NCPO claims flood-management win

[Ossy]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

Rainfall matches 2011 levels with 19 people drowning in past four weeks.

DUE TO THREE tropical storms and one tropical depression, cumulative rainfall so far this year this has been 1,798 millimetres – similar to the same period in 2011, when Thailand witnessed its worst flood in 50 years.

However, National Council for Peace and Order (NCPO) Spokesman Colonel Winthai Suvaree said the flood situation was not as bad because the government had a good water-management plan in place.

Yes, folks, with only 19 good folk drowning, this is a WIN . . . what do you think? And, thanks to our amazing water-retention area strategy, less than a million homes in those areas are still under 1 metre of water and only 22 provinces are still submerged . . . bloody terrific. Where does NCPO Spokesman Colonel Winthai Suvaree live? I can't help wondering . . . in a wet bit or a dry one? Smug twerp!

[Thian]

3 hours ago, Bob12345 said:

Its a sad state of affairs when government officials need to toot their own horn as nobody else is willing to do it.

I think they did a great job, BKK didn't flood like in 2011 and that's a big achievement.

 

Now of course you think the ricefields are far more important than BKK but priorities first.

[Thailand]

Sacrificing a few provinces is OK and a success then?

 

Having seen heavy rains up north in just the last few days and the rivers overflowing  at Mae Sai there may have to be a few more sacrifices.

[newcomer71]

18 minutes ago, robblok said:

Compared how the other provinces were during 2011 (same amount of rain) it certainly is a win...  far from a perfect win as there is flooding but far less people are affected as in 2011 with the same amount of rain.

That's your opinion. But I have a different one and given the brags than NCPO offered us before the raining season, there's no excuse for the situation we are in now. 

[Thian]

57 minutes ago, pattayadon said:

5555555555555....... YES! And I think I heard Trump say that everything is going great in Washington.    555   You can say anything you want, maybe "some" people will believe you!!!!!!    Hang on a second ....  can't stop laughing.  555   --People drowning in floods but it's a win.  Really?   C'mon now.

I can't be arsed what Trump thinks.

[robblok]

6 minutes ago, newcomer71 said:

That's your opinion. But I have a different one and given the brags than NCPO offered us before the raining season, there's no excuse for the situation we are in now. 

Yes they shot their mouth.. but given the amount of rain that is the same as in 2011 its handled far better. Still not a win as many people are flooded. I for one am happy it was not YL handeling it.. i would probably be flooded again for 1 1/2 month like before. So I certainly see it as a win. Also if you take the total amount of people affected in 2011 and now its a win.

 

Though the rain did fall in a different pattern more in the NE than before. I feel a lot more money should be set aside against flooding and a lot less weapons should be bought.. other popular policies should also not be done until they have good flooding protection. I think that would be one of the best things to do for the country spend a lot on flooding and do it right for once. 

[Ossy]

3 hours ago, robblok said:

The junta was releasing water early on (people were not happy about it as it did cause some flooding). But a far greater disaster was averted. YL her minister kept it closed only thinking of the rice (rice program was already active then). Now we see the difference between real bad planning (YL) and better (but far from perfect) planning.

Come on you lot . . . sing, after me "Long live the Junta, the far-from-perfect Junta" and repeat 'til chorus, to be led by Prayut, himself . . . hmmm that's so soothing. 

[robblok]

Just now, Ossy said:

Come on you lot . . . sing, after me "Long live the Junta, the far-from-perfect Junta" and repeat 'til chorus, to be led by Prayut, himself . . . hmmm that's so soothing. 

Yes it is... given how many people were affected in 2011 and how many affected now with the same amount of rainfall. 

 

But what Prayut should do is make a law that a certain amount of money just has to be set aside to combat flooding. Problem is no government does it as it never sees completion in 4 years. Then a new goverment cancels it (just like the junta did big fail for them) and invents the wheel again. For flooding long term planning and funding is needed.. not rice programs free tablets, submarines or tanks.

[lopburi3]

Current report on Thai TV seems to be that Bangkok may still flood.

 

22 minutes ago, Thian said:

I think they did a great job, BKK didn't flood like in 2011 and that's a big achievement.

 

Now of course you think the ricefields are far more important than BKK but priorities first.

 

[Thian]

4 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

Current report on Thai TV seems to be that Bangkok may still flood.

 

 

I checked the chao praya waterlevel yesterday and it's not that high anymore. BKK won't get much rain this week so i think there won't be big floodings...maybe a few on the lowest spots but hey what can you do about that?

[farcanell]

With the worst flooding in fifty years, hitting yingluk right up the ass after her election win, it’s hardly fair to blame her.

 

the fault lies with the departments already in place... and ironically, one of the charges she faced, in being removed from power, was dismissing an appointee ( admittedly, not from the water department)... so damned if you do, damned if you dont

 

but, in fairness, having weathered the floods of 2011, one would expect a better management plan to have been put in place in response... a much better plan... that this was done is very very arguable

 

yes... robblok is better off, and good for him ?, but that’s a far cry from a win for thailand in general. 

 

Hopefully we will now see someone extract foot from arse, and actually come up with a real management plan, which relies less on amulet stroking, and more on science

[owl sees all]

The Junta are rubbish!! Bring back the Shinawatras.

Edited October 30, 2017 by owl sees all

[jenny2017]

4 minutes ago, owl sees all said:

The jaunta are rubbish!! Bring back the Shinawatras.

(New York) – Thailand’s junta has failed to fulfill pledges to respect human rights and restore democratic rule three years after the military coup, Human Rights Watch said today. The ruling National Council for Peace and Order (NCPO), led by Prime Minister Gen. Prayuth Chan-ocha, has instead prolonged its crackdown on basic rights and freedoms, and devised a quasi-democratic system that the military can manipulate and control.

“The Thai junta’s empty promises to respect rights and restore democratic rule have become some sort of a sick joke played on the Thai people and the international community,” said Brad Adams, Asia director. “Three years after the coup, the junta still prosecutes peaceful critics of the government, bans political activity, censors the media, and stifles free speech.”

[robblok]

4 minutes ago, farcanell said:

With the worst flooding in fifty years, hitting yingluk right up the ass after her election win, it’s hardly fair to blame her.

 

the fault lies with the departments already in place... and ironically, one of the charges she faced, in being removed from power, was dismissing an appointee ( admittedly, not from the water department)... so damned if you do, damned if you dont

 

but, in fairness, having weathered the floods of 2011, one would expect a better management plan to have been put in place in response... a much better plan... that this was done is very very arguable

 

yes... robblok is better off, and good for him ?, but that’s a far cry from a win for thailand in general. 

 

Hopefully we will now see someone extract foot from arse, and actually come up with a real management plan, which relies less on amulet stroking, and more on science

Not only I am better off.. the Thais in general are better off.. just look at the numbers in 2011 and now. So do please stick to the facts.

[mikiea]

7 hours ago, candide said:

The issue is not how much rain fell in one year. It is how much rain fell during the flood period. Obviously, during this critical period, it did not rain as much as in 2011 and the flood was not comparable.

Next it will be compared to noah's flood

 

7 hours ago, candide said:

The issue is not how much rain fell in one year. It is how much rain fell during the flood period. Obviously, during this critical period, it did not rain as much as in 2011 and the flood was not comparable.

Will be compared to noah's flood next week 

[farcanell]

3 minutes ago, robblok said:

Not only I am better off.. the Thais in general are better off.. just look at the numbers in 2011 and now. So do please stick to the facts.

Prey tell.... in which paragraph did I make a non factual claim, as most of the post was an opinion, barring of course, the fact that you are better off ( that fact was right, right?)

[andersonat]

Some "political' info/background on the 2001 floods.

 

*

 

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/news/national/aec/30169695

 

"Agriculture Minister Theera Wongsamut (in the Abhisit Cabinet) yesterday acknowledged that the controversial decision to delay the release of water from the country's major dams had been made by the government.

“I admit ordering a delay in the release of water into the plains areas so that farmers could harvest their crops first,” he said.

 

Theera said storms had brought a lot of water in late June, with rain levels in the North over 50 per cent higher than usual. Therefore, the (Abhisit) government had not wanted to release water, fearing it would cause more problems for farmers.

Within the minimum and maximum water levels allowed at the Bhumibol, Sirikit and Pasak Jolasit dams, specific decisions on when to release water needed to be made on a case-by-case basis, he said.

Weather forecasting had been problematic, Theera said, as the Meteorological Department can only forecast conditions one week in advance."

 

[robblok]

22 minutes ago, farcanell said:

Prey tell.... in which paragraph did I make a non factual claim, as most of the post was an opinion, barring of course, the fact that you are better off ( that fact was right, right?)

You said a far cry from a win.. i consider a lot less people flooded while there was the same amount of rainful

 

15 minutes ago, andersonat said:

Some "political' info/background on the 2001 floods.

 

*

 

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/news/national/aec/30169695

 

"Agriculture Minister Theera Wongsamut (in the Abhisit Cabinet) yesterday acknowledged that the controversial decision to delay the release of water from the country's major dams had been made by the government.

“I admit ordering a delay in the release of water into the plains areas so that farmers could harvest their crops first,” he said.

 

Theera said storms had brought a lot of water in late June, with rain levels in the North over 50 per cent higher than usual. Therefore, the (Abhisit) government had not wanted to release water, fearing it would cause more problems for farmers.

Within the minimum and maximum water levels allowed at the Bhumibol, Sirikit and Pasak Jolasit dams, specific decisions on when to release water needed to be made on a case-by-case basis, he said.

Weather forecasting had been problematic, Theera said, as the Meteorological Department can only forecast conditions one week in advance."

 

He was a minister during the YL cabinet too.. at that time he should have released the water cause during the Abisith time the dams were still far from full, like i showed with the graph i posted and you ignored. You said full in May i show it was not true.. get met by.. silence.

Edited October 30, 2017 by robblok

[farcanell]

6 minutes ago, robblok said:

You said a far cry from a win.. i consider a lot less people flooded while there was the same amount of rainful

 

He was a minister during the YL cabinet too.. at that time he should have released the water cause during the Abisith time the dams were still far from full, like i showed with the graph i posted and you ignored. You said full in May i show it was not true.. get met by.. silence.

Ta da....

 

paragraph one... that’s an opinion, and arguable, as unlike you, I believe the current situation is far from a win, and certainly not laudable

 

paragraph two (part one).... the minister should have released water earlier, or more relevantly, those departments should have acted sooner... years sooner, with proper planning. A failure on previous governments behalf, not yinglucks alone ( as a new PM she probably took advice from the people already in position, which is fair)

 

paragraph two ( part two)... I saw your graph, noted your point, filed it away... and made no real comments pertaining to the information

 

paragraph two ( part three)... you are referencing a different poster

 

paragraph two ( part four)... ergo per my paragraph four above... silence from me on the point you made

 

In summation.... your confusing yourself, but I do hope this simplistic breakdown helps ????

[andersonat]

12 minutes ago, robblok said:

You said a far cry from a win.. i consider a lot less people flooded while there was the same amount of rainful

 

He was a minister during the YL cabinet too.. at that time he should have released the water cause during the Abisith time the dams were still far from full, like i showed with the graph i posted and you ignored. You said full in May i show it was not true.. get met by.. silence.

 

As someone else has previously pointed out, it not only the total amount of rainfall that is important, but also the rate at which it falls.

 

I congratulate you on your Google-skills - I searched for a similar graph, but my Mac refused to load it ( - it was unhappy with the  security-level of the Thaiwater-website). 

After straining my eyes somewhat, I can see that The Bhumipol Dam was indeed not full. [I will go back and recheck the original source for my incorrect info.]

You were right ( - at least about the Bhumipol Dam), and I was wrong. 

Feeling happier now ?

[It would be informative (for me) to know the fill-levels for the other dams in Thailand at that time ( - but my Mac is not allowing that).]

I also feel happier that you agree that the water-levels in the reservoirs should have started being reduced during the time of the Abhisit -Government.

 

*

The new Rice-Scheme introduced by the Yingluck-Government took effect from 7 October 2011.

But you're correct, there was indeed a Rice-Scheme in effect in the Summer of 2011.

The Thai Rice-Pledging program – which began nearly 50 years ago – buys rice from Farmers at lower-than-market prices. For four months at the beginning of harvest season, Farmers are usually offered low prices for their rice (such as 80 percent or 90 percent of market value - this price-level ensures that Thai Farmers have a price-incentive to reclaim their mortgaged rice later). This government program takes their rice as mortgage in exchange for loans at a fixed price. When the market later rises, Farmers can reclaim their rice to sell at a higher price and repay the original loan amount to the government.

 

 

 

[rojaron]

It's not over yet,look like there is one more storm coming around the end of this week.

[DM07]

I think, it might be high time that Bangkok gets some!

Maybe then, this total and utter BS will stop and something might be done!

I am saying "might be", because I doubt anything actually WILL be done, as long as the big wigs' houses stay dry and only the peasants get washed away!

[candide]

2 hours ago, robblok said:

So you prove my point the dams were NOT full in may it just had a bit of rain. Remember we just had a dry season so the dams could NEVER be full. It received 24 cm or rain.... wow.... that is nothing it rains that much certain days in BKK.

 

YL won the election 3 july  flash floods 31 july... but that was not the problem the problem was that she did not open the dams. I was there in 2011 I lived through the floods of 2011 was flooded for 1 1/2 month so I know what I am talking about.

 

Look at the red line graph in 2011 in may... I wonder how you can call tha tfull

Thank you Roblock for providing figures. 

I found an article which provides other interesting figures about the amount of water released. It streses that "In fact by August 2 – when 2.838 billion cubic metres had been discharged – the amount of water discharged in 2011 slipped below 2005 and became the lowest amount of accumulated discharge of water in any of the 7 years at that point. This is despite the fact that you also had more water, at this point, going into the dam than in any of the previous years. Then, of course, it quickly accelerated form August 2 onwards which was likely done to keep the capacity of the dam under 100%."
https://asiancorrespondent.com/2011/11/bhumipol-dam-water-entering-the-dam-discharge-of-water-and-capaicty/

So as already noticed by Andersonat, Yingluck started office in August 2011. How can the insufficient water release be caused by a rice scheme that was only launched in October 2011? 

[wvavin]

This is no longer news. No government ever bothers on this issue.

[sambum]

And tourist figures have gone up by another 12% this month!

[CantSpell]

4 hours ago, Ossy said:

Yes, folks, with only 19 good folk drowning, this is a WIN . . . what do you think? And, thanks to our amazing water-retention area strategy, less than a million homes in those areas are still under 1 metre of water and only 22 provinces are still submerged . . . bloody terrific. Where does NCPO Spokesman Colonel Winthai Suvaree live? I can't help wondering . . . in a wet bit or a dry one? Smug twerp!

Flooding 22 province so that Mr PM can keep his feet dry as well as people in BKK having a dry week-end is what they consider a win indeed...

 

Who cares about those people in the country anyway, they should have been in Bangkok...

[atsiii]

Just curious... does anyone remember the death toll as a result of flooding in 2011?   If so, how does it compare with this year?  19 in the last four weeks... or almost 5 per week seems pretty high.  

[andersonat]

4 minutes ago, atsiii said:

Just curious... does anyone remember the death toll as a result of flooding in 2011?   If so, how does it compare with this year?  19 in the last four weeks... or almost 5 per week seems pretty high.  

 

"Flooding persisted in some areas until mid-January 2012, and resulted in a total of 815 deaths (with 3 missing) and 13.6 million people affected. Sixty-five of Thailand's 77 provinces were declared flood disaster zones, and over 20,000 square kilometres (7,700 sq mi) of farmland was damaged. The disaster has been described as 'the worst flooding yet in terms of the amount of water and people affected.' ... The World Bank's estimate for this disaster means it ranks as the world's fourth costliest disaster as of 2011 surpassed only by the 2011 earthquake and tsunami in Japan, 1995 Kobe earthquake, and Hurricane Katrina in 2005."

[lvr181]

1 hour ago, sambum said:

And tourist figures have gone up by another 12% this month!

Compared to this time in 1941?

[sambum]

1 hour ago, lvr181 said:

Compared to this time in 1941?

No - compared to last month, which was 12% more than the month before, which was 12% more than  the month before, which was 12% more than  the month before, which was 12% more than  the month before etc etc etc 

Aren't  "copy"and "paste" useful tools - I think TAT must use them  a lot! 

Edited October 30, 2017 by sambum