's a lot of different people with different thought processes. Duterte is also the first local chief executive to get elected straight to the Office of the President, so he has a steep learning curve.

 

I have confidence he'll get his mouth working right with some practice. 

 

 

Edited September 15, 2016 by tropo

[Opl]

Do you think Duterte would dare calling Xi Jinping the same way he did with Obama ?

 

Edited September 15, 2016 by Opl

[tropo]

42 minutes ago, Opl said:

Do you think Duterte would dare calling Xi Jinping the same way he did with Obama ?

 

What is this? Quora Digest?

 

Did you miss his jokes about China claiming the South China Sea?

 

Anyway, thanks for the quiz...

[Jingthing]

22 minutes ago, tropo said:

What is this? Quora Digest?

 

Did you miss his jokes about China claiming the South China Sea?

 

Anyway, thanks for the quiz...

Did he call him a son of a whore as he did Obama? Did he call the Chinese ambassador a gay son of a whore as he did the U.S. ambassador? 

 

Given you and other apologists for the mass murderer strong man Duterte, who have said it was just a little joke that means nothing in the his native lingo, well, if so, why not the same means nothing to the Chinese leaders?

Edited September 15, 2016 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, tropo said:

...

 

I have confidence he'll get his mouth working right with some practice. 

 

 

Why would he change? In your experience, do old men often change? 

[RaoulDuke]

The Philippines does not have a drug problem, it has a poverty problem, coupled with an out of control corruption epidemic. Killing off dirt poor drug users and equally poor street-level pushers will only make some room in the slums (but not enough to make a difference). High rates of addiction are a symptom, not a cause of a society's ailments.  Once Rodrigo turns the guns on corrupt politicians and businessmen, I will reconsider my current appraisal of him as a feeble minded megalomanic buffoon. Perhaps he is just trying to turn the drug market in the PI into a monopoly for his buddies??? Its the only rational explanation, as a war on drugs is always an exercise in futility.

 

[car720]

Let him whack everyone that needs whacking until the people run the streets again and then if he doesn't behave just whack him.

[Laughing Gravy]

Absolute 'head banger' who has little understanding of world politics. Potentially a very dangerous man.

[irwinfc]

On 9/11/2016 at 8:26 PM, Jingthing said:

He's a mass murderer. His rule began in tears and it will end in tears. Popular or not. He won't be the first or last popular mass murderer. 

would you care to elaborate on the mass murderer bit? killings during the previous administration was much higher than the current. here are some stats:

 

"... average daily deaths since the 2010 to January to June 2016 and on July to August 2016. That graph shows that the year 2013 had the highest rate of people killed at 16,160 murders/homicide or 44 deaths per day. That graph also shows that for January to June 2016, there were 5,491 murders/homicides or a total of 30 per day, while the record for July-August 2016, there were 681 murders/homicides or 20 deaths per day." (http://www.philstar.com/freeman-opinion/2016/08/24/1616689/killings-were-worst-duterte)

 

even with stats cited by time.com (http://time.com/4478954/philippines-rodrigo-duterte-drug-war-vigilante-killing-deaths/) of 37 deaths per day, still lower than Thaksin's Shinawatra's 2003 anti-drug campaign with 1,200 deaths during the first month (http://time.com/4462352/rodrigo-duterte-drug-war-drugs-philippines-killing/). if you called him out as a mass murderer then, please accept my sincere apologies and simply ignore the rest of this post. otherwise, read on. the high numbers are likely due to the ramped-up operations by the police. nevertheless, during the previous administration the average number of deaths peaked in 2013 at 44 per day yet nobody called the former president a mass murderer. more than 30 journalists (who spoke/wrote against criminals, politicians, and businessmen) were killed from 2010-2016 (http://www.manilatimes.net/more-than-30-journalists-killed-during-the-bs-aquino-regime/264718/), most of them still unsolved. the previous administration did little to nothing about extrajudicial killings. the previous president even said that some of those journalists deserved to die. and this is what prompts the current president to curse at the US, EU, and UN - more deaths before, nothing solved, not a word from them. less deaths now, more done (less criminals and drugs on the streets; over 600,000 have surrendered) yet full of criticisms from the US, EU, and UN.

 

 

The Philippines does not have a drug problem, it has a poverty problem, coupled with an out of control corruption epidemic. Killing off dirt poor drug users and equally poor street-level pushers will only make some room in the slums (but not enough to make a difference). High rates of addiction are a symptom, not a cause of a society's ailments.  Once Rodrigo turns the guns on corrupt politicians and businessmen, I will reconsider my current appraisal of him as a feeble minded megalomanic buffoon. Perhaps he is just trying to turn the drug market in the PI into a monopoly for his buddies??? Its the only rational explanation, as a war on drugs is always an exercise in futility.

 

 

your first few words, sadly, invalidates the rest of your message.

 

Did he call him a son of a whore as he did Obama? Did he call the Chinese ambassador a gay son of a whore as he did the U.S. ambassador? 

 

Given you and other apologists for the mass murderer strong man Duterte, who have said it was just a little joke that means nothing in the his native lingo, well, if so, why not the same means nothing to the Chinese leaders?

 

you're 0 out of 2.

1) Duterte did NOT call obama a s.o.w. he threatened to call obama a s.o.w. the moment he speaks of ejk during their scheduled meeting.

2) he did not call goldberg a gay s.o.w. Duterte called him a faggot for making statements during the campaign period

get your facts straight.

Edited October 3, 2016 by irwinfc
added text

[kamahele]

On 9/11/2016 at 0:30 PM, elgordo38 said:

Its refreshing to see someone shake up this good ole boys club. They are truly a boring bunch with a threatening vocabulary that achieves zero zilch nada.  Right now the bad boy of North Korea is in the sights of the good ole boys club. They as usual are verbally bombbasting him after yet another nuclear test and he is giving them the finger as usual and laughing up his sleeve. Ho Hum. Given time I think he will be OK. Frankly I find him refreshing as in past all the battles against the drug trade have proven fruitless and people just keep on dying and the dealers keep laundering the illicit green. Even though the odd innocent person is killed there are many more killed by drugs. At least now the drug leaders are looking over their shoulders. He has definitely taken them down a peg or two. 

So, it is refreshing in your view to allow the mass slaughter of those not charged with a crime and not given due process?

[seancbk]

On 9/11/2016 at 8:39 PM, lovelomsak said:

Appears to be practical to me. Bad guys dead. Hundreds of thousands of people surrender. Pretty tough stats to compete with. Where else in the world where this is not practiced can they say drug dealers are surrendering by the 100,000's .there have been over 500,000 people surrender.

Once all the drug users are dead should he start on the alcoholics?

And why kill drug users anyway?  Is it because you and many other people think all drugs user commit crimes?   What about rich drug users who never need to steal to pay for their use?  Do you kill everyone who's ever used a recreational drug?

Might need to murder half of Philippine High Society and most of their actors and models, because you can be sure they are all using cocaine at party's, not to mention of course many of the western foreigners living and working there.   

[cdnvic]

You can disagree with a nation's government but making derogatory comments about an entire nationality isn't allowed (one post removed).

[elgordo38]

On 9/11/2016 at 1:12 PM, lungnorm said:

President Duterte does speak off the cuff often. His English is far from perfect. He is often mis quoted in the press ie He was recently reported to have called Obama a son of a whore, the truth of that story is that crude remark was directed at the reporter and not Obama. I have lived in the Philippines for the last 2 years and have witnessed the tremendous support he has here. They do have a drug problem here and it needs to be cleaned up. Unfortunately there are some innocents getting in the firing line, but when you consider there are so many Government officials and Police in the drug trade it will take someone like Duterte to get any kind of result.

I just hope in the end he is not killing off the competition. 

[Credo]

The man is a nut case of epic proportions.   His election makes clear why the country, which has so much potential, has never come close to achieving much.  

[rosst]

Ask the people who live in the Philippines. 

I live in the Philippines and the overwhelming majority are right in tune with the sentiment and direction he wishes to take.

I am also satisfied with his leadership.

[tropo]

1 hour ago, Credo said:

The man is a nut case of epic proportions.   His election makes clear why the country, which has so much potential, has never come close to achieving much.  

Apart from what you read/hear on international media, how much do you really know about the Philippines? There's a lot of people pegging Duterte as a nutcase based on the crap they are fed by international media.

 

Duterte certainly didn't cause the problems in the Philippines. If anyone can make some positive changes he's the only chance they've got.

 

How can you solve big problems without taking drastic measures?

Edited October 3, 2016 by tropo

[Jingthing]

Mass murder is not ok. Too drastic.

[tropo]

11 hours ago, RaoulDuke said:

The Philippines does not have a drug problem, it has a poverty problem, coupled with an out of control corruption epidemic. Killing off dirt poor drug users and equally poor street-level pushers will only make some room in the slums (but not enough to make a difference). High rates of addiction are a symptom, not a cause of a society's ailments.  Once Rodrigo turns the guns on corrupt politicians and businessmen, I will reconsider my current appraisal of him as a feeble minded megalomanic buffoon. Perhaps he is just trying to turn the drug market in the PI into a monopoly for his buddies??? Its the only rational explanation, as a war on drugs is always an exercise in futility.

 

The Philippines doesn't have a drug problem? LOLOLOL

 

It has/had a huge drug problem.

 

Who's killing off poor street level drug users and pushers?

 

They are being tagged and rehabilitated. They have rehabilitation programs all over the Philippines for drug users, who are often the low level sellers too.

 

Low level sellers are warned. If caught again they are jailed. No one is killing them. If they were being killed the kill numbers would in in the 10's of thousands by now.

 

 

[lungbing]

I have a sneaking admiration for him for not kowtowing to the USA.  And that's what is really upsetting many of the above posters.

The only thing he has to worry about is that America might decide they need a regime change and the  rebels there suddenly find themselves with more military hardware than they know what to do with.

[tuky]

Agreed.

the question is...where will it end?

Once all the druggies are killed will smokers be next?

Gay?

Lesbian?

drinkers?

 

Once a guy like this, one who will compare himself to hitler gets power there is no stopping him.

 

The Phils needs reform, granted. But by mass murder?

once the druggies are dead, who will stop the murderers? More murderers?