Are people who use smart phones smarter?

[thaibeachlovers]

15 minutes ago, amvet said:

Confirmed the damage the next day in daylight as the critters left a large path of damage.

Can you give a link to the newspaper article or forum thread about it? If not, then I don't believe it.

 

[amvet]

15 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Used to be a few elephants wandering around begging for people to buy bananas to feed them. Same in Bkk. One of the tragedies that happened when they stopped logging.

Unfortunately, many were injured by vehicles and the law now forbids it, I believe. Anyway, there haven't been elephants wandering Pattaya for years.

My photo from 1997.

 

 

Rioting elephants, I think not.

They had red lights on their tails and when spooked could charge anything.  I realize your point is to attack me personally and not discuss anything about the topic but the elephants didn't riot they charged a bar entertainment area which caused the people to riot trying to get away.  I know as I was there and was one of the people who ran.  When it occurred has nothing to do with the topic as I was explaining to a poster as a result of another personal attack that my I had quite a full life and that since moving to Thailand 20 years ago had encountered many hazards and trials that go along with living in a 3rd world country. 

Edited September 17, 2017 by amvet

[amvet]

4 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Can you give a link to the newspaper article or forum thread about it? If not, then I don't believe it.

 

I would not give you the time of day.  Let alone provide you with more information to attack me about something that has nothing to do with the topic.  Had you been a decent sort of chap I would have given you the name of the bar which is still there and sustained the majority of the damage and they would readily confirm what happened. 

[thaibeachlovers]

48 minutes ago, amvet said:

Medical science has spent billions, that is billions, on research for smart phone apps to transmit medical information so doctors can better diagnose and treat patients.  

 

They didn't know what you seem to that those billions spent was and is unnecessary.   

 

To re phrase you are writing that an unconscious patient with a allergy bracelet will get the same care as a patient where the doctor has access to a thousand pages of medical history and records.  Ya sure.  

Well, in the hospitals I worked in, patients did indeed get the same care. We didn't discriminate.

BTW, hospitals have been treating patients long before mobile phones existed, yet we managed somehow to save lives and make the sick better.

Seems incredible, but when I started there weren't even any computers on the wards. Wasn't till 1992 that I saw my first computer in a hospital.

[Antonymous]

1 hour ago, amvet said:

Since the majority of people access the internet and email on a smart phone I really don't know what your point is.

You said: “Your statement, " Telephones are invasive and distracting." could have been made shorly after the invention of the phone by Alexander Bell. “

 

I replied:“It could yes. But you see, they didn't have the perfect alternative of internet and email back then did they?”

 

My point? It is not that little piece of plastic and metal in your hand per se that is invasive and distracting (duh), but the telephone call.

 

If your phone is switched on a telephone call demands to be answered, or you switch it off and annoy the caller. And if it is switched off you get a ‘missed call’ message later that also demands an answer. You may know who called, but not why they called. You may not even know who called. All of which is invasive and distracting (and can be stressful too).

 

With an email you know who sent it, what the message is about, you can read it when you want and reply at leisure without being drawn into a conversation you may not want. Nobody expects you to reply immediately.

 

Plus you have a permanent record of all conversations to refer to at a later date if needed. I have a 20 years database of every incoming and outgoing email ever sent which I can search (with email software) in seconds with any word or string or subject to bring up every mention of that issue. That’s invaluable. Telephone, not.

[amvet]

5 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Well, in the hospitals I worked in, patients did indeed get the same care. We didn't discriminate.

BTW, hospitals have been treating patients long before mobile phones existed, yet we managed somehow to save lives and make the sick better.

Seems incredible, but when I started there weren't even any computers on the wards. Wasn't till 1992 that I saw my first computer in a hospital.

They could not possibly get the same care because the doctor would not have the same amount of information.  How would the doctor know if you had a history of heart problems or what had been done to treat them or any other other complications that occurred and your history of medications taken (not allergic to but consumed).  And pray tell would the medical profession spend billions to develop more and better ways to store and transmit medical records on smart phones if they didn't deem it important?

[thaibeachlovers]

6 minutes ago, amvet said:

They had red lights on their tails and when spooked could charge anything.  I realize your point is to attack me personally and not discuss anything about the topic but the elephants didn't riot they charged a bar entertainment area which caused the people to riot trying to get away.  I know as I was there and was one of the people who ran.  When it occurred has nothing to do with the topic as I was explaining to a poster as a result of another personal attack that my I had quite a full life and that since moving to Thailand 20 years ago had encountered many hazards and trials that go along with living in a 3rd world country. 

YOU claimed there was an elephant "riot" in Pattaya, not me.

 

I never saw a red lights on their tails, in Pattaya or in Bkk, but sometimes they had an old CD as a reflector tied on.

Google brings up nothing about an elephant causing damage to bars in Pattaya, which leads me to believe it didn't happen, but if you can give us a link, I will accept that.

 

I have no interest in "attacking" you personally or otherwise, and I believe I have discussed the topic quite fully. However, I do get somewhat annoyed when people imply those of us that choose not to use so called smartphones are dumb.

 

Surely you realise that posting such a contentious subject on farang pub is going to attract push back?

 

Had you restricted the subject to a discussion as to the benefits of smartphones, or otherwise, I would not have bothered to even click on it. However, to imply that they make people "smarter" was never going to get away without a response.

[Travel2003]

When I got my first smart phone, I quickly realized the phone was smarter than me.

[amvet]

4 minutes ago, Antonymous said:

You said: “Your statement, " Telephones are invasive and distracting." could have been made shorly after the invention of the phone by Alexander Bell. “

 

I replied:“It could yes. But you see, they didn't have the perfect alternative of internet and email back then did they?”

 

My point? It is not that little piece of plastic and metal in your hand per se that is invasive and distracting (duh), but the telephone call.

 

If your phone is switched on a telephone call demands to be answered, or you switch it off and annoy the caller. And if it is switched off you get a ‘missed call’ message later that also demands an answer. You may know who called, but not why they called. You may not even know who called. All of which is invasive and distracting (and can be stressful too).

 

With an email you know who sent it, what the message is about, you can read it when you want and reply at leisure without being drawn into a conversation you may not want. Nobody expects you to reply immediately.

 

Plus you have a permanent record of all conversations to refer to at a later date if needed. I have a 20 years database of every incoming and outgoing email ever sent which I can search (with email software) in seconds with any word or string or subject to bring up every mention of that issue. That’s invaluable. Telephone, not.

 

They had the telegraph before the telephone so they could have sent a printed message easier and after that the teletype and after that the Telex. 

 

My phone keeps records of who calls when and for how long. 

 

In 2022, monthly mobile data traffic per active smartphone in North America will reach 26 GB per phone.

https://www.ericsson.com/assets/local/mobility-report/documents/2017/ericsson-mobility-report-june-2017-raso.pdf

[Antonymous]

OP,

 

You wanted to know if people who use smart phones are smarter and the resounding weight of answers is ‘NO’. A large proportion of smart phone users are definitely not very smart and I’m sure a proportion of dumb phone users aren’t smart either. But that has nothing to do with their choice of phone use.

 

There’s been ample evidence in this thread to show that non-smart phone users can be smart. The only poster who agreed with you said that dumb phone users are all dumb, which says a lot about how smart he is!

 

Surely you have your answer now?

[amvet]

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

YOU claimed there was an elephant "riot" in Pattaya, not me.

 

I never saw a red lights on their tails, in Pattaya or in Bkk, but sometimes they had an old CD as a reflector tied on.

Google brings up nothing about an elephant causing damage to bars in Pattaya, which leads me to believe it didn't happen, but if you can give us a link, I will accept that.

 

I have no interest in "attacking" you personally or otherwise, and I believe I have discussed the topic quite fully. However, I do get somewhat annoyed when people imply those of us that choose not to use so called smartphones are dumb.

 

Surely you realise that posting such a contentious subject on farang pub is going to attract push back?

 

Had you restricted the subject to a discussion as to the benefits of smartphones, or otherwise, I would not have bothered to even click on it. However, to imply that they make people "smarter" was never going to get away without a response.

People riot not elephants and the incident was mentioned in relationship to Thailand not being a nanny state but a more exciting place to live.  Nothing to do with smart phones.  Another poster compared a smartphone to a security blanket and in a way it is by providing more security and a better lifestyle than those without one. 

[thaibeachlovers]

12 minutes ago, amvet said:

They could not possibly get the same care because the doctor would not have the same amount of information.  How would the doctor know if you had a history of heart problems or what had been done to treat them or any other other complications that occurred and your history of medications taken (not allergic to but consumed).  And pray tell would the medical profession spend billions to develop more and better ways to store and transmit medical records on smart phones if they didn't deem it important?

Ever heard of an ECG? Drs use them to determine if there are any heart problems. Pretty simple really.

If the patient is unconscious, there are many ways to diagnose problems.

Medical history is just one part of diagnosis.

 

Does the "medical profession" spend billions on transmission of medical record research? The British government paid an IT company to develop one in Britain that cost a lot of money and was not very good.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/sep/18/nhs-records-system-10bn

An abandoned NHS patient record system has so far cost the taxpayer nearly £10bn, with the final bill for what would have been the world's largest civilian computer system likely to be several hundreds of millions of pounds higher, according a highly critical report from parliament's public spending watchdog.

[amvet]

8 minutes ago, Antonymous said:

OP,

 

 

 

You wanted to know if people who use smart phones are smarter and the resounding weight of answers is ‘NO’. A large proportion of smart phone users are definitely not very smart and I’m sure a proportion of dumb phone users aren’t smart either. But that has nothing to do with their choice of phone use.

 

There’s been ample evidence in this thread to show that non-smart phone users can be smart. The only poster who agreed with you said that dumb phone users are all dumb, which says a lot about how smart he is!

 

Surely you have your answer now?

I have not seen any evidence of non smart phone use being anything except stupid, counterproductive and archaic.  People refuse to change and adopt new technology because they are anti progress and want to stay in a world of yesterday where they were more at home not having to learn new things. 

[Kadilo]

Used to be a few elephants wandering around begging for people to buy bananas to feed them. Same in Bkk. One of the tragedies that happened when they stopped logging.
Unfortunately, many were injured by vehicles and the law now forbids it, I believe. Anyway, there haven't been elephants wandering Pattaya for years.
My photo from 1997.
 

 
Rioting elephants, I think not.

Yeah I've seen them in the streets of Bangkok and Udon but never in Pattaya. As you say their owners selling any old crap to feed them. All very unsavoury and glad it got stopped


Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[amvet]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Ever heard of an ECG? Drs use them to determine if there are any heart problems. Pretty simple really.

If the patient is unconscious, there are many ways to diagnose problems.

Medical history is just one part of diagnosis.

 

Does the "medical profession" spend billions on transmission of medical record research? The British government paid an IT company to develop one in Britain that cost a lot of money and was not very good.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/sep/18/nhs-records-system-10bn

An abandoned NHS patient record system has so far cost the taxpayer nearly £10bn, with the final bill for what would have been the world's largest civilian computer system likely to be several hundreds of millions of pounds higher, according a highly critical report from parliament's public spending watchdog.

You have never tried to get an ECG at a Thai public hospital or at least not at the same ones I have. How can you argue that hospitals without computers were as good as today?  Mind boggling but a good example of this topic.

[thaibeachlovers]

36 minutes ago, amvet said:

I would not give you the time of day.  Let alone provide you with more information to attack me about something that has nothing to do with the topic.  Had you been a decent sort of chap I would have given you the name of the bar which is still there and sustained the majority of the damage and they would readily confirm what happened. 

Given that elephants have not been roaming Pattaya streets for many years, I doubt "they" in the bar would have been there when the incident happened, to confirm or deny.

I went to the temple where Rambo 3 was made ( and that is on the internet for all to see ), but to my surprise not a soul remembered the occasion and no one knew it ever happened. Perhaps I'm biased, but I'd have thought a Hollywood film being made in the temple would have been a big deal, but obviously wrong. Certainly a bigger deal than an elephant knocking a few chairs about in a Pattaya barbeer.

 

I would not give you the time of day

Perhaps you need to "jai yen, jai yen".

Life is too short to get stressed about some silly topic banter on the banter subforum of a forum lots of bored people use to pass the time of day.

 

The question has been asked and answered, and the rest is just froth.

 

[Antonymous]

13 minutes ago, amvet said:

I have not seen any evidence of non smart phone use being anything except stupid, counterproductive and archaic.  People refuse to change and adopt new technology because they are anti progress and want to stay in a world of yesterday where they were more at home not having to learn new things. 

None so blind as those who will not see.

 

I rest my case.

[SheungWan]

Just now, Antonymous said:

None so blind as those who will not see.

 

I rest my case.

Dumb phones are not worth having a case.

[thaibeachlovers]

10 minutes ago, amvet said:

You have never tried to get an ECG at a Thai public hospital or at least not at the same ones I have. How can you argue that hospitals without computers were as good as today?  Mind boggling but a good example of this topic.

Of course I've had an ECG at a Thai hospital. No one gives an anaesthetic without one.

Computers in hospital are only as good as the people that use them.

I'm not saying diagnostics isn't better without them. Most of the machines use computers, but it's usually a surgeon using the same instruments as 30 years ago doing an operation. What has advanced immensely is anaesthetics, and that is fully computerized, but the anaethetist better be able to do without if the power goes off during the op.

 

Anyway, that's all very interesting, but the subject is about phones making us smarter, and all the consultants I worked with learned their craft before a mobile phone was anything other than science fiction.

[SheungWan]

32 minutes ago, Antonymous said:

OP,

 

 

 

You wanted to know if people who use smart phones are smarter and the resounding weight of answers is ‘NO’. A large proportion of smart phone users are definitely not very smart and I’m sure a proportion of dumb phone users aren’t smart either. But that has nothing to do with their choice of phone use.

 

 

 

There’s been ample evidence in this thread to show that non-smart phone users can be smart. The only poster who agreed with you said that dumb phone users are all dumb, which says a lot about how smart he is!

 

 

 

Surely you have your answer now?

 

 

21 minutes ago, amvet said:

I have not seen any evidence of non smart phone use being anything except stupid, counterproductive and archaic.  People refuse to change and adopt new technology because they are anti progress and want to stay in a world of yesterday where they were more at home not having to learn new things. 

 

All that dumb phone users have shown in this thread is old man stubbornness masquerading somewhat at times as new age gibberish

[JLCrab]

I miss my Blackberry Curve --it died after almost 10 years and I had to get a Galaxy Note. Android. Oh well.

[dick dasterdly]

42 minutes ago, Travel2003 said:

When I got my first smart phone, I quickly realized the phone was smarter than me.

A couple of decades I was taken aback to see a group of girls walking along the road - all talking on their mobiles, rather than the friends they were with !

 

It's even worse nowadays as even my friends (who had previously agreed that they didn't understand why everyone had their nose in their smartphone) - are also glued to their smartphones!

 

I'm obviously a heathen as the constant 'beeps' signifying (mostly) unwanted messages annoyed the hell out of me - and so I switched off the internet function. 

Edited September 17, 2017 by dick dasterdly

[SheungWan]

4 minutes ago, JLCrab said:

I miss my Blackberry Curve --it died after almost 10 years and I had to get a Galaxy Note. Android. Oh well.

Some guys still using those things and there is still a second hand market for them. Still good for email on the run, but the small screen just limits other internet apps. I had a lookalike Nokia Asha 302. Just used it as a dumb phone. I finally cracked a couple of years ago and yes, I too went out and bought a Samsung Galaxy Note (3).

Edited September 17, 2017 by SheungWan

[JLCrab]

One of the Apps I use daily is the marvelous free Audacity -- comes in Windows, Linux, and Mac versions but no Android. There may be other audio editors to run on Android but this is universally hailed as the best.

[amvet]

46 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Given that elephants have not been roaming Pattaya streets for many years, I doubt "they" in the bar would have been there when the incident happened, to confirm or deny.

I went to the temple where Rambo 3 was made ( and that is on the internet for all to see ), but to my surprise not a soul remembered the occasion and no one knew it ever happened. Perhaps I'm biased, but I'd have thought a Hollywood film being made in the temple would have been a big deal, but obviously wrong. Certainly a bigger deal than an elephant knocking a few chairs about in a Pattaya barbeer.

 

I would not give you the time of day

Perhaps you need to "jai yen, jai yen".

Life is too short to get stressed about some silly topic banter on the banter subforum of a forum lots of bored people use to pass the time of day.

 

The question has been asked and answered, and the rest is just froth.

 

I don't remember what year the elephants disappeared from Pattaya and surrounding areas.  Not more than four years ago because I remember walking my dog and her seeing her first elephant.   I used to rent one to cruise down a soi with bars.  It was an impressive entrance. 

[amvet]

44 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Of course I've had an ECG at a Thai hospital. No one gives an anaesthetic without one.

Computers in hospital are only as good as the people that use them.

I'm not saying diagnostics isn't better without them. Most of the machines use computers, but it's usually a surgeon using the same instruments as 30 years ago doing an operation. What has advanced immensely is anaesthetics, and that is fully computerized, but the anaethetist better be able to do without if the power goes off during the op.

 

Anyway, that's all very interesting, but the subject is about phones making us smarter, and all the consultants I worked with learned their craft before a mobile phone was anything other than science fiction.

I said a Thai public hospital because they prioritize who gets them and they are not used for everyone.  Sounds to me like you are in the dark ages as my doctors all use at least 3 smartphones/appliances during any consultation.  The blood tests are all done by computer and the billing and record keeping is all done by computer as is much of the diagnostic work and done better than it was by a live physician because they can access more information and information is the key to success in almost any field of endeavor.  Using a smart phone keeps me mentally nimble and I can do it on my feet.  

[ColeBOzbourne]

1 hour ago, amvet said:

I have not seen any evidence of non smart phone use being anything except stupid, counterproductive and archaic.  People refuse to change and adopt new technology because they are anti progress and want to stay in a world of yesterday where they were more at home not having to learn new things. 

Simply based on your style of writing and presentation of information I can see that you are intelligent and educated, amvet. Open your eyes and mind just a wee bit and you could use the same clues to see that many people involved in this discussion against smart phones are far from stupid and archaic. It's not difficult to recognize when another person has a decent level of education.

 

Learning new things is not limited to smart phones, surely you are intelligent enough to realize. I have been a life-long learner in many areas. Currently I enjoy studying languages. A friend and I pick a new language every few years and study just for the joy of learning. In some I am fluent, in others I'm not. Recently I've taken it upon myself to learn sign language (ASL). 

 

Your way is fine if that's what you enjoy, more power to you. But why do you insist that your way is the only way?

 

[robblok]

Smart phones are just great for those who know how to use them, they can enrich your life and make things easier. Its great how the apps can help you. I love the GPS on my phone its much better then a dedicated gps. I got a holder for it in the car, works better as any dedicated garmin GPS I ever had. 

 

You can safe things much easier and share locations much easier as with a normal GPS. I use the gym app to record my program easy to keep your history. Email on the phone if something important gets in and everyone uses line or whatsapp. The camera on the phones are great. There are of course countless other apps you can use depending on what you like. 

 

Of course if your not good with new technology then a smartphone is useless to you and it easier to do it the old fashioned way. 

[George FmplesdaCosteedback]

19 hours ago, amvet said:

What evidence that smart phones makes one dull?  The evidence is the complete opposite. I can only think it is because your brain has atrophied that you would not recognize the complexity of the photo you commented on and its obvious merit for intelligence in the future.  

 

Have you also eschewed all technology like the other nutters commenting on anti tech bias?   

 

Of course I'm an active and productive person evidenced by the fact I moved from a nanny state 20 years ago to face the hazards and trials of living in a 3rd world country and the excitement that life here brings. 

 

Last night the Thai family was visiting to watch Mission Impossible dubbed in Thai on my giant screen TV and I used my smart phone to listen to the audio in English while they listened in Thai.  Not an easy intellectual accomplishment.  I imagine you could not even figure out how I did it. 

Quite frankly, you don't actually sound very tech savvy, if you find that is not easy to achieve.

Do you do data recovery, have you run a hospital computer department, repaired hardware, designed websites from scratch etc etc.

I still contend "having a smart phone" does NOT make you or anyone else smarter.

What it does is makes access to information easier, nothing more.

Also I have not had to be smuggled anywhere thanks, as that would make me an illegal immigrant...

 

It seems obvious that your computer is much smarter than you...

 

 

 

 

[George FmplesdaCosteedback]

19 hours ago, SheungWan said:

'A slave to the machines'. You have got to be joking George. One simple question. Given that you are presumably a 'productive and active person', why should anybody have to spend money sending you a text message or making a phone call to you?

They don't need to spend money to call or text me, if you hadn't noticed it comes as part of a mobile contract. What is your point Bill?

Retired now thanks.