Planning Visa/Residence for the last 5 years in life

[saakura]

8 hours ago, IgboChief said:

Minor issue: Will tax on capital gains suffice? Cause I do not work here (seriously) and so do not pay income tax.

Is there a minimum amount of annual tax to be paid for the PR?

 

Cheers

Yes there is some consideration given to the amount of taxes being paid, i dont know the details.

[Jim Geiger]

I'm a 28 year veteran of LOS with wife of 25 years. Your question is a good one. Here's what I have done. 

1) I have a clear, simple will drawn by a Thai law firm with a certified translation in Thai. Copy is filed with local district police.

     Will also names wife as executor of my estate. This is legal in Thailand. 

2) Wife has a well defined Power of Attorney (for bank use) enabling her to act in my behalf in the event of dementia. 

3) A living will exists with a local hospital which sets conditions and definition of dementia or permanent loss of consciousness. 

4) A detailed list of my wishes at death to be provided to Thai & US family.

5) US family has been informed of all the above and copied in "Will File".

 

I have been involved with several Expat deaths in which there was no will. It's truly a painful, complicated mess. Regardless of your age, you should do the above. We never know when we will move to the next dimension. 

 

GreyFox

[IgboChief]

Jim and saakura,

 

thank you for the info and the insight.

After thinking it through, my plan for the next 5 years looks like that:

 

1) get an Investor Visa (10 M. THB in Thai Government Bonds)

2) check if the tax on capital gains suffices, otherwise hire 2 Thais for my company, apply for WP, pay myself a (minimum) salary and pay the (minimum) income tax

3) go to school again, learn how to read/write Thai (unfortunately I find that alphabet quite annoying)

4) semi-annual contribution to the local temple and school

5) get a legal counsel and start the application for PR/citizenship

 

Hell of a project though, I would have started that earlier but I am concerned that my application never passes as I live in Isaan.

Cheers!

[GOLDBUGGY]

You are only 40 years old. Keep working and put aside as much money as you can now. Remember that in Thailand; "Man with Money No Have Problem".

 

There are plenty of Visa Services around who speak English and for the right price would take care of all of that for you. If you are a mental state where you don't even know your name or where you are, then I guess it don't much matter to you anymore. Somebody will take care of you somehow. 

[NancyL]

Both you and your wife should have a Final Will and also Power of Attorney so that each can act on the other's behalf should you become incapacitated.  I've known some expats, as young as you, who end up with big problems when their Thai wife (and owner of their home and business) dies suddenly in a traffic accident without a Final Will.

 

As for how to maintain your visa when you're older and the wife and daughter are gone, many many older expats manage quite well on their own, thank you.  I know dozens in their 80s and even 90s.  They use visa agents -- good professional visa agents, who call or email to remind them of upcoming deadlines, fill out the forms, drive them to Imm, etc, not just a cheap agent whose sole functions is to jump the queue.  Some have a trusted housemaid or caregiver who they trained to help with visa matters.

 

And there are several assisted living centers in Chiang Mai where the staff takes care of everything.  Once someone becomes so infirm that they can no longer swear to the veracity of an Income Letter, then the facility can arrange for the resident to go on a medical extension.  They have residents who are have on-going "permanent" medical extensions, extended every 90 days.

 

From a practical standpoint, will Immigration deport an elderly, demented person on overstay?  They don't want to, but the elderly person can become vulnerable to exploitation by police who offer to "fix" the problem for a fee, but don't really do anything.  If the elderly person on overstay is admitted to hospital and unable to pay the bill, then yes, indeed, their Embassy can be pressured into finding a way to return the person to their home country.  I've seen cases as described in this paragraph several times in Chiang Mai.  Also, many of the assisted living facilities won't admit new residents who are on overstay.

[JackThompson]

22 hours ago, IgboChief said:

2) check if the tax on capital gains suffices, otherwise hire 2 Thais for my company, apply for WP, pay myself a (minimum) salary and pay the (minimum) income tax

I am very interested in the answer to this question, as I am also considering a path to citizenship. 

Edited July 5, 2017 by JackThompson

[Mattd]

8 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

I am very interested in the answer to this question, as I am also considering a path to citizenship. 

I would have thought that the requirement is for income tax payments and not capital gains tax payments, as it is an absolute requirement to have a work permit and so by definition be working and paying income tax?

[JackThompson]

1 hour ago, Mattd said:

... it is an absolute requirement to have a work permit ...

That is the piece I was missing - though suspected it to be so.  So we cannot just pay taxes on business-related income (dividends, etc), but must also 'actively work in Thailand' with a work-permit.  Thank You.

[perthperson]

2 hours ago, NancyL said:

Also, many of the assisted living facilities won't admit new residents who are on overstay.

 

I only have experience of one such case and the Immigration Service was spectacularly helpful.

 

It is of absolute importance to ensure the Officer in Command is spoken to and assistance from a well connected Thai person can help in securing this.

 

I am avoiding posting detail to eliminate any possibility of the individual involved being identified but will respond to PMs (Other than to provide personal details) 

[IgboChief]

1 hour ago, Mattd said:

I would have thought that the requirement is for income tax payments and not capital gains tax payments, as it is an absolute requirement to have a work permit and so by definition be working and paying income tax?

This also means you will need to succeed before 60/65 as you won't get a WP after, so indeed starting to think about all of that right now seems reasonable. I actually was also thinking to go with the 20 year PE visa at 70 -- but of course nobody know what options will be available in 30 years, so a bit of an uncertain 2nd choice only. I only know that most of the time at least grandfathering of changed rules exists.

 

Buying a PR in Namibia seems to easier eventually.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

On 7/4/2017 at 11:24 AM, IgboChief said:

Jim and saakura,

 

thank you for the info and the insight.

After thinking it through, my plan for the next 5 years looks like that:

 

1) get an Investor Visa (10 M. THB in Thai Government Bonds)

2) check if the tax on capital gains suffices, otherwise hire 2 Thais for my company, apply for WP, pay myself a (minimum) salary and pay the (minimum) income tax

3) go to school again, learn how to read/write Thai (unfortunately I find that alphabet quite annoying)

4) semi-annual contribution to the local temple and school

5) get a legal counsel and start the application for PR/citizenship

 

Hell of a project though, I would have started that earlier but I am concerned that my application never passes as I live in Isaan.

Cheers!

 

OP, that seems like an awful lot of work and spending and efforts just to accomplish something that can be done much more simply and easily, as per Nancy's comments above and a few others. Plus, your entire plan above is simply about satisfying Immigration, but doesn't deal at all with the more fundamental issues of who will take care of you, should you need it, and your wife is not present at that time.

 

I think the topic you started here is a good one, and part of the reason you were getting nothing answers from some folks is, many here either haven't thought about the issues you're raising or don't want to think about the issues you're raising, because they're complicated and no one really wants to think about the difficult things that can coming with aging.

 

If you've got time, energy and money to spend on the subject now, how about taking care of some of the things Nancy laid out above -- wills and powers of attorney for you and your wife, perhaps visit and tour some of the residential assisted living places, see about making some connections in the nursing community so you'd have somewhere to turn if that became necessary at some point, etc etc.  All of that seems more practical and direct vs putting 10M baht of money into Thai govt bonds and pursuing Thai citizenship.

 

[JackThompson]

Re:

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

... putting 10M baht of money into Thai govt bonds and pursuing Thai citizenship.

Since he has to work with a work-permit, anyway, to qualify to apply for PR or Citizenship, permission-to-stay based on Investment would not be necessary, as he could get a B-Visa + extensions with a job+work-permit. OTOH, one advantage of the Investor Visa in this scenario, would be continuous permission of stay, should work be interrupted.  Many work while on a Non-O based on marriage for the same reason (permit-of-stay not tied to a job) - though that only lasts as long as the marriage, and the OP was considering the possibility of a wife's departure.

 

For those not over 50, the investment-visa is the "surest way" to stay here on an annually-renewable permission-of-stay, not requiring additional, large lump-sum contributions in the future, as with the Elite scheme  As well, working is not permitted on the Elite - but work is required for PR or Citizenship.  If work is permitted with an Investment-based visa (I think so - but correct me if wrong), this would seem to be a stable insurance-policy for avoiding complications with future permission-of-stay.  Who knows what the rules for retirement (or other options) will be in 10 years, when he reaches the age of 50.

[IgboChief]

3 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Plus, your entire plan above is simply about satisfying Immigration, but doesn't deal at all with the more fundamental issues of who will take care of you, should you need it, and your wife is not present at that time.

Yes, because this is the difficult part.

Getting a Nanny/Nurse/Mia Noi is very simple and can be arranged in one evening.

 

Another advantage of the Investors Visa is a kind of small fixed income in THB terms.