Am I a Thai citizen ...?

[JohnnySixString]

My father was an American in the Army, married to my Thai mother,  when I was born in Bangkok in 1971. He moved us here shortly after. I have a US Army issued birth certificate, but I believe I also had a Thai birth certificate. I'd assume one would be issued because my mom was still a Thai citizen? If so, would I also be considered a Thai citizen...or something...now?

[ubonjoe]

You have Thai nationality from birth.

It may not be easy to prove you are Thai though. You will need a Thai birth certificate to prove it which will require going to where your birth was registered here.

You will have to ask your mother where your birth was registered.

[JohnnySixString]

Both parents are dead, so I'm on my own trying to figure anything out now. Along with my US Army issued birth certificate, I found my "Record of Birth Overseas" form that shows I was born in "United States Army Hospital, Bangkok, Thailand", which I'm assuming isn't there anymore. It also lists my mother as a "Thai National". Do I need to contact the Army or an American Embassy...? How's that work?

[ubonjoe]

If a Thai birth certificate was done I would assume the birth was registered at a Khet/Amphoe in Bangkok.

Since you have a document that states your mother was a Thai national the consular section of the embassy in Washington DC might be able to help. Contact info is here: http://thaiembdc.org/contact/

Do you have anything to support the fact your mother was a Thai national such as a ID card or passport? Are you aware of any relatives (brothers or sisters) of you mother that are still living? 

 

[AsiaHand]

5 hours ago, JohnnySixString said:

Both parents are dead, so I'm on my own trying to figure anything out now. Along with my US Army issued birth certificate, I found my "Record of Birth Overseas" form that shows I was born in "United States Army Hospital, Bangkok, Thailand", which I'm assuming isn't there anymore. It also lists my mother as a "Thai National". Do I need to contact the Army or an American Embassy...? How's that work?

So you waited about 50 years to do this? It will be very difficult unless you were born in a Thai hospital,no what town or Ubon and you were registered by your mother in her village.There are many Thais with a second passport in another country but they keep it secret from the Government.I am thinking that if you could get a Thai passport you must give up all citizenship to other countries.

Edited May 1, 2018 by AsiaHand

[PerkinsCuthbert]

First, how is it remotely relevant that he "waited fifty years"? Second, he already stated he was born in the "United States Army Hospital, Bangkok, Thailand". Third, what does, "what town or Ubon" mean? Fourth, if he achieves Thai citizenship, he will NOT have to renounce US nationality. See UJ's comment here: 

For an "AsiaHand" you sure seem full of irrelevances and misinformation.

Edited May 1, 2018 by PerkinsCuthbert

[ubonjoe]

19 minutes ago, AsiaHand said:

So you waited about 50 years to do this? It will be very difficult unless you were born in a Thai hospital,no what town or Ubon and you were registered by your mother in her village

I would guess that he was not aware he is a Thai national from birth and I suspect his parents were not aware either.

Birth registration were done differently when he was born. His registration was probably done in Bangkok.

 

20 minutes ago, AsiaHand said:

I am thinking that if you could get a Thai passport you must give up all citizenship to other countries.

Why?

There is no law that prohibits Thais having a another nationality. Many people have dual nationalities and passports.

Also no problem for him to have another as a US citizen.

[FritsSikkink]

"I am thinking that if you could get a Thai passport you must give up all citizenship to other countries."

You thought wrong, loads of Thais with a second passport. 

[jenny2017]

1 hour ago, AsiaHand said:

So you waited about 50 years to do this? It will be very difficult unless you were born in a Thai hospital,no what town or Ubon and you were registered by your mother in her village.There are many Thais with a second passport in another country but they keep it secret from the Government.I am thinking that if you could get a Thai passport you must give up all citizenship to other countries.

Some people haven't learned anything in 50 years. 

[otherstuff1957]

When people who are citizens of another country go through the multi-year naturalization process to become Thai citizens they are supposed to renounce their citizenship in their old country, though I believe that this is not enforced. 

 

The OP was born a Thai citizen, so no renunciation is required.

[BritTim]

There should be a record of your birth at the district office in Bangkok where the US Army hospital was located. That birth certificate will not by itself make you a Thai citizen from birth. Until about 20 years ago, children of Thai mothers and foreign fathers were not entitled to Thai nationality. (Also, since 1952, being born in Thailand does not automatically confer Thai citizenship.) However, later revisions of the Nationality Act (I think the 2000 revision) allows those previously born of Thai mothers to claim Thai citizenship.

 

It is likely that your parents made no attempt to get you documentation as a Thai citizen when you were a child because, at that time, you could not claim Thai citizenship.

 

If money is not a key consideration, you might want to employ the services of a good immigration lawyer to sort this out. You are entitled to Thai citizenship today.

[thaikahuna]

21 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

You have Thai nationality from birth.

It may not be easy to prove you are Thai though. You will need a Thai birth certificate to prove it which will require going to where your birth was registered here.

You will have to ask your mother where your birth was registered.

You will need a copy of your mother's Birth Certificate, Copy of parents Marriage documents, copy of her Thai ID, Thai passport and any other relevant documents you can provide.

 

Good Luck!

[mahjongguy]

It seems that your answer is: if you come here and stay a while and doggedly pursue the needed documentation then you may very well succeed. 

 

From a legal standpoint, the two most important benefits would be the right to live here indefinitely without any interaction with Immigration, and the right to own property. If neither of those is your intention, and especially if you are not fluent in Thai language, the ID card and passport might not be of great value to you. In any case, I wish you well.

[ubonjoe]

1 hour ago, BritTim said:

There should be a record of your birth at the district office in Bangkok where the US Army hospital was located. That birth certificate will not by itself make you a Thai citizen from birth. Until about 20 years ago, children of Thai mothers and foreign fathers were not entitled to Thai nationality. (Also, since 1952, being born in Thailand does not automatically confer Thai citizenship.) However, later revisions of the Nationality Act (I think the 2000 revision) allows those previously born of Thai mothers to claim Thai citizenship

The current nationality of 1965 rescinded all previous ones. It has been amended in several times. The most recent amendment was done in 2012. A amendment done in 1992 revised section 7 that is titled "The following persons acquire Thai nationality by birth:"

Download: Nationality Act B.E. 2508 (1965) with amendments until B.E. 2555 (2012) - English translation

There is no need for him to do anything more than acquire proof his mother was Thai.

 

 

[onera1961]

4 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

Also no problem for him to have another as a US citizen.

While there are no explicit laws that bar dual citizenship in the USA and federal courts have upheld validity of dual citizenship for US passport holders. However, USDOS does not like it and warns US passport holders not to enter any country using a non-US passport. If they do so, consular help will not be available to them in case of emergency. My friend was drafted  in Venezuelan army and it took a senator to intervene and bring him home from Venezuelan military because consular officials told him they could not do anything because he entered Venezuela using a Venezuelan passport instead of a US passport (he is dual citizens). 

[ubonjoe]

1 minute ago, onera1961 said:

However, USDOS does not like it and warns US passport holders not to enter any country using a non-US passport.

I would not say they do not like it. It is only a warning that they cannot help you unless you enter using your US passport.

I think all countries that allow dual nationalities has the same policy as the US.  

[onera1961]

7 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

I would not say they do not like it

I said they don't like it because they went to the federal court asking justices to invalidate dual citizenship of US passport holders. 

Edited May 1, 2018 by onera1961

[mikosan]

OP.  It seems you are a newbie on ThaiVisa, so you probably don't know ubonjoe.  Take careful note of what he says, he's the expert on subject matter such as this.  Many others are just pretenders, although mostly trying to be helpful.  

[BritTim]

5 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

7 hours ago, BritTim said:

There should be a record of your birth at the district office in Bangkok where the US Army hospital was located. That birth certificate will not by itself make you a Thai citizen from birth. Until about 20 years ago, children of Thai mothers and foreign fathers were not entitled to Thai nationality. (Also, since 1952, being born in Thailand does not automatically confer Thai citizenship.) However, later revisions of the Nationality Act (I think the 2000 revision) allows those previously born of Thai mothers to claim Thai citizenship

The current nationality of 1965 rescinded all previous ones. It has been amended in several times. The most recent amendment was done in 2012. A amendment done in 1992 revised section 7 that is titled "The following persons acquire Thai nationality by birth:"

Download: Nationality Act B.E. 2508 (1965) with amendments until B.E. 2555 (2012) - English translation

There is no need for him to do anything more than acquire proof his mother was Thai.

Right. As my full post indicated, the OP does now have the right to Thai nationality. However, until he was about 20 years old, he could not claim Thai nationality. As the source you cited indicates, the amendments that allowed him to claim Thai nationality were promulgated

Quote

Reason:- Due to the principle of equality between men and women, a child shall acquire Thai nationality on the principle of jus sanguinis from his or her mother. Furthermore, rules on acquisition of Thai nationality of all consanguine descendents of migrants, illegal migrants, persons with temporary residence and persons having been given leniency for temporary residence in Kingdom as a special case shall be revised circumspectly because these persons hardly register their marriage as a matter of facts which do not comply with previous principles in the Declaration of the Revolutionary Party No.337 dated 13th December, B.E.2515. This Act, therefore, shall be enacted  

Published in the Government Gazette Vol.109, Chapter 13, Page 3 dated 25 February B.E.2535 (1992). 

His parents no doubt, based on the rules that applied prior to 1992, did not consider documentation of his birth in Thailand to be of significant importance. 

[DJ54]

https://immigration.findlaw.com/citizenship/dual-citizenship.html

[ericthai]

13 hours ago, AsiaHand said:

So you waited about 50 years to do this? It will be very difficult unless you were born in a Thai hospital,no what town or Ubon and you were registered by your mother in her village.There are many Thais with a second passport in another country but they keep it secret from the Government.I am thinking that if you could get a Thai passport you must give up all citizenship to other countries.

Why do you post when you dont really know anything?? 

Allot of misinformation. 

Edited May 1, 2018 by ericthai

[Maestro]

Removed some off-topic posts and the replies to them.

[PhonThong]

21 hours ago, AsiaHand said:

So you waited about 50 years to do this? It will be very difficult unless you were born in a Thai hospital,no what town or Ubon and you were registered by your mother in her village.There are many Thais with a second passport in another country but they keep it secret from the Government.I am thinking that if you could get a Thai passport you must give up all citizenship to other countries.

Wrong!

[samran]

In your case it is doable but there will be some legwork involved. There was a old member of TV, now banned called greenwander108, who went through a similar process to you having a deceased thai parent. Essentially a DNA test with the next closest relative was involved.

 

He used to have a blog which has since been taken down. I used the way back machine to find elements of it and if you do some digging you’ll find the more detailed elements as he has laid out all the steps 

 

https://web.archive.org/web/20080325055400/http://www.thaiskale.com:80/journal/applying-for-a-thai-passport-the-siamericans-final-dual-nationality-hurdle/

 

good luck 

[brianp0803]

I would think you would need some legal document connecting you to a 50 year old birth certificate.

Does your name in America match the birth certificate?

i would think a government official would want to know the birth certificate belongs to you?

 

if you never usef your Thai born name for 50 years and nonblood relatives living then difficult to prove the nirth certificate belongs to you.

[JohnnySixString]

Thanks for the responses. Not that it matters, but having grown up on this side of the planet, I had no real interest in going to Thailand, much less claiming a citizenship I didn't know I was entitled to. If I had a Thai birth name, I didn't know about it. Neither my older sister or I were called anything but our American names by our mother, even if her accent made it sound otherwise. My sister got rid of everything document-wise that had to do with our parents, so any passport, birth certificate, etc are gone. Having nothing on hand to go on besides the Report of Birth Abroad record (I mistakenly called it Report of Birth Overseas) and my birth certificate, both US issued, it seems like I'd have an uphill battle much like the 'Siamerican' story. Looking for relatives might prove difficult since I've discovered her maiden name is as common in Thailand as Garcia is in Texas. Although I'm not sure if her siblings there are alive, I know I have cousins from them. It might not lead anywhere, but I'm going to contact the Thai embassy like Ubonjoe suggested. But it seems like if I get serious about this, I might need to hire some people.

[ubonjoe]

9 minutes ago, JohnnySixString said:

Thanks for the responses. Not that it matters, but having grown up on this side of the planet, I had no real interest in going to Thailand, much less claiming a citizenship I didn't know I was entitled to. If I had a Thai birth name, I didn't know about it. Neither my older sister or I were called anything but our American names by our mother, even if her accent made it sound otherwise. My sister got rid of everything document-wise that had to do with our parents, so any passport, birth certificate, etc are gone. Having nothing on hand to go on besides the Report of Birth Abroad record (I mistakenly called it Report of Birth Overseas) and my birth certificate, both US issued, it seems like I'd have an uphill battle much like the 'Siamerican' story. Looking for relatives might prove difficult since I've discovered her maiden name is as common in Thailand as Garcia is in Texas. Although I'm not sure if her siblings there are alive, I know I have cousins from them. It might not lead anywhere, but I'm going to contact the Thai embassy like Ubonjoe suggested. But it seems like if I get serious about this, I might need to hire some people.

To bad your sister tossed everything. That certainly makes everything more difficult.

All I can say now is good luck. You might want to send a PM to Mod @Badbanker he may be able to give you some info and advice since he has been involved in record searches