US says Chinese warship seized Navy underwater drone

[rooster59]

US says Chinese warship seized Navy underwater drone 

LOLITA C. BALDOR, Associated Press

 

WASHINGTON (AP) — A Chinese warship seized a U.S. Navy unmanned underwater glider that was collecting unclassified scientific data in the South China Sea, and the U.S. is demanding its return, the Pentagon said Friday.

 

Navy Capt. Jeff Davis, a Pentagon spokesman, said that the U.S. has issued a formal diplomatic complaint over Thursday's incident, but he was not aware of any response yet. He said this may be the first time in recent history that China has taken a U.S. naval vessel. There have been periodic incidents over the years between U.S. and Chinese military ships and aircraft.

 

The Chinese Embassy said it had no immediate comment. But the incident is likely to fray the already tense relations between U.S. and China. Beijing was angered by President-elect Donald Trump's decision to talk by phone with Taiwanese President Tsai Ing-wen on Dec. 2, and by his later comments that he did not feel "bound by a one-China policy" regarding the status of Taiwan, unless the U.S. could gain trade or other benefits from China.

 

There also have been increased tensions over Beijing's ongoing military buildup in the South China Sea. It includes the development and militarization of man-made shoals and islands aimed at extending China's reach into the Pacific region.

 

Davis said the USNS Bowditch, a civilian U.S. Navy oceanographic survey ship operated by the military's Sealift Command, was recovering two of the gliders about 50 nautical miles northwest of Subic Bay near the Philippines when the Chinese ship approached. He said the Dalang Class Chinese ship, which does rescue and recovery missions, sent out a small boat that then took one of the Navy gliders.

 

He said the Chinese ship acknowledged radio messages from the U.S. ship, but did not respond to demands the craft be returned. The U.S. issued a so-called diplomatic demarche, or formal complaint, overnight.

 

The Navy drone is a glider, about 10 feet long and less than two feet wide that can be programmed and moves automatically through the water collecting data on temperature, salinity, and other scientific facts used for sonar operations.

 

"It is ours. It's clearly marked as ours. We would like it back, and we would like this not to happen again," Davis told reporters. He said the drone costs about $150,000 and is largely commercial, off-the-shelf technology.

 

Davis said the USNS Bowditch, which is not a combat ship, was stopped in international waters Thursday afternoon when the Chinese ship approached. The two vessels were within about 500 yards of each other. He said the USNS Bowditch carries some small arms, but no shots were fired.

 

As the Chinese ship left with the drone, the Pentagon said, its only radio response to the U.S. vessel was, "We are returning to normal operations."

 

Bonnie Glaser, senior adviser for Asia at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, said the seizure of the glider occurred inside the exclusive economic zone of the Philippines, not China, and appeared to be a violation of international law.

 

She said China was likely sending a signal to Trump's incoming administration because of his comments about Taiwan. After those comments, Chinese government spokesman An Fengshan said breaching the one-China principle "will seriously affect peace and stability across the Taiwan Strait," and undermine relations between Beijing and Washington.

 

Under the one-China policy, the U.S. has long recognized Beijing as China's government and maintains only unofficial relations with Taiwan, a former Japanese colony which broke from the Chinese mainland in 1949. U.S. law requires the government to ensure that the island has the ability to defend itself and to treat all threats to it as issues of national concern.

 

"My guess is this is not the act of a rogue commander on a Chinese navy ship. We have seen tight control by (Chinese President) Xi Jinping over the military. I'm more inclined to see it as a deliberate act and as a signal," Glaser said. She said China would want Trump "to understand before he is sworn in that the United States can't challenge China's core interests with impunity."

 

There have been periodic such incidents in the area over the years. In March 2001, early in the George W. Bush administration, the same hydrographic survey ship involved in Thursday's incident, USNS Bowditch, was confronted by a Chinese frigate inside China's exclusive economic zone. A few days later, the U.S. filed a diplomatic protest to China, and the Bowditch later returned to the area of the encounter with an armed U.S. escort to continue its mission.

 

In a more serious encounter in April 2001, a mid-air collision between a U.S. Navy surveillance aircraft and a Chinese fighter jet about 70 miles from China's Hainan island caused the death of a Chinese pilot. The U.S. plane made an emergency landing on Hainan and the 24 U.S. crew were detained there for 10 days, until the U.S. sent a letter to China expressing sorrow for the death of the Chinese pilot.

 

In March 2009, less than three months into the presidency of Barack Obama, Chinese ships surrounded and harassed a U.S. Navy mapping ship, the USNS Impeccable, in international waters off China. The Chinese ships at one point came within 25 feet of the American boat and strewed debris in its path. China later said the U.S. ship was operating illegally inside China's exclusive economic zone. The Impeccable returned to the area the next day, escorted by a guided-missile destroyer.

 

 

-- © Associated Press 2016-12-17

[jpinx]

Really?  That's one US captain who needs a sharp rap over the knuckles for putting himself in such a position.

[hEaDy]

[craigt3365]

1 hour ago, jpinx said:

Really?  That's one US captain who needs a sharp rap over the knuckles for putting himself in such a position.

You didn't read the article very closely did you????  Kinda hard to fight a Chinese navy war ship when all you have on board is small arms.  I'd say the captain did all he could.  Which wasn't much.

[jpinx]

21 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

You didn't read the article very closely did you????  Kinda hard to fight a Chinese navy war ship when all you have on board is small arms.  I'd say the captain did all he could.  Which wasn't much.

Positioning -- naval tactics are not your strong point, are they?

[NumbNut]

8 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

You didn't read the article very closely did you????  Kinda hard to fight a Chinese navy war ship when all you have on board is small arms.  I'd say the captain did all he could.  Which wasn't much.

 

Yes, it's a hydrographic survey vessel, not a warship. Read the link below:-

 

Here's What the USNS Bowditch Does

 

The vessel is named after Nathanial Bowditch, a polymath in every sense of the world. Taught himself algebra and calculus at a young age and went on to author 'The American Practical Navigator', the bible of navigation. He's considered the father of modern navigation, absolute genius of a man.

 

Most ships I've been on have a copy of the American Practical Navigator on the bridge somewhere, and while obviously it has had many amendments and additions over time, it is still a work in regular use today. Not too many technical books first authored in the 18th Century can claim that eh!

 

 

 

 

[dunroaming]

It will be interesting to see how Trump handles the situations when China starts "testing" him as hey undoubtedly will.

[NumbNut]

2 minutes ago, jpinx said:

Positioning -- naval tactics are not your strong point, are they?

 

Depending on what the drone was doing it can take hours sometimes to safely recover in-sea equipment once deployed and operational. It's not for us to comment on the actions the Captain and his crew took in regard to the drone in question, so many factors at play here.

 

 

 

 

[craigt3365]

10 minutes ago, jpinx said:

Positioning -- naval tactics are not your strong point, are they?

Definitely not!  But hard to position a big ship like that against a zodiac.  Actually, impossible.

[jpinx]

Just now, craigt3365 said:

Definitely not!  But hard to position a big ship like that against a zodiac.  Actually, impossible.

Difficult - yes, but not impossible.  That's why the training is so lengthy.  Did the US ship not have a zodiac as well -- just for these situations?

 

Anyway -- what did the US expect when operating something that can be construed as "clandestine" so close to something as sensitive as the Chinese-claimed new islands.  There's a lot more to this story than a simple snatching of a drone.  How did the Chinese know where it would surface? 

[NumbNut]

10 minutes ago, jpinx said:

Difficult - yes, but not impossible.  That's why the training is so lengthy.  Did the US ship not have a zodiac as well -- just for these situations?

 

Anyway -- what did the US expect when operating something that can be construed as "clandestine" so close to something as sensitive as the Chinese-claimed new islands.  There's a lot more to this story than a simple snatching of a drone.  How did the Chinese know where it would surface? 

 

Because they were tracking it

[craigt3365]

8 minutes ago, jpinx said:

Difficult - yes, but not impossible.  That's why the training is so lengthy.  Did the US ship not have a zodiac as well -- just for these situations?

 

Anyway -- what did the US expect when operating something that can be construed as "clandestine" so close to something as sensitive as the Chinese-claimed new islands.  There's a lot more to this story than a simple snatching of a drone.  How did the Chinese know where it would surface? 

Having had a dingy on my sailboat in San Diego, I can say it takes a bit of time to deploy the thing.  Though I am an amateur.  And not sure I'd do that when in the presence of a warship! LOL

 

We use to sail past them all the time in the SD harbor.  These are big, bad, mean looking ships.  China's are probably exactly the same.  Hard to go up against something like that with an M16.

 

Don't think for a second that China doesn't do exactly the same thing.  The US has just not snatched one of their drones. 

[jpinx]

1 minute ago, NumbNut said:

 

Because they were tracking it

Fair comment -- it's all very James Bond-ish and we'll never know the full story, but interesting to speculate

[jpinx]

4 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

Having had a dingy on my sailboat in San Diego, I can say it takes a bit of time to deploy the thing.  Though I am an amateur.  And not sure I'd do that when in the presence of a warship! LOL

 

We use to sail past them all the time in the SD harbor.  These are big, bad, mean looking ships.  China's are probably exactly the same.  Hard to go up against something like that with an M16.

 

Don't think for a second that China doesn't do exactly the same thing.  The US has just not snatched one of their drones. 

Maybe they have but not told anyone  -- and the chinese don't want to lose face.... 

[dunroaming]

I think  that espionage is fair enough for the big players.  It has always happened and is pretty much accepted as long as you stick to the rules.  After all some of our best movies are about the subject!

[craigt3365]

5 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

I think  that espionage is fair enough for the big players.  It has always happened and is pretty much accepted as long as you stick to the rules.  After all some of our best movies are about the subject!

Hunt for Red October!  One of my favs! LOL

[IAMHERE]

Wonder what the Chinese story is. Why didn't the drone just go underwater to avoid the Chinese? Was the drone incapacitated and the Chinese just salvaged it, being helpful, planning on giving it back when the sea calms down?

Probably see it again after the Chinese reverse engineer the thing, buy a copy of it on Alibaba after xmas.

[Johpa]

Really?  That's one US captain who needs a sharp rap over the knuckles for putting himself in such a position.

Well that attitude is in the grandest traditions of the US Navy of placing full blame on the captain and absolving all those above him of any failures; e.g. USS Pueblo, USS Stark, USS Cole.


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[jpinx]

1 minute ago, Johpa said:

 

Well that attitude is in the grandest traditions of the US Navy of placing full blame on the captain and absolving all those above him of any failures; e.g. USS Pueblo, USS Stark, USS Cole.


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

Ultimately the buck stops where?  

[sendbaht]

This is all planned out...it is working perfectly. China took it to their top secret headquarters....They have following in the trap....all meant to be...

[Kasset Tak]

This is like when US blame Russia for leaking hacked emails before the election by saying that it must be state sponsored as the hackers used the same type of technology NSA uses against Russia. Its not Russia's fault that NSA don't leak what they find when they are spying on both enemies and friends (which is proved that they do by the documents leaked by Snowden)...

[Usernames]

Wonder if there is an auto destruct built in to go off if it doesn't get countermanded in time?

[craigt3365]

2 minutes ago, Kasset Tak said:

This is like when US blame Russia for leaking hacked emails before the election by saying that it must be state sponsored as the hackers used the same type of technology NSA uses against Russia. Its not Russia's fault that NSA don't leak what they find when they are spying on both enemies and friends (which is proved that they do by the documents leaked by Snowden)...

I think it's great the NSA doesn't leak what they find when spying.  Putting massive amounts of info on the internet with no vetting isn't right. And actually does more harm than good.  Ask the women in Turkey.

 

Worth reading:

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/05/opinion/what-were-missing-while-we-obsess-over-john-podestas-email.html

Quote

WikiLeaks Isn’t Whistleblowing

 

[elgordo38]

3 hours ago, jpinx said:

Really?  That's one US captain who needs a sharp rap over the knuckles for putting himself in such a position.

Do you mean we cannot trust one of the US's largest trading partners who have stolen so many good American jobs and tech IT and in return sold back to the US a bunch of worthless Chinese junk. A country that literally holds you by your financial whatsit. Lordy who can one trust anymore. 

[impulse]

Kind of reminds me of the 3rd grade when we didn't ask Michael Camelli to play football with us.  So he ran onto the field, stole the ball and ran home with it.

 

That was the end of that football game...  And the playground rules forbade any of us to tattle on him.

[elgordo38]

1 hour ago, craigt3365 said:

You didn't read the article very closely did you????  Kinda hard to fight a Chinese navy war ship when all you have on board is small arms.  I'd say the captain did all he could.  Which wasn't much.

You have to know when to hold em and know when to fold em. 

[Usernames]

1 hour ago, dunroaming said:

It will be interesting to see how Trump handles the situations when China starts "testing" him as hey undoubtedly will.

 

China is playing into his hands.  Easy to impose a 35 percent tariff on a nation that engages in piracy on the high seas.

[Johpa]

Ultimately the buck stops where?

I believe President Truman got that one right.


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[dunroaming]

1 hour ago, Usernames said:

 

China is playing into his hands.  Easy to impose a 35 percent tariff on a nation that engages in piracy on the high seas.

 

I love the blind faith.  The fact that you think that China is playing into Trumps hands is priceless.  Let's all hope that you are right because the alternative is somewhat worrying!

[Retiredandhappyhere]

I guess that Trump's threat of a 45% tariff on Chinese goods going into the USA has just been increased to 50%!