is this an urban myth in Thailand

[JamJar]

2 hours ago, LammyTS1 said:

I've been using my UK clarity credit card weekly for the past 6 months and always get free counter withdrawals with no limit at all banks and exchange booths. 

 

I once withdrew 75,000 baht from Bangkok bank to buy a bike. I usually withdraw 40,000 at a time.

 

No Thai bank fees and no foreign transaction fees. I also get the MasterCard exchange rate which is better than Thai banks and exchange booths. 

 

The only time I was charged was at SCB. 300 baht but I complained and got the cash back in my hand(after a lot of debate).

 

 

Surprised, as the Clarity has a £500 per day limit for ATM withdrawals. 

[SunsetT]

On 22/05/2017 at 4:25 AM, sanemax said:

If you get money from over the counter with a foreign ATM card, there is no ATM fee .

   Why dont you do that and then look if there were any other fees ?

........Case in point!!!

 

[SunsetT]

2 hours ago, LammyTS1 said:

I've been using my UK clarity credit card weekly for the past 6 months and always get free counter withdrawals with no limit at all banks and exchange booths. 

 

I once withdrew 75,000 baht from Bangkok bank to buy a bike. I usually withdraw 40,000 at a time.

 

No Thai bank fees and no foreign transaction fees. I also get the MasterCard exchange rate which is better than Thai banks and exchange booths. 

 

The only time I was charged was at SCB. 300 baht but I complained and got the cash back in my hand(after a lot of debate).

 

.....Always Bangkok bank?

 

[LammyTS1]

 

Surprised, as the Clarity has a £500 per day limit for ATM withdrawals. 

 

No limit for purchases. Counter withdrawals are not ATM withdrawals.

 

I can withdraw any amount up to my cards limit in 1 transaction which can be anything up to 250,000 baht.

 

 

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[LammyTS1]

.....Always Bangkok bank?

 

 

I use Bangkok bank often but have also used Krungsi, kasikorn, SCB.

 

You will find that some branches may not have counter withdrawal facilities for various reasons but mostly all do.

 

Just a few days ago a Bangkok bank branch advised me they had run out of cash. I then just used a Krungsi currency exchange booth in the same shopping mall.

 

 

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[Pib]

2 hours ago, LammyTS1 said:

 

No limit for purchases. Counter withdrawals are not ATM withdrawals.

 

I can withdraw any amount up to my cards limit in 1 transaction which can be anything up to 250,000 baht.

 

 

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If you asked your bank or it's in the card docs and got above answer then good.  However, if making an assumption about the cash advance limit....like equaling the daily purchase limit....your should ask your card-issuing bank.

 

The reason I say above and for others listening in, when using a credit card (or debit card)" do not assume" whatever the daily "purchase limit may be" is also the "daily cash advance limit when done over the counter."  

 

For example I use a couple of U.S. no foreign transaction fee and no cash advance fee credit cards for cash advances/counter withdrawals..   I also prepay the amount I plan to get to avoid an interest charge.   Seems to be very similar to the UK Clarity credit card in terms of fees. 

 

Now although I have a $10K USD credit  line on each card when it comes to cash advances there are specific limitations....that is, you can not pull $10K per cash advance transaction/daily or anything close to that, whether at an ATM or at the counter.   With the exception of the ATM limitation, the counter withdrawal limitation is not stated in the documents I got from the card-issuing bank nor on their website....can only be found out by contacting the a bank rep.  

 

Now I asked my card-issuing bank several times over several months regarding the cash advance limitation and each time got below answer from a different rep...the answer addresses doing a cash advance to put money into your bank account with the bank, from an ATM, and/or a counter withdrawal at another bank.    See below....and note the $2K (approx Bt70K) cash advance limit per transaction/per day when doing a counter withdrawal...and if I wanted to I could also use an ATM to get $1K....so, if I wanted to I could do a counter withdrawal and use an ATM and get a total of $3K (approx Bt100K) per day.

 

Quote

 

Members may advance up to $5,000 into a checking, share, or Money Market Savings Account.

A member may do a cash advance withdraw up to $1,000 per day from a ATM.

A member may withdraw up to $2,000 per day from a financial institution

 

 

What really drove me to ask was the first time I did a counter withdrawal using one of the credit cards at a Bangkok Bank branch I asked for Bt100K (approx $3K) and the transaction was rejected...the rejection memo on the point of service machine said "Over Limit."  Well, that's embarrassing......my brain gears were clicking....what to do....what to do?..  Well, I just told the bank rep to try again for Bt60K (less than $2K) and the transaction processed no problem.  I came home...send an email to my credit card-issuing bank asking about "cash advance limits" and got above answer.    So, whenever I go to the bank to do a counter withdrawal, I ensure I ask for a little below the $2K limit in baht.....been doing this for a couple of years now.

 

I also asked another one of my credit card-issuing banks regarding the cash advance limit on a particular credit card (didn't plan to use it for a cash advance but wanted to know the cash advance limitation....also had a high credit line on this account)....their answer was the daily cash advance limit whether by ATM or counter.  withdrawal was $1K (approx Bt35K).     Actually, I could make a purchase of a product/service way, way above $1K but for a cash advance there was a limit.    

 

Yea, be sure to confirm with your card-issuing bank for debit or credit cards what you daily limit is for ATM and at a financial institution (a.k.a, cash advance, counter withdrawal, etc)...don't assume just because a counter withdrawal in the branch is processed using a point of service machine like at a merchant checkout for product/service then that means my cash advance advance limit will match my purchase limit.....or a counter withdrawal cash advance limit will match the ATM withdrawal limit.  Very different limits can exist.   

 

 

 

[JamJar]

6 hours ago, LammyTS1 said:

 

No limit for purchases. Counter withdrawals are not ATM withdrawals.

 

I can withdraw any amount up to my cards limit in 1 transaction which can be anything up to 250,000 baht.

 

 

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It depends on how the transaction is processed. The bank that I use doesn't allow me to go over the ATM withdrawal limit. Though I don't use the Clarity.

[Chivas]

14 hours ago, LammyTS1 said:

 

 

No Thai bank fees and no foreign transaction fees. I also get the MasterCard exchange rate which is better than Thai banks and exchange booths. 

 

 

 

you should be getting interbank rates (better) not mastercard/visa with the clarity. Myself and friend certainly do at least when used in ATM anyway

[SunsetT]

10 minutes ago, Chivas said:

you should be getting interbank rates (better) not mastercard/visa with the clarity. Myself and friend certainly do at least when used in ATM anyway

I dont know what u mean by interbank rate, but if its the exchange rate offered by the ATM u r crazy to accept it as it is far far inferior to the Mastercard/Visa rate u will get.

[Chivas]

4 minutes ago, SunsetT said:

I dont know what u mean by interbank rate, but if its the exchange rate offered by the ATM u r crazy to accept it as it is far far inferior to the Mastercard/Visa rate u will get.

dont give up your day job !

interbank is the full international rate banks use to one another. Revolut card when first introduced had interbank rates (but no longer with the baht as junk status) and the only other card in uk (that I'm aware of) is the halifax clarity card

Edited May 24, 2017 by Chivas

[SunsetT]

2 minutes ago, Chivas said:

dont give up your day job !

interbank is the full international rate banks use to one another. Revolut card when first introduced had interbank rates (but no longer with the baht as junk status) and the only other card in uk (that I'm aware of) is the halifax clarity card

I have been using the Clarity card ever since it was issued. It is a Mastercard so that is the rate u get and it is usually about .5thb below the 'interbank' rate.  I didnt think the 'interbank' rate u referred to could possibly be the 'full international rate banks use' because no customer ever gets that whatever way they transfer money. It is the rate the banks use between themselves. If your Revolut card is not Mastercard or Visa and give u the Interbank rate then it must be unique. But then u say then u say  u cannot get it  because the Thai baht has junk status? ......Wish it was then we would all get a better exchange rate.

[Chivas]

1 minute ago, SunsetT said:

I have been using the Clarity card ever since it was issued. It is a Mastercard so that is the rate u get and it is usually about .5thb below the 'interbank' rate.  I didnt think the 'interbank' rate u referred to could possibly be the 'full international rate banks use' because no customer ever gets that whatever way they transfer money. It is the rate the banks use between themselves. If your Revolut card is not Mastercard or Visa and give u the Interbank rate then it must be unique. But then u say then u say  u cannot get it  because the Thai baht has junk status? ......Wish it was then we would all get a better exchange rate.

up to you buddy !!  if you believe the clarity gives 50 satang less than interbank you knock yourself out

revolut is/was unique and you still get interbank on most currencies just not baht and rouble

[JamJar]

2 hours ago, Chivas said:

dont give up your day job !

interbank is the full international rate banks use to one another. Revolut card when first introduced had interbank rates (but no longer with the baht as junk status) and the only other card in uk (that I'm aware of) is the halifax clarity card

 

No...it's the Mastercard rate.

[JamJar]

Our exchange rates for card transactions are determined by the payment scheme provider for the card. For further information and other exchange rates and currencies see MasterCard or Visa. 

 

https://www.halifax.co.uk/travel/help-guidance/using-debit-credit-cards-abroad/

 

0.5 baht off the 'mid market rate' isn't necessarily accurate. I noted 0.2 yesterday. This betters any Thailand bank's TT rate in any case.

 

As to Revolut:

 

Quote

For a few illiquid currencies, we provide the best rate we possibly can. For THB and RUB, we apply a small 1.5% markup on the exchange rate. For UAH we apply a 1% markup.

At the weekend (Friday 23:59 - Sunday 23:59) we apply a small mark up on the spot rate as the Forex markets are closed. We take the rate from Friday 23:59 and apply a 0.5% mark up on major currencies and 1.0% on other currencies to protect the company from potential losses due to a large fluctuation in the rate. For illiquid currencies like Russian Ruble and Thai Baht, there is 1.5% mark up on weekend.

 

Don't use it at the weekend and forget about it for Thai baht.

 

The problem with Revolut is that they implemented these things and then only announced it after people began to notice.

 

Example: https://metabubble.net/payment-cards-bank-accounts/revolut-not-necessarily-cheaper-than-any-other-mastercard/

 

I noticed it last year when I was looking at AU$.

Edited May 24, 2017 by JamJar

[Hardie]

It's easier just to find a foreign bank that rebates your ATM fees, not so hard to find in the US, especially if you can get 'private client' status...

[JamJar]

1 minute ago, Hardie said:

It's easier just to find a foreign bank that rebates your ATM fees, not so hard to find in the US, especially if you can get 'private client' status...

 

So then it's not easier, is it? 

 

Nonsensical post.

[Hardie]

1 minute ago, JamJar said:

 

So then it's not easier, is it? 

 

Nonsensical post.

Going to an ATM is much easier than going to a counter, genius...

[JamJar]

3 hours ago, Chivas said:

dont give up your day job !

interbank is the full international rate banks use to one another. Revolut card when first introduced had interbank rates (but no longer with the baht as junk status) and the only other card in uk (that I'm aware of) is the halifax clarity card

 

Other credit cards that pass on the full Mastercard rate from the UK are;

 

Creation Everyday

Santander Zero

 

Barclaycard Travel Platinum passes on the full VISA rate.

 

There are a few Prepaid Mastercard debit cards that pass on the full Mastercard rate.

 

 

[JamJar]

3 minutes ago, Hardie said:

Going to an ATM is much easier than going to a counter, genius...

 

 

Genius enough to understand that one account in the USA; Charles Schwab Bank High Yield Investor Checking Account® , is not going to be easily attainable for most of the people using this forum. Especially since most are not from the USA.

The other nonsense concerning 'Private Client status' deserves scorn poured upon it since it then narrows down the options even further.

 

 

 

[rickudon]

Jamjar on the ball again. Totally agree.

 

As for counter wihdrawals, after hearing this 'urban myth' i tried it in Udon. My brother-in-law swore he didn't get charged. Well i tried (not the branch he used as out of my way). Result - Bangkok bank - 'No can do'. - Kasikorn - pointed me to ATM. -  Krungthai - 'No can do'. SCB - 'Can do' - but shafted me on exchange rate (maybe gave me dynamic rate) AND charged a fee. I decided to stop wasting my time chasing this mythical miracle. You could do it 6-7 years ago, because i did it before ATM charges, but bloody hard to find it now and i expect some are paying fees but do not know it. Maybe a few do it where they have many foreign customers, but it is a dying option. Now i just stick with Aeon  ATM's or SWIFT bank transfers.

 

Other options - I used to bring Travellers cheques as only a small fee, but then they started charging 150 baht PER CHEQUE - and was told it was going up soon! As my UK bank only issued mixed denominations this would cost around 10%  of the value on average .....

 

We are no longer welcome guests, just cash cows!

[JamJar]

1 hour ago, rickudon said:

Jamjar on the ball again. Totally agree.

 

As for counter wihdrawals, after hearing this 'urban myth' i tried it in Udon. My brother-in-law swore he didn't get charged. Well i tried (not the branch he used as out of my way). Result - Bangkok bank - 'No can do'. - Kasikorn - pointed me to ATM. -  Krungthai - 'No can do'. SCB - 'Can do' - but shafted me on exchange rate (maybe gave me dynamic rate) AND charged a fee. I decided to stop wasting my time chasing this mythical miracle. You could do it 6-7 years ago, because i did it before ATM charges, but bloody hard to find it now and i expect some are paying fees but do not know it. Maybe a few do it where they have many foreign customers, but it is a dying option. Now i just stick with Aeon  ATM's or SWIFT bank transfers.

 

Other options - I used to bring Travellers cheques as only a small fee, but then they started charging 150 baht PER CHEQUE - and was told it was going up soon! As my UK bank only issued mixed denominations this would cost around 10%  of the value on average .....

 

We are no longer welcome guests, just cash cows!

 

Have never been to Udon.  Still can do in tourist city. No fees and checked against https://www.mastercard.us/en-us/consumers/get-support/convert-currency.html

 

14000 baht on the 7th of April 2017, £326.83 with a fee free Mastercard CC. 

Check the rate for yourself. Both with xe.com and the Mastercard conversion tool above.

Won't post the receipt, as too much identifying info on it.

Edited May 24, 2017 by JamJar

[LammyTS1]

Yes it must be restricted to tourist cities and areas then.

I just used my card now at Krungsi exchange booth. No fee's and had cash in hand within 3 minutes. I'll find out tomorrow what the MasterCard exchange rate was once I check my account. XE states 44.3.

I haven't used an ATM for over 6 months.

My GBP a/c that I opened has never been used. Opened it to transfer GBP but charges are made for this.


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[mrjohn]

I do it (withdraw funds over-the-counter, that is) every month and I have done ever since the ATM charge was introduced.

 

It is not an urban myth. There are no fees charged by the Thai bank and the exchange rate is determined by MasterCard or Visa, i.e. depends on your card. It is an interbank rate, usually the same as the travellers cheques rate shown in the bank.

 

Whether your home bank charges any fees is another matter but in my experience it will be the same for any foreign withdrawal, either over-the-counter or from an ATM.

 

It has nothing to do with living in a tourist area as I live in a small town in the North.

 

If a bank refuses to do it, it’s probably because they can’t be bothered. You don’t have to live here very long to realise that Thais will expend a great deal of effort to avoid doing something they perceive as difficult.

Edited May 25, 2017 by mrjohn

[sanemax]

7 minutes ago, mrjohn said:

If a bank refuses to do it, it’s probably because they can’t be bothered. You don’t have to live here very long to realise that Thais will expend a great deal of effort to avoid doing something they perceive as difficult.

No need for Thai bashing .

The reason why some banks cannot carry out an over the counter transaction is because the branch doesnt have a portable ATM scanning machine needed to carry out the transaction .

[JamJar]

3 hours ago, mrjohn said:

I do it (withdraw funds over-the-counter, that is) every month and I have done ever since the ATM charge was introduced.

 

It is not an urban myth. There are no fees charged by the Thai bank and the exchange rate is determined by MasterCard or Visa, i.e. depends on your card. It is an interbank rate, usually the same as the travellers cheques rate shown in the bank.

 

Whether your home bank charges any fees is another matter but in my experience it will be the same for any foreign withdrawal, either over-the-counter or from an ATM.

 

It has nothing to do with living in a tourist area as I live in a small town in the North.

 

If a bank refuses to do it, it’s probably because they can’t be bothered. You don’t have to live here very long to realise that Thais will expend a great deal of effort to avoid doing something they perceive as difficult.

 

You just made this part up. 

 

It can't be the Interbank, Mastercard/Visa and Thailand bank'sTravellers cheque rate at the same time. It should simply be the Mastercard/Visa rate.

[JamJar]

3 hours ago, sanemax said:

No need for Thai bashing .

The reason why some banks cannot carry out an over the counter transaction is because the branch doesnt have a portable ATM scanning machine needed to carry out the transaction .

 

Not at all true. The bank that I utilise does not even use one of those to carry out cash advances.

 

[sanemax]

39 minutes ago, JamJar said:

 

Not at all true. The bank that I utilise does not even use one of those to carry out cash advances.

 

Well, every time that I make an over the counter withdrawal using a foreign ATM card, they always use a hand held card reader . The whole transaction goes through that reader and a receipt comes our from it

   How does your Thai bank get your foreign ATM cards details into their system ?

[JamJar]

1 hour ago, sanemax said:

Well, every time that I make an over the counter withdrawal using a foreign ATM card, they always use a hand held card reader . The whole transaction goes through that reader and a receipt comes our from it

   How does your Thai bank get your foreign ATM cards details into their system ?

 

Pointless to discuss the system they utilise. The point is that they do not use a "portable ATM scanning machine"/ portable card machine/card machine.

So your assertion as to the reason for them not doing it is incorrect.

There may be varied reasons, but that isn't necessarily one of them.

 

 

[Pib]

If they are not using a Point of Service (POS) machine just like they use a store checkouts I don't know what they could be using. Gotta have such a machine to insert/swipe the card which also validates the transaction.

 

When I use my Krungsri branch they use the POS right at their position while I watch...each position seems to have a POS...receipt for signature spits out...I sign it...done.

 

Now when I use my Bangkok Bank branch they don't have POS machines at every postion so they take my card to a desk behind a wall with several POSs on it, receipt for signature pops out....they bring the receipt back....I sign it...done. I was able to peek behind that wall one time to see the several centralized POS machines.

 

Both branches also make copies of my main passport page and front of card...I sign that copy.

 

The Visa/Mastercard/card logo exchange rate is used minus any "card-issuing bank" fees. The Thai bank TT, sight bill, travellers cheque or some FX rate is not used. All of mentioned rates will be "kinda" close to the card rate but that is just coincidence. And of course the excludes a DCC transaction which will be around 3% lower than the card rate.

 

 

 

 

[JamJar]

Not all banks use the same system. 

 

Anyway.....

 

As per; http://www.bangkokbank.com/BangkokBank/WebServices/Rates/Pages/FX_Rates.aspx

 

Bank Note Buying rate is what you get when exchanging cash. Sight Bill(Buying rate) is for Travellers cheques. TT(Buying rate) is the rate used when transferring currency from abroad.

All of these rates are inferior to the Mastercard rate.

 

I'm sure that you know this. Posted just for general information.

 

All of the bank rates can be found here: http://bankexchangerates.daytodaydata.net