Never thought it would come to this

[simoh1490]

18 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Wikipedia says

Estimates of tourism receipts directly contributing to the Thai GDP of 12 trillion baht range from 9 percent (one trillion baht) (2013) to 17.7 percent (2.53 trillion baht) in 2016.

That's a lot lower than your 21%.

Please tell me that you're not going to try and debate the difference between an estimate of ABOUT 21% in 2018 and a Wiki. entry that cites 17.7% dated 2016, a difference of 0.7% and one that is supposedly "a lot lower"!

[thaibeachlovers]

5 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

Please tell me that you're not going to try and debate the difference between an estimate of ABOUT 21% in 2018 and a Wiki. entry that cites 17.7% dated 2016, a difference of 0.7% and one that is supposedly "a lot lower"!

Sigh. 17.7 is the TOP estimate, not THE estimate. 9% is a huge difference. In the middle, is still a lot lower.

 

BTW, no one knows how much ''tourism" actually contributes as so much is in the "black economy" and beach hawkers etc do not declare their earnings.

Should all the suckers sending their BG "girlfriends" a monthly allowance be included?

Edited February 16, 2018 by thaibeachlovers

[thaibeachlovers]

3 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

Please tell me that you're not going to try and debate the difference between an estimate of ABOUT 21% in 2018 and a Wiki. entry that cites 17.7% dated 2016, a difference of 0.7% and one that is supposedly "a lot lower"!

?????????????The difference between 17.7 and 21 is not 0.7.

[simoh1490]

Just now, thaibeachlovers said:

Sigh. 17.7 is the TOP estimate, not THE estimate. 9% is a huge difference. In the middle, is still a lot lower.

You can sigh all you want but it's still within the range of your quote, even if we overlook the fact it was qualified with the word, "about", which implies an approximation! Please don't make me waste my time digging out budgets etc on this!

[simoh1490]

2 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

?????????????The difference between 17.7 and 21 is not 0.7.

OK 3.3, or even 10.0 would still be within the bounds of an approximation, don't ya think!

[JAZZDOG]

3 hours ago, norrska said:

Totally different apples and oranges comparisons.  CR is very close to the US and so has a disproportionate number of wealthy Americans compared to the global diaspora in Thailand(many of whom are not wealthy).  CR also has almost no industry compared to Thailand economic powerhouse and also has no restrictions on foreigners buying land, resulting in prime real estate being bought up by foreigners.  Thailand has completely different laws. 

Humm! Maybe then you explain why the results are the same. You have obviously never been to Costa Rica either. The place is full of low-life expats hence the name "Land of the Wanted and Unwanted". I guess same could be said of Thailand but on a much larger scale. It's mangoes and mangoes if you have lived in both countries as I have.

[JAZZDOG]

4 hours ago, norrska said:

You expect people to run out and read an entire book so they can understand one post on a thread.   Sorry, no time to go on a wild goose chase, but thanks anyway.

This from a guy who seems to base most everything he knows from reading one publication or another? I submit that a "wild goose chase" is actually believing everything you see in print without the benefit of first hand knowledge. Really have no time to consider ones hear-say data base.

[simoh1490]

10 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Sigh. 17.7 is the TOP estimate, not THE estimate. 9% is a huge difference. In the middle, is still a lot lower.

 

BTW, no one knows how much ''tourism" actually contributes as so much is in the "black economy" and beach hawkers etc do not declare their earnings.

Should all the suckers sending their BG "girlfriends" a monthly allowance be included?

I'm going to put this here because knowing how TVF posters are as a group, somebody will try to make hay out of this point!

 

"The total contribution of Travel & Tourism to GDP was THB2,906.8bn (USD82.5bn), 20.6% of GDP in 2016, and is forecast to rise by 9.4% in 2017, and to rise by 6.5% pa to THB5,985.5bn (USD169.9bn), 31.7% of GDP in 2027".

 

"In 2016, the total contribution of Travel & Tourism to employment, including jobs indirectly supported by

the industry was 15.1% of total employment (5,739,000 jobs). This is expected to rise by 6.9% in 2017 to

6,137,500 jobs and rise by 4.6% pa to 9,599,000 jobs in 2027 (24.9% of total)"

 

https://www.wttc.org/-/media/files/reports/economic-impact-research/countries-2017/thailand2017.pdf

[norrska]

35 minutes ago, JAZZDOG said:

Humm! Maybe then you explain why the results are the same. You have obviously never been to Costa Rica either. The place is full of low-life expats hence the name "Land of the Wanted and Unwanted". I guess same could be said of Thailand but on a much larger scale. It's mangoes and mangoes if you have lived in both countries as I have.

You have obviously no idea where or where not others have "obviously" been given your inane comments.  What is clear is that regardless of where you may or may not have been, you come up with wildly inaccurate generalizations and try to sell them as some sort of gospel truth. Example, never heard of your parochial expression which I presume was shared amongst you and  your inner circle "braintrust".  The "results"  you refer to is a totally unintelligible comment. Enjoy your beans and rice!

Edited February 16, 2018 by norrska

[JAZZDOG]

3 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

I'm going to put this here because knowing how TVF posters are as a group, somebody will try to make hay out of this point!

 

"The total contribution of Travel & Tourism to GDP was THB2,906.8bn (USD82.5bn), 20.6% of GDP in 2016, and is forecast to rise by 9.4% in 2017, and to rise by 6.5% pa to THB5,985.5bn (USD169.9bn), 31.7% of GDP in 2027".

 

"In 2016, the total contribution of Travel & Tourism to employment, including jobs indirectly supported by

the industry was 15.1% of total employment (5,739,000 jobs). This is expected to rise by 6.9% in 2017 to

6,137,500 jobs and rise by 4.6% pa to 9,599,000 jobs in 2027 (24.9% of total)"

 

https://www.wttc.org/-/media/files/reports/economic-impact-research/countries-2017/thailand2017.pdf

No doubt huge numbers but maybe a pie graph would put you point in better perspective.

[norrska]

11 hours ago, thailien8 said:

Big Corporations love it when we give them our money to pay  for their advertised products that we don't need.  Then they use our money against us., buying politicians cheaply to give them tax advantages.

Paranoid conspiracy theorist.  Be careful, they are listening......

[simoh1490]

18 minutes ago, JAZZDOG said:

No doubt huge numbers but maybe a pie graph would put you point in better perspective.

[JAZZDOG]

9 minutes ago, norrska said:

You have obviously no idea where or where not others have "obviously" been given your inane comments.  Never heard of your parochial expression which I presume was shared amongst you and a few of your equally unwanted and judgemental friends, if you have any.  The "results" (whatever that means) are totally different.

Seems all your "facts" are those from some publication or another. You have never given the impression that you have ever actually  lived in any of these places you claim to know so much about. The wanted and unwanted is actually well known to those who travel extensively. It would appear to me you just might be the one who is judgemental based on which channel your tuned into. I for one put forth my first hand knowledge and experiences. I also am aware of media reports, just not naïve enough to buy into their agenda. For every article that paints a subject in a negative light there is another which points toward the positive. I prefer to comment on that which I have experienced. What you know is not all that important, knowing what you don't know is key.

The results of the Costa Rica / Thai tourism experiments are quite similar:

-both countries started out seemingly happy with expats, now not so much

-governments with open arms to expats, now not so much

-originally little violence towards expats, now not so much

-expats ramping up demand sex trafficking on drugs, now much worse

-crime, now much worse

To just cite of few and I have lived to see both first hand, no Wiki

[JSixpack]

1 hour ago, JAZZDOG said:

Humm! Maybe then you explain why the results are the same. You have obviously never been to Costa Rica either. The place is full of low-life expats hence the name "Land of the Wanted and Unwanted". I guess same could be said of Thailand but on a much larger scale. It's mangoes and mangoes if you have lived in both countries as I have.

 

Let's hear the rationale for "much larger scale." CR, population 5 million; TH, 68 million. CR, tourists 3 million; TH, 35 million. Could Thailand therefore reasonably have more in absolute numbers? Duh. But percentage-wise? Lot of low lifes in tourist areas, true, but I'd say the vast majority of tourists and expats are by no means low lifes. Now some may merely look like low lifes, as on Soi Buakhao, but we must learn to look past the merely superficial. Appearances can be most deceiving.

 

 

You see, like so many of our posters, the Chang vest wearers hanging out at Soi Buakhao are actually scions of British royalty, landed gentry, City financiers, and construction magnates, to name but a few credentials. You merely have to stop and engage them in conversation to realize their true eminence.

 

From what you say, it seems that CR might have a larger percentage. But you don't seem an unbiased observer, as your estimate of the Thai expat low life seems so exaggerated. Maybe just another victim of confirmation bias like so many of our posters, sigh.

[JSixpack]

6 hours ago, norrska said:

Totally different apples and oranges comparisons.  CR is very close to the US and so has a disproportionate number of wealthy Americans compared to the global diaspora in Thailand(many of whom are not wealthy).  CR also has almost no industry compared to Thailand economic powerhouse and also has no restrictions on foreigners buying land, resulting in prime real estate being bought up by foreigners.  Thailand has completely different laws. 

 

Right. Thailand is a NIC and by no means a banana republic. Thailand has a firm sense of distinct identity, IS distinct, and intends to stay that way. Foreigners can't own land or even a majority share of companies (w/ some exceptions). If there were going to be a big foreign takeover, it would have happened long ago.

 

From JAZZDOG:

 

Quote

Things are good, the locals selling property for crazy prices having to move farther and farther into the mountains. The beaches get covered up by resorts/gated communities. Meanwhile the locals get fat/lazy/pissing money away.

 

Total contrast to Thailand. Locals merely sold to other locals. The sellers used the money to farm better land outside and establish businesses. Nobody got fat/lazy/pissing money away, except perhaps for the odd exception of course.

 

Quote

The ugly farang with the US$100 bill glued to his forehead have most all the attractive young girls attention. The younger male generation has to settle for the fat and ugly Ticas no farang will pay for, they are really pissed.

 

Another total contrast. Some farang have bought the attention of a few of the millions of attractive young girls in Thailand but most settled for dark, less attractive or ugly Thai girls the local men wouldn't prefer for themselves. But the younger male generation continued enjoying all the best Thai women as they do today. You might pay attention to all the lovely babes on the back of Thai guys' bikes or walking with them in the malls. Compare who's with the old "moneyed" farangs.

 

Quote

The results of the Costa Rica / Thai tourism experiments are quite similar:

 

No.

 

Quote

-both countries started out seemingly happy with expats, now not so much

-governments with open arms to expats, now not so much

-originally little violence towards expats, now not so much

-expats ramping up demand sex trafficking on drugs, now much worse

-crime, now much worse

To just cite of few and I have lived to see both first hand, no Wiki

 

Thailand didn't start out happy w/ any foreigners and in fact in the early days they weren't allowed to stay on land but were required to stay on their ships. Though our bashers and whingers constantly claim Thailand isn't happy with them, the reverse may be more the case: they aren't as happy w/ Thailand, 'cause Thailand cut down on the abuse of tourist visas and dared raise visa fees after many years--a step in the right direction against the low lifes. Meanwhile, Western currencies collapsed and Western tourists/expats just have a lot less money than they used to.

 

At the same time, however,  Thailand actually became MORE welcoming w/ the Elite visa. And more foreign investment is in fact being welcomed. The generosity of Thailand w/ visas is comparable, all in all, w/ countries of similar states of economic development, e. g., Malaysia.

 

As far as crime increasing, when you consider the vast increase in population, urban expansion, tourism, and mass communication, it may be that the crime rate has actually decreased. Plus we have the aging of the expat population so that reports of crime tend to make them soil their adult diapers and make a lot more noise about it to exaggerate the reality. As you admit, you have no numbers but are merely relying on the classic TVF Poster Eyeballs measure that tells us there are no shoppers in the malls and none of the condos have owners. But I can easily quote you the same complaint about "thugs taking over Pattaya" from 1997. There's real Pattaya and then there's TVF Virtual Pattaya, you see.

 

Edited February 16, 2018 by JSixpack

[JSixpack]

On 2/10/2018 at 9:22 AM, Justfine said:

20 years to work out Pattaya is a dump. Some people are quick thinkers.

 

Ah, but later

 

 

 

[whitemouse]

On 10/02/2018 at 9:49 PM, swissie said:

Travelled exensively. Had my domicile in a small village in the sticks for almost 5 years.
I never considered myself as a "Pattaya-Addict".

But it is in Pattaya, where I notice a detoriation of friendly interactions between Thai's/Farangs, not in rural Thailand.

 

You lived in rural Thailand, so why return to Pattaya, place you clearly do not like? I'd never go back to a place I didn't like.

 

You said you lived on Canary Islands, why did you leave, only to return to terrible, terrible Pattaya?

 

I'm now trying to be helpful, and offer constructive ideas - why not form a social club, here in Pattaya, of people who do not like Pattaya! Invite beachlover to join, you could organise field trips and count pot holes  in roads. You could start a photography  class, and take pics of empty plastic bottles on the beach. 

Let it all out! And no Thais needed! Limit your interactions with Thais to zero, and life will turn. 

 

Seriously, posting years after year how Pattaya sucks isn't going to solve it for you.  I'm just trying to help! 

[simoh1490]

43 minutes ago, JSixpack said:

But I can easily quote you the same complaint about "thugs taking over Pattaya" from 1997. There's real Pattaya and then there's TVF Virtual Pattaya, you see.

 

 

In fact, this same conversation has been had repeatedly ever since 1997. Newbies ask the same questions and make the same points yet Pattaya continues to go from strength to strength despite it all, we even know what you're going to say next and JSP has his script ready by way of reply. Rather boring for some of us really but we like to try and make newbies feel as though they've made a unique observation that nobody has spotted before, it makes them feel special and indeed they are.

[whitemouse]

I have a confession to make,

whenever I feel slightly down (too hot, too cold, too much traffic, too little traffic due to low season, Thais being too friendly and imposing, Thais too rude, and not letting people cross a road, Thai girls too fat, and all the pretty ones walking in malls with their handsome Thai boyfriends in hand, and not  wanting to be with me..  things like that) I come to ThaiVisa Forum, to be cheered up. So thank you,  Swissie, beachlover, every other Pattaya ex resident, I read about your misery, and I feel blessed, not a worry in my head after 10 min here. And  I realize my life is really, really good. 

The best therapy for a rainy day is TVF Pattaya subforum ')

 

Thank you, guys!

Edited February 16, 2018 by whitemouse

[norrska]

2 hours ago, JAZZDOG said:

Seems all your "facts" are those from some publication or another. You have never given the impression that you have ever actually  lived in any of these places you claim to know so much about. The wanted and unwanted is actually well known to those who travel extensively. It would appear to me you just might be the one who is judgemental based on which channel your tuned into. I for one put forth my first hand knowledge and experiences. I also am aware of media reports, just not naïve enough to buy into their agenda. For every article that paints a subject in a negative light there is another which points toward the positive. I prefer to comment on that which I have experienced. What you know is not all that important, knowing what you don't know is key.

The results of the Costa Rica / Thai tourism experiments are quite similar:

-both countries started out seemingly happy with expats, now not so much

-governments with open arms to expats, now not so much

-originally little violence towards expats, now not so much

-expats ramping up demand sex trafficking on drugs, now much worse

-crime, now much worse

To just cite of few and I have lived to see both first hand, no Wiki

Unfortunately almost everything you have written is incorrect.  Let's have a closer look item by item.

 

 

Seems all your "facts" are those from some publication or another.

Wrong. My extensive knowledge has been gleaned from education, data sources, empirical observation, and from common sense which includes knowing when someone is blowing smoke.

You have never given the impression that you have ever actually  lived in any of these places you claim to know so much about.

Wrong.  I have no need to try and impress people by boasting where or where I haven't been, unlike yourself.  Unfortunately for you, I probably have more experience in almost all of the areas you have lived, than you.  That being said, it is a logical fallacy to claim you have to live somewhere to "know" about it.  I don't need to live in or visit Chicago to know it has a high murder rate.  I don't need to live in Germany to know that many WW1 and WW2 battles were fought there etcetc.  You seem to imply that something only occurred if you personally experienced it which is some sort of personal observation bias and fantasy.

The wanted and unwanted is actually well known to those who travel extensively.

Wrong.  People have different perceptions, wants, and needs. Some people who travel extensively know very little (example traveling salesman who flies to a different region every day), while others who travel less may have alot of knowledge.

It would appear to me you just might be the one who is judgemental based on which channel your tuned into. I for one put forth my first hand knowledge and experiences.

Wrong.  There you go again, judging people by calling them judgmental.  See previous points.  You don't have to personally experience something for it to have happened.  Did DaVinci paint the Mona Lisa?  You weren't there so you would claim it didn't happen.

I also am aware of media reports, just not naïve enough to buy into their agenda. For every article that paints a subject in a negative light there is another which points toward the positive. I prefer to comment on that which I have experienced. What you know is not all that important, knowing what you don't know is key.

Wrong. See previous comment, but let me amplify by quoting Rumsfeld , who said during the Iraq War.

"There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know.

 

The results of the Costa Rica / Thai tourism experiments are quite similar:

-both countries started out seemingly happy with expats, now not so much

-governments with open arms to expats, now not so much

-originally little violence towards expats, now not so much

-expats ramping up demand sex trafficking on drugs, now much worse

-crime, now much worse

To just cite of few and I have lived to see both first hand, no Wiki

Wrong again.  You say both countries started out.  What is your historical starting point. Provide data to support this level of happiness, open arms, crime stats etc.  This is all hearsay based on.......wait for it.....your own personal limited observations and experience.

 

Conclusion: Lest you think this is an attempt to lecture you, I leave you with some friendly advice.  Try to read more, learn about the world, study, use both empirical  observation and credible data sources, and do not think you know everything about a place because you visited there once.  By your logic, someone who visited somewhere twice would know twice as much as someone who visited once, which is obviously false.  Good luck with your learning.

 

 

Edited February 16, 2018 by norrska

[JAZZDOG]

4 hours ago, norrska said:

Unfortunately almost everything you have written is incorrect.  Let's have a closer look item by item.

 

 

Seems all your "facts" are those from some publication or another.

Wrong. My extensive knowledge has been gleaned from education, data sources, empirical observation, and from common sense which includes knowing when someone is blowing smoke.

You have never given the impression that you have ever actually  lived in any of these places you claim to know so much about.

Wrong.  I have no need to try and impress people by boasting where or where I haven't been, unlike yourself.  Unfortunately for you, I probably have more experience in almost all of the areas you have lived, than you.  That being said, it is a logical fallacy to claim you have to live somewhere to "know" about it.  I don't need to live in or visit Chicago to know it has a high murder rate.  I don't need to live in Germany to know that many WW1 and WW2 battles were fought there etcetc.  You seem to imply that something only occurred if you personally experienced it which is some sort of personal observation bias and fantasy.

The wanted and unwanted is actually well known to those who travel extensively.

Wrong.  People have different perceptions, wants, and needs. Some people who travel extensively know very little (example traveling salesman who flies to a different region every day), while others who travel less may have alot of knowledge.

It would appear to me you just might be the one who is judgemental based on which channel your tuned into. I for one put forth my first hand knowledge and experiences.

Wrong.  There you go again, judging people by calling them judgmental.  See previous points.  You don't have to personally experience something for it to have happened.  Did DaVinci paint the Mona Lisa?  You weren't there so you would claim it didn't happen.

I also am aware of media reports, just not naïve enough to buy into their agenda. For every article that paints a subject in a negative light there is another which points toward the positive. I prefer to comment on that which I have experienced. What you know is not all that important, knowing what you don't know is key.

Wrong. See previous comment, but let me amplify by quoting Rumsfeld , who said during the Iraq War.

"There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know.

 

The results of the Costa Rica / Thai tourism experiments are quite similar:

-both countries started out seemingly happy with expats, now not so much

-governments with open arms to expats, now not so much

-originally little violence towards expats, now not so much

-expats ramping up demand sex trafficking on drugs, now much worse

-crime, now much worse

To just cite of few and I have lived to see both first hand, no Wiki

Wrong again.  You say both countries started out.  What is your historical starting point. Provide data to support this level of happiness, open arms, crime stats etc.  This is all hearsay based on.......wait for it.....your own personal limited observations and experience.

 

Conclusion: Lest you think this is an attempt to lecture you, I leave you with some friendly advice.  Try to read more, learn about the world, study, use both empirical  observation and credible data sources, and do not think you know everything about a place because you visited there once.  By your logic, someone who visited somewhere twice would know twice as much as someone who visited once, which is obviously false.  Good luck with your learning.

 

 

Impressive replies based totally on hypotheticals but you were correct quoting Rumsfield. By your logic then retirees in crime ridden Chicago stay caged up in fear in their North Shoreline Drive condos. You obviously have never lived in Sao Paulo, R.J. or anywhere else in Brazil or you would not repeat this dribble you read somewhere. Get out and about my friend, actually go and experience life in some of these places then come back and we can have a discussion. I am simply giving my opinions based on my life experiences having lived and run businesses in these countries for extended periods of time.

[JAZZDOG]

7 hours ago, JSixpack said:

 

Let's hear the rationale for "much larger scale." CR, population 5 million; TH, 68 million. CR, tourists 3 million; TH, 35 million. Could Thailand therefore reasonably have more in absolute numbers? Duh. But percentage-wise? Lot of low lifes in tourist areas, true, but I'd say the vast majority of tourists and expats are by no means low lifes. Now some may merely look like low lifes, as on Soi Buakhao, but we must learn to look past the merely superficial. Appearances can be most deceiving.

 

 

You see, like so many of our posters, the Chang vest wearers hanging out at Soi Buakhao are actually scions of British royalty, landed gentry, City financiers, and construction magnates, to name but a few credentials. You merely have to stop and engage them in conversation to realize their true eminence.

 

From what you say, it seems that CR might have a larger percentage. But you don't seem an unbiased observer, as your estimate of the Thai expat low life seems so exaggerated. Maybe just another victim of confirmation bias like so many of our posters, sigh.

CR has a much higher % of low-lifes due to the vast supply a mere three hour flight north. It is more like one giant Pattaya/Phuket/Patong combined. Just change out the Brits/Aus for Gringoes. Deal is the experiment played out quickly in CR much quicker because the draw was everywhere. Legal prostitution from sea to shining sea. Many expats check in the Del Rey and never leave the hotel till they depart 5 days later. Thailand on the other hand offers the expat the same experience for a third of the price and has succeeded in keeping it confined to certain areas. The actual origins differed in that in CR the girls were brought in to calm the banana plantation workers in the 40's. Thailand it was the war in the 60's but same difference. Thailand, CR top the list as far as sex tourism destinations. Just imagine how different they both would be today had their governments not given into greed and given a green light to the "Profession"

[swissie]

10 hours ago, whitemouse said:

You lived in rural Thailand, so why return to Pattaya, place you clearly do not like? I'd never go back to a place I didn't like.

 

You said you lived on Canary Islands, why did you leave, only to return to terrible, terrible Pattaya?

 

I'm now trying to be helpful, and offer constructive ideas - why not form a social club, here in Pattaya, of people who do not like Pattaya! Invite beachlover to join, you could organise field trips and count pot holes  in roads. You could start a photography  class, and take pics of empty plastic bottles on the beach. 

Let it all out! And no Thais needed! Limit your interactions with Thais to zero, and life will turn. 

 

Seriously, posting years after year how Pattaya sucks isn't going to solve it for you.  I'm just trying to help! 

Sadly, you missed the key sentence in my OP:

 

- "So I took the advice, posted here many a times: "If you don't like it, get out!". Well, I did just that!"

 

The last visit was just the infamous straw that broke the camels back. No big deal. There is a time to come, there is a time to leave.
Cheers.

 

[norrska]

10 hours ago, JAZZDOG said:

Impressive replies based totally on hypotheticals but you were correct quoting Rumsfield. By your logic then retirees in crime ridden Chicago stay caged up in fear in their North Shoreline Drive condos. You obviously have never lived in Sao Paulo, R.J. or anywhere else in Brazil or you would not repeat this dribble you read somewhere. Get out and about my friend, actually go and experience life in some of these places then come back and we can have a discussion. I am simply giving my opinions based on my life experiences having lived and run businesses in these countries for extended periods of time.

Lots more experience than you my friend, though I am concerned that you claim it took you 15 years living somewhere to figure out it wasn't for you.  Seems a bit slow to figure things out, don't you think!

[norrska]

10 hours ago, JAZZDOG said:

CR has a much higher % of low-lifes due to the vast supply a mere three hour flight north. It is more like one giant Pattaya/Phuket/Patong combined. Just change out the Brits/Aus for Gringoes. Deal is the experiment played out quickly in CR much quicker because the draw was everywhere. Legal prostitution from sea to shining sea. Many expats check in the Del Rey and never leave the hotel till they depart 5 days later. Thailand on the other hand offers the expat the same experience for a third of the price and has succeeded in keeping it confined to certain areas. The actual origins differed in that in CR the girls were brought in to calm the banana plantation workers in the 40's. Thailand it was the war in the 60's but same difference. Thailand, CR top the list as far as sex tourism destinations. Just imagine how different they both would be today had their governments not given into greed and given a green light to the "Profession"

You need to do some more research....this all sounds like barstool banter. I haven't seen any verifiable objective data to support your inane hypotheses.

[JSixpack]

12 hours ago, JAZZDOG said:

CR has a much higher % of low-lifes due to the vast supply a mere three hour flight north. It is more like one giant Pattaya/Phuket/Patong combined.

 

Good, so you've agreed w/ me on that point and on my others by default.

 

Quote

The actual origins differed in that in CR the girls were brought in to calm the banana plantation workers in the 40's. Thailand it was the war in the 60's but same difference.

 

So a sex tourism destination has a beginning as sex tourism destination. Yeah, no start, no business. I think most of our members probably knew that, but I can't be sure.  

 

Quote

Thailand, CR top the list as far as sex tourism destinations.

 

Actually CR doesn't even make the top ten on all the lists I've seen.

 

Quote

Just imagine how different they both would be today had their governments not given into greed and given a green light to the "Profession"

 

Thailand, poorer no doubt and so more Thai thugs would have taken the place of the present-day farang low lifes. But who cares? You can probably find some barstool companions to discuss that fantasy w/ you. Here's a list of alternate history movies for you: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Alternate_history_films As for greed, just depends on your preferred economics. Is the government of Spain greedy for permitting prostitution? The Netherlands? Some governments offer more freedom in some areas than others. But please start a topic in the Farang Pub forum for that discussion. 

 

Are we done? I've waited in vain for this little discussion to relate to the topic. The whole thing really should be deleted. Your comparisons have either been misinformed, irrelevant, or trivial.

 

 

[thaibeachlovers]

23 hours ago, simoh1490 said:

I'm going to put this here because knowing how TVF posters are as a group, somebody will try to make hay out of this point!

 

"The total contribution of Travel & Tourism to GDP was THB2,906.8bn (USD82.5bn), 20.6% of GDP in 2016, and is forecast to rise by 9.4% in 2017, and to rise by 6.5% pa to THB5,985.5bn (USD169.9bn), 31.7% of GDP in 2027".

 

"In 2016, the total contribution of Travel & Tourism to employment, including jobs indirectly supported by

the industry was 15.1% of total employment (5,739,000 jobs). This is expected to rise by 6.9% in 2017 to

6,137,500 jobs and rise by 4.6% pa to 9,599,000 jobs in 2027 (24.9% of total)"

 

https://www.wttc.org/-/media/files/reports/economic-impact-research/countries-2017/thailand2017.pdf

31.7% of GDP in 2027".

Brave indeed of anyone to state what anything at all will be in 2027. 

By then the world could be destroyed by an asteroid strike ( or a nuclear immolation ), or we could all be Chinese subjects etc etc.

I realise that some minion in an office somewhere is paid to come up with statistics that depend on extrapolating what is happening NOW, but it's just guessing. Who could have foreseen the Russian invasion, and exit, or the Chinese zero baht tours back in 1995?

By 2027 VR might make actual travel irrelevant, and sex androids might make Pattaya a ghost town, but who knows? I'm pickin' that antibiotic resistant diseases will kill off half the population of the planet within 20 years, but that's a guess too.

[thaibeachlovers]

21 hours ago, JSixpack said:

 

Ah, but later

 

 

 

That must be the first post you've made that I enjoyed. Well done!

[thaibeachlovers]

21 hours ago, whitemouse said:

 

 

I'm now trying to be helpful, and offer constructive ideas - why not form a social club, here in Pattaya, of people who do not like Pattaya! Invite beachlover to join, you could organise field trips and count pot holes  in roads. You could start a photography  class, and take pics of empty plastic bottles on the beach. 

 

 

Why pick on me? I love Pattaya.

[thaibeachlovers]

20 hours ago, whitemouse said:

I have a confession to make,

whenever I feel slightly down (too hot, too cold, too much traffic, too little traffic due to low season, Thais being too friendly and imposing, Thais too rude, and not letting people cross a road, Thai girls too fat, and all the pretty ones walking in malls with their handsome Thai boyfriends in hand, and not  wanting to be with me..  things like that) I come to ThaiVisa Forum, to be cheered up. So thank you,  Swissie, beachlover, every other Pattaya ex resident, I read about your misery, and I feel blessed, not a worry in my head after 10 min here. And  I realize my life is really, really good. 

The best therapy for a rainy day is TVF Pattaya subforum ')

 

Thank you, guys!

Leave me out of it. My only "misery" is being not in Pattaya.

What some are apparently not capable of realising is that one can love a place and yet ( strangely for some ) still see the things that are wrong with it. 

Quite easy to do if one takes off the "I heart Pattaya" glasses and realise that bad things can happen in Pattaya.