Overstay: Flight booked but not enough money to pay fine.

[Aditi Sharma]

8 minutes ago, The Girl said:

Hawker, I understand that you are concerned. May you please be practical. How would you propose I leave the country, knowing my situation, I have an ETD and 10k? I have to leave in 2 weeks. I am not shying away from my wrongful doing, well non-doing in the case.

If you have had enough of Thailand, try Vietnam. They need plenty of teachers there. 

[hawker9000]

First rule of crisis management:   When you find yourself in a deep hole, STOP DIGGING!

 

[gilo]

I agree with UJ but at your own risk. There are many who have worked and are working as teachers at really low pay (250 is appalling). However, just keep your wits about you and get out as soon as you can. Given that you are not intending to come back then this at least partly mitigates the downside risk.

[Aditi Sharma]

2 minutes ago, gilo said:

I agree with UJ but at your own risk. There are many who have worked and are working as teachers at really low pay (250 is appalling). However, just keep your wits about you and get out as soon as you can. Given that you are not intending to come back then this at least partly mitigates the downside risk.

Is this right? 250? You mean 250 baht per hour? That's appalling.

[anon789561]

30 minutes ago, The Girl said:

I have not started. Would you recommend I don't start at all and pawn my stuff, rather? I desperately need 10k in any way possible. It is very easy to overlook getting caught when you just want to make it out of Thailand in one piece. I was wrong I know, but I am trying not to fuel the fire. 

i wouldn;t suggest risking it and then you end up in deep s***. if i were you i would pawn my stuff and get on the plane. possessions can be bought again in the future. i hope none are sentimental. by all means work but at your own risk. just think about the consequences and how you will get yourself out of it if you do get caught. i've never been to idc but i hear it's pretty horrible

[Aditi Sharma]

5 minutes ago, hawker9000 said:

First rule of crisis management:   When you find yourself in a deep hole, STOP DIGGING!

 

Hawker9000, I would define crisis as something where you havent yet fallen into the hole. Wouldnt you agree?

Edited September 26, 2017 by Aditi Sharma
correction

[ubonjoe]

13 minutes ago, hawker9000 said:

You're advising her to knowingly violate the law?!  'Knowing what could happen if there's some random check and she gets caught??  I have to say, that surprises me, UJ.

 

You should note I wrote in your situation. It is not something I would normally advise but they are between a rock and a hard place.

There are risks of course. The random check on the school is not big. I don't know how many hundreds of people are working at those type of schools on tourist visas but you don't hear much about them being caught.

[BritTim]

26 minutes ago, The Girl said:

I have not started. Would you recommend I don't start at all and pawn my stuff, rather? I desperately need 10k in any way possible. It is very easy to overlook getting caught when you just want to make it out of Thailand in one piece. I was wrong I know, but I am trying not to fuel the fire. 

It is difficult to advise you on that without knowing the agency you would be working for, and their relationship with the local immigration/labor department. Maybe, it is only a small risk, in which case (with the pickle you are already in) you might decide to cross your fingers and grab the 1,500 baht a day or so you may be able to earn. As others have stated, if you did get caught, it would mean big trouble.

 

One piece of advice I would give. Your story about what happened does not quite add up. Before talking to immigration, write down on paper

• the date your permission to stay ended;
• the date you realized your passport was lost;
• the date you reported your passport stolen;
• the date you applied for a replacement passport; and
• the date you applied for an emergency travel certificate.

Avoid saying anything to immigration that conflicts with those dates. If leaving normally through the airport, and paying the fine, the truth is not going to hurt you (though avoid telling them you were working without a work permit!) If they catch you out in obvious lies, they may not let you go until convinced they have the full picture.

[hawker9000]

Just now, Aditi Sharma said:

Hawker9000, I would define as crisis as something where you havent yet fallen into the hole. Wouldnt you agree?

She's lost her passport, on a 6mo+ overstay, and not enough money to pay the fine.   THAT's a HOLE, wouldn't YOU agree??

[Aditi Sharma]

1 minute ago, hawker9000 said:

She's lost her passport, on a 6mo+ overstay, and not enough money to pay the fine.   THAT's a HOLE, wouldn't YOU agree??

It is a hole. But will you call it a crisis? 

[hawker9000]

1 minute ago, ubonjoe said:

You should note I wrote in your situation. It is not something I would normally advise but they are between a rock and a hard place.

There are risks of course. The random check on the school is not big. I don't know how many hundreds of people are working at those type of schools on tourist visas but you don't hear much about them being caught.

Well, Girl, UJ IS the universally acknowledged expert here on all things immigration.  If he says it's a risk but not a big risk, I certainly wouldn't argue that point.   It's still not something I would do in your situation, but I'm particularly risk averse, and the thought of spending time in the IDC would have me pawning a kidney if that's what it took to get out without further upping the ante.   So, up to you.

 

[The Girl]

12 minutes ago, Aditi Sharma said:

I dont think it is appropriate to equate teaching with modern day slavery. You have earned good karma by teaching and it will remain with you forever. Maybe the school had good reasons to pay you less and werent articulate enough to explain it. But I think you should have persevered. If it is possible for you to go back to teaching please do.

I understand your point Aditi, far too many teachers do not care about the profession and its ethics. I just wish I was not presented in that light. I also think I am not explaining my issue clearly. I was paid 50k for teaching every grade when the promise made was 80k. If anything, I would at least take that we were both wrong. But I cant be crucified for wanting better career prospects and the school gets a thumbs up? I will only return to teaching with the correct visa and a return ticket. Hahha 

[The Girl]

9 minutes ago, hawker9000 said:

First rule of crisis management:   When you find yourself in a deep hole, STOP DIGGING!

 

Noted! Well-put!

[hawker9000]

2 minutes ago, Aditi Sharma said:

It is a hole. But will you call it a crisis? 

I would define "crisis" as "critical",  And, yes, I would call this "critical".  For me, it would be.  'Certainly worth pawing material possessions to avoid imprisonment.

 

[Aditi Sharma]

2 minutes ago, The Girl said:

I understand your point Aditi, far too many teachers do not care about the profession and its ethics. I just wish I was not presented in that light. I also think I am not explaining my issue clearly. I was paid 50k for teaching every grade when the promise made was 80k. If anything, I would at least take that we were both wrong. But I cant be crucified for wanting better career prospects and the school gets a thumbs up? I will only return to teaching with the correct visa and a return ticket. Hahha 

Remember The Girl, nobody is perfect. It is not a perfect world. If you make a lot of noise, your case would seem like a catastrophe. Even if you land in the IDC, remember God and all will be fine. Fear consorts with the devil. Be strong.

[Get Real]

1 hour ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

Get real

If you read all before comment you would understand. By all means...Let´s hear your point of view in more than the 2 useless words you already used.

[anon789561]

19 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

You should note I wrote in your situation. It is not something I would normally advise but they are between a rock and a hard place.

There are risks of course. The random check on the school is not big. I don't know how many hundreds of people are working at those type of schools on tourist visas but you don't hear much about them being caught.

UJ does have a point though, i've rarely heard of teachers at language schools being caught and i have known quite a few that were working for years on tourist visas. it's your choice though. with a bit of luck maybe you'll be ok. i would assume the school is paying someone in authority to use teachers without permits so they shouldn't get checked but no one can be really sure. i'd say it's a good bet though as they wouldn;t want the fine themselves

[Aditi Sharma]

The Girl, survive the academy.

[4evermaat]

i would just show up at airport 5-6 hours early with confirmed ticket, emergency passport, police report, and whatever money you have, and take your chances.  You have nothing to lose anyway at this point.   It's a question of holding you over 10k baht or just letting you go and blacklisting you for a year.  I think if you smile and just calmly present your case when you get to the airport immigration checkpoint (overstay office), you can negotiate a better deal.

 

If you have a friend that could speak thai and help, maybe that might help also.

[gilo]

14 minutes ago, 4evermaat said:

i would just show up at airport 5-6 hours early with confirmed ticket, emergency passport, police report, and whatever money you have, and take your chances.  You have nothing to lose anyway at this point.   It's a question of holding you over 10k baht or just letting you go and blacklisting you for a year.  I think if you smile and just calmly present your case when you get to the airport immigration checkpoint (overstay office), you can negotiate a better deal.

 

If you have a friend that could speak thai and help, maybe that might help also.

I would strongly caution against this advice. Saying that she has nothing to lose is really quite a dangerous presumption...she could easily face a spell in the IDC and thus lose her ticket home to boot if she rolls up without the 20k fine money.

Edited September 26, 2017 by gilo
factual

[sanemax]

51 minutes ago, 4evermaat said:

i would just show up at airport 5-6 hours early with confirmed ticket, emergency passport, police report, and whatever money you have, and take your chances.  You have nothing to lose anyway at this point.   It's a question of holding you over 10k baht or just letting you go and blacklisting you for a year.  I think if you smile and just calmly present your case when you get to the airport immigration checkpoint (overstay office), you can negotiate a better deal.

 

 

Has anyone ever got a reduced fine because they didnt have the money ?

I have never heard of it happening and fines dont seem to be negotiable .

If I/O were able to do this , it would lead to all kinds of possible corrupt scenarios

 

[007 RED]

OP... Please be cautious what you say on an open forum, especially regarding working without a work permit given the problems that you already face concerning your overstay.

 

You have already informed the world that you have overstayed by 7 months and that you have a ticket booked on Kenyan Airways in a couple of weeks time.

 

As there is only one flight per day departing BKK at 01:30am, you could be tipping immigration off of your pending departure and they could start asking additional questions regarding your finances during your overstay etc.

 

Good luck with sorting things out.

[JackThompson]

Just 2 questions to the OP:
1. Is your existing flight refundable in whole or part?
2. Is it permissible to use your ETD to travel anywhere other than to your home-country?

If yes to both, consider refunding the expensive ticket, taking a cheap flight to Cambodia or Vietnam, and using the remaining money from the ticket-refund and cash you have to pay Immigration. 

Better teaching gigs are available in both Cambodia and Vietnam, and it is easier stay legal doing so, and stay in general, than it is in Thailand.

[Aditi Sharma]

4 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

Just 2 questions to the OP:
1. Is your existing flight refundable in whole or part?
2. Is it permissible to use your ETD to travel anywhere other than to your home-country?

If yes to both, consider refunding the expensive ticket, taking a cheap flight to Cambodia or Vietnam, and using the remaining money from the ticket-refund and cash you have to pay Immigration. 

Better teaching gigs are available in both Cambodia and Vietnam, and it is easier stay legal doing so, and stay in general, than it is in Thailand.

Why didnt anybody think of this before JT did??? Common sense. Hey The Girl, why do you have to leave home from Thailand? Do a border hop and fly away home.

Edited September 26, 2017 by Aditi Sharma
correction

[Aditi Sharma]

1 hour ago, 4evermaat said:

i would just show up at airport 5-6 hours early with confirmed ticket, emergency passport, police report, and whatever money you have, and take your chances.  You have nothing to lose anyway at this point.   It's a question of holding you over 10k baht or just letting you go and blacklisting you for a year.  I think if you smile and just calmly present your case when you get to the airport immigration checkpoint (overstay office), you can negotiate a better deal.

 

If you have a friend that could speak thai and help, maybe that might help also.

This is fine if she is having a good day. The odds will be against it. 

[007 RED]

9 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

Just 2 questions to the OP:
1. Is your existing flight refundable in whole or part?
2. Is it permissible to use your ETD to travel anywhere other than to your home-country?

If yes to both, consider refunding the expensive ticket, taking a cheap flight to Cambodia or Vietnam, and using the remaining money from the ticket-refund and cash you have to pay Immigration. 

Better teaching gigs are available in both Cambodia and Vietnam, and it is easier stay legal doing so, and stay in general, than it is in Thailand.

JT... good suggestion, but...... most ETD are only valid to enable the person to travel back to their home country.... it is very unlikely that another country will allow entry on an ETD other than transiting.

[Aditi Sharma]

3 minutes ago, 007 RED said:

JT... good suggestion, but...... most ETD are only valid to enable the person to travel back to their home country.... it is very unlikely that another country will allow entry on an ETD other than transiting.

Well transiting is what she needs to do now before getting back home and dry and as she promised earlier getting the proper visa and return tickets so 007Red, do you think Myanmar Vietnam or Cambodia will let her transit in your experience? 

Edited September 26, 2017 by Aditi Sharma
correction

[007 RED]

1 minute ago, Aditi Sharma said:

Well transiting is what she needs to do now before getting back home and dry and as she promised getting the proper visa and return ticket. 

Transiting = getting off one flight, remaining airside at the airport, and then departing on another flight - not entering the country.  The OP will do this when she flies from BKK to NBO where she will transit onto a flight to SA.

[ubonjoe]

22 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

2. Is it permissible to use your ETD to travel anywhere other than to your home-country?

The OP wrote in an earlier post that the embassy would not issue the ETD without a ticket to South Africa.

I think that answers your question.

[Aditi Sharma]

5 minutes ago, 007 RED said:

Transiting = getting off one flight, remaining airside at the airport, and then departing on another flight - not entering the country.  The OP will do this when she flies from BKK to NBO where she will transit onto a flight to SA.

I am sorry I was imagining it would be easier to sneak out of Thailand through a land border, lets say into Cambodia, head to the airport and take the flight available to SA. Before she books a flight she can head to the South African consulate or embassy in Cambodia and see if they will give her an emergency document. She can say she lost the document after landing in Cambodia. <deleted> I dont mean to teach you to lie. Just being helpful What is OP? And what is NBO?

Edited September 26, 2017 by Aditi Sharma
correction