Britain agrees to set EU 'Exit Day' in law

[webfact]

Britain agrees to set EU 'Exit Day' in law

 

Britain's Prime Minister Theresa May arrives to speak at the Conferederation of British Industry's annual conference in London, Britain, November 6, 2017. REUTERS/Mary Turner

 

LONDON (Reuters) - Britain's government said on Thursday it would use legislation to fix the time and date of the country's European Union exit, addressing concerns of Brexiteers who fear slow negotiations and opposition to the divorce could cause delays.

 

The government said it was proposing a change to the EU (Withdrawal) Bill currently making its way through parliament to set the exit for 2300 GMT on March 29, 2019.

 

"We’ve listened to members of the public and Parliament and have made this change to remove any confusion or concern about what 'exit day' means," Brexit minister David Davis said in a statement.

 

The date has previously been implied by a fixed two-year negotiating period triggered on March 29, 2017, but not explicitly stated in law.

 

Prime Minister Theresa May and her team are battling to keep exit negotiations with the EU moving, amid growing concern that talks have yet to begin on a transitional deal to smooth the exit for businesses or the complex terms of a future trade deal.

 

At home, May's government is facing a rough ride in parliament on the withdrawal bill, which forms the central plank of her Brexit strategy.

 

After losing her parliamentary majority in an ill-judged election in June, May has to unite a Conservative Party deeply split over leaving the EU and rely on the support of a small Northern Irish party to get the bill through without defeats.

 

The decision to define the date of Brexit in law came with a clear statement that the government is prepared to consider other concessions - even those proposed by political opponents.

 

"This important step demonstrates our pragmatic approach to this vital piece of legislation," Davis said. "Where MPs (Members of Parliament) can improve the Bill, whatever their party, we will work with them." 

 

The bill will begin the latest stage of its journey through parliament on Tuesday and Wednesday, when lawmakers will debate and vote on some of the 186 pages of changes that have so far been proposed. The bill is at an early stage, and is expected to take months to make its way through both houses of parliament.

 

(Reporting by William James; editing by Andrew Roche)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-11-10

[Samui Bodoh]

I am not British so my views don't matter much, however...

 

This was a stupid decision, and it has been compounded by the most incompetent leaving process I have ever seen. If you feel that you need to set a time and date into law for getting out, your future relations ain't gonna be that great.

 

Apologies to my Brit friends...

 

Edited November 9, 2017 by Samui Bodoh

[alant]

46 minutes ago, Samui Bodoh said:

I am not British so my views don't matter much, however...

 

This was a stupid decision, and it has been compounded by the most incompetent leaving process I have ever seen. If you feel that you need to set a time and date into law for getting out, your future relations ain't gonna be that great.

 

Apologies to my Brit friends...

 

I welcome all views on Brexit as one that voted for it but may I ask why leaving is such a bad idea? The reason often given is that it is the biggest trading block for the uk. Unfortunately the UK trades at a loss with the rest of the EU and has a negative balance of payments largely due to this.

If you had a job where the employer charged you more to work for him than he paid you it is unlikely you would not look to get out of the arrangement. If not I bet your bank manager would have a thing to say about it.

So why is it so stupid?

[Samui Bodoh]

25 minutes ago, alant said:

I welcome all views on Brexit as one that voted for it but may I ask why leaving is such a bad idea? The reason often given is that it is the biggest trading block for the uk. Unfortunately the UK trades at a loss with the rest of the EU and has a negative balance of payments largely due to this.

If you had a job where the employer charged you more to work for him than he paid you it is unlikely you would not look to get out of the arrangement. If not I bet your bank manager would have a thing to say about it.

So why is it so stupid?

 

You make a good point, but I will have to leave the specific, detailed discussions to those who know more than I. However, let me speak in generalities a bit...

 

Economically, I don't know if the UK has always had a negative balance of payments, but I doubt that it will always have one. My view is the the EU represents an opportunity to be part of a large market and to thrive within that market. I suspect the we are having a glass half full/glass half empty talk...

 

Culturally, this may sound funny as the British influence has been felt around the world for centuries, but I think protecting British culture into the future is more effective within a bloc of people that hold similar values. Forgive me, but outside of the EU the UK will be just one more small/medium country with minimal influence. Inside it has a strong, global voice.

 

Politically, I think the UK will be diminished greatly outside of the EU. When (and it is when, not if) the UN finally decides to reform, the first thing on the block will be the UK seat on the Security Council. Further, although the UK has a large army and the courage to use it, the opportunities for influence will be diminished outside of the EU. Force and influence thrive with a combination of power, both soft and hard. The UK isn't really big enough for soft power on its own, at least in any meaningful way. Finally, there are now doubts about the UK's commitment to partnerships. The UK does have the right to pull out of the EU, but I wonder if any country will ever be really comfortable with a long-term partnership with the UK again (I would certainly think very long and hard before any long-term agreement with the UK).

 

Generally, I think in this world of change and uncertainty, it is good to be in a community of like-minded folks. The EU members, for all their faults (and there are MANY), share a great deal; freedom of expression, freedom of the press, democracy, respect for human rights, respect for rule of law, etc. It seems to me that this is a good club to be a member of.

 

Finally, let me say that I should not have used the word "Stupid", but perhaps 'unwise'. The UK has every right to pull out of the UK, and I should respect that right a bit better.

 

Cheers

[Orac]

On  a technical point, surely this is just a proposal and not an agreement at present which would require the consent of parliament.

[nontabury]

2 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

I am not British so my views don't matter much, however...

 

This was a stupid decision, and it has been compounded by the most incompetent leaving process I have ever seen. If you feel that you need to set a time and date into law for getting out, your future relations ain't gonna be that great.

 

Apologies to my Brit friends...

 

Perhaps you’ve been listening to too many remoaners. The decisions to leave this so-called Union was agreed by the majority of those who voted. It was decided on many different issues, national sovereignty, security, economics and the wish not to be governed by the unelected bureacrats in Brussels. True the leaving process is not going smoothly, perhaps due to the P.M who is not really a supporter of 

the British people’s determination.

 

Edited November 10, 2017 by nontabury

[Laughing Gravy]

23 minutes ago, Samui Bodoh said:

Politically, I think the UK will be diminished greatly outside of the EU. When (and it is when, not if) the UN finally decides to reform, the first thing on the block will be the UK seat on the Security Council. Further, although the UK has a large army and the courage to use it, the opportunities for influence will be diminished outside of the EU. Force and influence thrive with a combination of power, both soft and hard. The UK isn't really big enough for soft power on its own, at least in any meaningful way. Finally, there are now doubts about the UK's commitment to partnerships. The UK does have the right to pull out of the EU, but I wonder if any country will ever be really comfortable with a long-term partnership with the UK again (I would certainly think very long and hard before any long-term agreement with the UK).

 

Generally, I think in this world of change and uncertainty, it is good to be in a community of like-minded folks. The EU members, for all their faults (and there are MANY), share a great deal; freedom of expression, freedom of the press, democracy, respect for human rights, respect for rule of law, etc. It seems to me that this is a good club to be a member of.

The UK have tried to change the EU for years. It has refused. by the time they start to reform, other countries will have left. The EU is becoming more federalized and wants its own army, more control over the countries, taking away democratic parliaments. The EU is not democratic, I suggest you read up on it. If you want to be a cloned sheep being the same as everyone else, I pity you.

 

You talk about trust in partnerships. We were partners for 40 plus years. We actually joined a common market. The EU is not that organization now.

 

As for the EU being a good club. It has been for some countries who were poor and have developed, especially putting little in and getting lots out. the UK has never been one of those. The rest of the world does OK outside of the EU. You talk as if the UK is going to but a wall around itself. it isn't. You are right it has many faults and they are becoming more obvious.

 

We shared a house with 6 others, then it grew to 27. We are moving out. We can still be friends and even trade but we are not going to be told we can't trade with others in the street and we have to do as we are told on everything.  It does mean that whatever we put in the fridge, everyone else won't be stealing it,  If we ever get out of the EU with the way TM is going.

 

As a side note, I was thinking that TM and delivering brexit must be like being a non-believer in religion and then having to stand up in church and tell the congregation that god exists and the true savior of everyone. The sooner she goes the better.

 

[baansgr]

49 minutes ago, Samui Bodoh said:

 

You make a good point, but I will have to leave the specific, detailed discussions to those who know more than I. However, let me speak in generalities a bit...

 

Economically, I don't know if the UK has always had a negative balance of payments, but I doubt that it will always have one. My view is the the EU represents an opportunity to be part of a large market and to thrive within that market. I suspect the we are having a glass half full/glass half empty talk...

 

Culturally, this may sound funny as the British influence has been felt around the world for centuries, but I think protecting British culture into the future is more effective within a bloc of people that hold similar values. Forgive me, but outside of the EU the UK will be just one more small/medium country with minimal influence. Inside it has a strong, global voice.

 

Politically, I think the UK will be diminished greatly outside of the EU. When (and it is when, not if) the UN finally decides to reform, the first thing on the block will be the UK seat on the Security Council. Further, although the UK has a large army and the courage to use it, the opportunities for influence will be diminished outside of the EU. Force and influence thrive with a combination of power, both soft and hard. The UK isn't really big enough for soft power on its own, at least in any meaningful way. Finally, there are now doubts about the UK's commitment to partnerships. The UK does have the right to pull out of the EU, but I wonder if any country will ever be really comfortable with a long-term partnership with the UK again (I would certainly think very long and hard before any long-term agreement with the UK).

 

Generally, I think in this world of change and uncertainty, it is good to be in a community of like-minded folks. The EU members, for all their faults (and there are MANY), share a great deal; freedom of expression, freedom of the press, democracy, respect for human rights, respect for rule of law, etc. It seems to me that this is a good club to be a member of.

 

Finally, let me say that I should not have used the word "Stupid", but perhaps 'unwise'. The UK has every right to pull out of the UK, and I should respect that right a bit better.

 

Cheers

Ever heard of NATO, Brexit wont change he that

[bert bloggs]

Good,about time ,stop fafing around Teresa and get on with it .

[ilostmypassword]

2 hours ago, alant said:

I welcome all views on Brexit as one that voted for it but may I ask why leaving is such a bad idea? The reason often given is that it is the biggest trading block for the uk. Unfortunately the UK trades at a loss with the rest of the EU and has a negative balance of payments largely due to this.

If you had a job where the employer charged you more to work for him than he paid you it is unlikely you would not look to get out of the arrangement. If not I bet your bank manager would have a thing to say about it.

So why is it so stupid?

Because presumably Britain needs the things it gets from the EU and it's going to have to get them elsewhere if not from the EU. Do you really believe there are some major bargains out there outside of the EU that will dramatically shift the balance?

[petermik]

7 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

Because presumably Britain needs the things it gets from the EU and it's going to have to get them elsewhere if not from the EU. Do you really believe there are some major bargains out there outside of the EU that will dramatically shift the balance?

We are not leaving to shop in the "bargain basement" we are leaving because we are British and want to be governed by our OWN elected government who will carry out the wishes of the British people......not some jumped up "johnnie foreigners" in Europe telling us what is best for OUR country......and paying a ridiculously high price for it....end of

[ilostmypassword]

Just now, petermik said:

We are not leaving to shop in the "bargain basement" we are leaving because we are British and want to be governed by our OWN elected government who will carry out the wishes of the British people......not some jumped up "johnnie foreigners" in Europe telling us what is best for OUR country......and paying a ridiculously high price for it....end of

Another Pavlovian response.  Either you didn't read or didn't understand the post I was responding to. Here it is again just for your benefit.

 

 "I welcome all views on Brexit as one that voted for it but may I ask why leaving is such a bad idea? The reason often given is that it is the biggest trading block for the uk. Unfortunately the UK trades at a loss with the rest of the EU and has a negative balance of payments largely due to this.

If you had a job where the employer charged you more to work for him than he paid you it is unlikely you would not look to get out of the arrangement. If not I bet your bank manager would have a thing to say about it.

So why is it so stupid?"

 

Actually there was a lot more clueless stuff in that Alant's post but I let it go.

[goldenbrwn1]

Has the 'May ready for tough talks on brexit' topic expired?

 

I have an open question concerning the UN connection with Britain leaving the EU. How and even why would the UK lose its veto powers in the UN , just because of brexit???   Be glad when it's all over tbh , it's an absolute nightmare here in the UK .....brexit...brexit...brexit....brexit....brexit.....? Anyway it's gone 3 am here and I'm absolutely bollo#ed.. good night.

Edited November 10, 2017 by goldenbrwn1

[hansnl]

5 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

I am not British so my views don't matter much, however...

 

This was a stupid decision, and it has been compounded by the most incompetent leaving process I have ever seen. If you feel that you need to set a time and date into law for getting out, your future relations ain't gonna be that great.

 

Apologies to my Brit friends...

 

The decision to leave the EU was a good one.

That EU Moloch is undemocratic.

The only way back to democracy in Europe may be the return to the EEC.

Or break up the EU.

Or leave it.

[retarius]

I love it. If you are a person who, like me, thinks that sovereignty is more important than GDP, this will solidify Brexit, remove some of the uncertainty that is killing business and hopefully shut up some of the remainers who keep harping on about staying in.

 

How Britain performs post-Brexit is much less dependent on how well people accept the decision and put their efforts onto making Brexit a success; the omens are not good as the remainers seem willing to cut their collective noses off to spite their faces.

 

Roll on 2019.

 

[ilostmypassword]

I b

3 minutes ago, retarius said:

 

 

How Britain performs post-Brexit is much less dependent on how well people accept the decision and put their efforts onto making Brexit a success; t

 

 

 

Well I agree with you that the notioh of How Britain performs post-Brexit is much less dependinet on how well people accept the decision and putting their efforts into making Brexit a success ... I wouild go even further and saying that such dependence is economic nonsense. But what is post-Brexit success dependent on? Magic? 

[petermik]

9 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

Another Pavlovian response.  Either you didn't read or didn't understand the post I was responding to. Here it is again just for your benefit.

 

 "I welcome all views on Brexit as one that voted for it but may I ask why leaving is such a bad idea? The reason often given is that it is the biggest trading block for the uk. Unfortunately the UK trades at a loss with the rest of the EU and has a negative balance of payments largely due to this.

If you had a job where the employer charged you more to work for him than he paid you it is unlikely you would not look to get out of the arrangement. If not I bet your bank manager would have a thing to say about it.

So why is it so stupid?"

 

Actually there was a lot more clueless stuff in that Alant's post but I let it go.

ilostmypassword along with my commonsense..........we voted out...we want out ASAP.....the don,t like it have to lump it

[ilostmypassword]

2 minutes ago, petermik said:

ilostmypassword along with my commonsense..........we voted out...we want out ASAP.....the don,t like it have to lump it

Go back to Mordor for some rest and recreation. Apparently, you lack even simple analytical skills.

[rockingrobin]

This is just simply making it clear that the UK will not be implementing the EU's anti tax avoidance measures that are due after the Brexit date

[RuamRudy]

5 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

I am not British so my views don't matter much, however...

 

This was a stupid decision, and it has been compounded by the most incompetent leaving process I have ever seen. If you feel that you need to set a time and date into law for getting out, your future relations ain't gonna be that great.

 

Apologies to my Brit friends...

 

A date and time needed to be set to provide assurance to the billionaire elites who bankrolled the Brexit madness that they would be free of the potential horrors of the impending EU-wide Anti Tax Avoiding Directive. Thanks to the support of a large number of useful idiots, the likes of Lord Rothermere, Lord Ashcroft, and other tax avoiding parasites can continue to keep their money out of reach of the tax man without fear of having to cough up like the little people they brainwashed.

[natway09]

Anyone can make a law to leave,,,, that"s the easy bit.

Achieving it is a different issue & more complex than they imagined in their wildest dreams.

I read an article on commercial fishing the other day & 80%  of the UK's fish are harvested in waters 

that without huge negotiation will not even be available to them.

And what about the Irish issue & border control ,,,, just to name a few issues.

They will never make the deadline & of course the EU are not going to make it easy for the UK

& why should they, how would you like your left arm chopped off

 

[RuamRudy]

7 minutes ago, natway09 said:

Anyone can make a law to leave,,,, that"s the easy bit.

Achieving it is a different issue & more complex than they imagined in their wildest dreams.

I read an article on commercial fishing the other day & 80%  of the UK's fish are harvested in waters 

that without huge negotiation will not even be available to them.

And what about the Irish issue & border control ,,,, just to name a few issues.

They will never make the deadline & of course the EU are not going to make it easy for the UK

& why should they, how would you like your left arm chopped off

 

Indeed, many are now waking up to the reality of their actions. Grimsby, a fishing town that was 70% in favour of Brexit, now realises what a monumental mistake they made, and now want special exemptions:

 

Grimsby residents branded 'idiots' for Brexit vote as seafood industry seeks free trade deal

"People in Grimsby have been accused of “double standards” and of being “idiots” for voting to leave the EU after representatives of the town’s seafood industry called for special free trade status after Brexit."

[Enoon]

 

1 hour ago, RuamRudy said:

Indeed, many are now waking up to the reality of their actions. Grimsby, a fishing town that was 70% in favour of Brexit, now realises what a monumental mistake they made, and now want special exemptions:

 

Grimsby residents branded 'idiots' for Brexit vote as seafood industry seeks free trade deal

"People in Grimsby have been accused of “double standards” and of being “idiots” for voting to leave the EU after representatives of the town’s seafood industry called for special free trade status after Brexit."

 

Kicked out by the Icelanders and now kicked further out by their own stupidity.

 

"Great" Britain in microcosm.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 10, 2017 by Enoon

[Baerboxer]

8 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

I am not British so my views don't matter much, however...

 

This was a stupid decision, and it has been compounded by the most incompetent leaving process I have ever seen. If you feel that you need to set a time and date into law for getting out, your future relations ain't gonna be that great.

 

Apologies to my Brit friends...

 

 

Please don't feel the need to apologies. Non British and non EU member state citizens can express an objective view based on their perceptions looking in; and with the emotions.

 

I think many EU citizens, British and others, would totally agree with your observation. A stupid decision, taken for all the wrong reasons, with campaigns spouting downright lies intentionally, and one which the politicians didn't expect. The inept way in which the referendum procedures were amateurishly drawn up, the shock of those pushing leave at actually winning, albeit by a tiny margin, and the total lack of their preparedness to actually implement the decision.

 

The Bexiters continually claim that this was a one off, never to be repeated decision which must last for infinity (and beyond!). Yet they were always shouting about another referendum if they lost closely! Hypocrisy, lack of respect for democracy and the constitution and emotions played and inflamed with outright lies. The CBI (Confederation of British Industry) are so right to call for an end to this pantomime.

 

Thank you for your comments. It's good non British and non EU take the trouble.

 

 

[Baerboxer]

2 hours ago, RuamRudy said:

A date and time needed to be set to provide assurance to the billionaire elites who bankrolled the Brexit madness that they would be free of the potential horrors of the impending EU-wide Anti Tax Avoiding Directive. Thanks to the support of a large number of useful idiots, the likes of Lord Rothermere, Lord Ashcroft, and other tax avoiding parasites can continue to keep their money out of reach of the tax man without fear of having to cough up like the little people they brainwashed.

 

Just wait till the British population becomes more polarized. The very wealth and poor working class. Won't be much middle class - far too dangerous an element. Wonder how long before some bright Tory spark dreams up "means" tests for the right to vote! 

 

Hey ho - back to Victorian values. 

[Laughing Gravy]

1 hour ago, RuamRudy said:

Grimsby residents branded 'idiots' for Brexit vote as seafood industry seeks free trade deal

"People in Grimsby have been accused of “double standards” and of being “idiots” for voting to leave the EU after representatives of the town’s seafood industry called for special free trade status after Brexit."

Yes representatives from the fishing industry. It doesn't mean the people of Grimsby.88,000 of them are all in the seafood industry. The headline should be representatives of the towns seafood industry if voting for brexit are idiots.

 

I am sure if the UK took control of its waters for 200 miles that the seaport would become very prosperous anyway.  Just another paper headline trying to make out people, are regretting brexit. They are not.

[sandyf]

6 hours ago, Orac said:

On  a technical point, surely this is just a proposal and not an agreement at present which would require the consent of parliament.

Exactly.

IAW Article 50 any exit arrangement must be ratified by the European Parliament, one would think that must include the date. I seem to remember some time ago that the EU had stated that their new customs regulations would be introduced on 1st April 2019, a much more appropriate date for brexit.

 

 

[ResandePohm]

6 hours ago, petermik said:

We are not leaving to shop in the "bargain basement" we are leaving because we are British and want to be governed by our OWN elected government who will carry out the wishes of the British people......not some jumped up "johnnie foreigners" in Europe telling us what is best for OUR country......and paying a ridiculously high price for it....end of

Then it is a shame that your elec ted Government hasn't got a clue what to do or how to do it.

[Grouse]

9 hours ago, alant said:

I welcome all views on Brexit as one that voted for it but may I ask why leaving is such a bad idea? The reason often given is that it is the biggest trading block for the uk. Unfortunately the UK trades at a loss with the rest of the EU and has a negative balance of payments largely due to this.

If you had a job where the employer charged you more to work for him than he paid you it is unlikely you would not look to get out of the arrangement. If not I bet your bank manager would have a thing to say about it.

So why is it so stupid?

Read what you just wrote and see the error in your logic

 

Yes, we buy more than we sell. So what. Make better products that people wish to buy. This cock up will result in a deteriorating trade balance. Watch.

[Grouse]

This thread should be compulsory reading for foreigners wanting to understand how the UK voted for Brexit.

 

We obviously have become a country with a majority of idiots

 

I mean, look at the OP. May wants to force Brexit on a specific date regardless of prevailing conditions. In fact, as has been explained today, there is no reason why the whole process could not be halted at any time by adults.

 

In fact, the Komodo branch of the CON Party don't want a deal. So set a hard time limit to assist crashing out and blaming EU intransigence. Guess what, low level munchkins don't see it! It would be hillarious if it wasn't so tragic