Economic recession in Pattaya?

[Daryle]

yes, but it was quite some years ago

I think I remember that time, Adam was a boy and he and his snake were looking for a threesome.

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[Chivas]

I certainly am not the oldest continued visitor to Pattaya but at a quarter century plus fairly well versed and have to say the 6 weeks from January 1st was the quietest I have ever seen it period.

Dying a death seriously. I dont care what visitor numbers are claimed they are not in Pattaya......On 5th February I sat in the new Champagne Coyote bar in Soi LK Metro.....I was the only customer between 8.10pm till 9pm. Staggering

[newnative]

24 minutes ago, Chivas said:

I certainly am not the oldest continued visitor to Pattaya but at a quarter century plus fairly well versed and have to say the 6 weeks from January 1st was the quietest I have ever seen it period.

Dying a death seriously. I dont care what visitor numbers are claimed they are not in Pattaya......On 5th February I sat in the new Champagne Coyote bar in Soi LK Metro.....I was the only customer between 8.10pm till 9pm. Staggering

Oh, boy.  DYING A DEATH SERIOUSLY.  I think we've found 2017's addition to the 'Pattaya is Dying' thread. 

[AbeSurd]

5 hours ago, Daryle said:

I think I remember that time, Adam was a boy and he and his snake were looking for a threesome.
 

Yes, the really good old days. I too almost remember them well. I think my grandfather had some photos.

[Chivas]

6 hours ago, newnative said:

Oh, boy.  DYING A DEATH SERIOUSLY.  I think we've found 2017's addition to the 'Pattaya is Dying' thread. 

What.....???

Am just calling it as it was, simple as. Why the sarcasm

[JB300]

In my case yes. I'd buy a house or apartment. Okay local council taxes and charges would be higher than what I pay in Thailand ( next to zero) then there would be water, electricity, insurance etc.
For me the real saving would be on clothes, foodstuffs, alcohol and cars. As in Thailand they are my largest costs.  The only downside for me would be paying a lot of tax..
Swings and roundabouts really..

I'm confused, unless you plan on working there or are from a country that doesn't have a DTA with where your income is coming from, what extra income tax would you need to pay?

[pegman]

19 hours ago, Banana7 said:

There are lots of places in the world that have warm winter weather, good food, low cost of living. At least 50% of the guys that retire/stay long time in Thailand, not just Pattaya, are here for the lovely Thai ladies, many of who prefer western men.

 

 

Sounds like a good enough reason to me.

[1FinickyOne]

Appearance of dying?

 

As there is continued building for growth, it takes time for new places to sell out and fill up, and maybe they are overbuilt by a decade... and so maybe it gives an appearance of dying while tourist figures are still rising... I was first there in 1974 - it was a few bungalows down a dusty main street... no more. 

[newnative]

7 hours ago, Chivas said:

What.....???

Am just calling it as it was, simple as. Why the sarcasm

I was simply pointing out that, yet again, we have a post proclaiming that Pattaya is dying; in your case 'calling it as it was' based on your one experience of one hour at one new bar.  Hmm. New bar. Maybe they haven't built up a regular clientele yet?

[KittenKong]

1 hour ago, JB300 said:

I'm confused, unless you plan on working there or are from a country that doesn't have a DTA with where your income is coming from, what extra income tax would you need to pay?

 

I cant speak for anyone else but by living in Thailand I pay no income tax anywhere. If I moved to Spain (though possibly not Portugal, at least for 10 years) I would have to pay some. So all that's "extra". The same would apply if I moved to the USA or most other countries. So that's a big incentive not to move.

[Naam]

40 minutes ago, KittenKong said:

 

I cant speak for anyone else but by living in Thailand I pay no income tax anywhere. If I moved to Spain (though possibly not Portugal, at least for 10 years) I would have to pay some. So all that's "extra". The same would apply if I moved to the USA or most other countries. So that's a big incentive not to move.

bingo!

[Pdaz]

2 hours ago, JB300 said:

 

I'm confused, unless you plan on working there or are from a country that doesn't have a DTA with where your income is coming from, what extra income tax would you need to pay?
 

 

I'm a self employed Brit who works all over the World. My income is paid from a raft of different companies/countries. If I was permanent resident in an EU country I'd have to pay tax either there or in the UK. Unless of course I was able to get a rebate based on the seaman's tax rules. Unfortunately that has become more difficult over the years as more conditions have been applied. Once retired I expect I would still be liable for income tax in Europe/UK if resident there as my income from investments would exceed the non taxable allowance.. As that thresh hold is currently only around GBP 12k a year I'm pretty sure I would end up paying tax to someone.

Hence while still working I'm better off in Thailand. Once retired and earning less I may need to rethink. Maybe paying some tax maybe offset by better healthcare/emergency services and cheaper wine, cheese, cars etc ? Or maybe staying in Thailand would be better due to lower Monthly costs and a local income stream.. Who knows ? I'm still trying to figure it out but luckily still have a few years work left in me :)

[JB300]

I'm a self employed Brit who works all over the World. My income is paid from a raft of different companies/countries. If I was permanent resident in an EU country I'd have to pay tax either there or in the UK. Unless of course I was able to get a rebate based on the seaman's tax rules. Unfortunately that has become more difficult over the years as more conditions have been applied. Once retired I expect I would still be liable for income tax in Europe/UK if resident there as my income from investments would exceed the non taxable allowance.. As that thresh hold is currently only around GBP 12k a year I'm pretty sure I would end up paying tax to someone.

Hence while still working I'm better off in Thailand. Once retired and earning less I may need to rethink. Maybe paying some tax maybe offset by better healthcare/emergency services and cheaper wine, cheese, cars etc ? Or maybe staying in Thailand would be better due to lower Monthly costs and a local income stream.. Who knows ? I'm still trying to figure it out but luckily still have a few years work left in me :)

Cool [emoji1303]

Was thinking more about income from Pensions & Investments etc... but can see how it could work if you're a true Nomad & don't stay anywhere Long enough to be considered a Tax Resident [emoji1303]

[Chivas]

6 hours ago, newnative said:

I was simply pointing out that, yet again, we have a post proclaiming that Pattaya is dying; in your case 'calling it as it was' based on your one experience of one hour at one new bar.  Hmm. New bar. Maybe they haven't built up a regular clientele yet?

 

What on earth are you banging on about.....??  I gave one instance within a 6 week stint. I could have listed 101 more. Keep burying your head sunshine. I repeat for that period of time it was the quitest I have ever seen by a country mile at the relevant time of year.

Same night out interest I went Club Mistys Babydolls and Dollhouse all nigh on empty. Dollhouse had 5-6 customers others 1-2

The only bars that were busy every time were the likes of Billabong 1 and 2 probably emphasing that price is all important these days

Edited February 21, 2017 by Chivas

[newnative]

1 hour ago, Chivas said:

 

What on earth are you banging on about.....??  I gave one instance within a 6 week stint. I could have listed 101 more. Keep burying your head sunshine. I repeat for that period of time it was the quitest I have ever seen by a country mile at the relevant time of year.

Same night out interest I went Club Mistys Babydolls and Dollhouse all nigh on empty. Dollhouse had 5-6 customers others 1-2

The only bars that were busy every time were the likes of Billabong 1 and 2 probably emphasing that price is all important these days

With all due respect, all your examples are bars.  Your observation would only be valid if Pattaya was a tiny town with just the bars you mentioned and nothing else.  Pattaya's demographic is changing.  People, especially, apparently, old-timers, don't want to believe that Pattaya is attracting more families and more young couples and more young singles but it definitely is.  There are more Asian honeymooners.  More Asian young people coming in groups.  More Middle Easterners and Indians.  More Russian young couples, often with children.  More Thais, as well.  Plus other groups like older couples.  All these groups don't necessarily hang out at the same bars as you do--or even go to bars.   All the bars you mentioned could go out of business and it would still not be an indication that Pattaya was dying--because these days there's a lot more to Pattaya than just the bars.  I'm not saying bars and clubs are not important, because they are.  But, as with everything, supply and demand will determine how many of what kind of bar is needed for the population demographic.  Perhaps a British sports bar closes...and, across town a Korean karaoke bar opens.  Meanwhile, Pattaya survives--and thrives.

[champers]

Well said, sir. Are you familiar with Thai copyright laws? If not, I might think about copy and pasting for repeated future reference. That's if JSixpack doesn't beat me to it. ?

[mauroest]

Go to Italy and try to live. 

Electricity bills Kw consumed+100% more of tax,

water bills fix tax 64 Euro/six months+mc consumed, gas bill mc consumed+120% more of tax if you have your own central heating; condominium 200Euro/month ++;

garbage for 100 sqm apartment 350 Euro/year and more depend which city; home tax :)) ;

transport 1,5 Euro 60 minutes of public bus if they are not on strike;

health assistance you could wait 13 months for a mammography in public hospital or pay a lot for private visit...and so on.

Do you want to know more?

 

That's why my wife and I, spend our winters in Thailand, like many Russian couples that do not care about bars and gogo girls

Edited February 21, 2017 by mauroest
change verb

[Chivas]

1 hour ago, newnative said:

With all due respect, all your examples are bars.  Your observation would only be valid if Pattaya was a tiny town with just the bars you mentioned and nothing else.  Pattaya's demographic is changing.  People, especially, apparently, old-timers, don't want to believe that Pattaya is attracting more families and more young couples and more young singles but it definitely is.  There are more Asian honeymooners.  More Asian young people coming in groups.  More Middle Easterners and Indians.  More Russian young couples, often with children.  More Thais, as well.  Plus other groups like older couples.  All these groups don't necessarily hang out at the same bars as you do--or even go to bars.   All the bars you mentioned could go out of business and it would still not be an indication that Pattaya was dying--because these days there's a lot more to Pattaya than just the bars.  I'm not saying bars and clubs are not important, because they are.  But, as with everything, supply and demand will determine how many of what kind of bar is needed for the population demographic.  Perhaps a British sports bar closes...and, across town a Korean karaoke bar opens.  Meanwhile, Pattaya survives--and thrives.

Being polite but absolute poppycock......every one of the groups you mention spend close to jack shight. In my hotel last month you had 6 to a room for Christ sake. The Chinese dont spend. The Indians dont spend and the Arabs hang out in their own bars.

Go 808 any night you want and just watch the lot of then standing at the back drinkless. Arabs Chinese Africans Indians they're in the main completely potless......if this Thai Minister gets her own way re Bars and Clubs (she wont !) the whole scene comes tumbling down make no mistake

Edited February 21, 2017 by Chivas

[Viggo McQuaid]

Pattaya needs to reinvent themselves! Is not sustainable selling the same t shirts and dvds for 15 consecutive years. It your not in town for sex it's very little stimuli to be had. Can't sit at Cage Des Amis 7 days a week. The tourists grew tired and found other locations. Don't get me wrong it's a great town but suffers over the same fate as Phuket,

Edited February 21, 2017 by Rimmer
slur removed

[JSixpack]

47 minutes ago, Viggo McQuaid said:

Pattaya needs to reinvent themselves! Is not sustainable selling the same t shirts and dvds for 15 consecutive years. It your not in town for sex

 

Rip Van Winkle awakens. Yeah, if only Pattaya had something like this:

 

 

JKC

 

If it did, then would something besides T-shirts and DVDs be sold therein? Or at least T-shirts other than that "Bad Guys To Pattaya?" I agree: I'm tired of wearing that around all the time.

 

Quote

The tourists grew tired and found other locations.

 

Yeah, whole town's been deserted for years. But it's so nice to zip around all the time among the bleached ruins with never a need to search for a parking space.

 

I sense our TVF doomsters just aren't gettin' enuff red meat in this thread. May have to help 'em out soon.

[JSixpack]

2 hours ago, Chivas said:

Being polite but absolute poppycock......

 

No, spot on actually.

 

Quote

every one of the groups you mention spend close to jack shight. In my hotel last month you had 6 to a room for Christ sake. The Chinese dont spend. The Indians dont spend and the Arabs hang out in their own bars.

 

As newnative said, your examples relate only to cheap bars, specifically YOUR bars, as Arabs spending in their own bars doesn't count. (I love this forum!) Other sectors now account for vast swathes of the Pattaya economy and obviously you have no idea about the numbers, simply mindlessly parroting the TVF myth that "Chinese don't spend" [in your bars]. Actually they spend quite a bit, as I repeated for another of our economists here: 

 

Edited February 21, 2017 by JSixpack

[yaagjon]

It's easy picking the posters that are flogging real estate.

 

For those of us who don't have a vested interest in talking up Pattaya and Thailand, it has without doubt been the quietest high season ever.

 

One of the reasons the Thai government waived their visa fees.

[Naam]

6 minutes ago, yaagjon said:

it has without doubt been the quietest high season ever.

i wish i was as quiet as in november 1973 when i first visited Pattaya.

[bkk6060]

There may be a property recession here but not a "deep" recession otherwise like the OP suggests.

The entertainment venues look pretty crowded to me.

As far as the bars that is the Thai's fault.  Why go out an drink at these places when many seem to give you high prices, dirty looks and unfriendly interaction?  A big difference between the Philippines and here from my observation is the service workers seem much friendlier in the Phils, or in most other Asian countries for that matter. 

[morrobay]

20 hours ago, yaagjon said:

It's easy picking the posters that are flogging real estate.

 

For those of us who don't have a vested interest in talking up Pattaya and Thailand, it has without doubt been the quietest high season ever.

 

One of the reasons the Thai government waived their visa fees.

By what metrics is this quietest high season? 

[Naam]

51 minutes ago, morrobay said:

By what metrics is this quietest high season? 

compared to 1973 it's peak time.

[Naam]

51 minutes ago, anotheruser said:

A thread arguing about where Arabs drink... makes sense when you think about it.

and a thread in which hotel six Chinese share a room (most probably a five-star establishment) 

[craigt3365]

I've been doing my own "research" the past year or so.  Basically seeing how many shop houses are closed.  It seems that a lot are closed even in the high traffic areas.  The tourist areas seem to be OK and generally filled with people.  But outside that, quiet. 

 

I had some friends who had a 1 year contract to perform at a nice restaurant here.  that ended in December.  Owner, from Bangkok, says not enough business now to support them.  I don't think all these police checkpoints help much either!

[pegman]

2 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

I've been doing my own "research" the past year or so.  Basically seeing how many shop houses are closed.  It seems that a lot are closed even in the high traffic areas.  The tourist areas seem to be OK and generally filled with people.  But outside that, quiet. 

 

I had some friends who had a 1 year contract to perform at a nice restaurant here.  that ended in December.  Owner, from Bangkok, says not enough business now to support them.  I don't think all these police checkpoints help much either!

Talk to Thai business people. They will tell you that everything is down everywhere since the coup. The country is being destroyed day by day.

[craigt3365]

1 minute ago, pegman said:

Talk to Thai business people. They will tell you that everything is down everywhere since the coup. The country is being destroyed day by day.

I think the coup is definitely an issue, but the collapse of the global economy is another.  Along with the strong Baht and weak currencies back home.  Ugh....