9 years overstay

[bluebird729]

so I know this guy...

He has overstayed for about 9 years in Thailand.

 

the immigration rules state:

if someone overstays for more than 5 years and surrenders himself to the authorities, they are Banned for 10 years.

and if this person is overstayed 1 year and caught in the street by the authorities, they are banned for 10 years.

 

But nowhere does it mention what happens to the person if they overstay.

Are they deported and then not allowed to re-enter ?

or, are they thrown in jail for "x" amount of time, and then deported ?

or, are they allowed to continue their stay in Thailand and then they are not allowed to re-enter once they have left the country ?

 

 

How can you Ban someone from Entering if they are Already Entered !!

there is zero mention of what happens to a person that is caught.

 

Could someone please explain what would happen to my friend if they are caught ?

Are they looking at Jail ?

would it be a few days/weeks/months of jail ?

or no jail at all ?

is it instant deportation ?

if they have no funds, does the Thai Authorities pay for his deportation ?
if he is deported, must it be to the country he is from ?

if he threw away his passport and fails to give his correct name, can they find out who he actually is ?

 

sorry many questions.

this is a serious question about a person I know.

[Chou Anou]

"are they allowed to continue their stay in Thailand and then they are not allowed to re-enter once they have left the country ?"

 

Haha, I very highly doubt it!  My money is on "immediately deported, and not allowed to re-enter for 10 years."  I would imagine a fine must be paid somewhere along the line as well...

[BritTim]

Leaving aside the attempt to hide your identity, this is the procedure. Once the person on overstay is discovered, he is arrested and taken to court. The court assesses a fine for the overstay of up to 20,000 baht (but usually less). He is then transferred to the immigration detention center (IDC). If he has money for the fine assessed in court plus an (expensive) air ticket direct to home country, usually on the national airline, and he has a current passport (or emergency travel document) he is in principle free to be deported. If he has no money for the fine, the fine is reduced by 200 baht for each day he is held in the IDC. The Thai authorities will never pay for the deportation. These days, in most cases, the authorities in your home country will also not pay the cost of deportation. There are charities that may eventually pay the cost of deportation for the indigent, but only after years languishing in the IDC. While the IDC is not bad by the standards of Thai jails, you would need a pretty good constitution to survive years there.

 

If the Thai authorities cannot verify your identity, I would imagine they would hold you in a regular Thai jail until they can. Once your identity is established, see above.

[bluebird729]

1 minute ago, BritTim said:

Leaving aside the attempt to hide your identity, this is the procedure. Once the person on overstay is discovered, he is arrested and taken to court. The court assesses a fine for the overstay of up to 20,000 baht (but usually less). He is then transferred to the immigration detention center (IDC). If he has money for the fine assessed in court plus an (expensive) air ticket direct to home country, usually on the national airline, and he has a current passport (or emergency travel document) he is in principle free to be deported. If he has no money for the fine, the fine is reduced by 200 baht for each day for each day he is held in the IDC. The Thai authorities will never pay for the deportation. These days, in most cases, the authorities in your home country will also not pay the cost of deportation. There are charities that may eventually pay the cost of deportation for the indigent, but only after years languishing in the IDC. While the IDC is not bad by the standards of Thai jails, you would need a pretty good constitution to survive years there.

 

If the Thai authorities cannot verify your identity, I would imagine they would hold you in a regular Thai jail until they can. Once your identity is established, see above.

That's a very informative answer.  (really).

Is it ok if I ask you how accurate you think your answer is ?

do you have a background knowledge on this subject.. or is it just what you have heard from person to person ?

anyway.. really.. thanks for your detailed answer 

[BritTim]

2 minutes ago, bluebird729 said:

That's a very informative answer.  (really).

Is it ok if I ask you how accurate you think your answer is ?

do you have a background knowledge on this subject.. or is it just what you have heard from person to person ?

anyway.. really.. thanks for your detailed answer 

I have spoken over the years to two people who have been through arrest and deportation.

There have been posts on here from people who have real expertise in this area. To some extent, I rely on what they have posted on the subject (for instance, regarding charities who help people in the IDC).

I am pretty sure of my facts on the basic procedure for arrest and deportation. However, I am speculating on what would happen if the Thai authorities cannot verify your identity.

[ezzra]

Not the one to gloat, overstaying for 9 years only shows utter disregards and disrespect

of the host country laws and rules, one can understand a few days or few weeks,

but 9 years? man, and we keep complain of how hard and uncompromising the

immigrations rules are.....

[BritTim]

I would just add that, if the person on overstay can scrape together the money for a cheap one-way ticket to home country, plus 20,000 baht for the overstay fine, just leaving voluntarily is the preferred procedure. It is overall cheaper than going through deportation. Of course, there is no way (without using dodgy agents) of avoiding the blacklisting.

[tomwct]

You will be given time to serve in the IDC> You will stay there doing your time. You will have to pay any fines, get an airline 

ticket, and then deported. I wouldn't be surprised if you were blacklisted for life!

[colinneil]

My friend has a problem, how many times is that one posted?

If anybody is on nine years overstay, they deserve a stay in theI IDC.

It shows a total disregard for the law, total lack of respect for Thailand.

Many things here are not to our liking, but as we chose to live here, we have to put up with them.

[dbrenn]

1 hour ago, ezzra said:

Not the one to gloat, overstaying for 9 years only shows utter disregards and disrespect

of the host country laws and rules, one can understand a few days or few weeks,

but 9 years? man, and we keep complain of how hard and uncompromising the

immigrations rules are.....

I think that the OP came to this forum for advice, rather than moralising. He obviously is aware that his friend has broken the law, and that there is a price to pay for doing that.

[dbrenn]

1 minute ago, colinneil said:

My friend has a problem, how many times is that one posted?

If anybody is on nine years overstay, they deserve a stay in theI IDC.

It shows a total disregard for the law, total lack of respect for Thailand.

Many things here are not to our liking, but as we chose to live here, we have to put up with them.

Oh dear, the TV overstay moral police have come out in force. 

[colinneil]

Just now, dbrenn said:

Oh dear, the TV overstay moral police have come out in force. 

Not moral police just stating facts about living here.

[dbrenn]

1 minute ago, colinneil said:

Not moral police just stating facts about living here.

There but for the grace of God my friend. I've known great guys - decent and honest by nature - who married wrongly, hit the booze, drugs, ran out of money and then lived hand to mouth teaching on overstay - unable to get themselves out of the hole that they'd drifted into.

 

It would make you sound a lot more human if you knew the facts surrounding each case before rushing to condemn one of your fellow expatriates.

[colinneil]

Just now, dbrenn said:

There but for the grace of God my friend. I've known great guys - decent and honest by nature - who married wrongly, hit the booze, drugs, ran out of money and then lived hand to mouth teaching on overstay - unable to get themselves out of the hole that they'd drifted into.

 

It would make you sound a lot more human if you knew the facts surrounding each case before rushing to condemn one of your fellow expatriates.

 

Yes there but for the grace of god, i agree with you on that.

Yes a married a wrong 1, lost over 3 million baht, house car even my clothes.

Did not resort to drink/drugs, just went back to the UK earned more money and came back, started again.

Where ever possible i try to keep myself within the law, not just bury my head in the sand and hope the problems will go away.

[Crossy]

OK, the Forum Police are here now. The bickering will cease forthwith or a stay in the FDC (Forum Detention Centre) will result.

 

To our OP.
 

If he has (or can obtain) a valid travel document and a flight out of the country along with the 20,000 Baht max overstay fine he can go to the airport and fly out. He will get a severe ear-bending, 20k fine and a 10 year ban.

 

If he gets picked up by the authorities it's a trip to the IDC, a court appearance (where the fine is often reduced from the maximum) then residence in the IDC until he can come up with a valid travel document and a flight out of the country, he will still get the 10 year ban.

 

Not condoning illegal activities, but your friend has managed to stay under the radar for 9 years, what is to stop him continuing in the same manner? I'm sure there are others who have slipped past the point of no return and are just living their lives in the middle of nowhere, the authorities don't know and the locals don't care. The one thing he can't do (that he could have a couple of years back) is simply clear the overstay and come straight back.

 

 

[james1995]

Well, seeing as he's already up to the neck in a certain brown substance.  Might as well stay put.

[Doiger]

I wonder if the ops friend even has a valid passport to travel on.

if he is already 9 years overstay then good chance his passport is close to or already expired.

[paul18620]

1 hour ago, colinneil said:

Not moral police just stating facts about living here.

People who live here know the facts so there is no need to state the obvious is there

[steven100]

5 hours ago, bluebird729 said:

so I know this guy...

you will be deported ....  fined the maximum ....   and banned for at least 10 years. 

 

Immigration does not take kindly to long overstayers .

[impulse]

Keeping in mind the majority of his overstay occurred during a time when such an extended overstay could be cleared up with 20,000 baht and the perpetrator could fly out and return very next day, I don't see what all the condemnation is about.  It used to be a very common practice to maximize the days in country for the inevitable 20,000 fine.  It's only been in the last couple of years that the rules tightened up.

 

I'd suggest the guy write a book detailing how to stay under the radar for so long.  Lots of folks who don't have the juevos to post up here could probably benefit.

 

BTW, I'm on a very legal WP before anyone goes there in reply to my post here.  But I agree- there but for the Grace of God (or the luck of the draw for you atheists).

 

 

[simoh1490]

Whoever the person is they have been very fortunate to evade being caught/identified for 8 years, the odds that will continue for the rest of their life is slim to remote. If that person is considering staying or leaving, it may be best to bite the bullet now and get it over and done with because it will be so much harder in future years.

[8OA8]

Keeping in mind the majority of his overstay occurred during a time when such an extended overstay could be cleared up with 20,000 baht and the perpetrator could fly out and return very next day, I don't see what all the condemnation is about.  It used to be a very common practice to maximize the days in country for the inevitable 20,000 fine.  It's only been in the last couple of years that the rules tightened up.
 
I'd suggest the guy write a book detailing how to stay under the radar for so long.  Lots of folks who don't have the juevos to post up here could probably benefit.
 
BTW, I'm on a very legal WP before anyone goes there in reply to my post here.  But I agree- there but for the Grace of God (or the luck of the draw for you atheists).
 
 

Curious as to what the difference is between a WP and a legal or very legal WP? I ask as I was usually issued my WP by the One Stop department and it wasn't anything special.

Sent from my SM-N910C using Tapatalk

[impulse]

1 minute ago, 8OA8 said:

Curious as to what the difference is between a WP and a legal or very legal WP? I ask as I was usually issued my WP by the One Stop department and it wasn't anything special.

 

One and the same.  The emphasis was mine because the normal accusation here on TVF is that anyone who has empathy for someone's plight must be in a similar situation.

[khunano]

2 minutes ago, 8OA8 said:

Curious as to what the difference is between a WP and a legal or very legal WP? I ask as I was usually issued my WP by the One Stop department and it wasn't anything special.

Sent from my SM-N910C using Tapatalk
 

He differentiates between WP's issued by "The Grace of God" and those having obtained an atheist WP.

[Suradit69]

1 hour ago, impulse said:

BTW, I'm on a very legal WP before anyone goes there in reply to my post here.

Quote

One and the same.  The emphasis was mine because the normal accusation here on TVF is that anyone who has empathy for someone's plight must be in a similar situation.

 

Having a WP has nothing to do with over-staying. One has over-stayed if one remains in the country after his permission to stay or extension of that permission, granted by immigrations, has expired.  WPs are not issued by immigrations.

 

Not sure about "normal accusations"  related to empathy.  Pretty certain that empathy/sympathy flows more freely when the subject under discussion is a farang and the knives come out if a Thai does anything that inconveniences those whining about it all.

 

 

 

[CharlieH]

I'm curious as to "why now" ? its been 9 years!!  Whats happened that this guy now needs to leave or wants to leave and thats why he wants to know the consequences of his actions.

[realenglish1]

First " Tell your Friend " that to overstay for more than  9 years is just plain irresponsibility  on his part

From the start he is an illegal and if they catch  you they will jail you and then deport you For how long I have no idea so get used the idea you 

can end up in jail

 

And if you just go to the airport and surrender to Immigration then will give you a very hard time  You will pay a 20,000 baht fine and they will ban you from Thailand for 

10 years  No ifs ands or buts about it 

You're in a heap of doo doo my friend It is sheer stupidity that led you here Sorry If I am not understanding about it 

I have been here for more than 15 years and never had a lapse in my visa 

[justaphase]

You need 20,000 for the fine and 13,000 for a one way ticket home if you're from the UK as you'll be immediately deported and u wont spend much time anywhere.

Blacklisted for 10 years as the law states.

If u dont have money then you're looking at 100 days (@ 200 baht/day) to pay off the fine in the jail nearest u were arrested in.

Then u go to the detention centre and u try to get home.

There's no free trip. After 6 months uk will lend u the money.

[impulse]

32 minutes ago, Suradit69 said:

 

Having a WP has nothing to do with over-staying. One has over-stayed if one remains in the country after his permission to stay or extension of that permission, granted by immigrations, has expired.  WPs are not issued by immigrations.

 

Not sure about "normal accusations"  related to empathy.  Pretty certain that empathy/sympathy flows more freely when the subject under discussion is a farang and the knives come out if a Thai does anything that inconveniences those whining about it all.

 

I do agree that empathy is usually free-flowing for people who break all the stupid rules- as defined by the poster, and withheld from people breaking the important rules -again, as defined by the poster.  

 

My favorites are the guys who would string a guy up for an overstay, but defend to the death another guy's right to drink in a bar 'til dawn, then barfine a lady for his inalienable right to carnal pleasure.

 

[CharlieH]

This reminds me of a story......

 

A little bird was flying south for the Winter. It was so cold the bird froze and fell to the ground into a large field.

While he was lying there, a cow came by and dropped some dung on him.
As the frozen bird lay there in the pile of cow dung, he began to realize how warm he was.

The dung was actually thawing him out!
He lay there all warm and happy, and soon began to sing for joy.

A passing cat heard the bird singing and came to investigate. Following the sound, the cat discovered the bird under the pile of cow dung, and promptly dug him out and ate him.

Morals of the story:
(1) Not everyone who shits on you is your enemy.
(2) Not everyone who gets you out of shit is your friend.
(3) And when you're in deep shit, it's often best to keep your mouth shut!