Why Thai's fail at business, examples I've seen

[blackcab]

33 minutes ago, lkn said:

I can just imagine the board meeting.

 

Chairman: We want to build brand awareness among Thai women for our new makeup line.

 

Chairman: We can get our message out to at least 100,000 women daily by buying advertising space on the BTS.

 

Chairman: We have made this billboard, our message superimposed on a great looking model. Any input?

 

Board member: Shouldn’t we add English subtitles to the message?

 

Chairman: Why? That would ruin our clear succinct message, and we may even alienate some Thais.

 

Beard members: But I see at least a couple of females in the BTS that I do not think can read Thai.

 

Chairman: Yes, but we do not care about building brand awareness among foreigners who stay here for only a week, and certainly not when it means compromising on our aesthetics and paying higher sign tax on all of our 10,000 signs…

 

Another board member: I see a lot of Chinese women on the BTS who I don’t think can read English, shouldn’t we add Chinese subtitles as well?

 

So in true Thai style everyone compromises and adds English to the train itself because signs affixed to vehicles are sign tax exempt.

[jgarbo]

First, Cracker, you don't understand franchising. Learn yourself. Second, observe the ratio of Thai to Farang customers. Do the few Ethiopian customers also complain, "No signs in Amharic!"?  You're not God, you're a foreign tourist. Third, learn Thai, since you're in Thailand.

These are not business failures, but features of business here and elsewhere. Do Thais complain about No SIgns in Thai when they shop in Paris? Do French staff learn Thai?? No. Thais learn English or French.

Your neo-colonial attitude will make your stay here continually uncomfortable. Go home.

[rickudon]

My wife runs a successful shop (going 6 months now). Obviously i fronted the money. Just a typical village convenience store and when she opened it i didn't expect her to take much more than 1,000 baht gross a day, but it gave her something to do rather than obsessively clean the house every day and would give her her own pocket money. As it is based on the home (which used to have a shop in it until 12 years ago) overheads are low. The shop across the road had just closed because the owner wasn't making enough to cover his overheads, wife bought his drinks fridge.

 

To my surprise, she grosses at least 3,000 baht every day, and with her markups probably 15-20% profit before outgoings. A long day, but she must make around 10,000 baht a month - i think. For 2 months i tried to get her to keep accounts so she could see how much she was really making, but she just wasn't interested. Just couldn't understand the benefits, and being Thai, maths are hard .... and very difficult to get her to keep enough cash for next big restocking. As was said back in the beginning, Thais live for today not tomorrow, guess that is why the chinese own everything!

 

Previously the family ran a restaurant (built by another farang, married to wife's sister), cost millions. But off the roads down a small soi, it required continual promotion and excellent chefs to keep customers coming as no passing trade. When the brother-in-law had a heart attack and went back to UK with his wife for 5 years, it rapidly degraded, but they didn't realise it was running at a loss until i refused to pay their bills. Finally they had one customer in one week. Couldn't buy any more food, whisky and cola all gone, and electric bill had to be paid and drinks licences needed renewal. I had been telling them for 6 months it was finished, but no, kept going. Finally 3 of them had to get proper jobs!

 

Yes, business acumen among Thais isn't great, but they can operate on a shoestring.

[simoh1490]

The first part of what rick (above) wrote is replicated all over Thailand, in every rural village and town, there are four such shops operating exactly the same way in my wife's home village. The last line is also very true and perhaps one of the reasons why Thai businesses do get by, the right combination of willingness, ability, ignorance and stupidity (not intended in any negative way whatsoever).

[elgenon]

On 3/7/2018 at 11:47 AM, lkn said:

I can just imagine the board meeting.

 

Chairman: We want to build brand awareness among Thai women for our new makeup line.

 

Chairman: We can get our message out to at least 100,000 women daily by buying advertising space on the BTS.

 

Chairman: We have made this billboard, our message superimposed on a great looking model. Any input?

 

Board member: Shouldn’t we add English subtitles to the message?

 

Chairman: Why? That would ruin our clear succinct message, and we may even alienate some Thais.

 

Beard members: But I see at least a couple of females in the BTS that I do not think can read Thai.

 

Chairman: Yes, but we do not care about building brand awareness among foreigners who stay here for only a week, and certainly not when it means compromising on our aesthetics and paying higher sign tax on all of our 10,000 signs…

 

Another board member: I see a lot of Chinese women on the BTS who I don’t think can read English, shouldn’t we add Chinese subtitles as well?

 

Wow! 10,000 signs you say? You sound Thai. 10,000 signs! Good god . I give up, you have won. 10,000 signs! I admit I don't know how many BTS stations there are because I never counted them. 10,000 signs! You win. I know when I am outsmarted.10,000 signs!

[elgenon]

On 3/7/2018 at 10:20 AM, blackcab said:

 

I make it 600 baht, or 400 baht per square meter for signs in English and Thai.

 

Now consider the tax difference for the billboards you see around Suvarnabhumi which are quite immense in size.

 

 

One, of course, would evaluate the location if a second language would work at all. In Chinatown maybe have Chinese . Off the top of my head I would not think immense billboards around Suvarnabhumi is a typical investment that many companies would consider. Don't know if a second language would be worth the expense. Do you have that data?

 

I think I mentioned BTS stations. Signs are not made by hand but by computer. Not difficult. Even there I am thinking only at stations frequented by foreigners. There are areas where quite a few foreigners live. I just felt if an airline picked up even a few additional customers a week it would be worth the expense. The tax is per year right? One customer a month would more than pay for a poster on a BTS station.

 

Many respondents take the opposition to my question to exaggeration. It would be proper to study any situation before spending any money on advertising.  You do need to know who your audience is and who you want to be your audience.

[jerry921]

7 minutes ago, elgenon said:

One, of course, would evaluate the location if a second language would work at all. In Chinatown maybe have Chinese . Off the top of my head I would not think immense billboards around Suvarnabhumi is a typical investment that many companies would consider. Don't know if a second language would be worth the expense. Do you have that data?

 

I think I mentioned BTS stations. Signs are not made by hand but by computer. Not difficult. Even there I am thinking only at stations frequented by foreigners. There are areas where quite a few foreigners live. I just felt if an airline picked up even a few additional customers a week it would be worth the expense. The tax is per year right? One customer a month would more than pay for a poster on a BTS station.

 

Many respondents take the opposition to my question to exaggeration. It would be proper to study any situation before spending any money on advertising.  You do need to know who your audience is and who you want to be your audience.

Without disagreeing with your point, I think you've picked a poor example. A lot, perhaps most, of the foreigners who might theoretically read the sign because of the english text probably are just visiting and already have a return air ticket bought and paid for, so they aren't prospective customers.

[blackcab]

53 minutes ago, elgenon said:

Off the top of my head I would not think immense billboards around Suvarnabhumi is a typical investment that many companies would consider.

 

The existing signs are almost always in use - mostly from phone manufacturers, car manufacturers and the like.

 

54 minutes ago, elgenon said:

The tax is per year right?

 

It is.

[elgenon]

24 minutes ago, jerry921 said:

Without disagreeing with your point, I think you've picked a poor example. A lot, perhaps most, of the foreigners who might theoretically read the sign because of the english text probably are just visiting and already have a return air ticket bought and paid for, so they aren't prospective customers.

Thanks. Yes, I am just trying to make a point. But there are many foreigners who live in Thailand. You can look the number up. Like other posters you seem to believe foreigners never travel. They travel to Thailand and plop down and that's it.You are kind so I don't want to disparage you. I don't want to make a number up to impress you. I don't know where you are from but I would dare say that many travelers from many countries have a working knowledge of English (speak, read) even many Chinese. And they do travel, especially home for a visit to their mums, or maybe just to Cambo, VN, Laos, Burma, Malaysia, Indonesia, Singapore for a few days. I travel to other countries with friends who live in Thailand. 

And I am exhausted. I don't need to "win". Enough time spent on this! On to solving the next major question. I have run businesses which may give me an edge over some other members but who cares? I would not recommend anyone change 10,000 signs though. I have to admit I never knew there were 10,000 BTS stations. Did you?

 

No more exaggerated claims from members to "win" please. It was just a point to consider. Good god people. To anyone who needs to win: You win!

[lkn]

38 minutes ago, elgenon said:

I have to admit I never knew there were 10,000 BTS stations. Did you?

While the number was pulled out of thin air without any thought (as my main point was not about sign tax), an advertising campaign is rarely limited to a single sign per BTS station.

 

They tend to fill up the train cabins with signs, so a more relevant question would be how many trains are there and how many signs per train? Though surely there are more advertising space in Bangkok than just the BTS…

[remorhaz]

On 3/2/2018 at 6:17 AM, champers said:

Interesting theory but without one iota of supporting evidence. It could just be the product of an over-imaginative mind and a deep dislike for Thais. 

Possible - or maybe it is just personal observation and an ability to form a hypothesis without having to have someone else tell me the answer or do my thinking for me.  I love Thais actually and I admire their lifestyle it just isn't the best way to run a business.  I assume you have another comment which will be intellectual equivalent of a chimp throwing its own dung?

[champers]

1 hour ago, remorhaz said:

Possible - or maybe it is just personal observation and an ability to form a hypothesis without having to have someone else tell me the answer or do my thinking for me.  I love Thais actually and I admire their lifestyle it just isn't the best way to run a business.  I assume you have another comment which will be intellectual equivalent of a chimp throwing its own dung?

I think you are the one throwing the dung around. 

I'm off to see my girlfriend at her profitable and successful business; one of many I know of. They are the product of all the things your identikit, stereotype Thai does not posess: determined and organised hard work coupled with the ability to plan ahead to improve the business and to enjoy the fruits of its success.

Edited March 12, 2018 by champers

[remorhaz]

17 hours ago, champers said:

I think you are the one throwing the dung around. 

I'm off to see my girlfriend at her profitable and successful business; one of many I know of. They are the product of all the things your identikit, stereotype Thai does not posess: determined and organised hard work coupled with the ability to plan ahead to improve the business and to enjoy the fruits of its success.

I'm sure your gf is a great guy and a stand up business man.  Stereotypes exist for a reason and for every one of the ladyboys you have dated there are 50 other Thai business owners that don't do as well and for the reasons I mentioned.  Cheers.  

[champers]

3 hours ago, remorhaz said:

I'm sure your gf is a great guy and a stand up business man.  Stereotypes exist for a reason and for every one of the ladyboys you have dated there are 50 other Thai business owners that don't do as well and for the reasons I mentioned.  Cheers.  

Manners maketh the man and you're still in your cot.

[dpcjsr]

I have also noticed a tendency for Thai's to destroy a good market thru cut throat competition. 

In the local mountains a man opened up a coffee shop and sold strawberries. He had a nice farm and sold lots of strawberries so business was good. 

Another Thai farmer down the road opened up a small strawberry stall and sold strawberries at a lower price. Things were still OK but the future was easy to predict. Today there are 20 small stalls selling cheap strawberries and the guy with the original idea has gone out of business. Today none of these stalls makes much of a profit. 

This scenario happens over and over in Thailand. Thai's are good at copying someone elses business and selling cheaper. The result is that these Thai business just barely make a profit. 

 

This is good for us Farang as many things sell dirt cheap. It also explains the lack of innovation in Thailand. The creator of original ideas is usually the first to fail. Why try?

Edited May 14, 2018 by dpcjsr

[BEVUP]

On 2/28/2018 at 4:45 PM, Brunolem said:

This is a perfect example!

Better be empty than lower the price...

 

And there are so many more examples, of a different nature...I will just give one, the shoe shops, but it is also valid for many kinds of shops.

They order 5 pairs of each size, say, 4 to 9 (women shoes)

The first day of sale, all the size 6 and 7 are sold, because 90% of women wear these sizes.

At the end of the season, they are left with all, or almost all of their size 4, 8 and 9, while having missed tens of size 6 and 7 sales.

So, what do they do when comes the time of the next order?

They again order 5 pairs of each size!

& I go vvith vvife to buy shoes 

No have, but I see one on display  - The right foot shoe (colour / size ) just vvhat she vvanted

Ok I'll buy that pair - NO HAVE 

VVhat do you mean no have - " only have right foot "

Hovv does that vvork, you usually buy a pair of shoes

So vvhat happened to the Left one - No ansvver or idea 

So vve moved on 

[jerry921]

21 minutes ago, dpcjsr said:

I have also noticed a tendency for Thai's to destroy a good market thru cut throat competition. 

In the local mountains a man opened up a coffee shop and sold strawberries. He had a nice farm and sold lots of strawberries so business was good. 

Another Thai farmer down the road opened up a small strawberry stall and sold strawberries at a lower price. Things were still OK but the future was easy to predict. Today there are 20 small stalls selling cheap strawberries and the guy with the original idea has gone out of business. Today none of these stalls makes much of a profit. 

This scenario happens over and over in Thailand. Thai's are good at copying someone elses business and selling cheaper. The result is that these Thai business just barely make a profit. 

 

This is good for us Farang as many things sell dirt cheap. It also explains the lack of innovation in Thailand. The creator of original ideas is usually the first to fail. Why try?

I wouldn't blame this on Thai's or Thai culture, I think it's true pretty much everywhere. Businesses that have some kind of "secret sauce" or can otherwise create a competitive moat succeed in the long term, businesses with a low barrier to entry and no secret sauce get copied to death.

[lkn]

On 5/14/2018 at 10:20 AM, jerry921 said:

I wouldn't blame this on Thai's or Thai culture, I think it's true pretty much everywhere. Businesses that have some kind of "secret sauce" or can otherwise create a competitive moat succeed in the long term, businesses with a low barrier to entry and no secret sauce get copied to death.

Yeah, he is pretty much describing the free market.

 

The problem with Thailand is that due to poor education there are less opportunities and therefor people compete for the same few business ideas, for example selling stuff at the market (either homegrown produce / homemade items, or arbitrage, buying stock at a larger market), food cart / restaurant, tuk-tuk / taxi, or in the tourist areas, reselling trips, renting bikes, massage, etc.