Thinking hard about moving back to the US

[Thailimpan]

On September 13, 2016 at 8:11 PM, bwpage3 said:

Do you know his wife? If not how can you even make such a ridiculous comment?

My wife lives in Florida and she never wants to go back to Thailand, not even to visit

Try having some facts to post

So your own personal experience is a fact. Of course there are exceptions to the rule. Your comment is laughable stupid

[bwpage3]

59 minutes ago, Thailimpan said:

So your own personal experience is a fact. Of course there are exceptions to the rule. Your comment is laughable stupid

Stupid is when you make a post that has nothing to do with what you are quoting. Now how stupid is that? 

Must be really, really bored in Thailand to be wasting your time on that one.

[Thailimpan]

7 hours ago, bwpage3 said:

Stupid is when you make a post that has nothing to do with what you are quoting. Now how stupid is that? 

Must be really, really bored in Thailand to be wasting your time on that one.

Oh like what you just did....

[Thailimpan]

7 hours ago, bwpage3 said:

Stupid is when you make a post that has nothing to do with what you are quoting. Now how stupid is that? 

Must be really, really bored in Thailand to be wasting your time on that one.

Oh like what you just did....

[ExpatJ]

On 9/13/2016 at 6:18 AM, bwpage3 said:

My son went to one of those 500,000 baht a year schools and when he got the USA, he was a grade behind in every subject. No matter the price, there is NO school in Thailand that will prepare your kid for a western education. I for one am extremely happy we moved back to the USA and my son is getting a world class education. My friends wife (age 38) has a law degree from Thammasart Uni and cannot even pass the USA written drivers test. That should tell you something right there. 

 

 From what i have seen the opposite is true- -graduates from the top 3 -4 international school in Bangkok actually find US/UK universities too easy in the first year since the IB courses in Bangkok international schools for 16-18 year olds is far more rigorous than standard, that is to say non-IB,  US/UK high schools. 

 

Updated: I was just reading the back threads- ok you are talking about Prem International school in CM- comparing that to the top international schools in Bangkok is apples v oranges so to speak. So yes, i get your point. 

 

Edited September 21, 2016 by ExpatJ

[bwpage3]

5 hours ago, ExpatJ said:

 

 From what i have seen the opposite is true- -graduates from the top 3 -4 international school in Bangkok actually find US/UK universities too easy in the first year since the IB courses in Bangkok international schools for 16-18 year olds is far more rigorous than standard, that is to say non-IB,  US/UK high schools. 

 

Updated: I was just reading the back threads- ok you are talking about Prem International school in CM- comparing that to the top international schools in Bangkok is apples v oranges so to speak. So yes, i get your point. 

 

Even the first part is not true unless you are talking about No Name Universities in the USA. Are you talking about the top 10 Universities in the USA are too easy for Thai Students?

 

Have a personal friend, American female, her husband has a PhD from Chulalongkorn. The past 5+ years he cannot even find a job other than being a waiter. His PhD is useless here.

 

Another friend and his Thai wife moving here next month. She is 38 with a law degree from Thammasart and cannot even past the USA drivers license test in English.

 

The majority of the population of Thai students cannot compete on the international level. If they could you would see industry, manufacturing, high tech sectors etc. all over Thailand. As it is, Thailand is still stuck in the third world.

 

There will always be a few students here and there that excel past international standards. But as a whole? Thai people seriously struggle with anything concerning advanced education.

 

At the multi-billion dollar per year company I work for, we have over 45,000 employees. 1000's from India and China work here in the USA. Masters Degree the minimum education for those foreigners. Not one from Thailand.

 

IB classes or not. You might think the cost of Bangkok International Schools dictate a good education but they do not. You have to ask yourself why in the world would a world class teacher move all the way to Thailand and put up with everything, (pollution, traffic, scams, etc. that is Bangkok), when they could have a cushy job in the USA?

 

The answer is even the international schools do NOT get the best teachers.

 

When you have first hand experience with your own kid like I do, let me know. PREM was always touting their foreign teachers and their qualification yet my son came to the USA, tested and was a year behind.

 

You cannot always believe what you hear unless you have first hand knowledge of your own experience.

 

How good are Bangkok schools that parents around the world that do not even live in Thailand want to send their kids to IB school there?   Probably Zero.

 

Tons of private prep schools in New England in the USA have students sent from all over the world. Big difference. 

 

How many Bangkok IB students were admitted to Harvard last year?

 

 

[pgt99]

I too work offshore and have spent my leave in Thailand for the past 8 years. I am one of the lucky one's to still have a job though on a much reduced salary. I bitch about the Thai system, but then again people will always find something to moan about. Overall I prefer Thailand to my native UK. Yes, it is cheaper here to live. I am based in Jomtien and have many places yet to explore. I have found if you have good manner's, a happy outlook on life and of course sociable you get on anywhere in the world. Think I will be pitching here for some time to come.

[does]

On 9/14/2016 at 2:39 AM, anotheruser said:

 

Because your low expectations in life don't allow it.

Or maybe because I know people who do not know how to pay for their kids to go to school.

[does]

On 9/14/2016 at 2:39 AM, anotheruser said:

 

Because your low expectations in life don't allow it.

Or maybe because I know people who do not know how to pay for their kids to go to school.

[does]

On 9/13/2016 at 9:27 AM, Strange said:

 

Why? Because I want a better lifestyle? Because I want more opportunities? When did personal drive to have a better life become nasty to you?

Why? If you had problems paying school fees for your kids I would feel sympathy.

[jayboy]

 

 From what i have seen the opposite is true- -graduates from the top 3 -4 international school in Bangkok actually find US/UK universities too easy in the first year since the IB courses in Bangkok international schools for 16-18 year olds is far more rigorous than standard, that is to say non-IB,  US/UK high schools. 

 

Updated: I was just reading the back threads- ok you are talking about Prem International school in CM- comparing that to the top international schools in Bangkok is apples v oranges so to speak. So yes, i get your point. 

 

You exaggerate.Even the best students from the best international schools in Thailand would not find the first year of Russell Group universities too "easy".Such a silly statement suggests you don't properly understand how top universities operate.

[Xircal]

On 9/13/2016 at 1:48 AM, Scotwight said:

Not true and you can do your 90 day report by mail or INTERNET.  

 

I think it's ridiculous to have to report every 90 days like you're a common criminal. If Thailand wants to attract more foreigners it needs to rethink that stupid rule.

[Strange]

3 hours ago, does said:

On 9/13/2016 at 9:27 AM, Strange said:

Why? Because I want a better lifestyle? Because I want more opportunities? When did personal drive to have a better life become nasty to you?

Why? If you had problems paying school fees for your kids I would feel sympathy.

 

Don't need your sympathy. I don't have kids and I'm not poor. I can have a better life in the states on my income than Thailand will ever be able to provide. 

[BudRight]

2 hours ago, jayboy said:

 

 

You exaggerate.Even the best students from the best international schools in Thailand would not find the first year of Russell Group universities too "easy".Such a silly statement suggests you don't properly understand how top universities operate.

 

 

 

The other poster probably does not realize that students at American Universities take entrance exams and are placed according to their ability. Lower scores = easier classes.

Edited September 25, 2016 by BudRight

[balo]

I lived in the US for 3 months and that was enough for me. The food is terrible and overpriced. Unless you want to eat unhealthy mass produced food with lots of chemicals in it.  

 

[mania]

1 hour ago, balo said:

I lived in the US for 3 months and that was enough for me. The food is terrible and overpriced. Unless you want to eat unhealthy mass produced food with lots of chemicals in it.  

 

 

 

Sorry Balo the US is not to be blamed for your poor choices of cooks nor restaurants

 

Most people can find good, healthy, fairly priced food, anywhere in the world or better yet cook it themselves

 

[anotheruser]

 

2 hours ago, balo said:

I lived in the US for 3 months and that was enough for me. The food is terrible and overpriced. Unless you want to eat unhealthy mass produced food with lots of chemicals in it.  

 

Terrible, maybe. Overpriced absolutely not.

[chiang mai]

On 15/09/2016 at 7:38 AM, JAFO said:

 

I could easily respond to your points but to what point? I think what you struggle to understand is that a great number of expats do very well here. You are just so jaded because of your experience that you can't see it nor are you willing to accept it. Your perception is that all expats here are all old guys, sitting at bars drinking their lives away miserable, trapped and broke, eating noodle soup. Some how you managed to "Escape" the tyranny and found nirvana living back in the US. LOL!!!

 

Cheers 

 

 

 

I liked the above post because it really does nail one of the key issues, perception. Far too many posters develop their perception of expats in Thailand based on a limited sample in a single location and it produces a pretty unattractive model, the old man spending all his time at the beer bar with all that entails.. But they never see the settled expats with nice homes and established families in semi-rural Thailand, the ones who live fairly normal lives by western standards and there are thousands of them, the silent majority that don't grease these forums with their bitching and gripes about everything Thai. I suppose it's a self professing prophecy in many respects that posters who complain about all things Thai and want to go home are actually arguing for evidence to support their point of view, justification to make that move home. Perhaps if I had children I might see things differently but from where I sit today, very happily I might add, I think that far too many expats move to the tourist centres because it was that type of environment that attracted them to Thailand in the first place - after a while, everyone becomes jaded with the excess but forgets those centres are not representative of Thailand. Perhaps many should consider a move within Thailand to be a more reasonable location rather than leave the country altogether, baby and bathwater and all that.

[JDGRUEN]

 

I liked the above post because it really does nail one of the key issues, perception. Far too many posters develop their perception of expats in Thailand based on a limited sample in a single location and it produces a pretty unattractive model, the old man spending all his time at the beer bar with all that entails.. But they never see the settled expats with nice homes and established families in semi-rural Thailand, the ones who live fairly normal lives by western standards and there are thousands of them, the silent majority that don't grease these forums with their bitching and gripes about everything Thai. I suppose it's a self professing prophecy in many respects that posters who complain about all things Thai and want to go home are actually arguing for evidence to support their point of view, justification to make that move home. Perhaps if I had children I might see things differently but from where I sit today, very happily I might add, I think that far too many expats move to the tourist centres because it was that type of environment that attracted them to Thailand in the first place - after a while, everyone becomes jaded with the excess but forgets those centres are not representative of Thailand. Perhaps many should consider a move within Thailand to be a more reasonable location rather than leave the country altogether, baby and bathwater and all that.

I really agree with your take on this issue. But I will point out that some tourist spots here make great places to live because by sheer luck they are anti-excess. Ao Nang, Krabi is small, laid back little corrupted by the Patong - Samui - Pattaya type environment. I have toured all over Isaan and love it and may move back there some day. I see the value in that environment especially places like Nong Khai province along the Mekong in the small towns. Issan has been in my heart since first spending time there some 48 years ago. I never forgot it.

[chiang mai]

8 minutes ago, JDGRUEN said:

 

I really agree with your take on this issue. But I will point out that some tourist spots here make great places to live because by sheer luck they are anti-excess. Ao Nang, Krabi is small, laid back little corrupted by the Patong - Samui - Pattaya type environment. I have toured all over Isaan and love it and may move back there some day. I see the value in that environment especially places like Nong Khai province along the Mekong in the small towns. Issan has been in my heart since first spending time there some 48 years ago. I never forgot it.

 

 

I lived in Patong for four years and I would put it and Pattaya close to the number one spot in terms of excess. And I also know Ao Nang quite well and would agree completely except I still find it a bit too touristy (not sure if you can have the touristy part without some degree of excess) by comparison to my resent location albeit far less so than Patong. Despite having lived in Thailand for close to 15 years I was quite taken aback by what I found in the mountain communities North of Chiang Mai, it's a world I never knew existed so I'm certain that many tourist centre based expats will be unaware also. The interesting part for me is that many of these places have integrated foreigners into their communities really well and both groups are often middle class Thai's rather than rural impoverished locals - and not a beer bar or go-go pole to be seen for miles. And if truth be known there are many other areas of Thailand that are very similar, if not the majority of the country, the tourist areas are the exception and I think people loose sight of that, thinking that the rest of the country is the same. Indeed much of Issan is and I'm thinking initially of Petchabun Province which is 180 degrees off from the touristy parts, different environment and different people with totally different attitudes.

[JDGRUEN]

55 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

 

I lived in Patong for four years and I would put it and Pattaya close to the number one spot in terms of excess. And I also know Ao Nang quite well and would agree completely except I still find it a bit too touristy (not sure if you can have the touristy part without some degree of excess) by comparison to my resent location albeit far less so than Patong. Despite having lived in Thailand for close to 15 years I was quite taken aback by what I found in the mountain communities North of Chiang Mai, it's a world I never knew existed so I'm certain that many tourist centre based expats will be unaware also. The interesting part for me is that many of these places have integrated foreigners into their communities really well and both groups are often middle class Thai's rather than rural impoverished locals - and not a beer bar or go-go pole to be seen for miles. And if truth be known there are many other areas of Thailand that are very similar, if not the majority of the country, the tourist areas are the exception and I think people loose sight of that, thinking that the rest of the country is the same. Indeed much of Issan is and I'm thinking initially of Petchabun Province which is 180 degrees off from the touristy parts, different environment and different people with totally different attitudes.

 

One thing about Ao Nang... the touristy part is easy to get away from - just get back off the beach 2-3 kilometers.  And having some Western style restaurants to go to from time to time in the tourist area makes for a break in routine. 

[JAFO]

1 hour ago, chiang mai said:

 

I lived in Patong for four years and I would put it and Pattaya close to the number one spot in terms of excess. And I also know Ao Nang quite well and would agree completely except I still find it a bit too touristy (not sure if you can have the touristy part without some degree of excess) by comparison to my resent location albeit far less so than Patong. Despite having lived in Thailand for close to 15 years I was quite taken aback by what I found in the mountain communities North of Chiang Mai, it's a world I never knew existed so I'm certain that many tourist centre based expats will be unaware also. The interesting part for me is that many of these places have integrated foreigners into their communities really well and both groups are often middle class Thai's rather than rural impoverished locals - and not a beer bar or go-go pole to be seen for miles. And if truth be known there are many other areas of Thailand that are very similar, if not the majority of the country, the tourist areas are the exception and I think people loose sight of that, thinking that the rest of the country is the same. Indeed much of Issan is and I'm thinking initially of Petchabun Province which is 180 degrees off from the touristy parts, different environment and different people with totally different attitudes.

We live in the North.  Absolutely love the area and people are incredibly pleasant and nice.  We live in a small neighborhood. We are 20 minutes away from the city of Lampang if we need a day at the mall or to catch a movie.  I can ride my motorcycle in the mountains, fish the local river. Ride my mountain bike along the trails. It's quiet and clean.  I have my stuff to keep with my hobbies. 

 

There is no excess where we are. As you stated just a bit of rural living middle class. It's a nice mix.  

 

But I do understand that some expats left their home country and want all the comfortable things they left behind.  This is why the congregation of expats in Patong or Pattaya doesn't surprise me.  It's all good.  We all find a spot to suit our needs

 

Like a few others I moved around to see the country.  Best thing I ever did. Afforded me a chance to see where I like.

I honestly feel many move here on a whim or for a woman not giving any consideration to the long term.  Many of those implode and make the chronicles of TV forums.

 

 

 

 

[chiang mai]

24 minutes ago, JAFO said:

We live in the North.  Absolutely love the area and people are incredibly pleasant and nice.  We live in a small neighborhood. We are 20 minutes away from the city of Lampang if we need a day at the mall or to catch a movie.  I can ride my motorcycle in the mountains, fish the local river. Ride my mountain bike along the trails. It's quiet and clean.  I have my stuff to keep with my hobbies. 

 

There is no excess where we are. As you stated just a bit of rural living middle class. It's a nice mix.  

 

But I do understand that some expats left their home country and want all the comfortable things they left behind.  This is why the congregation of expats in Patong or Pattaya doesn't surprise me.  It's all good.  We all find a spot to suit our needs

 

Like a few others I moved around to see the country.  Best thing I ever did. Afforded me a chance to see where I like.

I honestly feel many move here on a whim or for a woman not giving any consideration to the long term.  Many of those implode and make the chronicles of TV forums.

 

 

 

 

 

I think you can have the comfortable things that were left behind living anywhere in the country, the only thing you can't have of course is seashore and a proper beach- if any of you have seen pictures of poster Villagefarang's house it's as pleasant and modern as anything found in the West plus the location and views are to die for (I use VF's house as the example here solely because pictures of his house have been posted so people can relate to what I wrote by using that example).

 

I think what happens is many expats overstay their location, they came here initially because the freedom and hedonistic ways of say Pattaya were appealing and for a while it was great fun. But boiling frog syndrome sets in and when it does, the immediate thought is to return home rather than move. And this is another reason why many expats can't relate to each others experiences in Thailand, some of us might as well live on different planets given the lack of similarity between locations and all that entails.

 

Without wishing to bore, my favorite encounter with an expat was in Don Muang many years ago, a Brit baggage handler at Heathrow. He claimed to live in Pattaya and had been doing so for many many years and was fluent in Thai and was the wise old expat if ever there was one. Come to find out that he still worked at Heathrow and would use travel concessions to visit Thailand frequently, Pattaya to be precise, every time. In over fifteen years of visits he'd never been anywhere else in Thailand and always took the same limo service backwards and forwards from DM to Pattaya - his actually knowledge of Thai language was limited to the usual stuff picked up in bars. There's a man who knows and has seen absolutely zero about Thailand despite spending much time in the country, sadly his friends back home and in the bars hear will heed his sagely words of wisdom when anything Thai is mentioned, thus it is how the image and myths of what Thailand "is really like", is perpetuated.

[OMGImInPattaya]

2 hours ago, JDGRUEN said:

 

One thing about Ao Nang... the touristy part is easy to get away from - just get back off the beach 2-3 kilometers.  And having some Western style restaurants to go to from time to time in the tourist area makes for a break in routine. 

The same could be said of Pattaya...Ao Nang is still the sticks no matter how you cut it.

[OMGImInPattaya]

7 hours ago, balo said:

I lived in the US for 3 months and that was enough for me. The food is terrible and overpriced. Unless you want to eat unhealthy mass produced food with lots of chemicals in it.  

 

And you think the food in Thailand and has no chemicals in it...talk about drinking the Kool-Aid? You have more faith and trust in the Thai FDA than the US FDA...I'm sorry that just doesn't scan.

 

Most areas in the US have cheap and healthy eating options if one avails themselves...and there are farmer's markets 3-4 days a week in many places, with more healthy variety of fresh fruits, veggies, meats, breads, and prepared foods than are found at any Thai market. In addition, one Whole Foods Market or Trader Joe's has more variety of healthy raw and prepared foods than all the supermarkets and "gourmet" markets in Thailand combined.

Edited September 26, 2016 by OMGImInPattaya

[BudRight]

5 hours ago, chiang mai said:

 

I liked the above post because it really does nail one of the key issues, perception. Far too many posters develop their perception of expats in Thailand based on a limited sample in a single location and it produces a pretty unattractive model, the old man spending all his time at the beer bar with all that entails.. But they never see the settled expats with nice homes and established families in semi-rural Thailand, the ones who live fairly normal lives by western standards and there are thousands of them, the silent majority that don't grease these forums with their bitching and gripes about everything Thai. I suppose it's a self professing prophecy in many respects that posters who complain about all things Thai and want to go home are actually arguing for evidence to support their point of view, justification to make that move home. Perhaps if I had children I might see things differently but from where I sit today, very happily I might add, I think that far too many expats move to the tourist centres because it was that type of environment that attracted them to Thailand in the first place - after a while, everyone becomes jaded with the excess but forgets those centres are not representative of Thailand. Perhaps many should consider a move within Thailand to be a more reasonable location rather than leave the country altogether, baby and bathwater and all that.

 

You mean it's nice living a country estate and not having to work? Tell me where that isn't true.

 

The chief difference between the whiners and the apologists is whether they have to work for a Thai boss. If you're rich, Thailand is your oyster. If you have to make money in the Kingdom, more fun to saw your own dick off.

 

Don't bore me either with the "I know a guy who made millions" crap. They're the exception. Most end up teaching on 30k a month at some shitty back alley primary school before they get fired at sixty.

[Strange]

8 hours ago, balo said:

I lived in the US for 3 months and that was enough for me. The food is terrible and overpriced. Unless you want to eat unhealthy mass produced food with lots of chemicals in it.  

 

Lives in US for 3 months

 

Becomes expert

 

I don't even know what to say about this statement. There is more variety in the USA then Thailand will ever have. Not just in a regular supermarket, but different cuisines as well. Overpriced? No. 

[chiang mai]

42 minutes ago, BudRight said:

 

You mean it's nice living a country estate and not having to work? Tell me where that isn't true.

 

The chief difference between the whiners and the apologists is whether they have to work for a Thai boss. If you're rich, Thailand is your oyster. If you have to make money in the Kingdom, more fun to saw your own dick off.

 

Don't bore me either with the "I know a guy who made millions" crap. They're the exception. Most end up teaching on 30k a month at some shitty back alley primary school before they get fired at sixty.

 

I don't understand where you're coming from! I don't know people who have country estates (apart from one retired Thai Police General), I sure as sh*t don't know any English teachers but I do know quite a few retired foreigners who have pleasant homes. And exactly why people have to be grouped into the two extremes of whiners and apologists is totally beyond me, loads of normal people, the vast majority in fact, complain about things from time to time and they defend aspects of life in Thailand from time to time, isn't that they way people are in every country! 

[JAFO]

17 minutes ago, Strange said:

8 hours ago, balo said:

I lived in the US for 3 months and that was enough for me. The food is terrible and overpriced. Unless you want to eat unhealthy mass produced food with lots of chemicals in it.  

 

Lives in US for 3 months

 

Becomes expert

 

I don't even know what to say about this statement. There is more variety in the USA then Thailand will ever have. Not just in a regular supermarket, but different cuisines as well. Overpriced? No. 

 

I agree. 3 months? Not really long enough to offer a fair comparison 

 

The US has become strip malls with chain everything. Virtually every corner is a Starbucks, Some mexican burrito place, Panda express, Target shopping, Home Depot, Mc'D's, Carl Jr's and a bunch of other chained food joints. Someone mentioned Trader Joes and Whole Foods.. LORD..... Have you ever shopped there? One bag of "Stated" organic food will set you back a C note and you got very little. I am not all on board with organic certified food. In the US I personally think "Organic" is a bit of a scam to sell the same food at elevated prices, slick way to improve gross margin. Its a hype and many Americans are sheeple and believe it and will brag about it to make other envy them that they can afford to buy their weekly food there. . If you want Organic grow it yourself if no,t you are wasting money and would be better served buying food at your local grocery store like Safeway, Ralphs, Walmart etc. 

 

But to the other points, Yes America has the widest selection of foods anywhere to be found, is it cheap??? Depends on what you buy and where you eat. Here is a quick comparison, I just took a customer and the customer focus team to a very nice dinner last week at a nicer Thai restaurant in the area. It had all the basic foods: Fish, pork, veggies, rice, soup, etc. For 15 people cost $124.71 cents with quite a few beers and a bottle of Australian wine. I have taken customers out in the US (4 people)  and the cost was pushing $200 - 250 without drinks. Add some drinks and that bill will add $100 more.  But can you eat cheap in the US. Yes, you can eat CarlsJr, McD's, Wendy's and spend $5. You can buy a burrito for $ 7.50, you can eat buffets and spend $12.50 ea. A good Sushi place in the US will set you back $60 to $70 for 2.  Go to a sporting event and spend $10 for a hot dog and $8 for a beer. LOL!!!

 

 

 

 

 

[pgrahmm]

^^^^^ Realistic viewpoint.... 

 

Also - if shopping at Whole Foods & particularly Trader Joes watch how they dumb down the packaging & the serving sizes.....When you notice this and work it out you can shop other places & get just as healthy of food in larger quantities at much better costs.....It's a handy little packaging scam they have going......

 

If you look around there are a lot of asian markets with good prices & variety that can be shopping staples - if around areas that have Asians in the community......

 

A little difficult in places like Wyoming though.....