Let’s see the junta’s exit strategy

[worgeordie]

I dont see much hope for Thailand in the short term,(next ten years),when/if

the army gives up controlling the country,they will be replaced by greedy,self

serving Politicians,buying votes,fighting for the best Ministries to control,with

the biggest budgets,ready to plunder,nothing is going to change,just different

people,the rest same,same. 

regards worgeordie

[NCC1701A]

freedom is not free.

 

nothing will change until the AK-47s come out.

 

and most of us are back home watching on CNN.

 

but it is too hot and humid in Thailand and fighting for your freedom is really hard work and Thais have to keep working to pay for their new pick-up truck.

Edited September 14, 2017 by NCC1701A

[connda]

3 hours ago, BuaBS said:

Some countries are not meant to have democracy , Thailand is one of them.

The US has not called the junta a 'regime', nor have they called the PM a 'dictator.'  
So, in the eyes of the West, it's a functional government.  All is well.  
Anyway, what fun is having power unless you're able to wield it.  No exit in the tea leaves anytime soon.  And 'Democracy?'  Democracy simply gives the masses the illusion of control and choice.  Monied interests put the candidates in place and provide the propaganda to buff their candidate to a brilliant shine to attract the attention of an electorate who don't have a clue as to what is actually going on beyond the populist promises and political beauty contest.   
The country is more stable now than anytime since I arrived here in 2007.  I remember walking around 'Democracy Circle' when I first got here.  Some Thai approached me and started bemoaning that he wished Thailand had a 'democracy' like the United States.  I left him standing bewildered with one sentence: "What makes you think the US has a Democracy?"  

Edited September 14, 2017 by connda

[connda]

1 minute ago, NCC1701A said:

freedom is not free.

 

nothing will change until the AK-47s come out.

 

and most of us are back home watching on CNN.

 

but it is too hot and humid in Thailand and fighting for your freedom is really hard work and Thais have to keep working pay for their new pick-up truck.

The Romans had it right: Bread and Circuses.  

[baboon]

1 minute ago, connda said:

The US has not called the junta a 'regime', nor have they call the PM a 'dictator.'  
So, in the eyes of the West, it's a functional government.  All is well.  

Sad reflection on contemporary politics, isn't it?

[GarryP]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

Again and again in the 85 years since the 1932 revolution, military intervention in politics has been harmful to the economy and ruinous to democracy. Generals are not equipped to handle fiscal matters and have no interest in individual rights and freedom of choice. These lessons have been learned in other countries. It’s time we learned 

them here.

Most of the generals are not equipped to handle military matters, let alone running the country. There needs to be an audit of the generals themselves. So many of them spend their time on the golf course or pursuing their own activities rather than actually working.  Those who are found not to be working for the good of the military should be formally retired from the military.  They could reduce the number of generals by two thirds by this simple act alone.  

[DrPhibes]

Well put Nation.  The Junta is trying to get as much as they can on their side at the moment.  The general population is in mourning and paying their respects to their beloved King.  The King's cremation is coming.    After that, the gloves come off. 

[brewsterbudgen]

Some countries are not meant to have democracy , Thailand is one of them.

As stupid comments go, this one is right up there with the best of them.

[Eric Loh]

28 minutes ago, connda said:

The country is more stable now than anytime since I arrived here in 2007.

You sure about that? Seem an increasing number of bombs that can happen anywhere and the authority seem clueless who they are. At least with the protests and demonstration, you know where to avoid in Bangkok. Other provinces were stable and safe. 

[Eric Loh]

4 hours ago, BuaBS said:

Some countries are not meant to have democracy , Thailand is one of them.

You are a thoughtful chap. So what do you advocate. Prayut broke up democracy but claimed he was a "democratic" soldier. Maybe each province should have a feudal lord. 

[Happyman58]

3 hours ago, JAG said:

The coup ( in fact both the latest coups) took place whilst an election was in progress, after it had been called and before voting ended. Both elections had been called with the agreement of and promulgated by the highest constitutional entity in the land, an entity to which the military swear allegiance.
I see a fatal flaw in your proposal...

Maybe u right i was not here at that time

[jesimps]

5 hours ago, BuaBS said:

Some countries are not meant to have democracy , Thailand is one of them.

What a patronising attitude from someone who's been fortunate to grow up in a democracy.

Democracy hasn't worked here because no govt has been allowed to stay for its full term, so the people haven't been given the chance to judge its performance and vote for it to continue, or democratically choose someone else.

[jesimps]

2 hours ago, worgeordie said:

I dont see much hope for Thailand in the short term,(next ten years),when/if

the army gives up controlling the country,they will be replaced by greedy,self

serving Politicians,buying votes,fighting for the best Ministries to control,with

the biggest budgets,ready to plunder,nothing is going to change,just different

people,the rest same,same. 

regards worgeordie

If that's the choice of the majority of the people then so be it.

It's called democracy.

 

[JAG]

The Romans had it right: Bread and Circuses.  

And because the ruling elite spent all the resources of the state on bread and circuses, in the capital city, they ended up being over run by barbarians from the north east.

 

Of course it is not an exact comparison, - but - the Romans were very partial to fish sauce...

 

 

 

[BuaBS]

8 hours ago, jesimps said:

What a patronising attitude from someone who's been fortunate to grow up in a democracy.

That "democracy" scr_wed up the country.

[wow64]

There is an exit strategy.. it's here somewhere.. maybe under this umm Sargent Somchai where is it?

 

oh that's right stay on in power forever 

[greeneking]

when some of these these people feel Thailand is going the wrong way and it's affecting their profits we may see a change.

Chirathivats family  - Central Group of Companies
CP - the Chearavanont family.
Charoen Sirivadhanabhakdi - Thaibev. Chang etc - Thailand's richest man
Bhirombhakdi & family - Boonrawd Singha, Leo beer etc
Vichai Srivaddhanaprabha - King Power, AirAsia shares etc
Karnasuta family - many many
Prasert Prasarttong-Osoth - hospitals, insurance, Bangkok Airways
Vongkusolkit family - sugar, power and mining, hotels, insurance etc
Chalerm Yoovidhya and family - Red Bull 51%, Siam Wineries

A lot of them  made their start in a Thailand with favourable treatment and lax laws but are now looking abroard where things could be better dealt with within legal systems.
But at the moment they are doing very well.  Or they may develop a social conscience.  You think?

[tominbkk]

Elections hopefully by 2050!

[GarryP]

1 hour ago, greeneking said:

when some of these these people feel Thailand is going the wrong way and it's affecting their profits we may see a change.

Chirathivats family  - Central Group of Companies
CP - the Chearavanont family.
Charoen Sirivadhanabhakdi - Thaibev. Chang etc - Thailand's richest man
Bhirombhakdi & family - Boonrawd Singha, Leo beer etc
Vichai Srivaddhanaprabha - King Power, AirAsia shares etc
Karnasuta family - many many
Prasert Prasarttong-Osoth - hospitals, insurance, Bangkok Airways
Vongkusolkit family - sugar, power and mining, hotels, insurance etc
Chalerm Yoovidhya and family - Red Bull 51%, Siam Wineries

A lot of them  made their start in a Thailand with favourable treatment and lax laws but are now looking abroard where things could be better dealt with within legal systems.
But at the moment they are doing very well.  Or they may develop a social conscience.  You think?

A few missing from that list but I agree that it is some of these monied  "elite" that are part of the problem.  Authorities would be unwilling to do anything to those giving big money gifts to certain people (wink wink), regardless what they are doing wrong. Advertising alcohol via water and soda, monopolizing business sectors, etc. It would be interesting to determine how all those families got their start in business. I don't think they were all above board.

[Jonah Tenner]

12 hours ago, Eric Loh said:

Maybe each province should have a feudal lord. 

Don't they have this already?

[heybruce]

16 hours ago, connda said:

The Romans had it right: Bread and Circuses.  

 

11 hours ago, JAG said:

And because the ruling elite spent all the resources of the state on bread and circuses, in the capital city, they ended up being over run by barbarians from the north east.

 

Of course it is not an exact comparison, - but - the Romans were very partial to fish sauce...

That's a good analogy.  The Roman Empire looted and repressed its northern territories for the benefit of Rome, then lost control of them.  This resulted in the invasion and looting of Rome.  The Bangkok Empire is doing the same thing, and if the general and elites refuse to allow a peaceful sharing of power through democracy, it will lead to the same result.

Edited September 14, 2017 by heybruce

[wakeupplease]

18 hours ago, robblok said:

I agree they are all in it for themselves.. that is why just voting is not enough.. tough laws on corruption should be upheld for everyone especially so for goverment officials and politicians... I don't see it happening. This the basis of all the problems we have. They all want to be in power to enrich themselves, then when in power they act with impunity and only when they are removed by a coup OR voting and lose their protection will they be punished. But then the others in power do the same thing and the whole game starts again.

 

Its too bad that anti corruption agencies don't have the real power to do something about this. Look at the rice scam.. YL.. no corruption we did our investigation... done... now removed all the corruption came to light because no more protection.. no more people in places to slow things down change details. The politicians and army have far too much power the independent corruption agencies are not strong enough or incompetent. Only when corruption is tackled will you have goverment leaders that are not in it for themselves.

 

I have no solution, but feel that government change however it is affected (yes coups included) is the only way to punish some of the people who commit the crimes. Without goverment change those in power get ever more powerful get ever more people in positions where they can help them stall corruption investigations and so on. (same goes for the army the longer they are in power the more they put people in positions of power)

Robo deep down I know you maybe a nice guy but for god sake give the YL and Shins a rest as corruption here is not a new thing is it, try looking at the history. then comment. Mean time go and do some fishing and enjoy yourself or go on holiday out of the hole and you will soon see those rose coloured glasses don't work outside these borders. Just a hit mate, it worked for many.

[Happyman58]

9 hours ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

No, the yellow shirts, their backers then the military screwed up the country.

 

Things were going good for Thailand up until that point.

 

Best times economically in the 30+ years I have been here. 

 

People were happy and there was hope. 

God bless you father You are so right  My Thai wife says that also We should get together one day and have a drink on that Of coarse you being being a priest it would have to be No-alcoholic wine

[lamyai3]

Exit strategy was successfully road tested two weeks ago, and further consolidated in the hugfest one week ago. 

[SABloke]

15 hours ago, JAG said:

The coup ( in fact both the latest coups) took place whilst an election was in progress, after it had been called and before voting ended. Both elections had been called with the agreement of and promulgated by the highest constitutional entity in the land, an entity to which the military swear allegiance.
I see a fatal flaw in your proposal...

A football coach is going into his final game before retirement. He goes on TV and say his team are going to do their best to win the game - the team are favourites anyway. Before the game the coach tells the team to throw the game. Team loses. Everyone is shocked that the team let the coach down. Did they though? 

[LannaGuy]

10 hours ago, greeneking said:

when some of these these people feel Thailand is going the wrong way and it's affecting their profits we may see a change.

Chirathivats family  - Central Group of Companies
CP - the Chearavanont family.
Charoen Sirivadhanabhakdi - Thaibev. Chang etc - Thailand's richest man
Bhirombhakdi & family - Boonrawd Singha, Leo beer etc
Vichai Srivaddhanaprabha - King Power, AirAsia shares etc
Karnasuta family - many many
Prasert Prasarttong-Osoth - hospitals, insurance, Bangkok Airways
Vongkusolkit family - sugar, power and mining, hotels, insurance etc
Chalerm Yoovidhya and family - Red Bull 51%, Siam Wineries

A lot of them  made their start in a Thailand with favourable treatment and lax laws but are now looking abroard where things could be better dealt with within legal systems.
But at the moment they are doing very well.  Or they may develop a social conscience.  You think?

The ammart rule and it's that simple

[LannaGuy]

11 hours ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

No, the yellow shirts, their backers then the military screwed up the country.

 

Things were going good for Thailand up until that point.

 

Best times economically in the 30+ years I have been here. 

 

People were happy and there was hope. 

True but they didn't screw it up they, a very, very small minority, ensured they stayed in power.

[rosst]

On 14/09/2017 at 10:27 AM, baboon said:

I suspect that there are those who cheered on the coup in the expectation that the army would simply turf out the Shinawatras then hand the country over to the Democrat party. It will have come as a nasty shock when the army started leaning back in the chairs at Government House, putting their boots up on the table and firing up stogies. 

But it is too late now. They wanted the coup, they got the coup and all that went with it. Exit strategy? 'Nah, think we'll stick around. Go and fill the kettle, there's a good lad...'

I have moved to the Philippines a few years ago and I return to my house in Nong Khai each year for a couple of months and from my perspective it feels like business as usual? 

There have been some very good changes including some anti corruption investigations and prosecutions. 

From my perspective it has not been all bad. 

I am worried that the army is entrenching itself in Thai politics and only time will tell how this plays out. 

Imagine the Reds and the yellows and the military, three powerful forces and each with it's own agenda, interesting times ahead. 

[Happyman58]

1 hour ago, rosst said:

I have moved to the Philippines a few years ago and I return to my house in Nong Khai each year for a couple of months and from my perspective it feels like business as usual? 

There have been some very good changes including some anti corruption investigations and prosecutions. 

From my perspective it has not been all bad. 

I am worried that the army is entrenching itself in Thai politics and only time will tell how this plays out. 

Imagine the Reds and the yellows and the military, three powerful forces and each with it's own agenda, interesting times ahead. 

My belief is you join the army to defend your country Not govern a country If you want to be politicon leave the army join a party and run for government Dont point a gun at somebody and say lump it or leave it. We have the guns you dont. Even Hitler left the army and joined a party. What he did when he got into power was to get rid of the opposition but at least he was voted in After that things changed a bit . These people running the government here were never voted in. Bit like going for a job and getting it without doing the interview

[heybruce]

7 hours ago, rosst said:

I have moved to the Philippines a few years ago and I return to my house in Nong Khai each year for a couple of months and from my perspective it feels like business as usual? 

There have been some very good changes including some anti corruption investigations and prosecutions. 

From my perspective it has not been all bad. 

I am worried that the army is entrenching itself in Thai politics and only time will tell how this plays out. 

Imagine the Reds and the yellows and the military, three powerful forces and each with it's own agenda, interesting times ahead. 

Check the Transparency International Corruption Perception Index; any appearance of change in the amount of corruption are an illusion promoted by junta propaganda and censorship.

 

What are these other good changes you refer to?  Restrictions on freedom of speech, press and assembly?  The prudish crackdown on closing times, alcohol promotions and increases in alcohol and tobacco taxes?  Detaining people incommunicado without charge?