Australian scientist, 104, plans to kill himself with 'Swiss option'

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

What if I want to "enjoy my last moments of life with rejoice" at age age 24 ?

 

At what age does it become acceptable?

I said earlier I thought I would live until I'm 25. I did go further. 
If you really want to end your life at age 24, it is your choice. Why shouldn't we allow you to do what you want? 

We can naturally try to tell you that life perhaps becomes better after that, but we are not sure of it. 

If a person wants to die at young age, so what? 

[ripstanley]

48 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

The guy hasnt said its because his friends are gone or failing health.

If I go and see a mental health doctor tomorrow and tell them I want kill myself, for no other reason than I want to, They would consider me a suicidal nut job.

 

Would you help your not in pain father to commit suicide at 94, 84, what about 54.

 

 

He actually has said its because his friends are all gone and his failing lifestyle due to his body failure.

 

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-05-05/david-goodall-trip-to-switzerland-for-voluntary-euthanasia/9716354

 

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-05-10/david-goodall-ends-life-in-a-powerful-statement-on-euthanasia/9742528

 

RIP David Goodall

[jvs]

The gentleman has passed away in Basel earlier today.

He said he regretted reaching the age of 104.

He went public because he wanted euthenasia a topic of discussion in

Australia.

[Happy Grumpy]

104?

 

 

Looks like some 50 year old blokes you see in Pattaya.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, jvs said:

The gentleman has passed away in Basel earlier today.

He said he regretted reaching the age of 104.

He went public because he wanted euthenasia a topic of discussion in

Australia.

Let's rise a drink for David Goodall.

Ballsy person who ended his life the way he wanted. 

Cheers 

 

[Credo]

I think a lot of people know when the time is right to make an exit.   I've been around a large family and naturally a fair amount of death.   I've seen younger people fight the good fight and lose.   They didn't want to go.   They didn't really feel their life was ready to end.   Most went rather peacefully, if not happily, because of pain and degeneration.

 

I've also seen a lot of older people, including my grandparents and great grandparents who were very much ready to leave.   They didn't commit suicide, but they did refuse intrusive medical care.   They were content, said goodbye to loved ones and passed happily into whatever is on the other side.   

 

Unfortunately, for this guy, he didn't feel he was finished, but he did realize things would have to be left undone.   

 

RIP

 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Credo said:

Unfortunately, for this guy, he didn't feel he was finished, but he did realize things would have to be left undone.   

You spoke most understanding words of the people you love. 

What's the difference of 'this guy'? He is clearly smarter person than your loved ones. 

Shouldn't he be allowed to go away in peace he wants?

When each of us decide to go, are we allowed to share our learned wisdom to the future generations or not?
 

[Credo]

4 minutes ago, oilinki said:

You spoke most understanding words of the people you love. 

What's the difference of 'this guy'? He is clearly smarter person than your loved ones. 

Shouldn't he be allowed to go away in peace he wants?

When each of us decide to go, are we allowed to share our learned wisdom to the future generations or not?
 

Yes, he most certainly should be allowed to go out as he chooses.   For my elderly family members, they really didn't have much choice, except to refuse intrusive medical treatment.    Suicide was really not an option any of them would chose.  

 

This guy seems to have a mind that keeps functioning clearly, but a body that has not kept pace, if you can say that a 104 year old body hasn't kept pace.   There is no chance that any of his physiological functions will get better.   

 

He feels he has nothing more to offer and his time is up.   It's always best to leave the party before people grow wearing of your presence.

 

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Credo said:

He feels he has nothing more to offer and his time is up.   It's always best to leave the party before people grow wearing of your presence.

Do we agree that he is allowed to take his last steps of life, the way he chooses?

That is what we, who support euthanasia, want.

[Credo]

9 minutes ago, oilinki said:

Do we agree that he is allowed to take his last steps of life, the way he chooses?

That is what we, who support euthanasia, want.

Yes.   

[webfact]

'This is taking an awfully long time!', says scientist before assisted suicide

By Marina Depetris

 

David Goodall, 104, arrives to hold a news conference a day before he intends to take his own life in assisted suicide, in Basel, Switzerland May 9, 2018. REUTERS/Stefan Wermuth

 

BASEL (Reuters) - A 104-year-old Australian scientist killed himself in Switzerland on Thursday by lethal injection in an assisted suicide he hoped would trigger more lenient euthanasia laws in his home country.

 

British-born David Goodall, who was not terminally ill, personally triggered a lethal dose of a barbiturate and died at 1030 GMT in a clinic near Basel, the assisted suicide group Exit International said.

 

Goodall, a member of the Order of Australia for work as a botanist that included publications on arid shrublands, said he had unsuccessfully tried to kill himself in Australia after his faculties including his hearing deteriorated.

 

He came to Switzerland for its laws that have made assisted suicide legal since the 1940s, a legal curiosity that has made the country what some call a "death tourism" magnet.

 

"My life has been rather poor for the past year or so, and I am very happy to end it," Goodall told reporters on Thursday, shortly before his death. "All the publicity that this has been receiving can only, I think, help the cause of euthanasia for the elderly, which I want."

 

Physician-assisted suicide or euthanasia remains illegal in many countries, including Australia, though the state of Victoria became the first to pass a euthanasia bill last November to allow terminally ill patients to end their lives. It takes effect in June 2019.

 

Several family members were with Goodall until his death, which was preceded by formal paperwork that visibly frustrated Goodall, who said "What are we waiting for?"

 

His last meal was fish and chips, and Exit International director Philip Nitschke helped organise Beethoven's 9th Symphony to be played at his death, a spontaneous request by Goodall prompted by a reporter's question at a news conference on Wednesday.

 

"The infusion started to drip as he activated the process -- he had to do that himself -- after answering questions which said he knew who he was, where he was and what he was about to do, and he answered these questions with great clarity," Nitschke told Reuters after Goodall's death.

 

"In fact his last words were 'This is taking an awfully long time!' " Nitschke said.

 

Goodall, a 20-year member of Exit International, was born in London in 1914 and moved to Australia in 1948, where he was a lecturer at the University of Melbourne. He also worked in Britain and held academic posts at U.S. universities, including at Utah State University in Logan.

 

'I DID MY BEST'

There, news of his death prompted debate over his legacy, with some former colleagues suggesting his public suicide fit a personality that did not shy the limelight.

 

Others called Goodall a fine scholar who was well-liked.

 

"If I had been asked to provide my own comments on David Goodall, I would have said he is perceptive, brilliant and inventive," said Robert Russon, a 30-year professor at the Logan school in a letter to the Herald Journal newspaper.

Before his death, Goodall said there were things he would have changed, had he to do it all over again.

 

"I'm not satisfied with what I have done, by any means," he said. "But I did my best."

 

(Additional reporting by John Miller in Zurich, Editing by Richard Balmforth, William Maclean)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-05-11

[Krataiboy]

13 hours ago, CharlesSwann said:

Just wondering... why are you so keen to make it easier for people to euthanase? No doubt certain people, like you and me, are intellectually sophisticated enough to make the decison, but many people - I would say most people - are actually quite feeble-minded, victim of their own unstable emotions, and had better be saved from themselves. I don't think society will ever make euthanasia easy for that reason.

Patronising, elitist nonsense.

[Krataiboy]

The reality is that assisted dying is already being practiced in UK hospitals. I know this because my very sick stepfather had his life support systems withdrawn, without him or his family being asked. When I found out what was going on, a hospital doctor took me on one side and told me: "He was "feeling very miserable and there was really not much more we felt we could do to help him. So we decided just to make him comfortable".

 

The poor guy had been feeling very depressed and fed up ever since being admitted. This was having a knock-on effect on his wife (my mother) whom I was taking to visit every few days, and who was herself very old and in poor health. For this reason, when feeding tubes, drips and urine bag were removed, neither my stepfather, my mother nor I insisted they all be put back.

 

A couple of days later the old fellow fell asleep and didn't wake up. It was a relief for everyone concerned and in retrospect I have no regrets about being a party to what was NHS-sanctioned euthanasia, carried out by professionals who clearly knew what they were doing and why.

[Jonnapat]

For many terminally ill people who suffer enormously at the end, euthanasia must be a great relief.

Ignoring all the religious questions I know which option I would choose.

Only a very few enlightened countries allow this practice, should be many more.

[TKDfella]

While I hold Life as being the valued property we have, I do sympathize with this. Families who see their loved ones in increasing unstoppable pain agonize as the pain drains every ounce dignity. Then cases like the OP where simply age takes it's toll. I have a 92 year friend who was fine during the previous couple of years, then his legs simply didn't obey the brains commands, though nothing wrong physically. This resulted in two falls and he now lies in a Care Home bed and he is in a somewhat confused state. It is indeed very sad.

[Aussieroaming]

His life, his choice but a shame he couldnt fade out in his home country, surrounded by family. No real winners 

[CharlesSwann]

12 hours ago, oilinki said:

Do we agree that he is allowed to take his last steps of life, the way he chooses?

That is what we, who support euthanasia, want.

Only certain people should qualify, such as those with hopeless medical conditions. In that sense, I'm not against it, just as I wouldn't be against suicide in such cases.

I don't see any difference between euthenasia and suicide at all, except the practical difference that euthanasia wants to have it easy (and is therefore arguably more cowardly).

 

It's not clear exactly what kind of system you are clamouring for in your multiple posts. If you're not careful, you will be giving everyone who is just having a bad day the easy ability to off themselves.

[Monomial]

30 minutes ago, CharlesSwann said:

Only certain people should qualify, such as those with hopeless medical conditions. In that sense, I'm not against it, just as I wouldn't be against suicide in such cases.

I don't see any difference between euthenasia and suicide at all, except the practical difference that euthanasia wants to have it easy (and is therefore arguably more cowardly).

 

It's not clear exactly what kind of system you are clamouring for in your multiple posts. If you're not careful, you will be giving everyone who is just having a bad day the easy ability to off themselves.

 

You are honestly going to try and argue that being 104 is not a hopeless medical condition? Perhaps you know of a drug the rest of us don't that will make him younger?

 

At his age, in the amount of pain he is in and with the quality of life he has, I think you are quite naive to say he isn't every bit as terminal as anyone with a hopeless medical condition. Just because his condition is extreme old age should not disqualify him from a bit of mercy on your part.

 

It is ridiculous to try and equate a 104 year old dying man with the problems of a 16 year old having a bad day...

 

[FritsSikkink]

17 hours ago, CharlesSwann said:

Care to explain why?

 

I'm all for euthanasia, but using one's own death to promote it - if that is what the news conference was about - is very questionable form. Surely lots of people go to Switzerland for this, and surely they would all rather do it in their home countries, but they don't hold news conferences about it they day before their quietus.

Modesty in all things, especially death.

 

Btw, any moral difference between euthanasia and suicide?

Because now people all over the world are talking about, which they wouldn't have done without the press being there. This could lead to change.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, CharlesSwann said:

Only certain people should qualify, such as those with hopeless medical conditions. In that sense, I'm not against it, just as I wouldn't be against suicide in such cases.

I don't see any difference between euthenasia and suicide at all, except the practical difference that euthanasia wants to have it easy (and is therefore arguably more cowardly).

 

It's not clear exactly what kind of system you are clamouring for in your multiple posts. If you're not careful, you will be giving everyone who is just having a bad day the easy ability to off themselves.

Why do you call a suicide or euthanasia as an act of cowardly? 

 

Euthanasia is one person's wish to end his or hers life without causing troubles to others. Without jumping them selves in front of train or a bus, thus causing the driver of these vehicles quite a lot of suffering. There is no mess to clean afterwards.

 

Don't you think people have right to end their lives if they so wishes? Don't you think they are allowed to do it in dignifying way? I don't understand the need for other people trying to put themselves above the people who simply wish to go and rest forever. 

 

 

 

 

 

[CharlesSwann]

53 minutes ago, Monomial said:

 

You are honestly going to try and argue that being 104 is not a hopeless medical condition? Perhaps you know of a drug the rest of us don't that will make him younger?

 

At his age, in the amount of pain he is in and with the quality of life he has, I think you are quite naive to say he isn't every bit as terminal as anyone with a hopeless medical condition. Just because his condition is extreme old age should not disqualify him from a bit of mercy on your part.

 

It is ridiculous to try and equate a 104 year old dying man with the problems of a 16 year old having a bad day...

 

 

At this stage in the discussion I'm talking about the general principle, not this particular case.

A 104 year old man can do exactly what he wants. I think he's perfectly entitled to kill himself or have himself killed. I intend to do so myself when the time comes.

My original point was only that the press conference was unseemly. And if he chose to do it publically, then we are all entitled to say exactly what we want about it.

[CharlesSwann]

52 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Because now people all over the world are talking about, which they wouldn't have done without the press being there. This could lead to change.

Fair enough, but by the same token I am entitled to say whatever I want about it without being insulted.

[CharlesSwann]

26 minutes ago, oilinki said:

Why do you call a suicide or euthanasia as an act of cowardly? 

 

Euthanasia is one person's wish to end his or hers life without causing troubles to others. Without jumping them selves in front of train or a bus, thus causing the driver of these vehicles quite a lot of suffering. There is no mess to clean afterwards.

 

Don't you think people have right to end their lives if they so wishes? Don't you think they are allowed to do it in dignifying way? I don't understand the need for other people trying to put themselves above the people who simply wish to go and rest forever. 

 

 

It's not that simple. We need to differentiate cases.

- Hopelessly ill people - no problem.

- Calm, intelligent people who have simply had enough - somewhat problematic.

- Temporarily depressed, emotionally-frail or attention-seeking people - including teenagers and all the girls you see with slash marks on their wrists - BIG PROBLEM.
 

There is no guarantee either that euthanasia doesn't cause problems for others - your friends and family may not agree about it.

Nor is suicide necessarily messy - in fact, it's quite possible to end your life without anyone knowing you've done it deliberately. Some people want to make a show of it though in which case they probably wouldn't be interested in euthanasia either.

 

I still don't know what kind of system you propose - who it applies to and how easy you intend to make it.

 

 

Edited May 11, 2018 by CharlesSwann

[CharlesSwann]

One last thought: there is a reason why he shouldn't have done it: centenarians are rare; they have a unique perspective on life and history, and memories of things that no one else shares. They should spend their remaining days writing their memoirs, imparting their wisdom, or just dictating their recollections of their early life. That's interesting and valuable. I wish my grandparents had done that - I know nothing about their early life.

 

Edited May 11, 2018 by CharlesSwann

[Guest]

57 minutes ago, CharlesSwann said:

 

It's not that simple. We need to differentiate cases.

- Hopelessly ill people - no problem.

- Calm, intelligent people who have simply had enough - somewhat problematic.

- Temporarily depressed, emotionally-frail or attention-seeking people - including teenagers and all the girls you see with slash marks on their wrists - BIG PROBLEM.
 

There is no guarantee either that euthanasia doesn't cause problems for others - your friends and family may not agree about it.

Nor is suicide necessarily messy - in fact, it's quite possible to end your life without anyone knowing you've done it deliberately. Some people want to make a show of it though in which case they probably wouldn't be interested in euthanasia either.

 

I still don't know what kind of system you propose - who it applies to and how easy you intend to make it.

I see euthanasia and suicide as a personal choice for each of us. There should not be stigma attached to it. Let a human being decide for him/herself what the person wants to do. 

 

If we remove the current stigma of suicide, then perhaps the general attitude towards death would change. That would also ease the fear of other elderly people, who are going to face death sooner than later. Why not think about the death as a relief rather than some kind of judgement day, which most religions seems to offer.

 

I certainly want to leave this life with a though "It's a good day to die". 
 

 

[midas]

21 hours ago, CharlesSwann said:

Care to explain why?

 

I'm all for euthanasia, but using one's own death to promote it - if that is what the news conference was about - is very questionable form. Surely lots of people go to Switzerland for this, and surely they would all rather do it in their home countries, but they don't hold news conferences about it they day before their quietus.

Modesty in all things, especially death.

 

Btw, any moral difference between euthanasia and suicide?

You really should educate yourself about the issues regarding euthanasia before embarrassing yourself  any further

[Oziex1]

On 10/05/2018 at 4:33 PM, CharlesSwann said:

 

I didn't see anything in the OP to suggest he is doing this to promote euthenasia in his home country. To exploit his own death for that purpose that would be unseemly in any case - smacks of self-immolation.

 

Seems this news is simply on account of him being 104 - which admittedly is remarkable.

 

 

As a Aussie I am well aware that he is trying to get some debate on this issue. What are you suggesting he is some publicity seeking ego tripper wanting to get on a reality TV show.

[Justfine]

On 10/05/2018 at 7:52 PM, Odysseus123 said:

Yes indeed.

 

I salute this Australian-a very brave and determined man.

Brave? Most people over 90yo are sick of life. He actually looks good for 104. Looks more like 93.

[lvr181]

On 5/10/2018 at 7:33 PM, CharlesSwann said:

 

I didn't see anything in the OP to suggest he is doing this to promote euthenasia in his home country. To exploit his own death for that purpose that would be unseemly in any case - smacks of self-immolation.

 

Seems this news is simply on account of him being 104 - which admittedly is remarkable.

 

 

" A 104-year-old Australian scientist travelled to Switzerland to end his life, telling a news conference on Wednesday the nation's liberal assisted suicide laws let him commit suicide legally, in contrast to his home where it remains forbidden."

 

What part of the OP do you not understand?

 

 

Edited May 11, 2018 by lvr181
Additional wording