Thai Pension for Thai wife

[millwall_fan]

I'm hoping someone can advise on this here. I know pensions are not strictly insurance, but this forum seems the best fit.

 

I went to Kasikorn Bank yesterday to inquire about a small Thai pension for my wife. The woman gave us a plausible option, but them told my wife that if we stopped paying the monthly premiums the bank would take all the contributions made so far. This is outrageous and amount to theft in my view. What I want to know is, does anyone have any experience with any institution in Thailand that would permit us to start a small pension and where, if our circumstances change, the money paid already will be actively invested to provide a pension when she is 60- i.e much as a pension operates in UK.

[stevenl]

I'm hoping someone can advise on this here. I know pensions are not strictly insurance, but this forum seems the best fit.
 
I went to Kasikorn Bank yesterday to inquire about a small Thai pension for my wife. The woman gave us a plausible option, but them told my wife that if we stopped paying the monthly premiums the bank would take all the contributions made so far. This is outrageous and amount to theft in my view. What I want to know is, does anyone have any experience with any institution in Thailand that would permit us to start a small pension and where, if our circumstances change, the money paid already will be actively invested to provide a pension when she is 60- i.e much as a pension operates in UK.

I think you have a wrong view of UK private pension insurance. Also there, premiums paid will get you a pension later, provided you keep up with the insurance premiums.

[millwall_fan]

1 minute ago, stevenl said:

I think you have a wrong view of UK private pension insurance. Also there, premiums paid will get you a pension later, provided you keep up with the insurance premiums.

Er? right?

I paid into an AVC in UK. When my circumstances changed, I stopped paying into it. The amount I had built up remains invested and when I choose to take it as a pension, I can. The woman from Kasikorn told my wife that if we agree to pay in to a pension for her for say, 10 years and we stop paying in after 5, the   5 years of contributions we had already made would be forfeit.

 

I can't see how you think that I have go a wrong view of UK private pensions. The two are fundamentally different.

[stevenl]

Er? right?

I paid into an AVC in UK. When my circumstances changed, I stopped paying into it. The amount I had built up remains invested and when I choose to take it as a pension, I can. The woman from Kasikorn told my wife that if we agree to pay in to a pension for her for say, 10 years and we stop paying in after 5, the   5 years of contributions we had already made would be forfeit.

 

I can't see how you think that I have go a wrong view of UK private pensions. The two are fundamentally different.

AVC's are part of workplace pension schemes, not private pension.

PS, I'm talking about pensions, not universal life products.

[millwall_fan]

1 hour ago, stevenl said:

AVC's are part of workplace pension schemes, not private pension.

PS, I'm talking about pensions, not universal life products.

Frankly, old chap, I think you'd better stick to diving. You clearly do not understand what I am looking for. 

[stevenl]

Frankly, old chap, I think you'd better stick to diving. You clearly do not understand what I am looking for. 

I know more about this than you'll ever know.
Good luck, if you don't want to take on honest advice you're going to need it.

[chiang mai]

Well I understand what you're looking for and if you find it, please let me know because I've searched for the same thing without success.

 

What Kasikorn seems to have described to you is an insurance product (I think) although the part about keeping funds paid if you cease to contribute sounds dire and somewhat scam like!

 

I have looked at this issue from the UK perspective with the thought of perhaps using an onshore IFA to set up something similar - the non-availability of IFA's to expats, combined with UK taxation laws and now a currency exchange issue, makes the whole thing a non-starter

[millwall_fan]

Just now, stevenl said:

I know more about this than you'll ever know.
Good luck, if you don't want to take on honest advice you're going to need it.

You are not giving me any advice, you are talking drivel. I want a UK style pension plan for my Thai wife, you have not offered me any useful advice whatsoever. If you can give me useful advice please do so, if not please butt out. 

[chiang mai]

Move on perhaps and see what ideas others might be able to give?

[millwall_fan]

1 minute ago, chiang mai said:

Well I understand what you're looking for and if you find it, please let me know because I've searched for the same thing without success.

 

What Kasikorn seems to have described to you is an insurance product (I think) although the part about keeping funds paid if you cease to contribute sounds dire and somewhat scam like!

 

I have looked at this issue from the UK perspective with the thought of perhaps using an onshore IFA to set up something similar - the non-availability of IFA's to expats, combined with UK taxation laws and now a currency exchange issue, makes the whole thing a non-starter

Thank you, CM. The only trouble with setting up something offshore is that they dont trend to be interested in the small amount I am able to invest: I want to put 2,000 to 3,000 Baht per month into a pension plan for the next 20 years, but who knows, our plans may change and I dont want a bl**dy bank taking stealing my hard earned contributions if we pay in for 15 years and then can't afford the sums involved. 

[chiang mai]

9 minutes ago, millwall_fan said:

Thank you, CM. The only trouble with setting up something offshore is that they dont trend to be interested in the small amount I am able to invest: I want to put 2,000 to 3,000 Baht per month into a pension plan for the next 20 years, but who knows, our plans may change and I dont want a bl**dy bank taking stealing my hard earned contributions if we pay in for 15 years and then can't afford the sums involved. 

 

You know that paying voluntary contributions to the Thai social security system will result in a small pension in later life, at THB 432 a month it's decent value?

 

I've been thinking/looking at this issue for some time but without success, perhaps if poster Fletchsmile sees this he can comment? I'll knock him up, as it were! :)

 

PM sent to FS.

Edited October 9, 2016 by chiang mai

[millwall_fan]

5 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

 

You know that paying voluntary contributions to the Thai social security system will result in a small pension in later life, at THB 432 a month it's decent value?

 

I've been thinking/looking at this issue for some time but without success, perhaps if poster Fletchsmile sees this he can comment? I'll knock him up, as it were! :)

OK this is god info. My wife says that in order to pay the 432 Baht a month you have to be employed, whereas she is a housewife and that principally the  scheme you are talking about is a health scheme with a pension tacked onto the back. Can you comment on that?

 

[stevenl]

Thank you, CM. The only trouble with setting up something offshore is that they dont trend to be interested in the small amount I am able to invest: I want to put 2,000 to 3,000 Baht per month into a pension plan for the next 20 years, but who knows, our plans may change and I dont want a bl**dy bank taking stealing my hard earned contributions if we pay in for 15 years and then can't afford the sums involved. 

Savings account.

What you're talking about is not a private pension but an investment, universal life style, that can amongst others be used for pensions.

Afaik this does not exist in Thailand.

And a bit more friendly would be nice.

[chiang mai]

8 minutes ago, millwall_fan said:

OK this is god info. My wife says that in order to pay the 432 Baht a month you have to be employed, whereas she is a housewife and that principally the  scheme you are talking about is a health scheme with a pension tacked onto the back. Can you comment on that?

 

 

I'm no expert on this subject but Mrs CM tells me there are three levels, each with different levels of return at retirement age:

 

1 - employed full time, employer makes contributions as does employee

2 - unemployed BUT worked previously, essentially a continuous of payment by the ex-employee based on voluntary contributions (this is Mrs CM's case)

3 - unemployed AND never worked - an unknown for us.

 

EDIT TO ADD: In mrs CM's case she is entitled to health care and pension and does not require she is employed currently but had to be employed previously (which sounds non-sensical to me)

Edited October 9, 2016 by chiang mai

[millwall_fan]

8 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Savings account.

What you're talking about is not a private pension but an investment, universal life style, that can amongst others be used for pensions.

Afaik this does not exist in Thailand.

And a bit more friendly would be nice.

I am not 'talking' about anything, I am asking questions, searching for answers. So you are telling me that a UK style pension plan does not exist in Thailand. Thank you for this information. I apologise if you think i was being unfriendly, I simply couldn't see any merit in your answers. As you sound very confident that you know what you are talking about, I will obviously have to search elsewhere. Thank you for your kind advice. 

[millwall_fan]

7 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

 

I'm no expert on this subject but Mrs CM tells me there are three levels, each with different levels of return at retirement age:

 

1 - employed full time, employer makes contributions as does employee

2 - unemployed BUT worked previously, essentially a continuous of payment by the ex-employee based on voluntary contributions (this is Mrs CM's case)

3 - unemployed AND never worked - an unknown for us.

 

I think this is a non starter, but thanks anyway. My wife has never been employed in the conventional sense, so it looks unlikely that she can pay in. Pretty grim situation for any Thai able to plan for the future. Maybe that's why most don't!

[Paul Catton]

Is the following of any value https://www.citibank.co.th/en/investments/investment-retirement-plan.htm#mainWrapper

Surely Mrs millwall_fan is a self employed homemaker without a need for financial record keeping wishing to make a voluntary investment at least once a year.

 

Edited October 12, 2016 by Paul Catton

[Mike45]

I'm hoping someone can advise on this here. I know pensions are not strictly insurance, but this forum seems the best fit.
 
I went to Kasikorn Bank yesterday to inquire about a small Thai pension for my wife. The woman gave us a plausible option, but them told my wife that if we stopped paying the monthly premiums the bank would take all the contributions made so far. This is outrageous and amount to theft in my view. What I want to know is, does anyone have any experience with any institution in Thailand that would permit us to start a small pension and where, if our circumstances change, the money paid already will be actively invested to provide a pension when she is 60- i.e much as a pension operates in UK.

I was talking to a guy that lives in Chiang Mai and he told me he set something like this up for his son with Tokio Marine. I'd try talking to them. Good luck

[millwall_fan]

On 12/10/2016 at 9:42 AM, Paul Catton said:

Is the following of any value https://www.citibank.co.th/en/investments/investment-retirement-plan.htm#mainWrapper

Surely Mrs millwall_fan is a self employed homemaker without a need for financial record keeping wishing to make a voluntary investment at least once a year.

 

Now that looks like the best bet so far. I will look into this. Many thanks