Stopped at Don Muang

[Argus Tuft]

1 hour ago, yogavnture said:

everything is computerized and what do you call it something rythms........the rythem of the computer put a flag..........2 tourist visas and its only feb 2. it caught the computer.........technically he wouldn't have needed any visas at all for this situation and he got two. 

Algorithm is the word you are looking for

[BritTim]

1 hour ago, stevenl said:

You might have to convince immigration of that next time. Bring income statements and anything else that proves you don't live and work here.

The immigration official can see how many days in the last couple of years he spent in Thailand. Even if he was outside the country working on a ship for 150 days a year, this would be a good indication that he is not living and working in Thailand (even without showing pay slips and/or bank statements with overseas payments). The only reasonable exception would be if his visits coincide with possible seasonal work like dive master at islands that suspend most diving activity when conditions are dangerous. Unless in the country for 250+ days a year (or some other red flag) I think the immigration official was just being difficult because he thinks current immigration rules are too lenient. That said, being prepared for a rogue official on future visits makes sense.

[BritTim]

3 hours ago, natway09 said:

Better reread the new entry rules.

They are not to know that you are not using Thailand as a base to work from.

It is up to you to prove to them that you are not. How many "tourist"entries in the last 12 months

I am not aware of any substantive official changes to the entry rules when arriving by air since the changes for visa exempt entries in the middle of 2014. If there is something I have missed, can you please direct me to a good source.

[BritTim]

28 minutes ago, Russell17au said:

But you, yourself said that you are here for 100 days and that exceeds any tourist visa which is a maximum of 90 days that is 60 days for the visa plus a 30 day extension, so you need a 90 day non-imm "O" visa with a 1 year extension on the basis of marriage if you want to stay longer.

Is there some new rule that restricts you to a single tourist visa per year? If so, please let me know where I can read up on this.

[gamini]

8 hours ago, Happy enough said:

really. i'm under 50 and i don't use an elite visa. should i leave and come back at retirement age or get an elite visa. you seem to be very anti anyone who isn't retirement age?

Many countries only allow a maximum stay for a tourist of six months. So why should Thailand be any different?

[Bangkok Barry]

1 hour ago, Happy enough said:

married for 18 years and never felt unwelcome. used either marriage visas or work visas. is that hard to understand?

Sorry - my comment was directed at the OP.

[buick]

i used bkk as my travel base/hub for 10 yrs.  using a combo of visa exempt and tourist visa entries.  got interviewed once about halfway through that period (at suvarnabhumi).  was told to use more tourist visas, less visa exempt.  not stopped again.  i finally turned 50 in 2017 so eligible for and obtained a non imm O.  if i was still w/o a non imm O, i think i'd used the VIP arrival services (even if arriving business class) for 1,200thb.  i can't say for sure that is an easy way to avoid problems but it isn't alot of money and probably gives you an edge. 

[PerkinsCuthbert]

Get this straight: Thailand and its immigration officers have every right to apply their judgement regarding entrants into the Kingdom, according to the local law; it may in a few cases not be palatable; it may in more cases be irritating and seemingly arbitrary. But get used to it, Thailand is more liberal in its immigration policies than almost any Western country you may care to name. It is a privilege to live in a country not of one's native birth, and we, by definition, have limited rights here. Suck it up. 

[moe666]

4 hours ago, midas said:

 

Hang on a minute? But isn't using a country as a base for travel what tourists usually do?

And since when is there a time limit to being a tourist?

This is getting crazier and crazier

 

The majority of tourist about 2 to 3 weeks and with chinese 10 days max. more like 5 to 7. When you include one of the biggest tourist countries to Thailand 1 to 3 days seems to sum it up

[midas]

1 hour ago, moe666 said:

The majority of tourist about 2 to 3 weeks and with chinese 10 days max. more like 5 to 7. When you include one of the biggest tourist countries to Thailand 1 to 3 days seems to sum it up

so what? Are you suggesting everybody must comply with your parameters otherwise they are not bone fide tourists? Maybe the OP is not in the majority- may be the OP is part of the minority.

Like an American couple I was speaking to a couple of weeks ago at the airport who have a yacht moored somewhere but are flying around Thailand. They have been travelling for SEVEN YEARS !

Maybe you should tell them to go home its way past their allowance (according to you)

 

[yogavnture]

3 hours ago, Argus Tuft said:

Algorithm is the word you are looking for

right . that word u know how your computer does that . well im sure immigration computers do the same thing . ive been using BKK as a home base (in winter) for 18 years and never had an issue because i follow the rules and i dont work here.  once you get on thier radar you are screwed

[JackThompson]

 

8 hours ago, stevenl said:

Bring income statements and anything else that proves you don't live and work here.

I agree with this - always carried them myself - but do we have known-cases of them accepting such things?  Reports indicate people being asked the same questions over and over, called liars, and prevented from going to ATMs to get cash.  If they want docs, they should specify what they will accept, so that people can oblige them.

 

7 hours ago, Russell17au said:

But you, yourself said that you are here for 100 days and that exceeds any tourist visa which is a maximum of 90 days that is 60 days for the visa plus a 30 day extension, so you need a 90 day non-imm "O" visa with a 1 year extension on the basis of marriage if you want to stay longer.

Much better to get a Non-O Multiple for only 100-days/yr - and avoid the headaches and potential corruption which varies by immigration office, to boot.

[BritTim]

11 hours ago, gamini said:

Many countries only allow a maximum stay for a tourist of six months. So why should Thailand be any different?

No reason, but Thailand is different in this regard.

 

Thailand could certainly impose such a restriction. In fact, for a short while a number of years back, there was a rule of maximum 90 days per six months on visa exempt entries. The reality is that Thailand has no fixed limit of six months as a tourist. Neither the Immigration Act of 1979, nor any Ministerial Orders specify any limit.

 

It is a common fallacy that Thailand, like most other countries, gives immigration officials discretion to deny travelers entry for any or no reason. This is not true. The grounds under which those entering with a visa should be denied entry are listed in Section 12 of the Immigration Act. For those entering using visa exempt entries, there are additional conditions. Well known is the relatively recent limit of two visa exempt entries by land per calendar year. Also, a Ministerial Order in mid 2014 gave immigration officials discretion over those using back-to-back visa exempt entries to stay long periods in Thailand. Outside of this, only the Minister has the power to arbitrarily admit or deny entry to individuals or groups.

 

Very occasionally, rogue officials may deny entry, using one of the justifications under Section 12 of the Immigration Act when the evidence shows the denied entry to be unlawful. They can do this with impunity, as they can easily thwart the appeal process, but thankfully these activities have been very rare.

[sco77y]

No i can get 60 day extention based on marriage but i went to see a pal in PP for 2 days or i would have just got the 60 extention.

[Soneva]

On 2/2/2018 at 10:33 PM, yogavnture said:

right . that word u know how your computer does that . well im sure immigration computers do the same thing . ive been using BKK as a home base (in winter) for 18 years and never had an issue because i follow the rules and i dont work here.  once you get on thier radar you are screwed

Could you please clarify what you mean by “on their radar”?

 

I don’t think being asked questions or receiving comments from an IO necessarily means one is “on the radar.”

[yogavnture]

1 hour ago, Soneva said:

Could you please clarify what you mean by “on their radar”?

 

I don’t think being asked questions or receiving comments from an IO necessarily means one is “on the radar.”

radar means they have computer programs that track what you are doing and if the computer deems you out of the norm. it flags immig. officer to look at you more intently. maybe asking you more questions. etc. then he can make determination. im sure if you look poor he will red stamp you

[kurtmartens]

On 2/2/2018 at 6:55 PM, gamini said:

Many countries only allow a maximum stay for a tourist of six months. So why should Thailand be any different?

It shouldn't be.  But ... in the meantime gives 50% of the folks on TV something to moan about.  Maybe its a IO conspiracy to annoy TV folks.

[BritTim]

35 minutes ago, yogavnture said:

radar means they have computer programs that track what you are doing and if the computer deems you out of the norm. it flags immig. officer to look at you more intently. maybe asking you more questions. etc. then he can make determination. im sure if you look poor he will red stamp you

I have no insider information on this, but this is my impression based on long observation. I think what happens after a long talk with a senior official at the airport can go both ways.

 

I think the fact that you have been interviewed and cleared is noted on the record. In many cases, this makes it less likely that you will be referred again. However, it does depend on what comment the senior official placed against your entry. If it indicates suspicion of illegal working, you could be in trouble.

[JackThompson]

6 minutes ago, kurtmartens said:

On 2/2/2018 at 6:55 PM, gamini said:

Many countries only allow a maximum stay for a tourist of six months. So why should Thailand be any different?

It shouldn't be.  ...

Most nations with such arbitrary limits do not have a large percentage of their GDP based on foreign-national spending into their economies (tourists, retirees, etc).  Even so, I think the USA, for example, preventing wealthy foreign tourists spending more time at their homes in Florida, is peak-idiocy.

 

But given Thailand's unique economic/GDP pie, why would it benefit Thailand to have such a limit? 

 

If it would be a benefit to Thailand, somehow, why has no restriction of this nature been added per law or ministerial-order?

 

The only result I can imagine for such a limit, would be to ensure more foreign-sourced income is spent in Cambodia, Vietnam, and The Philippines, instead of Thailand.

[Soneva]

Unfortunately, based on my last experience at BKK, I suspect my profile has triggered that increased scrutiny.  

 

Per your helpful advice, BritTim, I have decided to use a land boarder on my upcoming visa run. 

 

Going forward, I am not sure if I should simply continue to use land boarders, or if using BKK and possibly having an “interview” at some point may actually help me . In reality I have nothing to hide, as I am not working illegally and have foreign income that exceeds whay they require for retirement type visas, for example.  

 

On future visa runs to Ho Chi Minh, for example, it has occurred to me that I could just make a stopover in Vientiane on the way back and cross into Thailand by land.  It’s more hassle than flying directly back to BKK, but I actually like spending time in Laos anyway.

 

The dilemma is that on one hand I feel safer with the land boarder option, since even in the worst case scenario I could just extend my stay elsewhere and then try again at a different boarder crossing or on a different day.  However, on the other hand using BKK is the most convenient option, and as you have pointed out an interview could actually help if it satisfies the IO that one is not likely working illegally.

 

I guess I’ll have to find out in due course.  The good thing is that, even at the airports, actual denial of entry seems quite rare and would usually be preceded by official warning on a prior entry. 

 

BTW, how is immigration at the smaller international airports?  Entering by air to CNX airport is also an option from places like Yangon.

[YetAnother]

On 2/2/2018 at 9:23 AM, JackThompson said:

This batch of IOs are known, serial liars.

doubtless , you are correct;

so here we are;

prisoners to people of people that can actually impact us, people , if polled, want, All of us gone

[Soneva]

doubtless , you are correct;
so here we are;
prisoners to people of people that can actually impact us, people , if polled, want, All of us gone

I’m not sure what you mean, but that is not at all my experience with Thailand. And I have dealt with very friendly and cheerful IOs much more than with difficult ones.

No Thai could ever have a long term stay in the U.S., the U.K., or continental Europe by visa running. So, on the contrary I think Thailand is very friendly to foreigners.


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[metisdead]

Off topic posts and the replies have been removed. 

[anon789561]

23 hours ago, Soneva said:

 

I’m not sure what you mean, but that is not at all my experience with Thailand. And I have dealt with very friendly and cheerful IOs much more than with difficult ones.

No Thai could ever have a long term stay in the U.S., the U.K., or continental Europe by visa running. So, on the contrary I think Thailand is very friendly to foreigners.


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

you might want to rethink that. visa running? hmm. either you can stay or not. you choose your visa based on your own lifestyle and circumstances but i think you'll find visa running is not being 'friendly'. anyway no doubt you'll be refused entry sometime soon 5555

i have an idea. using the uk as example, fly to france every year to get a new visa. in fact. just go to calais and come back the same day on a ferry. (for what exactly) there you go. get it?

[JackThompson]

On 2/8/2018 at 8:41 PM, Soneva said:

The good thing is that, even at the airports, actual denial of entry seems quite rare and would usually be preceded by official warning on a prior entry. 

There is no reason to think a warning would ever occur.  Some who have been warned have not had trouble later.  Others who were never warned have been denied entry. 

It is true that the "odds are" you will get in - though that never made me feel any better about flying in, so I didn't/don't ever do it.

 

On 2/8/2018 at 8:41 PM, Soneva said:

BTW, how is immigration at the smaller international airports?  Entering by air to CNX airport is also an option from places like Yangon.

We do not have horror stories from CNX for those coming in with Tourist Visas - but if you were denied-entry, you would be detained until you could board a flight out to where you just came from. 

 

The trouble, with the Yangoon -> CNX plan, is you need a visa In Advance to enter at Yangon (why I never tried this), so not sure what would happen, since they cannot just "send you back" there.  You would probably sent to your home country, eventually, but see what happened to this guy, below, when he was denied-entry in 2 countries (Thailand and Ukraine) - with Immigration insisting the "same airline" handle his flight-out.  He was stuck in detention for days - not sure how it turned out:

 

[JackThompson]

On 2/9/2018 at 8:46 PM, Happy enough said:

i have an idea. using the uk as example, fly to france every year to get a new visa. in fact. just go to calais and come back the same day on a ferry. (for what exactly) there you go. get it?

The EU has a strict, PUBLISHED, 6-mo limit / yr on people from my passport-country (USA) staying in the Eurozone on tourist-entries.  Therefore, I can know, in advance of making any travel plans, what the rules are, and make plans accordingly. 

 

Thailand has very good financial reasons not to apply the same rule - and it appears some in the hierarchy - those who can "do math" and care about Thai-economic projections - have figured this out and prevented such a rule from being written into a Ministerial order. 

Others, at some level (in control of some airports and Poipet/Aranyaprathet) - have decided Thailand is better served by being "Poorer, but with fewer Farangs" hanging around "too long."  They seem to have enough power/connections to allow them to act independently.   I don't want to get caught as a pawn in the middle of this ongoing power-struggle - likely involving not only Immigration, but the MFA, TAT, etc.

[Just Weird]

On ‎2‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 9:23 AM, JackThompson said:

If you have 20K baht worth of cash, so they cannot block-entry on that technicality (they don't let you visit an ATM, so it's just a scam), 

 

It'd be interesting to know how requiring some visitors to have cash on them is a "scam".  What does the IO get out of that "scam"?

 

They do not prevent visits to ATMs, it's just that there are none there.

[Just Weird]

On ‎2‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 2:18 PM, Pattaya46 said:

Why do people who have grievances about Immigration at the airport never give precise information about their situation ? 

How difficult is it to say :

• how many times you entered Thailand in last year(s)
• which visa or exemptions you used
• how many days/weeks/month you stayed in Thailand in last year (or years)

...

It's nearly impossible to understand/explain/help without all information 

 

you forgot...

• How old you are
• What you look like to the IOs.
• What attitude you display

[Just Weird]

On ‎2‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 3:28 PM, Emster23 said:

Agree with Happy Enough. So much for being a "hub" of tourism.... they used to promote that Bangkok was the place to come and then hop about neighboring countries (at least when I started coming here in the '80's). Right hand doesn't know what left hand is doing, but what else is new?

The 80s were 30 years ago, a lot has changed in the world since then.

[Just Weird]

On ‎2‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 3:52 PM, glasswort said:

What happened to full stops at the end and capital letters the beginning of sentences? Not to mention capital Is.

Probably the same as whatever happened to the preposition at that should come after "letters" and before "the beginning", not to mention the quotation marks around the "I" in your last sentence.  It's never a good idea to bring up grammar on a forum.