Can you get a work permit from a Non O spouse visa 1 year multiple entry?

[Maca]

I got a Non O spouse visa back in May from Laos Savaankhet Thai embassy. I have just been offered a job at an international school in Bangkok, first they claimed that Id have to get another Non O from Samut Prakan immigration office , first a one month then a apply for a year one. Now they are claiming that Samut Prakan immigration will not process a work permit from a Non O and I will have to get a Non B visa. I think this is just to avoid them doing more paperwork, is there any truth in what they are saying?

[ubonjoe]

You can get a work permit and work with a non-o visa based upon marriage.

Immigration does not issue work permit so somebody is asking at the wrong place. Work permits are issued by the department of employe of the Labor Ministry.

A copy of your marriage certificate will be needed when the application for the work permit is done.

You getting it done with the non-o visa saves them paperwork at immigration since nothing needs to be done there.  For the work permit it is the same.

[Maca]

What the school just told me was the immigration at Samut prakan have to approve the Non immigrant visa before you can get a work permit from the Ministry of Labour and that they will not approve a Non O only a Non B. Is there any truth in that or would they just go straight to the M of L to get the work permit?

[overherebc]

No reason to involve Imm'.

I've worked constantly on non O multiples although obviously you have to leave and return every 90 days.

Local labour office is the place to go.

As posted before Imm' don't have anything to do with WP's .

My feeling is they want you to change to an extension so when the job finishes they can cancell your extension and you will get 7 days to leave Thailand, their thinking is that it makes it difficult for you to claim anything like severence.

On a multi O you keep the visa when the work ends.

Just my idea though.

[Maca]

That's my feeling as well, the school has far more power over you with a Non B because as you say when they cancel your work permit along with your Non B then you have 7 days to leave. With a Non O the school has no power over you staying in Thailand....

[elviajero]

2 hours ago, overherebc said:

My feeling is they want you to change to an extension so when the job finishes they can cancell your extension and you will get 7 days to leave Thailand, their thinking is that it makes it difficult for you to claim anything like severence.

On a multi O you keep the visa when the work ends.

Just my idea though.

2 hours ago, Maca said:

That's my feeling as well, the school has far more power over you with a Non B because as you say when they cancel your work permit along with your Non B then you have 7 days to leave. With a Non O the school has no power over you staying in Thailand....

Conspiracy theories!!

 

All that is happening in this case, as with others, is that the school/people involved don't know the rules/regulations.

[elviajero]

3 hours ago, Maca said:

What the school just told me was the immigration at Samut prakan have to approve the Non immigrant visa before you can get a work permit from the Ministry of Labour and that they will not approve a Non O only a Non B. Is there any truth in that or would they just go straight to the M of L to get the work permit?

It could be that the local labour office want the local immigration office to confirm that your immigration status is valid for a work permit.

 

The labour office should provide your employer with a list of requirements and that's where you will find your answer.

[overherebc]

14 minutes ago, elviajero said:

It could be that the local labour office want the local immigration office to confirm that your immigration status is valid for a work permit.

 

The labour office should provide your employer with a list of requirements and that's where you will find your answer.

The requirement for a WP is a Non Immigrant Visa or extension of such. 

It does not stipulate O, B or anything else, simply Non Immigrant.

[elviajero]

Just now, overherebc said:

The requirement for a WP is a Non Immigrant Visa or extension of such. 

It does not stipulate O, B or anything else, simply Non Immigrant.

I know.

 

But it is perfectly reasonable for the labour office to seek confirmation from the immigration office that the applicants immigration status meets the criteria. Rather than the labour office making the decision themselves.

[overherebc]

1 minute ago, elviajero said:

I know.

 

But it is perfectly reasonable for the labour office to seek confirmation from the immigration office that the applicants immigration status meets the criteria. Rather than the labour office making the decision themselves.

Never happened to me over a 15/16 year working life here.

Rayong office.

[elviajero]

Just now, overherebc said:

Never happened to me over a 15/16 year working life here.

Rayong office.

And because Rayong don't do that means every labour office in the country don't! After 15/16 years you should know that immigration and labour offices have 'local requirements' and often process applications differently. 

 

The labour office needs to confirm that the applicant has a qualifying permit to stay. How they document that confirmation is down to the labour office.

[overherebc]

6 minutes ago, elviajero said:

And because Rayong don't do that means every labour office in the country don't! After 15/16 years you should know that immigration and labour offices have 'local requirements' and often process applications differently. 

 

The labour office needs to confirm that the applicant has a qualifying permit to stay. How they document that confirmation is down to the labour office.

Read the OP. He's talking about what his school are telling him not what the labour office are saying.

His school are saying, is the expression, not the labour office are saying.

Obviously no one at the school has a clue who or what to ask.

My advice is go to the labour office yourself and ask.

They have a lot more knowledge of WP's than schools or local Imm' offices.

[overherebc]

I'll repeat what I have posted on other threads.

The OP has to firmly but politely push the school into contacting the Labour Office, not Imm'.

 

[elviajero]

1 hour ago, overherebc said:

The OP has to firmly but politely push the school into contacting the Labour Office, not Imm'.

How do you know the school haven't already contacted the labour office and were instructed to contact immigration.

 

The simple point I was making is that the labour office might have an arrangement with the immigration office for the immigration office to confirm the applicants visa/permit status.

 

If either the immigrant office or labour office insist on a non 'B' entry then the OP can be as polite and firm as they want. It will change nothing.

[lemonjelly]

I know.
 
But it is perfectly reasonable for the labour office to seek confirmation from the immigration office that the applicants immigration status meets the criteria. Rather than the labour office making the decision themselves.

The immigration office should confirm that the applicant meets the labor office's criteria? Lol


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[lemonjelly]

It's just another case of Thai personnel making up their own version of the facts


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[JackThompson]

2 hours ago, overherebc said:

I'll repeat what I have posted on other threads.

The OP has to firmly but politely push the school into contacting the Labour Office, not Imm'.

 

And, possibly go to the labor-office in-person, and simply show them his Non-O based stay, and ask them if there is any problem - maybe get anything they have in writing - since the person at the school might say anything just to get him to do their "usual process" - and leave his permission-of-stay tied to his job, which they might prefer.

[Maestro]

4 hours ago, elviajero said:

I know.

 

But it is perfectly reasonable for the labour office to seek confirmation from the immigration office that the applicants immigration status meets the criteria. Rather than the labour office making the decision themselves.

 

The immigration office has no criteria for the issuance of a work permit; the Department of Employment (DoE) has these criteria. The DoE will not ask immigration to confirm that an applicant for a work permit meets the DoE's criteria.

[Maestro]

If the school talked to immigration, an immigration official may have given the criteria for an application for extension of stay for the reason of employment, but certainly not for an application for a work permit.

[Maestro]

42 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

...the person at the school might say anything just to get him to do their "usual process" - and leave his permission-of-stay tied to his job, which they might prefer.

 

That may very well be the case here. An employer has a vested interest in getting a foreign employee to go the route of annual extensions based on employment.

[elviajero]

2 hours ago, Maestro said:

The DoE will not ask immigration to confirm that an applicant for a work permit meets the DoE's criteria.

They could.

[elviajero]

2 hours ago, Maestro said:

 

That may very well be the case here. An employer has a vested interest in getting a foreign employee to go the route of annual extensions based on employment.

It what way would such an employer gain?

[hgma]

I go with Joe!

[overherebc]

8 hours ago, elviajero said:

It what way would such an employer gain?

It's a perception that some employers adhere to.

We can control you better when we are in charge of your visa and WP.

In general the companies that want to keep your WP and allow you no access to it are the ones that try to push you into an extension rather than using your own visa.

It works well for them in the case of younger employees who are much easier to control and more likely just to accept the 7 days and leave, go home or somewhere else not realising that they are missing out on severence pay and tax returns, if any, that they might be entitled to.

I have even had companies try to cancel my multi O at times and tell me it was the law I had to go back to UK.

[Maca]

To settle the matter the school went to the immigration office in Samut Prakan and asked there without contacting the Ministry of Labour in any way. It was immigration who said  you can only get a work permit through a Non B not a Non O and as pointed out earlier immigration have nothing to do with the issuing of work permits. So either immigration have the wrong information or the school is lying which is plausible as the HR woman in charge of visas and WP already told me she got a WP for a teacher with a Non O spouse visa.

[Maca]

54 minutes ago, overherebc said:

In general the companies that want to keep your WP and allow you no access to it are the ones that try to push you into an extension rather than using your own visa.

Funnily enough that's exactly what this school does, I asked at the interview and they said you have to sign a release form to 'borrow' your work permit. As I haven't signed the contract yet and have contested their claim that I have to give up my Non O for Non B I would imagine they are now looking for someone else to hire. Which considering the unprofessional way they operate is probably no loss

[overherebc]

1 hour ago, Maca said:

Funnily enough that's exactly what this school does, I asked at the interview and they said you have to sign a release form to 'borrow' your work permit. As I haven't signed the contract yet and have contested their claim that I have to give up my Non O for Non B I would imagine they are now looking for someone else to hire. Which considering the unprofessional way they operate is probably no loss

Years ago I worked for a company that did the same thing. I just kept 'forgetting' to hand it back. I needed it at the time to buy a car, finance company asked for it before they would agree terms etc.

[elviajero]

9 hours ago, overherebc said:

It's a perception that some employers adhere to.

We can control you better when we are in charge of your visa and WP.

In general the companies that want to keep your WP and allow you no access to it are the ones that try to push you into an extension rather than using your own visa.

It works well for them in the case of younger employees who are much easier to control and more likely just to accept the 7 days and leave, go home or somewhere else not realising that they are missing out on severence pay and tax returns, if any, that they might be entitled to.

I have even had companies try to cancel my multi O at times and tell me it was the law I had to go back to UK.

You are talking about bad practise on the part of unscrupulous employers.

• Whether or not you have a visa or an extension of stay they can cancel your WP.
• A company could keep a WP regardless of whether you have a visa or extension of stay.
• I have heard of companies claiming that they will cancel someones extension of stay too, which they can't.

The problems you have described are down to bad employers and uninformed employees. In reality an employer has no more control over someone regardless of the basis of the permit to stay.

 

 

[elviajero]

8 hours ago, Maca said:

To settle the matter the school went to the immigration office in Samut Prakan and asked there without contacting the Ministry of Labour in any way. It was immigration who said  you can only get a work permit through a Non B not a Non O and as pointed out earlier immigration have nothing to do with the issuing of work permits. So either immigration have the wrong information or the school is lying which is plausible as the HR woman in charge of visas and WP already told me she got a WP for a teacher with a Non O spouse visa.

The school have no reason to contact immigration unless instructed to by the labour department. The school need to contact the labour office and ask them what's needed to issue your WP and the labour office will tell them. Most labour offices will simply require a copy of your visa/permit to stay and if it's a non 'O' visa they will want a copy of your marriage certificate.

 

 

[lemonjelly]

Funnily enough that's exactly what this school does, I asked at the interview and they said you have to sign a release form to 'borrow' your work permit. As I haven't signed the contract yet and have contested their claim that I have to give up my Non O for Non B I would imagine they are now looking for someone else to hire. Which considering the unprofessional way they operate is probably no loss

Walk away from it, I certainly wouldn't give up my non-o just to work for a school and thus put my permission to stay at their whimsical mercy..... easy enough to find private clients, especially around BKK.


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