Trump may not have paid income tax for 18 years

[keemapoot]

13 minutes ago, lannarebirth said:

 

Nixon was much more of a moderate and progressive than Clinton is. Who knows what Trump is?

 

I think I know. At base, he is an opportunist. He doesn't give a sh!t about conservative or liberal values, or any values. He doesn't believe in God, which I agree with. He is an incompetent rich kid, who by the luck of the draw was born to a rich daddy who fronted him his first tranche to gamble with, which he promptly lost, then inherited the bulk of the fortune and ran it up to some kind of billionaire status probably. 

 

An opportunist will take any kind of deal as long as he can see an angle to get something out of it. Nothing wrong with a guy like that except at President.

[lannarebirth]

1 minute ago, keemapoot said:

 

I think I know. At base, he is an opportunist. He doesn't give a sh!t about conservative or liberal values, or any values. He doesn't believe in God, which I agree with. He is an incompetent rich kid, who by the luck of the draw was born to a rich daddy who fronted him his first tranche to gamble with, which he promptly lost, then inherited the bulk of the fortune and ran it up to some kind of billionaire status probably. 

 

An opportunist will take any kind of deal as long as he can see an angle to get something out of it. Nothing wrong with a guy like that except at President.

 

Well if he operated like that as president he'd be out in a year or so. I think he wants adulation rather than money because there's always ways to cash in later. I think craving adulation would have him operating as a pragmatic populist. Probably some form of universal health care and an omni-infrastructure package. I think he'd farm out foreign policy. Just speculation as it's all moot really.

[gk10002000]

So?  I too have had some capital losses and was able to bunch them up in the same year.  Not millions but about 35,000.  The IRS let me write those losses off against any capital gains every year, until the loss is zeroed out.  For several years in a row, although for each year I had some capital gains, I was able to legally and simply write them off, and declare a net 3,000 loss.  The losses can be carried forward indefinitely until they run out, for an individual anyway.  Now, for a business or a corporation, I thought there were some rules that if you didn't make money for 3 or 4 years in a row you had to change status?  Maybe that was just an individual LLC.  Of course we don't know what Trump did for taxes for the other years.  But you can't fault the guy for having good accountants.  Maybe fault the IRS for doing lousy audits? 

[smedly]

he worked loopholes to his advantage just like others in his type of position have done, not technically illegal but then you have to question who made the rules and who gains - a corrupt system that imploded on itself in 2008 perpetrated by rich greedy corrupt people - and who bailed them out........................well the janitor

 

Be interesting to see how much of Trumphs wealth is earned or held offshore were it avoids US financial governance and regulation 

[stag4]

The New York Times who broke the story By releasing Trumps tax records paid no tax themselves in 2014 due to carrying over losses from previous years. Talk about hypocrisy! 

 

A new government accountability office report states that 1in5 big companies  pay no income taxes, according to CNN Money.

 

 

[Ulysses G.]

9 minutes ago, stag4 said:

The New York Times who broke the story By releasing Trumps tax records paid no tax themselves in 2014 due to carrying over losses from previous years. Talk about hypocrisy! 

 

 

Typical NYTs.

[alanrchase]

The big banks make some bad decisions and get bailed out by the taxpayer and Trump goes after them.

Trump makes some bad decisions and gets bailed out by the taxpayer and he says it proves he is a brilliant business man.

[LannaGuy]

2 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

He has royally cheated the system and he admits it.  He doesn't deserve to drive on roads or bridges.  He's paid less for taxes than any janitor.  Everything he's achieved has been with other peoples' money and by cheating.

 

what "cheated"?  that's defamation!  he broke the LAW?  prove it, links?  IF the law is stupid (and it IS in many cases) then CHANGE IT

 

what about Apple?  and all the others?  if the law is wrong change it don't sit there and say 'he cheated'

[boomerangutang]

 

38 minutes ago, OMGImInPattaya said:

Donald Trump has paid more money in taxes in one lifetime than you would in a hundred, including property taxes, sales taxes, excise taxes, real estate taxes, city taxes, state taxes, federal taxes, and Social Security taxes; not to mention the countless city, county, and state development fees and licenses paid for his many business enterprises. It seems to me that you're the one who needs to get off the road when his limousine passes you by.

 

Diversion again.  We're talking about income tax.  the Mexican who trims your hedge and pays $1 in income tax -has paid more in 20 yrs than 10 billion dollar Donald.

 

If a vege saleswoman unwittingly gives me change for bt.1000 instead of the Bt.500 I handed her, then i gain an added bt.500.   It's not illegal for me to walk away with that added 500, which is what The Divider would do.  yet, I'm honest, so I immediately tell the vendor her mistade, and we both feel good.  Donald has been gaming the system for decades, lying and cheating every chance he gets.

 

and yes HE HAS ADMITTED IT, during the rep debates, and other venues.  Again, look it up,  and read the Atlantic article:  http://www.theatlantic.com/notes/2016/10/a-better-trump-impersonator-than-alec-baldwin-or-darrell-hammond/502721/

 

....although Trump fans wouldn't admit the sky was blue even if the weatherman was standing next to them pointing at the sky with a color chart, telling them the sky is blue.

 

[Silurian]

2 hours ago, webfact said:

As for questions about his tax history, Trump said he had "brilliantly used those laws ... legally used the tax laws to my benefit and to the benefit of my company, my investors and my employees."

 

The benefit to Trump (himself) is quite obvious. He gets to carry forward that loss for up to 15 years to wipe away any personal income gain. Now since he himself is declaring this loss, what about the company, investors or employees? How do they benefit from Trump not paying any income taxes? They don't! He is simply stating that "since I benefit, the company benefits" which is not true. Trump needs to show how this carry forward loss is a benefit to anyone other than himself. Since he won't release his tax returns, we can only speculate that he didn't use any of this carry forward loss for anything other than personal income tax reductions. Therefore, the company, the investors, the employees and the taxpayers got stuck with the burden of the $918 million dollar loss while Trump smiles and says that he cares for the company.

[Ulysses G.]

7 minutes ago, boomerangutang said:

 

 Donald has been gaming the system for decades, lying and cheating every chance he gets.

 

and yes HE HAS ADMITTED IT, during the rep debates, and other venues.  

 

 

Don't think so. You have not been able to produce even one quote to support this claim and your link does not support it either.

 

Any fact checker would rate this FALSE.

[Silurian]

24 minutes ago, stag4 said:

The New York Times who broke the story By releasing Trumps tax records paid no tax themselves in 2014 due to carrying over losses from previous years. Talk about hypocrisy! 

 

A new government accountability office report states that 1in5 big companies  pay no income taxes, according to CNN Money.

 

 

There is a big difference between business carrying forward losses and someone using a business loss to cover personal income gains (as Trump did).

 

Business carry forward losses so they can keep running and keep people employed (a good thing yeah?). This carry forward loss is to help business through bad times until they can make money again in future years. Think of it as a loan against future gains. This loss helps keeps the lights on, keeps employees paid and keeps production going all of which help the overall economy.

 

Now, using a business loss to cover personal gains as Trump did does none of the above. It only benefits Trump unless Trump releases his tax returns or other financial documents showing how this business loss assisted anyone other than himself. You can expect these documents when the sun expands and swallows the earth in a few billion years.

[boomerangutang]

1 minute ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Don't think so. You have not been able to produce even one quote to support this claim and your link does not support it either.

 

Any fact checker would rate this FALSE.

 

More than once, when a rival mentioned in the Republican debates - something that Trump did illegally (hire undocumented Polish workers for less than min.wage, and not have them wearing hardhats on a construction job, for example), Trump would grin, shrug his shoulders and mutter something like, "so what."    There, you got your quote.   I don't have the transcripts for all the debates and interviews, and even if i did, I'm not going to comb through all of them  to satisfy your doubts.  I know what I heard:   Trump admitting he gamed the system - more than a few times.  

 

He may have also admitted cheating NYC by getting personal rent subsidies - which are only for people making less than $300k/yr.  But he's not going to openly admit all his cheating, is he?  Did you read the Atlantic story? Trump has been proven guilty in court of numerous law breaking episodes.  

 

How many times has HRC been found legally guilty of anything?   Zero.

 

[Dagnabbit]

 
There is a big difference between business carrying forward losses and someone using a business loss to cover personal income gains (as Trump did).
 
Business carry forward losses so they can keep running and keep people employed (a good thing yeah?). This carry forward loss is to help business through bad times until they can make money again in future years. Think of it as a loan against future gains. This loss helps keeps the lights on, keeps employees paid and keeps production going all of which help the overall economy.
 
Now, using a business loss to cover personal gains as Trump did does none of the above. It only benefits Trump unless Trump releases his tax returns or other financial documents showing how this business loss assisted anyone other than himself. You can expect these documents when the sun expands and swallows the earth in a few billion years.

So are you saying Trump did something illegal?

Or that he should follow his conscience instead of the law?

If the latter, perhaps you can give some other examples of companies using conscience driven tax policies.

Or perhaps regale some tales of when you overpaid taxes because it was 'the right thing'.

I wont hold my breath.,,


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Ulysses G.]

9 minutes ago, boomerangutang said:

I know what I heard

 

Still no proof - none what so ever.

 

Aren't you the one who demands that other members withdraw posts that you have decided - without any evidence - are not true? Well, you can not back up a false claim, but you keep doubling down on it. Face it, Trump shrugging his shoulders is not "admitting" anything. 

Edited October 4, 2016 by Ulysses G.

[OMGImInPattaya]

24 minutes ago, boomerangutang said:

 

 

Diversion again.  We're talking about income tax.  the Mexican who trims your hedge and pays $1 in income tax -has paid more in 20 yrs than 10 billion dollar Donald.

 

If a vege saleswoman unwittingly gives me change for bt.1000 instead of the Bt.500 I handed her, then i gain an added bt.500.   It's not illegal for me to walk away with that added 500, which is what The Divider would do.  yet, I'm honest, so I immediately tell the vendor her mistade, and we both feel good.  Donald has been gaming the system for decades, lying and cheating every chance he gets.

 

and yes HE HAS ADMITTED IT, during the rep debates, and other venues.  Again, look it up,  and read the Atlantic article:  http://www.theatlantic.com/notes/2016/10/a-better-trump-impersonator-than-alec-baldwin-or-darrell-hammond/502721/

 

....although Trump fans wouldn't admit the sky was blue even if the weatherman was standing next to them pointing at the sky with a color chart, telling them the sky is blue.

 

No diversion...just facts...deal with it. Do you voluntarily pay more in taxes than required by law...when buying things in Thailand,  do you tell the clerks to round-up the VAT to 10% as your contribution to the commonweal? Didn't think so  

[Pinot]

If the IRS is doing a really thorough audit, and it sounds like Trump's tax returns are byzantine, I'm betting that they uncover a mountain of illegal shit. Trump has been playing a shell game with his money for a couple of decades. Any close scrutiny will uncover criminal activity. The research from Wapo has already shown that he was using his foundation as a slush fund and political action fund.

 

Very few people (including his own supporters) deny that Trump has made his career out of scheming, manipulating, and cheating to the edge of the law. He has never shown one indication that his whole presidential run is not just more of the same. In fact he games the system while running!

 

The con man has conned the Repub party faithful, and now he hopes to con his way into the White House. 

 

The only successes Trump has enjoyed have been when he put his name on things that he no longer owned, or pretended to be successful for a NBC reality show.

 

Donald (sniffles)Trump...Super Genius 

 

 

 

[Pinot]

1 hour ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Let's say you are right. It still makes him an incredibly SUCCESSFULLY con man. Not paying any taxes legally sounds pretty smart to me

 

There you have it folks. The summation of the Republican nominee for POTUS...an incredibly successful con man. Thank you, U! I couldn't have said it better myself. 

 

Just keep doing what you're doing sniffles. 

[Silurian]

9 minutes ago, Dagnabbit said:

So are you saying Trump did something illegal?

 

Not really up to me to say. Let the IRS climb up his behind and find out. Or better yet, let Trump release his tax returns for the last 20 years and let qualified people determine that.

 

Anyway, I was not stating whether what Trump did was legal or not. I was stating that one can't call the NY Times hypocritical when using a business loss to keep the company running while Trump uses a business loss for personal gain. There is a BIG difference there. You might want to re-read what I wrote. It had nothing to do with legality or proper payment of taxes. It had to do with who benefits.

[yardrunner]

3 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

What a load of crap. He lost lots of money many years ago and has been living like a king ever since. That makes him a good businessman compared to most of us. He has paid the taxes that he was required to and nothing more. There is nothing here to see. 

As usual you talk a load of c**p

[Ulysses G.]

2 minutes ago, yardrunner said:

As usual you talk a load of c**p

 

What a convncing argument. 

[NanLaew]

1 hour ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Let's say you are right. It still makes him an incredibly SUCCESSFULLY con man. Not paying any taxes legally sounds pretty smart to me

I see he's conned at least one stellar forum member already... and hundreds of thousands of other average Americans who, before Trump came along, seemed remarkably unable to articulate their concerns.

 

Among all his vacuous claims to making America great again and other, pumped-up, catchy jingosim, has he ever mentioned tax reform?

[OMGImInPattaya]

12 minutes ago, Silurian said:

 

Not really up to me to say. Let the IRS climb up his behind and find out. Or better yet, let Trump release his tax returns for the last 20 years and let qualified people determine that.

 

Anyway, I was not stating whether what Trump did was legal or not. I was stating that one can't call the NY Times hypocritical when using a business loss to keep the company running while Trump uses a business loss for personal gain. There is a BIG difference there. You might want to re-read what I wrote. It had nothing to do with legality or proper payment of taxes. It had to do with who benefits.

All the thousands of employees of Trump's various enterprises. 

[BLUEEYEDTHAI]

May not have, if a bull frog had wings, he may not have bumped his ass

[Ulysses G.]

4 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

 

Among all his vacuous claims to making America great again and other, pumped-up, catchy jingosim, has he ever mentioned tax reform?

 

Yep.

 

https://www.donaldjtrump.com/policies/tax-plan

[Silurian]

9 minutes ago, OMGImInPattaya said:

All the thousands of employees of Trump's various enterprises. 

 

Actually, we don't know if Trump's employees benefited or not. We can only speculate until tax returns and financial documents are produced showing how this carry forward loss was used. Though we can know for sure that it benefited Trump alone in the year he declared the loss against his own personal income. How this business loss was used in future years and who it exactly benefits, we currently do not know.

[Neurath]

1 hour ago, OMGImInPattaya said:

Donald Trump has paid more money in taxes in one lifetime than you would in a hundred, including property taxes, sales taxes, excise taxes, real estate taxes, city taxes, state taxes, federal taxes, and Social Security taxes; not to mention the countless city, county, and state development fees and licenses paid for his many business enterprises. It seems to me that you're the one who needs to get off the road when his limousine passes you by.

Wow, he must have released his tax returns to you. 

[LomSak27]

Hahahaha - Its not like those who have open eyes did not know this about The Donald. A businessman, That is Bill Gates or Warren Buffet, Donold has always been a nothing more than a high stakes con man.

 

Why not a Con Man For President?!  I mean an out and out con man, not the Weapons of Mass Destruction  short con operator, but a guy who can pull the short amnd long con.  YeeHaa!

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

No wonder he did not worry about it. No one - including him - ever took that seriously. I still do not think he got serious about it until he started winning the Republican nomination.

He didn't exactly have to do much to win the nomination. But now that he has, he still hasn't upped his game to indicate that there a single thing more presidential than his rival. Sneeringly commenting, "Because I'm smart" during Clinton's rant about his lack of transparency on federal tax issues really wasn't very statesmanlike. Then again, with Giuliani labeling Trump 'genius' for having enough money to pay legions of accountants to work the system, I would hope that the winning Trump would offer the same team to every American paying over the odds to the IRS.

 

As my Republican-voter-for-life buddy lamented when I asked him about the choices, "It's about choosing the leper with most fingers."

[silent]

2 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

How many of them would pay taxes that they did not have to pay?

 

Anyway, the (FALSE?) claim was that he admitted to cheating the system, but no evidence that it ever happened has been presented. 

 

Change the word "cheating" which is more within his limited vocabulary than "taking advantages provided by the system through advice from accountants" would ever be and that's as close to any admission you ever get from a covert narcissist. He's perfectly happy to take credit for whatever creative accounting other people did for him along with everything else others have done, but now all of a sudden he's given credit for being smart enough to successfully cheat the IRS.and run for President? 

Al Capone eat your heart out.