Spreaders of Conspiracy Theories: Unmasking the Motivations Behind the Lies

[AGLV0121]

11 hours ago, redwinecheese said:

At least she's got guts

 

Repeating the  same old belief

[AGLV0121]

8 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

Actually, there is an overwhelming consensus among Israelis in support of expanding settlements in the West Bank.

 

I really wish you find your password.

http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.737973

Edited March 18, 2017 by AGLV0121

[Dumbastheycome]

3 minutes ago, AGLV0121 said:

 

Oh yes. Go see by yourself or read this:

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/jake-beaumont/israel-not-apartheid-state_b_9128056.html

The  link  you  offer suggests the idea  Israel is benificient to all inhabitants. But  what  concerns  many is the illegal  acquisition  of  territory that  is not of  genuine  right. And in that  acquisition by use  of military  action defend  it  by claiming defence against  offense ! The  situation  demonstrates another absurdity  in  UN  resolutions .

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, Dumbastheycome said:

It is  no  gobbledygook. Probably  why  even a  ten foot  bagel would  never  beat  down the  stench of sweaty palms  within the  UN !

Yeah. Sure thing. Whatever. 

[dexterm]

51 minutes ago, AGLV0121 said:

 

Oh yes. Go see by yourself or read this:

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/jake-beaumont/israel-not-apartheid-state_b_9128056.html

Every single one of Jake Beaumont's so called 10 Reasons Israel is not an apartheid state is spurious from #1 onwards

#1  All people living in Israel have full equal rights.

 

Not true. I suggest you view www.adalah.org/en/content/view/7771

 

"In March 2013, Adalah launched the Discriminatory Laws Database, an online resource that collects more than 50 Israeli laws enacted since 1948 that directly or indirectly discriminate against Palestinian citizens of Israel in all areas of life, including their rights to political participation, access to land, education, state budget resources, and criminal procedures."

 

Jake Beaumont in the Huff Post simply cherry picks a few token examples in order to sweep under the carpet the main instrument of apartheid as mentioned in the OP report...demographic engineering..attempts in various ways to restrict Palestinian population growth so that Israel remains a Jewish majority state.

Edited March 18, 2017 by dexterm

[Thorgal]

Another stooge as usual

New UN chief Guterres 'a friend of Israel' :

Quote from link :

"His stances reflect those of the world. The world's view of Israel is that it hopes to see a different Israel."

http://m.jpost.com/#/app/article/469589


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[dexterm]

3 minutes ago, Thorgal said:

 

New UN chief Guterres 'a friend of Israel' :

Quote from link :

"His stances reflect those of the world. The world's view of Israel is that it hopes to see a different Israel."

http://m.jpost.com/#/app/article/469589


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Explains his motivation on the censorship of the OP report.

 

"The world's view of Israel is that it hopes to see a different Israel."

..Amen to that!

 

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, spiderorchid said:

Israel and Judea ceased as a governing body long before JC lived in the Roman controlled country of Sumeria. Israel (Judea) were conquered by the Persians and never again had a parliament until the US and Britain stole land from Palestine to create the new country of Israel. The fact that the State of Israel now exists cannot be disputed, but you cannot blame the Palestinians for being a tad disturbed. Especially since the new Israelis continue to steal land. And the US continues to veto any of the 250 odd demands by the UN to have a sense of moderation and balance. So the UN is a waste of money, Israel has no intention of ceasing to steal land and the US has no intention of stopping them. QED  

Lots to "stuff" to digest there, but I'll focus on one absurdity.

No need to go back thousands of years on every thread as we both agree the Jewish people have deep and ancient roots in the area and also that there was a massive diaspora as well.

(As most people associate the word apartheid with South Africa, that's relevant, as the Europeans there ... didn't have any such roots.)

So now to the focus --

Britain and the U.S. "stole" land from Palestine?

(The U.N. partitioned two states, the Jews accepted it, the Arabs didn't.)

Come on now, dude. There was no Palestine to steal from. Be honest, OK, or didn't you know?

There was a much larger BRITISH mandate of Palestine. A colonial type thing. Back then the Jews and the Arabs were both Palestinians in that structure. The very notion of a specific Palestinian ARAB identity (which is obviously what you're talking about) is a very modern political construct that yes can be seen as a reaction to the Zionist movement that led to the existence of the nation state of Israel. 

Before that that land was part of the Turkish OTTOMAN empire.

If you're going to push biased narratives, at least get some basic stuff right first. OK? 

There isn't any doubt that the Jews and Arabs both have their own narratives about this stuff, but some historical facts aren't up for rational debate.

 

 

British mandate ere stamp:

Edited March 18, 2017 by Jingthing

[anon4546543]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Load of bizarre, but I'll focus on one absurdity.

Britain and the U.S. "stole" land from Palestine?

Come on now, dude. There was no Palestine to steal from. Be honest, OK, or didn't you know?

There was a much larger BRITISH mandate of Palestine. A colonial type thing.

Before that that land was part of the Turkish OTTOMAN empire.

If you're going to push bizarre narratives, at least get some basic stuff right first. OK? 

Please Jingthing, I am not yours or anyones'  "dude". You already admit the fact, the British administered to the country of Palestine. Not colonial, the Brits never claimed Palestine to be a colony, they administered Palestine after the defeat of the Turks and Germany. And the  country of Israel and Judea ceased to exist since Persia conquered the area. Everyone in ancient history owned the area you now call Israel.Israel never had a governing body of the Palestine lands until it was excised by UK and US in 1949. It was created by the US and UK,  but I see the UK is tempering its endorsement due to land grabbing activities of your countrymen.   

[Jingthing]

Palestine during the BRITISH mandate for Palestine was not a nation state.

You can have your own opinions.

You can't have your own FACTS. 

You're right colonial was the wrong word and it was sloppy to use it -- the British administered the land after the Turks. It was not an Arab nation state. It was not a Jewish nation state. It was not a nation state -- PERIOD. 

People living during Ottoman times generally identified with the Ottoman empire, certainly the idea of a specific Palestinian Arab identity was not a thing back then. 

I am not Israeli, dude, not that there's anything wrong with that. Just correcting your presumption. 

Not going to get into your repetitive shtick about ancient history. Don't bother.  Suffice it to say any honest person would agree that the Jewish people have ancient roots in that region. FACT. 

Edited March 18, 2017 by Jingthing

[anon4546543]

Israel ceased to exist after Persia conquered you. It no longer had a king, it no longer had a government, it ceased to exist. The remnants of the former country spread throughout the world. But they never had a government, the basis of a country. The land granted to you was excised from Palestine in 1949. You did not conquer the land, you have historical claim going back more than 2000 years. And still you steal land based on US military support. When the extreme religious US  sects finally learn the truth, your false country may be forced to make a positive attempt to make some sort of peace with your cousins.

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, spiderorchid said:

Israel ceased to exist after Persia conquered you. It no longer had a king, it no longer had a government, it ceased to exist. The remnants of the former country spread throughout the world. But they never had a government, the basis of a country. The land granted to you was excised from Palestine in 1949. You did not conquer the land, you have historical claim going back more than 2000 years. And still you steal land based on US military support. When the extreme religious US  sects finally learn the truth, your false country may be forced to make a positive attempt to make some sort of peace with your cousins.

Again with the Persia megilla. 

Yes we know, we know, for the 1000th time the modern nation state of Israel came into existence in 1948. Israel is indeed a young nation state, but there are younger nation states. 

Dude, your obsessive and extremist hostility towards the very existence of the state of Israel comes through loud and clear. 

False country? That's kind of funny actually. Kind of sounds like trump tweeting about fake news.

Last time I checked Israel is a VERY REAL country.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7381315.stm

 

The State of Israel was proclaimed on 14 May 1948, the culmination of nearly 2,000 years of hopes by Jewish people that they would one day return to the land from which the Romans expelled them. The Holocaust of European Jewry in the Second World War strengthened their determination.

The Balfour Declaration by the British government in 1917, enshrined in a League of Nations mandate in 1920, had said that a "national home for the Jewish people" would be founded in Palestine, while preserving the "civil and religious" rights of non-Jewish communities there. The British could not reconcile the conflicting principles.

Edited March 18, 2017 by Jingthing

[notmyself]

15 hours ago, Jingthing said:

You know there is a very wide consensus even among Israelis that Israeli expansion of west bank settlements is not supportive of moving towards real peace negotiations for a two state solution (which a majority of Israelis support). Similarly this kind of very biased report ... it's not helpful and only serves to encourage the Israeli right wing to circle the wagons. 

 

I saw a video on a news report the other day were 10s of thousands of Israelis took to the streets demanding an end to settlement building... oh... that might have been a dream. It is interesting to note JT that you say west bank settlement expansion rather than the illegal under international law settlements themselves. I presume you are happy with the settlements as is but not the expansion of them? 

[redwinecheese]

5 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Again with the Persia megilla. 

Yes we know, we know, for the 1000th time the modern nation state of Israel came into existence in 1948. Israel is indeed a young nation state, but there are younger nation states. 

Dude, your obsessive and extremist hostility towards the very existence of the state of Israel comes through loud and clear. 

False country? That's kind of funny actually. Kind of sounds like trump tweeting about fake news.

Last time I checked Israel is a VERY REAL country.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7381315.stm

 

The State of Israel was proclaimed on 14 May 1948, the culmination of nearly 2,000 years of hopes by Jewish people that they would one day return to the land from which the Romans expelled them. The Holocaust of European Jewry in the Second World War strengthened their determination.

The Balfour Declaration by the British government in 1917, enshrined in a League of Nations mandate in 1920, had said that a "national home for the Jewish people" would be founded in Palestine, while preserving the "civil and religious" rights of non-Jewish communities there. The British could not reconcile the conflicting principles.

Not one single Israeli soldier fought to build his so called homeland, the Brits and the French did.

[redwinecheese]

8 hours ago, spiderorchid said:

the US and Britain stole land from Palestine to create the new country of Israel.

Actually the Brits and the French.

8 hours ago, spiderorchid said:

And the US continues to veto any of the 250 odd demands by the UN to have a sense of moderation and balance. So the UN is a waste of money, Israel has no intention of ceasing to steal land and the US has no intention of stopping them.

True

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, redwinecheese said:

Not one single Israeli soldier fought to build his so called homeland, the Brits and the French did.

Bizarre post.

Israeli soldiers per se didn't exist until Israel became a nation in 1948.

Of course the Zionist movement (for political self determination of the Jewish people in a national homeland) existed for several decades BEFORE 1948 and many people fought and died to advance that movement that eventually led to the establishment of the state of Israel. 

 

 

Edited March 19, 2017 by Jingthing

[Dumbastheycome]

17 hours ago, spiderorchid said:

Please Jingthing, I am not yours or anyones'  "dude". You already admit the fact, the British administered to the country of Palestine. Not colonial, the Brits never claimed Palestine to be a colony, they administered Palestine after the defeat of the Turks and Germany. And the  country of Israel and Judea ceased to exist since Persia conquered the area. Everyone in ancient history owned the area you now call Israel.Israel never had a governing body of the Palestine lands until it was excised by UK and US in 1949. It was created by the US and UK,  but I see the UK is tempering its endorsement due to land grabbing activities of your countrymen.   

Quite  correct. As was also  mentioned the  partitioning of  territory was never intended to provide any  mandate to  encroachment by either side. 

[Jingthing]

Quite  correct. As was also  mentioned the  partitioning of  territory was never intended to provide any  mandate to  encroachment by either side. 

Conveniently failed to mention that large portion of the Arab world attacked Israel right after statehood refusing to accept Israel in any borders. Criticize Israel go ahead but enough with the absurd one sided narratives.

[Thorgal]

Quite  correct. As was also  mentioned the  partitioning of  territory was never intended to provide any  mandate to  encroachment by either side. 

First UN representative to evaluate and consolidate Israeli and Jordanian peace efforts was actually assassinated in September 1948 by Stern militants.

UN representative Folke Bernadotte from Sweden mentioned the segregation of Palestinian Arabs.

Any criticism towards Israeli politics has been dismissed like in OP.


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[Thorgal]

Quite  correct. As was also  mentioned the  partitioning of  territory was never intended to provide any  mandate to  encroachment by either side. 

First UN representative to evaluate and consolidate Israeli and Jordanian peace efforts was actually assassinated in September 1948 by Stern militants.

UN representative Folke Bernadotte from Sweden mentioned the segregation of Palestinian Arabs.

Any criticism towards Israeli politics has been dismissed like in OP.


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[Thorgal]

Quite  correct. As was also  mentioned the  partitioning of  territory was never intended to provide any  mandate to  encroachment by either side. 

First UN representative to evaluate and consolidate Israeli and Jordanian peace efforts was actually assassinated in September 1948 by Stern militants.

UN representative Folke Bernadotte from Sweden mentioned the segregation of Palestinian Arabs.

Any criticism towards Israeli politics has been dismissed like in OP.


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[Thorgal]

Quite  correct. As was also  mentioned the  partitioning of  territory was never intended to provide any  mandate to  encroachment by either side. 

First UN representative to evaluate and consolidate Israeli and Jordanian peace efforts was actually assassinated in September 1948 by Stern militants.

UN representative Folke Bernadotte from Sweden mentioned the segregation of Palestinian Arabs.

Any criticism towards Israeli politics has been dismissed like in OP.


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[Dumbastheycome]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

Conveniently failed to mention that large portion of the Arab world attacked Israel right after statehood refusing to accept Israel in any borders. Criticize Israel go ahead but enough with the absurd one sided narratives.

Does  that  alter the intent  of  providing  the  territory under partitioning? Or did  such  attacks  result  in  encroachment? Defense against  offence  can be understood. The  balance  has  now  been long  lost.

[Jingthing]

Does  that  alter the intent  of  providing  the  territory under partitioning? Or did  such  attacks  result  in  encroachment? Defense against  offence  can be understood. The  balance  has  now  been long  lost.

I am not defending continued west Bank settlement expansion. But we are where we are now. Both sides need to work from that basis now.

[Dumbastheycome]

Just now, Jingthing said:

I am not defending continued west Bank settlement expansion. But we are where we are now. Both sides need to work from that basis now.

Which brings it  straight back to  the original item. Why the totalitarian  rejection  of the  report? 

Is  the  UN  now  such  an undeniable  gimp?

[Jingthing]

Which brings it  straight back to  the original item. Why the totalitarian  rejection  of the  report? 
Is  the  UN  now  such  an undeniable  gimp?

Why are you asking me. I'm not the UN.

[Dumbastheycome]

Just now, Jingthing said:

40 minutes ago, Dumbastheycome said:

Which brings it  straight back to  the original item. Why the totalitarian  rejection  of the  report? 
Is  the  UN  now  such  an undeniable  gimp?

Why are you asking me. I'm not the UN.

So  you prefer  to  go  around  the question? So it  seems  does  the  UN. Resulting in the  resignation  of  an exasperated  individual.

[Jingthing]

Generally the U. N. has been extremely biased against Israel.

[stevenl]

Generally the U. N. has been extremely biased against Israel.

No. The UN has been accepting the continuous landgrab without any real consequences for Israel.

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[Jingthing]

11 minutes ago, stevenl said:

No. The UN has been accepting the continuous landgrab without any real consequences for Israel.

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Sure, believe that the U.N. isn't biased against Israel. I don't.

I think you're objectively wrong.

But I understand the Israel demonization agenda isn't about objectivity.

 

Now for the reality:

Quote

 

BAN KI-MOON RECOGNIZES BIAS AGAINST ISRAEL IN LAST SECURITY COUNCIL SPEECH

 

UN chief urges reconsideration of settlement bill in same comments.

         

 

NEW YORK – In his last address to the UN Security Council on Friday, outgoing Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon recognized that Israel is subject to strong bias in the international body, something that Israeli ambassadors to the UN, including Danny Danon today, have raised their voices about for years.

“Decades of political maneuverings have created a disproportionate volume of resolutions, reports and conferences criticizing Israel,” Ban said. “In many cases, rather than helping the Palestinian cause, this reality has hampered the ability of the UN to fulfill its role effectively.”

“The secretary-general admitted the clear truth, the UN’s hypocrisy towards Israel has broken records over the past decade,” Danon said in reaction to the statement.

 

 

http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/UN-chief-urges-Israeli-lawmakers-to-reconsider-settlement-bill-475617