Over 680 arrested in U.S. immigration raids; rights groups alarmed

[kevkev1888]

20 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Thailand is off topic.

The USA is a land of immigrants. 

Don't bother baiting me with off topic trash again. 

Don't secure your borders and don't enforce your immigration laws, any country can be a land of immigrants. Don't mean its a good idea. Look at Europe. 

Edited February 14, 2017 by kevkev1888

[Jingthing]

9 minutes ago, kevkev1888 said:

Ah so I thought, you are in the hang them high brigade then, and support breaking up families of otherwise law abiding undocumented persons?

Thailand is right to enforce its immigration rules, but the USA not.

On topic in a discussion about illegal immigrants. But it dose show the hypocrisy, so understand why you do not like it.

Do not put words in my mouth. That is massively obnoxious. I did not comment at all on Thailand immigration policy here and I won't be baited to do so either. It's too bad you feel the need to resort to such sleazy posting tactics. I suggest you grow up and show some respect to other members. Would you like it if others put words in your mouth? 

[Jingthing]

6 minutes ago, surangw said:

680  out of how many?    seems insignificant

Many millions but it's interesting there isn't any interest from the trump regime about WHITE undocumented persons. 

[kevkev1888]

7 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Do not put words in my mouth. That is massively obnoxious. I did not comment at all on Thailand immigration policy here and I won't be baited to do so either. It's too bad you feel the need to resort to such sleazy posting tactics. I suggest you grow up and show some respect to other members. Would you like it if others put words in your mouth? 

OK so in your own words should it be only USA who do not enforce border control and their immigration laws. Or should this apply to any other countries also? If so why?

Edited February 14, 2017 by kevkev1888

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, kevkev1888 said:

OK so in your own words should it be only USA who do not enforce border control and enforce their immigration laws. Or should this apply to any other countries also? If so why?

On this topic, I will only comment on the USA situation. Don't try again. It's obnoxious. How many times do you really need to get the message? 

To add, I never said the USA shouldn't enforce border control so even your obnoxious baited question is based on insinuating garbage. 

Back in the thread, I expressed my POV. More McCain than trump. A realistic compassionate approach that focuses on border control, economic realities (need for guest workers), trying to not break up families, respecting young dreamers, and providing a difficult lengthy path to legalization for worthy undocumented persons. 

Edited February 14, 2017 by Jingthing

[AlexRich]

Is this why Melania hides in Trump Tower?

[tx22cb]

Go to any large city in my home state, there will be numerous workers hanging around the parking lots of Home Depot and the like, waiting to get daily work and hopping into the back of pick-up trucks,

These people are honest hard workers, well appreciated by the temporary employers.  Yard work, manual labourers.  They do the work that white folks don't care for.

Not all are illegal immigrants, but all are immigrants.

[Berkshire]

4 hours ago, smotherb said:

The Obama administration chose not to enforce the law?  Did you read the article, " Obama was criticized for being the "deporter in chief" after he deported over 400,000 people in 2012, more than any president in a single year. "

 

He read it, but didn't understand it.  Trump supporters are dumber than a bag of rocks. 

[ELVIS123456]

58 minutes ago, Scott said:

You asked about the the headline and I gave an explanation.  

 

As far as the general problem of illegals, I don't know too many people that are against the deportation of illegals in the general course of business, but I do know people that are against the targeting of people because of ethnicity.   I also know people who are against the local police being tasked with taking the time to try and ascertain someone's immigration status.  

 

The situation with many of the people who arrived from Mexico is somewhat akin to the situation of Hill Tribe people in Thailand who have never gotten Thai Nationality (but are usually allowed to remain in Thailand).   Many, including the recently deported mother of two in AZ, arrived as a child, she is married to either a citizen or legal resident and her children are US citizens.   Her crime -- using someone elses Social Security Number to work, which is apparently a federal offense. 

 

I also know that the former Maricopa Sheriff, Joe Arpio, is under federal indictment for his round ups, which not only netted illegals working in Arizona, but also legal citizens.   These round ups were often at work places.   Among those detained  were people of Native American ancestry -- they looked like Mexicans and anyone who didn't look like a white American.  

 

I think the problem with much of this is the detaining of people who are doing nothing wrong and going about their ordinary business or working and then being detained.

 

Again, if we compare it to Thailand, there are a lot of foreigners whose status is questionable, but the police do not routinely round up foreigners and start checking for their status.   They could certainly have a great deal of fun raiding schools for teachers who work illegally, but they don't generally do it.

 

So, I don't think most people are concerned about the illegals, but deportation needs to be done with the minimum impact on US citizens and their families.  

 

 

Rubbish - most people ARE concerned - jst read the respondents to this post.  And now the majority of people are speaking out. The left has gone too far in many things and supporting illegals and giving them licences and rights -  it just ridiculous.  But (and here is the big thing) the majority knows that behind all this soft hearted 'love' is the desire to keep them all in USA, and encourage more to come there, because they vote Democrat.

 

[ELVIS123456]

6 minutes ago, tx22cb said:

Go to any large city in my home state, there will be numerous workers hanging around the parking lots of Home Depot and the like, waiting to get daily work and hopping into the back of pick-up trucks,

These people are honest hard workers, well appreciated by the temporary employers.  Yard work, manual labourers.  They do the work that white folks don't care for.

Not all are illegal immigrants, but all are immigrants.

Good point and that is the issue. Yes - they should allowed to immigrate legally. But no - they should not be allowed to stay if they are illegal.  Black and white - end of story - line drawn. 

[anotheruser]

31 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Many millions but it's interesting there isn't any interest from the trump regime about WHITE undocumented persons. 

lol Many hispanics are white. 

[Scott]

4 minutes ago, ELVIS123456 said:

Rubbish - most people ARE concerned - jst read the respondents to this post.  And now the majority of people are speaking out. The left has gone too far in many things and supporting illegals and giving them licences and rights -  it just ridiculous.  But (and here is the big thing) the majority knows that behind all this soft hearted 'love' is the desire to keep them all in USA, and encourage more to come there, because they vote Democrat.

 

I did NOT say people are not concerned.   I clearly said that I didn't believe that most people are against the deportation of illegals.  

 

[rijb]

33 minutes ago, Berkshire said:

 

He read it, but didn't understand it.  Trump supporters are dumber than a bag of rocks. 

I'll bet you didn't understand it either.  The reference to the article wasn't posted.

 

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2017/02/14/is-trump-immigration-crackdown-worse-than-deporter-in-chief-obama.html

 

But by the final years of his presidency, the Obama administration had changed its enforcement priorities, and insisted it was only targeting undocumented immigrants convicted of serious crimes (in the administration’s view, getting a DUI or using a fake Social Security number counted as serious).

[alex8912]

1 hour ago, Scott said:

You asked about the the headline and I gave an explanation.  

 

As far as the general problem of illegals, I don't know too many people that are against the deportation of illegals in the general course of business, but I do know people that are against the targeting of people because of ethnicity.   I also know people who are against the local police being tasked with taking the time to try and ascertain someone's immigration status.  

 

The situation with many of the people who arrived from Mexico is somewhat akin to the situation of Hill Tribe people in Thailand who have never gotten Thai Nationality (but are usually allowed to remain in Thailand).   Many, including the recently deported mother of two in AZ, arrived as a child, she is married to either a citizen or legal resident and her children are US citizens.   Her crime -- using someone elses Social Security Number to work, which is apparently a federal offense. 

 

I also know that the former Maricopa Sheriff, Joe Arpio, is under federal indictment for his round ups, which not only netted illegals working in Arizona, but also legal citizens.   These round ups were often at work places.   Among those detained  were people of Native American ancestry -- they looked like Mexicans and anyone who didn't look like a white American.  

 

I think the problem with much of this is the detaining of people who are doing nothing wrong and going about their ordinary business or working and then being detained.

 

Again, if we compare it to Thailand, there are a lot of foreigners whose status is questionable, but the police do not routinely round up foreigners and start checking for their status.   They could certainly have a great deal of fun raiding schools for teachers who work illegally, but they don't generally do it.

 

So, I don't think most people are concerned about the illegals, but deportation needs to be done with the minimum impact on US citizens and their families.  

 

 

You can't put under a microscope every single situation. Yes. Using a fake ss number is ( not apparently) a crime. It is a crime. I know you know this!  She should get the hell out of MY country. I hated that " story"  

a white guy born in the USA, whose parents were born in the USA , whose parents were BORN in the USA CAN't use a fake ss number. He would go to jail and/ or pay a fine and have a criminal record etc. She has children ( big deal!) Why would you support her situation? 

I saw her story as a way to get in CNN as I posted once before. The Mexicans know they are breaking the law. Do the hill tribe people really know. Sorry Scott this time your analogy is apples and soi dogs. 

[tropo]

1 hour ago, surangw said:

680  out of how many?    seems insignificant

To deport 3 million in 4 years, they'd need to average over 2000 per day. They better get cracking.

 

Even if he can't reach his goal, at least he'll slow it down a lot and possibly make the next president's job easier. If he can equal Obama's performance of 400k in 2012, he'll get close to his promised goal.

[anotheruser]

29 minutes ago, alex8912 said:

You can't put under a microscope every single situation. Yes. Using a fake ss number is ( not apparently) a crime. It is a crime. I know you know this!  She should get the hell out of MY country. I hated that " story"  

a white guy born in the USA, whose parents were born in the USA , whose parents were BORN in the USA CAN't use a fake ss number. He would go to jail and/ or pay a fine and have a criminal record etc. She has children ( big deal!) Why would you support her situation? 

I saw her story as a way to get in CNN as I posted once before. The Mexicans know they are breaking the law. Do the hill tribe people really know. Sorry Scott this time your analogy is apples and soi dogs. 

 

Speaking of CNN anybody watch the story of the African dummies sneaking into Canada because of the Trump travel ban. A couple were from Ghana and lost all of their fingers except one still had a thumb. Now they have entered Canada illegally and the mayor of the town says they are criminals when they cross the border. 

 

Here is news Ghana was never on the travel ban and there was never a ban on immigrants just a travel ban from 7 countries.

 

The other one's were from Somalia and although there was a travel ban they were already in the USa and decided to run again to Canada illegally. When asked if Trump's order caused this all 4 raised their hands.

 

I am from Minnesota and have seen what the Somalis have contributed to my hometown. It is a complete disgrace. So good luck to those people who could have just over stayed as they were doing and are now detained in Canada. Especially the guys from Ghana who were not aware of what frost bite is and still face deportation from Canada.

 

Canada isn't less strict than America and I am sure those guys will only be an asset to the Canadian economy with only one thumb between them. 

 

Talk about stupid. If those type of people in the USA cross to Canada that is a good result.

 

Can you imagine with no new wall you get criminals to run to the neighboring country and turn themselves in? The one's that froze their fingers should have asked a local from northern Minnesota to take them by snowmobile.

 

Once that local understood they are going to the border to be detained I am sure they would have obliged.

 

 

Edited February 14, 2017 by anotheruser

[surangw]

1 hour ago, ELVIS123456 said:

Good point and that is the issue. Yes - they should allowed to immigrate legally. But no - they should not be allowed to stay if they are illegal.  Black and white - end of story - line drawn. 

and no tax money paid on  day workers

[surangw]

its a pity the real   cause of this can't addressed,     the corrupt and  war torn places they come from.

[surangw]

9 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

So the people likely to be imprisoned and/or deported are either people who illegally entered the US, thereby breaking laws and becoming criminals; or people who entered legally but subsequently have broken laws and maybe be arrested and have their permission to enter/stay revoked.

 

So what are the human rights groups whining about? Are they saying that just because the Obama administrations chose not to enforce the law it's now unfair to do so? How daft must these people think the general public are to try such blatant nonsense? Of course all the left liberal PC types will lap it up.

could be the human rights   people  know they will get more attention "whining"  about what goes on in America, since the countries the immigrants come from don't give a crap.

[surangw]

4 hours ago, buick said:

i'm an american and not a trump supporter (nor a basher).  the illegal immigrant situation in the USA is totally out of control.  there are still a a couple million that need to go.  i don't care if they don't have a criminal record.  they are in the country illegally.  if i am in the USA and possess heroin, it is illegal, i go to jail.   the key word is ILLEGAL.  if that is your situation then you pay the price (so to speak).  if the ultra liberals want to help these people out, maybe they should send money to them in their home country after they get deported.  i'm sure they would appreciate it.  and it would be a great help to them.

maybe if they were forced to stay in their shit hole countries they might really get fed up with the corruption and effect a change for the better. ( we can only hope)

[anotheruser]

For anybody that argues America was a nation of immigrants, that's fine but back in the day America needed immigrants. We also gave you 40 acres for free if you were willing to go bust sod in Nebraska and help develop the country. 

 

The country as it stands now was built on the back of the original immigrants. I can pretty much guarantee you that if it didn't work out when you pushed westward that was on you and nobody intervened.

 

When you were processed at Staten island you didn't open your mouth about racism even though back then we were much worse than we are now. Everybody did what they could to develop the country. for this reason many Hispanic Americans resent the latest wave of self entitled, ignorant, peasants that try to plague our shores. 

 

The explanation for this is they have vested interests, speak the <deleted>%%%ing language and have helped built the country.

 

A good example of a reason not to welcome outsiders is the Native Americans. They welcomed us in and we did not assimilate. In fact we did our best to kill every last one of them. Thanksgiving.

 

There was a time America needed people to go to places like the Black Hills to divide and conquer for Uncle Sam but those days are long gone. Immigrants used to help cement new land and territory for the 

USA and not threaten to take away from it.

 

For the native Americans it must be all the same to them. Although they only were here first. They came across a land bridge and murdered anybody in their way as well.

 

So to simply say America has always been a nation of immigrants is not accurate or genuine. It was when we needed the labor and the energy. It didn't matter what color you were back then because the value of human life was cheap regardless. Ask the Irish.

 

The original tribes are in the way of the Keystone pipeline and they are going to find they are not welcome very much longer.

Edited February 14, 2017 by anotheruser

[hawker9000]

12 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

So the people likely to be imprisoned and/or deported are either people who illegally entered the US, thereby breaking laws and becoming criminals; or people who entered legally but subsequently have broken laws and maybe be arrested and have their permission to enter/stay revoked.

 

So what are the human rights groups whining about? Are they saying that just because the Obama administrations chose not to enforce the law it's now unfair to do so? How daft must these people think the general public are to try such blatant nonsense? Of course all the left liberal PC types will lap it up.

"How daft must these people think the general public are..."

 

You'd be surprised; wingnuts can be extremely imaginative (polite euphemism for delusional).  Over 60M were daft enough to vote for the Obama follow-on candidate last November.  It's still all about PCness and selective enforcement with them.  "Law of the land": what's that? 

 

I've noticed that most of the current outrage over immigration enforcement is now from the homegrown backbiters, criminal sympathizers, and of course illegals themselves (of which there's certainly no shortage - up to 20M).  Europeans seem to have evolved to a slightly more critical, more pro-enforcement take on illegal immigration - gee, I wonder why - and even the ever-obsessed Johnny-one-note America-haters usually find something else to whine about these days.

[manarak]

9 hours ago, Jingthing said:

The number of undocumented people living in the USA is MUCH HIGHER than a few million. Something ELEVEN MILLION. I don't think very many people are against deporting violent criminals that are undocumented. But reasonable people like McCain and democrats well understand it's just not practical or desirable to deport so many millions of people. 

 

There is fear and panic in the streets about trump's intentions based on his toxic campaign rhetoric. Not so much about what he's already done (except for the unconstitutional Muslim ban which is separate) but what he appears to be planning to do. In other words, if he's really serious about deporting 11 million ... and the communities effected start to feel it ... don't think it will be a peaceful situation. 

 

What's the civilized solution? Duh. Not rocket science. Long and difficult paths for undocumented persons to become legalized. Not favoring them over people applying from outside, but acknowledging the practical reality of the situation that exists. 

Well, arresting those with criminal records and sending them back is certainly a good thing!

[buick]

On 2/14/2017 at 5:51 AM, Jingthing said:

Local law enforcement people have enough work to do without working for ICE. 

close the post office and use those salaries to pay for more police.  let the post office guys get jobs at fed ex, UPS, amazon, etc... 

[anotheruser]

Just now, buick said:

close the post office and use those salaries to pay for more police.  let the post office guys get jobs at fed ex, UPS, amazon, etc... 

 

Local law enforcement work with the federal government and all law enforcement agencies to enforce the law. It is disingenuous of anybody to suggest otherwise. Imagine the FBI, state troopers, county sheriff, municipal police etc. didn't coordinate with each other.

 

 The local law enforcement officers main job is to enforce that of their jurisdiction but also the laws of the United States. Imagine somebody was smuggling drugs into the USA and the local cops didn't do anything because that's the coast guards job. These agencies are supposed to work in conjunction with one another.

 

To say anything otherwise is a back handed way to promote somebodies specific agenda. Local law enforcement can and will take down criminals wanted for federal offenses all the time.

[buick]

On 2/14/2017 at 9:38 AM, surangw said:

maybe if they were forced to stay in their shit hole countries they might really get fed up with the corruption and effect a change for the better. ( we can only hope)

 

well said.  i think the standard of living in mexico has increased over the years (but it started real low....).  unfortunately, places like honduras have gone the other way !!!  guatemala, el salvador, etc.. probably going backwards also.

 

i'd be amenable to a deal where half the illegals are given amnesty and can stay in return for the other half deported. 

[ddavidovsky]

On 14/02/2017 at 6:27 PM, LazySlipper said:

I REAALLLLLYYYY don't get it. Do any of those bleeding hearts back in the US actually know what goes on in the rest of the world???

 

Really, does anyone shed a tear or even bother if one of us foreigners gets deported from Thailand for being here illegally?

 

Do they know that we cannot own land even after working here legally for almost 14 years?

 

I wish they would crackdown back in Canada and get rid of the illegals there who are siphoning off our welfare system there... while me, a 6th generation Canadian, can't even get a dime if I need it.

 

Screw that crap!

 

It's the people who have got more than they need who are giving it all away. They're alright Jack, and the largesse makes them feel good. They are blithely unaware of the fact that some people don't have enough and are being out-competed by brazen arrivistes.

Edited February 16, 2017 by ddavidovsky

[Credo]

5 minutes ago, anotheruser said:

 

Local law enforcement work with the federal government and all law enforcement agencies to enforce the law. It is disingenuous of anybody to suggest otherwise. Imagine the FBI, state troopers, county sheriff, municipal police etc. didn't coordinate with each other.

 

 The local law enforcement officers main job is to enforce that of their jurisdiction but also the laws of the United States. Imagine somebody was smuggling drugs into the USA and the local cops didn't do anything because that's the coast guards job. These agencies are supposed to work in conjunction with one another.

 

To say anything otherwise is a back handed way to promote somebodies specific agenda. Local law enforcement can and will take down criminals wanted for federal offenses all the time.

There is a big difference between working with and working for an agency.   The FBI don't pick up people speeding on the local roads.   

 

There are issues of jurisdiction, and those are serious issues.   The local police are pursuing all kinds of criminals and do not have the time to question everybody about their legal status.    Do you think if you witness an accident or a crime, then the witness should be checked for legal status?    How much cooperation do you think you will get from the community at large if those reporting/witnessing a crime have to be 'vetted'?  

 

 

[anotheruser]

11 minutes ago, Credo said:

There is a big difference between working with and working for an agency.   The FBI don't pick up people speeding on the local roads.   

 

There are issues of jurisdiction, and those are serious issues.   The local police are pursuing all kinds of criminals and do not have the time to question everybody about their legal status.    Do you think if you witness an accident or a crime, then the witness should be checked for legal status?    How much cooperation do you think you will get from the community at large if those reporting/witnessing a crime have to be 'vetted'?  

 

 

 

Misunderstood the question so edited post.

Edited February 16, 2017 by anotheruser

[anotheruser]

A witness is no good anyway if they are unable or unwilling to appear in court later.