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[webfact]

In warning to Ankara, EU cuts funds for Turkey's membership bid

By Robin Emmott

 

FILE PHOTO: European Union (L) and Turkish flags fly outside a hotel in Istanbul, Turkey, May 4, 2016. REUTERS/Murad Sezer/File Photo

 

BRUSSELS (Reuters) - The European Union is set to cut up to 175 million euros (£154 million) for Turkey in 2018 that are linked to Ankara's stalled bid to join the bloc and could block some 3.5 billion euros in development loans earmarked for the country, lawmakers and diplomats said.

 

In a symbolic stand against deteriorating human rights in Turkey, the 2018 cuts are likely to be the start of a longer-term reduction of pre-accession aid that is meant to help EU candidate countries prepare for membership.

 

"As long as Turkey is not respecting freedom of speech, human rights, and is drifting further away from European democratic standards, we cannot finance such a regime with EU funds," said Siegfried Muresan, the European Parliament's chief budget negotiator.

 

Two EU diplomats said EU governments had agreed with the European Parliament this week to withdraw 105 million euros that would have gone to help finance political reforms in Turkey, as well as holding back another 70 million euros.

 

Ankara can still access the 70 million euros if it improves its rights record, Muresan said.

 

Signalling the slow collapse of Turkey's decades-long attempt to join the European Union, the cuts are deeper than an initial proposal to reduce funds by 80 million euros next year.

 

They follow a call for action by German Chancellor Angela Merkel during her re-election campaign, who has described Turkish behaviour on human rights as "unacceptable".

 

Aside from money that the EU gives Turkey as part of its 2016 migration deal, Ankara was set to receive 4.4 billion euros from the EU between 2014 and 2020.

 

Some EU governments now want frozen funds to go to non-governmental groups in Turkey, not to Ankara.

 

Next week, EU governments and lawmakers are set to decide whether Ankara should also lose access to some 3.5 billion euros of European Investment Bank loans that have been earmarked for Turkey until 2020 and that have yet to be assigned.

 

They are now likely to be made available to Ukraine and other former Soviet republics, diplomats said.

 

Merkel has said the rule of law in Turkey is "moving in the wrong direction", a reference to the large-scale purge that President Tayyip Erdogan has carried out following a failed coup attempt in July 2016.

 

While the EU condemned the coup attempt, the scope of Erdogan's response, his detention of U.S. and European citizens including dual nationals, and his jibes at Germany for what he has called "Nazi-like" behaviour have soured EU-Turkey ties.

 

Erdogan says the purges across society are necessary to maintain stability in a NATO country bordering Iraq and Syria.

 

Launched in 2015 after decades in which Ankara sought to formally start an EU membership bid, Turkey's EU membership negotiations were always sensitive for France and Germany because of its status as a large, mainly Muslim country.

 

They are not officially frozen, despite calls from Austria 175 to formally scrap Turkey's EU membership programme. That is in part because the EU relies on Ankara to take in Syrian refugees in return for billions of euros of aid.

 

But a majority of EU countries, led by Germany and the Netherlands, say it no longer makes sense to fund political reforms in Turkey when formal EU membership talks have not taken place since last year.

 

(Reporting by Robin Emmott; Editing by Catherine Evans)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-12-01

[nauseus]

“Company will retire, AAAbouT TurN!”

[klauskunkel]

3 hours ago, webfact said:

EU cuts funds for Turkey's membership bid

I would be wary of clubs that offer money for me to join...

[thaibeachlovers]

The only thing that makes me wonder about this is why they even considered Turkey as a suitable EU candidate. Their values are not consistent with those of most of the EU countries.

 

BTW, if they had joined already they would be required to TAKE refugees, not send them on to the EU. By sending them they are not showing themselves to be true believers in the EU ideology.

( I am aware that Turkey does in fact have a lot of refugees in the country- just making a point ).

[craigt3365]

This probably doesn't help either.

 

Erdogan helped Iran evade US sanctions, witness claims

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/30/middleeast/reza-zarrab-us-trial-erdogan/index.html

 

 

[ilostmypassword]

25 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The only thing that makes me wonder about this is why they even considered Turkey as a suitable EU candidate. Their values are not consistent with those of most of the EU countries.

 

BTW, if they had joined already they would be required to TAKE refugees, not send them on to the EU. By sending them they are not showing themselves to be true believers in the EU ideology.

( I am aware that Turkey does in fact have a lot of refugees in the country- just making a point ).

First off, it wouldn't be a case of "sending", it would be "allowing". You don't seem aware that Turkey hasn't been allwoing refugees to g0 to the EU. They regularly threaten to do just that but so far have not.

Turkish PM warns EU over refugee deal ahead of Syrian peace talks

Turkey’s prime minister has warned that the country has the power to allow millions of refugees to resume their journeys to western Europe if the US and EU-backed Kurdish forces fighting in Syria are given a role in peace talks.

A sixth round of UN-sponsored Syrian talks to find a political solution for the six-year conflict is due to resume in Geneva on Tuesday, and Turkish opposition to any role in the talks for the Kurdish forces, the YPG, is likely to prove one of many stumbling blocks. ..

Speaking after a meeting with Theresa May in London on Monday, Binali Yıldırım said it was possible for Turkey to renege on its agreement with the EU, under which 3.5 million refugees from neighbouring Syria have settled inside Turkey instead of heading for western Europe.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/nov/27/turkey-threatens-to-scrap-refugee-deal-over-syrian-peace-talks

[craigt3365]

The EU and Turkey should send the bill to Russia and Syria for having to deal with the refugees. I bet that would solve the problem quickly!

[Srikcir]

3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

why they even considered Turkey as a suitable EU candidate.

How about this:

"Turkey has a favourable location on the very edge of the world’s largest hydrocarbon reserves. The broader neighbourhood of Turkey—the Caspian basin, Middle East and North Africa (MENA)—contains more than 70 per cent of the world’s oil and natural gas supplies.,... Accessing these energy reserves in the Caspian and MENA region is the priority of external energy policy of the EU."

https://www.cairn.info/revue-l-europe-en-formation-2013-1-page-109.htm

 

[thaibeachlovers]

3 minutes ago, Srikcir said:

How about this:

"Turkey has a favourable location on the very edge of the world’s largest hydrocarbon reserves. The broader neighbourhood of Turkey—the Caspian basin, Middle East and North Africa (MENA)—contains more than 70 per cent of the world’s oil and natural gas supplies.,... Accessing these energy reserves in the Caspian and MENA region is the priority of external energy policy of the EU."

https://www.cairn.info/revue-l-europe-en-formation-2013-1-page-109.htm

 

So, at the same time as the EU is openly against the use of hydrocarbon energy, they are wanting to secure the very thing they don't want to use.

Doesn't make much sense to me, but IMO the EU is run by a bunch of bureaucrats that are economical with the truth.

I'm not saying you are wrong though.

[dick dasterdly]

1 minute ago, Srikcir said:

How about this:

"Turkey has a favourable location on the very edge of the world’s largest hydrocarbon reserves. The broader neighbourhood of Turkey—the Caspian basin, Middle East and North Africa (MENA)—contains more than 70 per cent of the world’s oil and natural gas supplies.,... Accessing these energy reserves in the Caspian and MENA region is the priority of external energy policy of the EU."

https://www.cairn.info/revue-l-europe-en-formation-2013-1-page-109.htm

 

Initially I was suprised to learn that the EU is giving ANY money to Turkey (a non-EU country) for anything other than the cost of 'holding back' immigrants - but it's beginning to make sense.....

[Srikcir]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

So, at the same time as the EU is openly against the use of hydrocarbon energy,

I don't think that's due to a plan to replace hydrocarbon energy with alternative energy.

Rather it seems about "the EU’s increasing dependency on energy imports from non-member countries. Indeed, more than half (54.0 %) of the EU-28’s gross inland energy consumption in 2015 came from imported sources." [for example Russia] http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/Energy_production_and_imports

So I don't see an inconsistency with the EU looking towards alternative sources for fossil fuel. 

[ilostmypassword]

12 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The only thing that makes me wonder about this is why they even considered Turkey as a suitable EU candidate. Their values are not consistent with those of most of the EU countries.

 

BTW, if they had joined already they would be required to TAKE refugees, not send them on to the EU. By sending them they are not showing themselves to be true believers in the EU ideology.

( I am aware that Turkey does in fact have a lot of refugees in the country- just making a point ).

It's odd that it's often the same people who defend the repression of dissent and the rule of law in some European nations find it offensive in Turkey.

[notmyself]

14 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The only thing that makes me wonder about this is why they even considered Turkey as a suitable EU candidate. Their values are not consistent with those of most of the EU countries.

 

 

Maybe not individual countries but they would fit in quite well with the EU as an institution. 

[Ulic]

15 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

The EU and Turkey should send the bill to Russia and Syria for having to deal with the refugees. I bet that would solve the problem quickly!

The bill should be sent to the USA. It was Obama's support of anti Assad opposition with weapons that started the civil war. It does not matter what kind of a despot you are, the US does not care as long as you are on the side of the US. With the Russians having a naval base on the Syrian Mediterranean Assad/Syria are aligned with Russia. The civil war in Syria is a proxy struggle between Russia and the USA. It is 100% the fault of Obama's foreign policy to crimp Russian influence. The deaths and refugee

crisis is on Obama.

[observer90210]

Just as the EU and the €uro make no sense, there is no sense in admitting Turkey within the UE as the country still functions with some dynamics from the middle ages, .... a bit like  some western or asian nations nevertheless...

[ilostmypassword]

4 hours ago, observer90210 said:

Just as the EU and the €uro make no sense, there is no sense in admitting Turkey within the UE as the country still functions with some dynamics from the middle ages, .... a bit like  some western or asian nations nevertheless...

Actually, Turkey is already partially within the EU. It is a member of the Customs Union. This allows Turkey to trade freely within the EU without tariffs being imposed on its good and unable to impose tariffs on other members of the Customs Union.

[craigt3365]

5 hours ago, Ulic said:

The bill should be sent to the USA. It was Obama's support of anti Assad opposition with weapons that started the civil war. It does not matter what kind of a despot you are, the US does not care as long as you are on the side of the US. With the Russians having a naval base on the Syrian Mediterranean Assad/Syria are aligned with Russia. The civil war in Syria is a proxy struggle between Russia and the USA. It is 100% the fault of Obama's foreign policy to crimp Russian influence. The deaths and refugee

crisis is on Obama.

So AFTER the civil war started, the US supported the opposition and that's what caused the war to start...before.

 

Place the blame properly. Assad was in charge. He's to blame. Period.

[adammike]

Turkey is a member of NATO they are allies to most of the EU,they had a fiercely secular government that's changed,Turkey applied to join the common market now the EU decades ago,the eu wanted them onside and in some sort of partnership full membership was never going to happen because it would take all 28 members soon to be 27 to agree to it. project fear of the brexiters that 60million Turks were massing on the borders to flood the EU was more of their lies.

[ballpoint]

23 hours ago, klauskunkel said:

I would be wary of clubs that offer money for me to join...

I'd be even more wary of clubs that make me pay more money to leave.

[Srikcir]

2 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

It is a member of the Customs Union.

CU may be a two-edged sword.

First, it's beneficial only when there is trade.

Second, it's not all encompassing:

"upgrading the customs union to cover trade in agricultural goods, services, and government procurement would increase Turkey’s GDP by 2.5 percent, along with 95 percent increase in agricultural exports to the EU and up to a 430 percent increase in the country’s services exports."

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/order-from-chaos/2017/08/29/the-eu-and-turkey-need-each-other-could-upgrading-the-customs-union-be-the-key/

Such an economic "sweetner" can be used by EU to leverage "reconciliation" with Turkey. Of course Turkey could reject the CU completely and turn to other hedgemonies for its trade needs such as Russia and China.

[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, Srikcir said:

CU may be a two-edged sword.

First, it's beneficial only when there is trade.

Second, it's not all encompassing:

"upgrading the customs union to cover trade in agricultural goods, services, and government procurement would increase Turkey’s GDP by 2.5 percent, along with 95 percent increase in agricultural exports to the EU and up to a 430 percent increase in the country’s services exports."

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/order-from-chaos/2017/08/29/the-eu-and-turkey-need-each-other-could-upgrading-the-customs-union-be-the-key/

Such an economic "sweetner" can be used by EU to leverage "reconciliation" with Turkey. Of course Turkey could reject the CU completely and turn to other hedgemonies for its trade needs such as Russia and China.

I don't know what trade needs you are referring to. First of all, Turkey already does a huge amount of trading with Russia. How much more can they do? And it's the 3rd biggest positive trade balance after the EU. Second, the stuff that Turkey now sells to the EU is stuff that Russia and China are going to want to buy? And in the same quantities as does the EU?

[Srikcir]

9 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

And it's the 3rd biggest positive trade balance after the EU. 

There you are.

[the guest]

On 12/1/2017 at 10:02 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

The only thing that makes me wonder about this is why they even considered Turkey as a suitable EU candidate. Their values are not consistent with those of most of the EU countries.

 

BTW, if they had joined already they would be required to TAKE refugees, not send them on to the EU. By sending them they are not showing themselves to be true believers in the EU ideology.

( I am aware that Turkey does in fact have a lot of refugees in the country- just making a point ).

Turkeys values are the same as Europe, both are corrupt, and both are not transparent.

[ilostmypassword]

11 minutes ago, the guest said:

Turkeys values are the same as Europe, both are corrupt, and both are not transparent.

Can you cite some terrestrial portion of the globe that is not corrupt and is transparent?

Edited December 2, 2017 by ilostmypassword

[craigt3365]

13 minutes ago, the guest said:

Turkeys values are the same as Europe, both are corrupt, and both are not transparent.

BS. Turkey is way more corrupt and not transparent at all. And becoming worse every day.

[ilostmypassword]

48 minutes ago, Srikcir said:

There you are.

Yes. There I am saying how much room is there for Russia to pick up the slack when it's already doing a huge trade volume with Turkey? Especially considering that the Russian economy is about 1/14 the size of the EU's. And if you discount the distorting effects of its fossil fuels component, much less..

[thaibeachlovers]

20 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

It's odd that it's often the same people who defend the repression of dissent and the rule of law in some European nations find it offensive in Turkey.

As you quoted me that means that you think I did that.

While I have no memory of when I supported repression in the EU, I like nothing about the failed experiment that is the catastrophe of the EU. I'd like to repress their bureaucrats bigly.

[ilostmypassword]

31 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

As you quoted me that means that you think I did that.

While I have no memory of when I supported repression in the EU, I like nothing about the failed experiment that is the catastrophe of the EU. I'd like to repress their bureaucrats bigly.

You mean the catastrophe whose economy is now growing at an accelerating rate? If there is a major problem with the EU it's the Eurozone.  Which the UK very wisely chose not to be a part of.