Police Check Requirements

[grtaylor]

From the CRB website http://www.crb.org.uk/Default.aspx?page=381

The current legislation does not allow the self-employed or individuals to apply for a CRB check on themselves.

Reading this, and other information on their website, I take it to mean that the only people who can apply for a CRB check on you are "registered bodies".

A Registered Body is an organisation that is registered with the CRB.

These organisations are entitled to ask exempted questions under the Exceptions Order to the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act (ROA) 1974 Exceptions Order 1975 or will countersign applications on behalf of people or organisations who themselves are entitled to ask exempted questions.

I doubt that any organisation in Thailand qualifies as a "registered body".

As far as I know, the document mentioned by the OP is the one a friend of mine had to get recently, having taught in Thailand for three years, in order to get a job teaching in the EU, to confirm she had no criminal record IN THAILAND.

G

[paully]

^ It's UK police reports they want (assuming you're from the UK) - as markg pointed out - confirming your record in the UK, not Thai police reports. You're correct about the CRB though, it's only effectively accessable by registered employers.

[Hadrian1]

It looks like I possibly wasn't so wrong after all....As I said before, the CRB check wasn't available for other member EU states up until as recent as 4 years ago.......Not sure of the situation now. I doubt if it will be avaiable to Thai organisations.

[grtaylor]

Nothing on the British Embassy, Bangkok website. However, from the website of the British Trade and Culture Office (i.e. the "Embassy") in Taiwan:

At present, the UK authorities do not provide police clearance certificates. Applicants can however apply for a subject access reply under the Subject Access Provisions of the Data Protection Act 1998. This is accepted by most foreign authorities in the absence of any other facility.

Looks like thats all you can get overseas. This is what I have just got for an application for Permanent Residency in Thailand. So far, its been accepted.

G

Edited January 11, 2007 by grtaylor

[paulmw]

Nothing on the British Embassy, Bangkok website. However, from the website of the British Trade and Culture Office (i.e. the "Embassy") in Taiwan:

At present, the UK authorities do not provide police clearance certificates. Applicants can however apply for a subject access reply under the Subject Access Provisions of the Data Protection Act 1998. This is accepted by most foreign authorities in the absence of any other facility.

Looks like thats all you can get overseas. This is what I have just got for an application for Permanent Residency in Thailand. So far, its been accepted.

G

Hi G.

Went to Savanaket Lao 25/12/06 to reapply for a B visa was informed all new B visa applications need a home country police back ground check + a Thai one.

E mailed Brit Embassy BKK 3 times nothing has ever come back not even an acknowledgment.

So how dow go about getting this Uk check & whtthe cost? G.

Haven't been back to the UK for 6 yrs left 9 yrs ago to come here.

[grtaylor]

I've just written it up for my school for any new teachers. I've never uploaded a document here before but I'll try

Nothing on the British Embassy, Bangkok website. However, from the website of the British Trade and Culture Office (i.e. the "Embassy") in Taiwan:

At present, the UK authorities do not provide police clearance certificates. Applicants can however apply for a subject access reply under the Subject Access Provisions of the Data Protection Act 1998. This is accepted by most foreign authorities in the absence of any other facility.

Looks like thats all you can get overseas. This is what I have just got for an application for Permanent Residency in Thailand. So far, its been accepted.

G

Hi G.

Went to Savanaket Lao 25/12/06 to reapply for a B visa was informed all new B visa applications need a home country police back ground check + a Thai one.

E mailed Brit Embassy BKK 3 times nothing has ever come back not even an acknowledgment.

So how dow go about getting this Uk check & whtthe cost? G.

Haven't been back to the UK for 6 yrs left 9 yrs ago to come here.

Application_for_Police_Record_Check_for_the_United_Kingdom.doc

[legaleagle]

I live and work in Vietnam in the role of a Manager and de facto HR Manager. Thus, I have spent significant time and effort sorting out the home country criminal check issue. Vietnam is doing a far better job of guaranteeing that one's criminal report is not manufactured on photoshop, as a criminal check requires notarisation at the source, confirmation of the notary by the state, and finally authentication by the VN Embassy within one's home country. This procedure also applies to certification of one's degree. The procedure is far more detailed and reliable than the proposed Thai, as there are several additional steps included. In my opinion, the current Thai requirements, while more onerous than before, are not impossible to follow.

From my experience, it is very easy for Aussies to get the criminal check completed, via the Australian Federal Police. A couple of weeks and you are done. Americans should go to their home state to request a criminal check. Almost every state will issue such a report, with California being the toughest to acquire. The time is approximately one month. UK citizens have the most problematic situation, due to the confidentiality issue which is indeed somewhat more strict than the US or Oz. In addition, it is/was the case that the UK passport was required to be sent to Scotland Yard for several months, during which time you were living in Thailand sans passport. For the UK citizen, I would recommend that you get a solicitor to pull your record (under a power of attorney, i.e., they are you) as the Embassy/Consulate is likely of little help. It sounds like a previous poster may be on to something, with the local constable report, and you might wish to pursue that if possible. Of course, sitting down with a cop you know in Blighty may allow you to walk out the door with a letter/report in the same day.

You should always use FedEx for these reports, as then you can track the package and also save time. Include return labels for the return of the package to you.

The final recommendation I would make is that everyone reading here start TODAY on this, and down the road you'll already have your letter/report when you need it.

Best of luck.

[mopenyang]

I live and work in Vietnam in the role of a Manager and de facto HR Manager. Thus, I have spent significant time and effort sorting out the home country criminal check issue. Vietnam is doing a far better job of guaranteeing that one's criminal report is not manufactured on photoshop, as a criminal check requires notarisation at the source, confirmation of the notary by the state, and finally authentication by the VN Embassy within one's home country. This procedure also applies to certification of one's degree. The procedure is far more detailed and reliable than the proposed Thai, as there are several additional steps included. In my opinion, the current Thai requirements, while more onerous than before, are not impossible to follow.

From my experience, it is very easy for Aussies to get the criminal check completed, via the Australian Federal Police. A couple of weeks and you are done. Americans should go to their home state to request a criminal check. Almost every state will issue such a report, with California being the toughest to acquire. The time is approximately one month. UK citizens have the most problematic situation, due to the confidentiality issue which is indeed somewhat more strict than the US or Oz. In addition, it is/was the case that the UK passport was required to be sent to Scotland Yard for several months, during which time you were living in Thailand sans passport. For the UK citizen, I would recommend that you get a solicitor to pull your record (under a power of attorney, i.e., they are you) as the Embassy/Consulate is likely of little help. It sounds like a previous poster may be on to something, with the local constable report, and you might wish to pursue that if possible. Of course, sitting down with a cop you know in Blighty may allow you to walk out the door with a letter/report in the same day.

You should always use FedEx for these reports, as then you can track the package and also save time. Include return labels for the return of the package to you.

The final recommendation I would make is that everyone reading here start TODAY on this, and down the road you'll already have your letter/report when you need it.

Best of luck.

Has the Vietnamese government issued all these instructions in English? If it has, how about providing a link?

[grtaylor]

I guess a solicitor in the UK could do it for you, but they won't be able to get any more than you can yourself. It will be the same "Subject Access Report". As I quoted before, private citizens cannot access their CRB record, only registered prospective employers or agencies.

G

I live and work in Vietnam in the role of a Manager and de facto HR Manager. Thus, I have spent significant time and effort sorting out the home country criminal check issue. Vietnam is doing a far better job of guaranteeing that one's criminal report is not manufactured on photoshop, as a criminal check requires notarisation at the source, confirmation of the notary by the state, and finally authentication by the VN Embassy within one's home country. This procedure also applies to certification of one's degree. The procedure is far more detailed and reliable than the proposed Thai, as there are several additional steps included. In my opinion, the current Thai requirements, while more onerous than before, are not impossible to follow.

From my experience, it is very easy for Aussies to get the criminal check completed, via the Australian Federal Police. A couple of weeks and you are done. Americans should go to their home state to request a criminal check. Almost every state will issue such a report, with California being the toughest to acquire. The time is approximately one month. UK citizens have the most problematic situation, due to the confidentiality issue which is indeed somewhat more strict than the US or Oz. In addition, it is/was the case that the UK passport was required to be sent to Scotland Yard for several months, during which time you were living in Thailand sans passport. For the UK citizen, I would recommend that you get a solicitor to pull your record (under a power of attorney, i.e., they are you) as the Embassy/Consulate is likely of little help. It sounds like a previous poster may be on to something, with the local constable report, and you might wish to pursue that if possible. Of course, sitting down with a cop you know in Blighty may allow you to walk out the door with a letter/report in the same day.

You should always use FedEx for these reports, as then you can track the package and also save time. Include return labels for the return of the package to you.

The final recommendation I would make is that everyone reading here start TODAY on this, and down the road you'll already have your letter/report when you need it.

Best of luck.

[paulmw]

Thanks for the link grtaylor.

Good mind to E the foreign office over the lack of help from the embassy.

I've just written it up for my school for any new teachers. I've never uploaded a document here before but I'll try

Nothing on the British Embassy, Bangkok website. However, from the website of the British Trade and Culture Office (i.e. the "Embassy") in Taiwan:

At present, the UK authorities do not provide police clearance certificates. Applicants can however apply for a subject access reply under the Subject Access Provisions of the Data Protection Act 1998. This is accepted by most foreign authorities in the absence of any other facility.

Looks like thats all you can get overseas. This is what I have just got for an application for Permanent Residency in Thailand. So far, its been accepted.

G

Hi G.

Went to Savanaket Lao 25/12/06 to reapply for a B visa was informed all new B visa applications need a home country police back ground check + a Thai one.

E mailed Brit Embassy BKK 3 times nothing has ever come back not even an acknowledgment.

So how dow go about getting this Uk check & whtthe cost? G.

Haven't been back to the UK for 6 yrs left 9 yrs ago to come here.

[paulmw]

Thanks for the link grtaylor.

Good mind to E the foreign office over the lack of help from the UK embassy.

The next problem is a tenner cheque don't have any contacts or bank in the Uk, burnt all my bridges when I left.

But thanks now on the right track

I don't think this is just for newbee's.

If u are changing contracts ( new school) with no teachers licence which I was.

You are going to come up against this.

Thanks again grtaylor.

Paul

I've just written it up for my school for any new teachers. I've never uploaded a document here before but I'll try

Nothing on the British Embassy, Bangkok website. However, from the website of the British Trade and Culture Office (i.e. the "Embassy") in Taiwan:

At present, the UK authorities do not provide police clearance certificates. Applicants can however apply for a subject access reply under the Subject Access Provisions of the Data Protection Act 1998. This is accepted by most foreign authorities in the absence of any other facility.

Looks like thats all you can get overseas. This is what I have just got for an application for Permanent Residency in Thailand. So far, its been accepted.

G

Hi G.

Went to Savanaket Lao 25/12/06 to reapply for a B visa was informed all new B visa applications need a home country police back ground check + a Thai one.

E mailed Brit Embassy BKK 3 times nothing has ever come back not even an acknowledgment.

So how dow go about getting this Uk check & whtthe cost? G.

Haven't been back to the UK for 6 yrs left 9 yrs ago to come here.

[paulsmithson]

Not sure if this is the same thing but here in the UK I paid a tenner early december and this week recieved a statement from the police that I have no criminal record.

[grtaylor]

Yes, that will be the same thing.

G

Not sure if this is the same thing but here in the UK I paid a tenner early december and this week recieved a statement from the police that I have no criminal record.

[markg]

UK citizens have the most problematic situation, due to the confidentiality issue which is indeed somewhat more strict than the US or Oz. In addition, it is/was the case that the UK passport was required to be sent to Scotland Yard for several months, during which time you were living in Thailand sans passport.

When i got my subject access done last year, i had a photocopy of my passport notarized at a local legal firm, who also included the solicitors credentials etc and tied it all together with a golden ribbon. It was about 500 baht. The cops in England accepted this.

However - as i have mentioned before, i believe that this check is technically not valid for use abroad and we should get the CRB check done. The Thai's probably wont realise this though so i reckon you would get away with the Subject access check.

Good luck

[grtaylor]

My point in an earlier message was that, as far as I know you cannot get a UK CRB check abroad, as its not available to private citizens, only to registered UK organisations or agencies. See their website (CRB).

The website I quoted earlier (British Trade and Culture Office, Taipei) says the following:

"At present, the UK authorities do not provide police clearance certificates. Applicants can however apply for a subject access reply under the Subject Access Provisions of the Data Protection Act 1998. This is accepted by most foreign authorities in the absence of any other facility." (my highlight)

G

However - as i have mentioned before, i believe that this check is technically not valid for use abroad and we should get the CRB check done. The Thai's probably wont realise this though so i reckon you would get away with the Subject access check.

Good luck

[grtaylor]

In reply to the post about police checks, I email my local police and this is what they sent back to me, I have attatched forms also.

Hope this helps.

I write in connection with your request for information dated 18th January 2007 concerning:

Personal information.

Your request for information has now been considered and I am not obliged to supply the information you have requested. Such information is exempt under section 40 of the Freedom of Information Act 2000. This exemption applies because the right given under the Act to request official information held by public authorities does not apply to personal data - any such requests become subject access requests under the Data Protection Act 1998.

In accordance with the Act, this letter represents a Refusal Notice for this particular request. This action cannot be taken as confirmation or denial that Nottinghamshire Police holds the information you have asked for.

Should you wish to know what information (if any) Nottinghamshire Police holds about you, or you would like confirmation that you do, or do not have a prosecution/conviction history, you must complete a Subject Access form. Payment of a £10.00 fee and proof of identification must accompany a completed application form. Such a form is enclosed.

Please note that once we have received your completed application the process to provide you with information can take up to 40 days.

I would like to this opportunity to thank you for your interest in Nottinghamshire Police.

Yours sincerely,

Jude Bentley

FOI Officer

Exactly what I got from my County Police.

G

[PeaceBlondie]

So, it would appear (but nothing's ever certain) that UK citizens residing abroad cannot get a CRB check, but they can get a Subject Access form for ten pounds. And how much, total, would it cost for the FedEx charges? And it takes how many weeks?

What about USA, NZ, Ireland, Australia, Cameroon, Sierra Leone, Romania, Slovenia, Canada, France, Belgium, South Africa, China, Netherlands, Japan, and Korea? I only mention those, being familiar with farang who teach in Thailand, who are from those countries.

If Thais wish to protect their children and themselves from criminals, they need to train themselves in knowing how to check credentials. They cannot. They will not. It will not happen, except on a very sporadic basis. Also, educational authorities who already reject authentic degrees for the silliest of reasons ("It's written in Latin!") may reject perfectly authentic criminal record clearances.

Yes, some consulates and embassies abroad were saying that they required such checks, recently. What about Immigration Police, and the Ministries of Labour and Education? How official is it, actually?

If I started trying to get my FBI clearance tomorrow (consulate, fingerprinting, mailing it, waiting, paying, etc.), it would take about three months, if I was lucky. That's good timing, if I wanted to start teaching in May. But no sooner.

[grtaylor]

Hi

Apparently you can have it sent by email or I think so as they give it as an option.

Not sure who you're replying to, but you definitely can't do the UK one by email. You can download the application form, but then it must be done by normal mail.

G

Edited January 21, 2007 by grtaylor

[BlackArtemis]

My friend just got his Visa in Laos, a lot of people were not told about this and were turned away. After he gave them the documents they were not even sure what to do because he was the first one to even provide it to them...

[PeaceBlondie]

I just read all 81 posts on this thread. I wish we could just delete all the 'wrong' opinions, but WE DO NOT KNOW. This is Thailand, the land of unspoken "I don't know." I wish we could post a pinned topic: How to Get a Criminal Record Check from Your Home Country," but we can't. The Brits have argued among themselves; two of the Americans seem to have hit a brick wall (yes, another brick in the wall; hey, teacher, leave those kids alone!).

I was wrong about the rumour I thought I heard, that the MFA met with its people and reversed its decision. Nobody knows, including the MFA, Immigration, MOE, MOL. Same as it ever was.

Like Steven, I've been checking other forums, and it looks just as bare of facts there, as well. But renewals of visas and WP's seem to not require police checks.

Good for Robski, refusing a job offer to work illegally. And the lass at the rajabat. Ask your interview committee to show you the work permits it got for the current farang teachers. See what they know about this idiotic, impossible snafu of a Catch-22. They won't know.

[Loaded]

I know someone who this week obtained a multi-entry non-immB from a UK Thai consulate for a teacher without needing any sort of police clearance. If you pm, I'll give you the name of the consulate.

[aqua4]

What a really negative thread. I am somewhat surprised that the Mods are so negative. Interesting question though is how many teachers will be left when the new school year starts. With an existing shortage adding on the raids will only make it worst. Does this push up salaries? Maybe that would be a dream.

I spoke to a friend of mine who has been running a teachers agency for the past 5 years in Thailand. He told me last week that it is becoming impossible to satisfy everyone and that he is closing up shop at the end of this school term. The reasons he says vary. Firstly it is becoming very difficult to find teachers, with or without degrees. There are just not that many over the last 2 years and has been on a steady decline. Secondly, the schools are becoming impossible to deal with in what they require. For 30k they want a teacher who has a B.Ed and the more he tries to explain that it would be impossible, the more they sit in disbelief. They also cannot set their timetable or hours correctly and at times want teachers to come in on Saturdays because kids had sports or other activities during the week. Added on is the new rules which makes it near impossible to find anyone. Those who he has here are planning on leaving. They don't see the new rules making teaching in Thailand worth its while. I asked him where they are planning on heading and he said mainly Korea and China. He took out a page and wrote something to this effect down:

Thailand

30,000 Baht - Accommodation (4,000 Baht) = 26,000 Baht

China

5,000 Yuan (23,000 Baht) + Free Accommodation + free annual return airline ticket.

There is a lower cost of living in China I am told compared to Thailand. The schools in China also handle all the paperwork for the teachers. I look at Bangkok and I see over the past 3 years how many language centers have fallen off the map. It makes me ponder and I think that speaking English very well is going to be in the elitist domain. It will only be kids whose parents have money that would not be affected. Lower and middle class, I think they will have a rough ride.

[mickeyrex]

Just wanted to say that if someone has a degree and experience, they can easily find a position paying 8,000 to 10,000 RMB in China. All it takes is a bit of research. Also, most of the free housing will be apartments, not frickin' overpriced bedsits like the one I'm posting from.

[roamer]

Well latest news in from several of my friends going through this process is that UK police reports are now required and that they have been basically told to go away and get one before applying for their non-imm B visa. They were originally told to get their police reports from the Bangkok police but that has now moved a goal post and it's back to your home country you must go. All of these guys are resident here in LOS and all of them recently got rejected from Penang for failing to have this police report.

If anyone is interested, I got my police report around August last year from the UK, it took about 8 weeks, cost me 10 pounds and all it said when it came back was "no police record found" and it was as non descript as you could get and no finger prints where required to obtain it either. But then again, i'm not here teaching English to kids so maybe all of this nonesense doesn't apply to me although my current employer did request this police record before extending my contract.

So, if anyone would like a genuine copy of a genuine UK police report to erhum maybe scan in and push through photoshop for a bit of creative engineering then you are more than welcome to have mine.

Just lifted this from immigration thread, looks like it going to take more than creative engineering !

"I spoke to the Thai consul in Hull yesterday as I already have my UK police check dated the 8th Jan but have suffered delay in my travel plans and will not arrive in BKK till late March when the document will be almost 3 months old.

His advice was to take it to Immigration right away before it is 3 months old.

He also told me to go to the BKK British embassy and get a letter from them regarding the monies I have banked here in the UK.

He also advised be to have the police check notarised!! This I do not understand as I tried to photocopy it and the result was that it will not copy without white lettering appearing in the new background saying FRAUD. Clever stuff eh.

What is the point in having an original document notarised????"

Incidently, I can just imagine the confusion this is going to cause when immigration or whoever start doing photocopies of this document

[Casanundra]

Well latest news in from several of my friends going through this process is that UK police reports are now required and that they have been basically told to go away and get one before applying for their non-imm B visa. They were originally told to get their police reports from the Bangkok police but that has now moved a goal post and it's back to your home country you must go. All of these guys are resident here in LOS and all of them recently got rejected from Penang for failing to have this police report.

If anyone is interested, I got my police report around August last year from the UK, it took about 8 weeks, cost me 10 pounds and all it said when it came back was "no police record found" and it was as non descript as you could get and no finger prints where required to obtain it either. But then again, i'm not here teaching English to kids so maybe all of this nonesense doesn't apply to me although my current employer did request this police record before extending my contract.

So, if anyone would like a genuine copy of a genuine UK police report to erhum maybe scan in and push through photoshop for a bit of creative engineering then you are more than welcome to have mine.

Just lifted this from immigration thread, looks like it going to take more than creative engineering !

"I spoke to the Thai consul in Hull yesterday as I already have my UK police check dated the 8th Jan but have suffered delay in my travel plans and will not arrive in BKK till late March when the document will be almost 3 months old.

His advice was to take it to Immigration right away before it is 3 months old.

He also told me to go to the BKK British embassy and get a letter from them regarding the monies I have banked here in the UK.

He also advised be to have the police check notarised!! This I do not understand as I tried to photocopy it and the result was that it will not copy without white lettering appearing in the new background saying FRAUD. Clever stuff eh.

What is the point in having an original document notarised????"

Incidently, I can just imagine the confusion this is going to cause when immigration or whoever start doing photocopies of this document

That's why I haven't made it available, I noticed the Fraud bit when I copied my original as well.

I am not sure why you would need to go through the hassle of going to the British embassy for them to confirm your overseas money because once you have the visa O or B then it doesn't matter unless of course you are coming here as a retiree or to support your Thai wife and looking to extend it in some way.

As for the police report itself, well I heard back from several of my friends again today for an update on their position and they all got their police reports only to then be told by the labour office to get it notorised by the embassy, then to get it translated into Thai and then notorised again by the Thai police. so off they all went (3 of them) and did the first two parts but when they got to the Thai police station, they were told to bugger off as it was not their job to notorise the Thai version of the UK police report and sent them packing. So now they are in that wonderful position of the labour office pointing them towards the Thai police station and the Thai police sending them away again saying it's not their job. Catch 22.

You have to laugh.

Edited January 25, 2007 by Casanundra

[PeaceBlondie]

So now they are in that wonderful position of the labour office pointing them towards the Thai police station and the Thai police sending them away again saying it's not their job. Catch 22.

You have to laugh.

Or you have to cry.

[Ijustwannateach]

Aqua, you can tell us your agency-friend's story and not understand why we mods are so negative? Go back and read your own post again, from a teacher's point of view!!!

In any "normal" country, economics would start to increase salaries- and even here, they will increase gradually- but not before there's a crisis. The schools that your agency-friend deals with will become believers when they open term with empty teacher desks (or more likely, unreliable illegal backpackers or non-Thai Asian teachers). No native-speaking B.Ed worth his salt would be working in Bangkok for less than 100K.

"Steven"

[Loaded]

So now they are in that wonderful position of the labour office pointing them towards the Thai police station and the Thai police sending them away again saying it's not their job. Catch 22.

You have to laugh.

Or you have to cry.

or do what Thais do - smile!

I think every Thai must be on drugs.

[Loaded]

OK, A Subject Access report for Brits

What about Americans? How can they obtain a police records clearance check thing? PB? Steven?

[Ijustwannateach]

There's a similar thread running in the visa section right now.

One of the problems for the Americans is going to be multiple jurisdictions- does a police report mean one from the local police in the place where you last lived? Or all the places you lived for a period of 10 years? State or city? FBI would only have jurisdiction over federal (interstate) crimes, so does that really cover the kind of crimes the process would be looking to avoid? Who knows?

I agree with PB that Thailand is not the best country to be planning to start work in for the next year or so.

"Steven"