Customers scream "Scam!" as True Fitness shut up shop

[Na Lee]

Whaaaat True fitness? No Scam fitness. American swindlers that's it is.

[YetAnother]

scam is an 'up front' mechanism; a business closing down, yes cheating their customers, is not a 'scam'

[midzo]

On 6/9/2017 at 3:07 PM, OldSiamHand said:

One reads many odd and inaccurate things on these boards, but this one is worth commenting on more than others.  

 

Credit card companies will not refund you the money you spend at True Fitness if you tell your credit card company that you did not receive the goods or services you requested.  You can file a complaint with the credit card company, and they may contact True Fitness about the charges (depending on your card), but they will in no event refund you your money.   They will reverse the charges if True Fitness agrees to reverse the charges.

 

This will depend on where the bank that issued the card is located. In the US, card issuers will indeed reverse the charges if the charge is more than $50, the goods or services were defective, undelivered or not as described and the purchaser has made an effort to resolve the issue with the merchant. I do not know if this protection applies to purchases made outside the US. Interesting question.

 

They do not make any adjustments, it's a 100% chargeback. 

 

The issuer will claw back funds, if available, or will become a creditor in the bankruptcy proceedings. Often, the issuer eats all or part of the chargeback.

 

This is done to give consumers confidence in using credit cards. It's a cost of doing business.

 

I have done three chargebacks in my life. In all three cases, I got my money back, in one case far more than I deserved.

 

I bought two Eurail passes from a US company. Cost was $1600. Their marketing materials and maps clearly showed the Channel crossing between Dover and Calais was included. British rail was not.

 

When I showed up in Dover, the ticket agent said the Channel crossing was not included. She was well aware that Americans had been told it was. I had to purchase two ferry tickets. $160.

 

When I got home, I contacted the agency that sold the tickets and asked for the $160 I spent. They refused, saying it was a printing error. I spoke to a manager, no joy.

 

I went to my bank and asked for $160 charge back. They said that was impossible, they could only reverse the entire transaction. Fine with me.

 

I got the $1600 back within a couple of weeks.

 

The company that sold me the passes called me and said "OK, you win. We'll pay the $160. Send us a check for $1440.

 

I got a lot of  pleasure from telling them to pound sand. 

 

 

[bbi1]

25 minutes ago, midzo said:

 

This will depend on where the bank that issued the card is located. In the US, card issuers will indeed reverse the charges if the charge is more than $50, the goods or services were defective, undelivered or not as described and the purchaser has made an effort to resolve the issue with the merchant. I do not know if this protection applies to purchases made outside the US. Interesting question.

 

They do not make any adjustments, it's a 100% chargeback. 

 

The issuer will claw back funds, if available, or will become a creditor in the bankruptcy proceedings. Often, the issuer eats all or part of the chargeback.

 

This is done to give consumers confidence in using credit cards. It's a cost of doing business.

Tru dat, amen 

[hobz]

29 minutes ago, midzo said:

 

 

I got a lot of  pleasure from telling them to pound sand. 

 

 

I got pleasure from reading it. Thankd for sharing haha.

[hawker9000]

On 6/9/2017 at 9:15 AM, steven100 said:

imagine if you signed up last week .....     oh well,  forget and move on as you won't be getting the money back .....

 

This happens in Thailand .. this happens everywhere all over the world ...  it's just bad luck

Ah, the old "it happens everywhere" chant.  There must be a button somewhere on these pages tbat automatically formats a reply with that & spits it out.

 

No, it actually doesn't.  Not without consequences as here. In developed countries the "corporate veil" isn't at all what it used to be.  But above & beyond all that, anybody who forks over money here for stuff like "lifetime memberships" best either literally have money to burn or be planning on a flying lesson off some convenient balcony soon.

[laban]

For all the gym lovers, a little bird tells me a European chain of gyms is opening in bangkok, and I am not referring to Virgin Active which is already here.


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[steven100]

42 minutes ago, hawker9000 said:

Ah, the old "it happens everywhere" chant.  There must be a button somewhere on these pages tbat automatically formats a reply with that & spits it out.

 

No, it actually doesn't.  Not without consequences as here. In developed countries the "corporate veil" isn't at all what it used to be.  But above & beyond all that, anybody who forks over money here for stuff like "lifetime memberships" best either literally have money to burn or be planning on a flying lesson off some convenient balcony soon.

you mean like :              oh that's right ....   you said it don't happen in the west    !!

 

Circuit city

Dick Smith electronics

Radio shack

Blockbuster

Friedmans, Brookstone, Lehman Bros, Merrill Lynch,

American international group.

Edited June 11, 2017 by steven100

[oxo1947]

7 minutes ago, hawker9000 said:

Ah, the old "it happens everywhere" chant.

No, it actually doesn't.

So are you saying that Google has it wrong & the company we are talking about didn't close down its outlets in the other countries it is in.?

 

I agree lifetime membership in any sort of club---should be viewed cynically. I have lived and used gyms here for 19 years now--just 2 chains have closed down--both overseas entity's .

If you would like to put the proposal that this only happens in Thailand---I would Google that first, start with the USA.

So you state that other countries the "Corporate veil" has it all covered when someone does a runner---would you like to point to examples of that --I think there's a Button with "Yes it only ever happens in Thailand" chant as well

[sanuk711]

41 minutes ago, hawker9000 said:

Ah, the old "it happens everywhere" chant.  There must be a button somewhere on these pages tbat automatically formats a reply with that & spits it out.

 

No, it actually doesn't.  Not without consequences as here. In developed countries the "corporate veil" isn't at all what it used to be.  But above & beyond all that, anybody who forks over money here for stuff like "lifetime memberships" best either literally have money to burn or be planning on a flying lesson off some convenient balcony soon.

 

A private company closes down, that's got to be Thailand's fault. Never happens in the west. The corporate veil protects us all there.

May I have what your smoking          

[Trumpish]

Anyone who has done business with True Move will be unsurprised by this, it represents exactly the underlying ethics of the company.

 

It beats me why anyone could have expected anything else really...

[hawker9000]

1 hour ago, steven100 said:

you mean like :              oh that's right ....   you said it don't happen in the west    !!

 

Circuit city

Dick Smith electronics

Radio shack

Blockbuster

Friedmans, Brookstone, Lehman Bros, Merrill Lynch,

American international group.

Actually I didn't say that. But any moron can make a list of failed companies.  But did you have a "lifetime membership" at, say, "Radio Shack", or "Circuit City".  ROFLMAO.  You were more likely to have been part of a class action lawsuit AGAINST them, that SUCCEEDED even, and that wasn't even worth your while to file the claim for, than to have actually lost any significant amount of money, except as an INVESTOR maybe.   

 

Thanks for the lame comedy.  Don't know if SNL is still looking for "evil korperashun" material or not.  You could always try the DNC; they're pretty desperate.

[ThailandLOS]

4 hours ago, Trumpish said:

Anyone who has done business with True Move will be unsurprised by this, it represents exactly the underlying ethics of the company.

 

It beats me why anyone could have expected anything else really...

Once again - this gym has nothing to do with True Move or other parts of True Corporation!

 

If you feel like slandering True Move, open up your own thread - and prepare yourself for a defamation lawsuit. Just some some friendly advise as you come across as a total newbie.

Edited June 11, 2017 by ThailandLOS

[fishbrando]

16 hours ago, midzo said:

I went to my bank and asked for $160 charge back. They said that was impossible, they could only reverse the entire transaction. Fine with me.

 

I got the $1600 back within a couple of weeks.

 

The company that sold me the passes called me and said "OK, you win. We'll pay the $160. Send us a check for $1440.

 

I got a lot of  pleasure from telling them to pound sand. 

 

Now that is some great justice!

[Tony125]

On 6/10/2017 at 7:17 PM, Deez said:

That one was still open. Just had a 3 month membership there. They also have Tennis School there so I would think it would stay open. They have tournaments scheduled until the end of the year.

Can you give us an update and report if its still open 

 

Latest update on 12 June 2017: True Fitness has closed down all its branches in Malaysia as well as Thailand. – http://www.truefitness.com.my/ and http://www.truefitness.co.th/

 

Reports of problems with company for a long time click on url and scroll down:

 

http://munfitnessblog.com/billonaire-family-wee-plans-to-conquer-fitness-industry-with-true-fitness/#comment-88862

[Thai Ron]

22 hours ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

Indeed but there seems to be no shortage of complete mugs arriving daily that make easy pickings for the locals, then posting here telling us how wonderful the place is and how they have invested in the country.

 

30+ years and the scammers outside the Grand Palace, the jetski scammers, the gem scams etc... it all still goes on, with full knowledge and complicity of the authorities. If they lack the willpower (read: are totally complicit) to deal with low level scamming then what chance of dealing with True Fitness or other fraudulent activity? 

 

Answer: none whatsoever. See Colin Vard and Ian Rance for evidence (two among thousands).

 

Meanwhile the Thais are laughing all the way to the gold shop.

 

Chai Yo! 

Thousands of Thais got scammed by True Fitness too in case that hadn't dawned on you up there in your ivory tower.

 

[OldSiamHand]

On 6/9/2017 at 4:01 PM, fishbrando said:

http://www.creditcards.com/credit-card-news/6-steps-getting-chargeback-1267.php

And your point is?

 

This article is on chargebacks under US law for one, and even in the US, the chargeback is not a warranty from the credit card company.  They will not be out their own funds in issuing a chargeback, even in the US. 

[Blackheart1916]

On 10/06/2017 at 10:43 AM, bangkokairportlink said:

 

Wrong.

 

If you had online business you would know that for some customers, especially in USA, a phone call to tell that your didn't receive the products/service or it was not what you expected, then they are automatically refunded (money taken from seller account), and then the seller has to provide evidence that what customers paid for has been delivered.

 

 

 

 

Ok you may be right as I have only been involved with unauthorised transactions which was credited back to the card pretty promptly by the bank, I think the problem here will be trying to get anything from the seller,s account.

[Trumpish]

22 hours ago, ThailandLOS said:

Once again - this gym has nothing to do with True Move or other parts of True Corporation!

 

If you feel like slandering True Move, open up your own thread - and prepare yourself for a defamation lawsuit. Just some some friendly advise as you come across as a total newbie.

 

 

Yes, you're right. A natural mistake to make given their behaviour historically. Sorry if I rained on your parade, 

 

But defamation lawsuit for commenting about True Move etc? I think not. Sorry again for the inaccuracy and for raining on your parade though..

Edited June 12, 2017 by Trumpish

[ThailandLOS]

10 minutes ago, Trumpish said:

But defamation lawsuit for commenting about True Move

You might become surprised abt what's actually possible in Thailand - and these are people with very deep pockets.

[Trumpish]

9 minutes ago, ThailandLOS said:

You might become surprised abt what's actually possible in Thailand - and these are people with very deep pockets.

*Shrug*. Worth a try perhaps. Like a hooker suing someone for saying she isn't a virgin though.

 

I doubt I would be very surprised about anything in Thailand really, the LOS fiction became clear long ago..

 

[Puwa]

Once upon a time, we had a great fitness center in Chiang Mai, Platinum, that closed up at the end of 2008. The steps to its demise might be instructive for anyone trying to guess the future of their own membership gym.

It started out as a great find-- full equipment, big swimming pool, sauna, steam, massage, unobtrusive trainers, yoga studio, juice bar, a good clientele, its own building and a big parking lot.   (Photos of the old gym are still viewable on Google). I think we paid 9-11K per year for both my wife and me. The owner or frontman was a minor Bangkok tv or film actor who would show up from time to time, known as a nice guy. One of the clever marketing tactics was to offer free or nearly free memberships to airline stewardesses as a way to draw other customers.

 

After a few years, trouble started. First was a noticeable cutback in maintenance and housekeeping. A showerhead or doorknob might break and not get fixed for weeks, if at all. Bit by bit, you notice that things aren't as clean as they used to be. Then the sauna and massage area were shut down. Because our gym had a nice outdoor pool, we got another big hint when the water kept going green and the management's efforts to correct it couldn't keep up and the pool was more or less permanently disabled. Meanwhile, the treadmills and stationary bikes are going out one at a time, just from ordinary wear-and-tear,  and not coming back online. Another huge clue came when we noticed that the gym only turned on the air conditioning when members came to work out. Enter a hot, humid gym and wait for 20 minutes or so for it to cool down. With the gym falling apart, the owners started a membership drive to bring in new people and secure commitments from old members. But the condition of the place made us wary of making that commitment-- the spiral downward towards insolvency had begun.

 

We decided not to re-up and sure enough a few months later the place went bust. Such a pity, really, because it had better facilities by far than any other gym in town. I don't think there was a problem with the lease or rent. It closed at the end of 2008 citing problems with "internal management," and apparently members got full or partial refunds. Great gym killed by poor strategy, leadership, and management. 

[Thainess]

What a pity, it was the best place in BKK to pick up very fit girls under 25 for free during my brief 4-month membership a couple of years ago. I seemed to get lucky every time I went there.

[chilli42]

On 6/10/2017 at 11:19 AM, bkkbudddy said:

But, no AC, during hot season, you're going to die at muscle Factory!

I would have thought so too but it's not as bad as I was expecting.  I was more put off by the traffic getting there.

[balo]

I am not surprised. We have a gym in our condo complex , free to use.

I would not pay a baht for a stupid membership . 

 

Edited June 13, 2017 by balo

[elgenon]

On 6/9/2017 at 6:02 PM, robblok said:

Got my own gym with powerrack bench, plates, barbell, and flooring, a lat pully, a machine for dips and a rowing maching, stepper, iron master dumbells up to 120 lbs and some other stuff.. Not cheap but kept me training and been using it 8 years now so i got part of my money out of it.

Can I use it? 

[theguyfromanotherforum]

I am not surprised. We have a gym in our condo complex , free to use.
I would not pay a baht for a stupid membership . 
 

It's not free. Paid by condo fees hopefully.

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[elgenon]

On 6/11/2017 at 1:36 PM, laban said:

For all the gym lovers, a little bird tells me a European chain of gyms is opening in bangkok, and I am not referring to Virgin Active which is already here.


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Can the little bird PM me? I am about to sign with a gym. 

[lvr181]

"No mention is made of the closure on the company's sign up page." I bet the financial owners have already left the country. 

[elgenon]

On 6/9/2017 at 3:44 PM, kingstonkid said:

And before anyone bashes that this is thailand I can tell you that it happens in Canada and the US quite a bit.

Which chains in America have done this recently?