E-Cigarettes / Thai Customs Question

[ChiangMaiLightning2143]

Not really sure what point you are trying to make.  Yes, I knew that vaping in Thailand is "illegal" but many things in Thailand, while technically illegal are often such only on the books and not in actual practice.  As you said, it's not hard to spot people openly vaping in public with no consequences. And, just to be clear, I was not intending to IMPORT for the purpose of reselling the item.  While my package can technically be considered an "import", I think it is pretty obvious to anyone, including Customs of what my intentions were.
 
As for the law itself, yes, it does exists in print.  Up to 10 years in prison!  I know of no one who has actually received such a sentence but it is on the books, and I'm sure that plenty of tourists have been fined, just the same way Police fine tourists for not having a Thail drivers license at checkpoint.  Sure you can go to the police station and fight it, but who really does that for a 500 baht fine.  The police know that, and so it's an easy way to add to their paycheck, and everybody that lives here know that it's just the way things are here in Thailand.
 
I have no qualms with the seizure of my e-cigarette device; I'm sure some Customs agent is enjoying it right now [emoji846]  My only issue is with the seizure of all of my other items which were perfectly legal.  As I said before, if this E-Cig were found in my luggage by Customs at the airport, I don't think they would seize my entire suitcase.  At any rate, what's done is done.
 
As for buying stuff here at a night bazaar, thanks but I'll pass.  Vaping probably is not the healthiest thing to do, but buying gear and e-liquid at a night bazaar is a pretty certain way to get a device that will blow up in your face or e-liquid with god-knows-what is in it...thanks, but no thanks, ya know?

You ordered something online to send to Thailand. That is called “importing”. You knew it was a prohibited item and did it anyway, so what is Thai customs supposed to do? Just ignore any further messages from customs about the package lesson learned. Doubt they will send agents all the way to CM to arrest you. If this is just a troll post nice talking to you it IS a ridiculous law but not uncommon in Asia.

I was just in Narita airport they have an eCig boutique near the Delta/Alitalia gates It would be very easy for someone unaware of Thai law to buy it there and fly to Bangkok. I looked it up on google.The ecigs they sell there are actually special Tobacco cigcareetes heated in a device (like the IQUOS cigs).

Vaping and everything else is illegal in Singapore. In Japan only juices containing NICOTINE are illegal so it must be imported illegally smuggled or sold underground. The vapor pens, electro pipes, and Mods are sold openly.

[Kohsamida]

16 minutes ago, ChiangMaiLightning2143 said:

You ordered something online to send to Thailand. That is called “importing”. You knew it was a prohibited item and did it anyway, so what is Thai customs supposed to do? Just ignore any further messages from customs about the package lesson learned. Doubt they will send agents all the way to CM to arrest you. If this is just a troll post nice talking to you it IS a ridiculous law but not uncommon in Asia.

I was just in Narita airport they have an eCig boutique near the Delta/Alitalia gates It would be very easy for someone unaware of Thai law to buy it there and fly to Bangkok. I looked it up on google.The ecigs they sell there are actually special Tobacco cigcareetes heated in a device (like the IQUOS cigs).

Vaping and everything else is illegal in Singapore. In Japan only juices containing NICOTINE are illegal so it must be imported illegally smuggled or sold underground. The vapor pens, electro pipes, and Mods are sold openly.

It's a crazy law here in Thailand but I guess it was well-intentioned by those who came up with it.  I mean, Vaping's long term effects on health really are not yet known. 

 

At this stage, I don't think the law is really enforced at all.  I was just unlucky enough to have my package randomly searched.  I spoke with the Custom agent on the phone and he was really quite friendly and understanding when I pleaded my case about letting me have my other stuff but said there was really nothing he could do; it was policy.

 

It's just a funny situation right now with the law.  I bought an E-cig mod when I was in Kuala Lumpur (where it is entirely legal).  I flew into Pattaya, and when I left, bound for CNX, while passing through security I got stopped because the scanner detected the E-Cig mod in my check-in baggage. 

 

The security guy asked me if it was indeed an E-Cig and I said it was.  He took it out of my bag, looked at it, then opened it and took the battery out and handed it to me, telling me to put the battery in my carry-on since it was Lithium-ion.  That was it!  So, it's all just crazy!

[HooHaa]

20 hours ago, Kohsamida said:

In fact, You're right! They called me back and said the entire consignment is being destroyed!  Yeah, right; Some Customs official is having Christmas early. That s*cks!  If you get something confiscated in the airport, they don't take your luggage!  Oh well. live and learn, I guess.

tell them you want to witness the destruction . 

[ChiangMaiLightning2143]

It's a crazy law here in Thailand but I guess it was well-intentioned by those who came up with it.  I mean, Vaping's long term effects on health really are not yet known. 
 
At this stage, I don't think the law is really enforced at all.  I was just unlucky enough to have my package randomly searched.  I spoke with the Custom agent on the phone and he was really quite friendly and understanding when I pleaded my case about letting me have my other stuff but said there was really nothing he could do; it was policy.
 
It's just a funny situation right now with the law.  I bought an E-cig mod when I was in Kuala Lumpur (where it is entirely legal).  I flew into Pattaya, and when I left, bound for CNX, while passing through security I got stopped because the scanner detected the E-Cig mod in my check-in baggage. 
 
The security guy asked me if it was indeed an E-Cig and I said it was.  He took it out of my bag, looked at it, then opened it and took the battery out and handed it to me, telling me to put the battery in my carry-on since it was Lithium-ion.  That was it!  So, it's all just crazy!

The LI batteries are a known fire hazard and can’t be put in hold luggage.

Vaping can’t be as unhealthy as cigarettes. Pure nicotine (in small doses) is not toxic to adults nor cancer causing, it is all the other crap and chemicals in the smoke.

I don’t smoke or vaporize (anything) but the vapour cloudz are less offensive to me than wafting stinking tobacco smoke and the smelly bodies and breath of so-called “smokers” I am forced to encounter in daily life.

[Kohsamida]

2 minutes ago, HooHaa said:

tell them you want to witness the destruction . 

Ummm, no I don't think so ?  Funny comment from the Thai Customs official  I spoke with on phone.  His English was very broken, and when I was trying to plead my case for my other stuff to be sent to me, he said something like, "Well you can come and discuss with Custom "police" but then they might arrest you"  He said it in a sort of humorous way, but I could see something like that actually happening, ya know?  Better to let it go, and just call it a learning experience to not do something so stupid in the future.

 

[HooHaa]

4 minutes ago, Kohsamida said:

Ummm, no I don't think so ?  Funny comment from the Thai Customs official  I spoke with on phone.  His English was very broken, and when I was trying to plead my case for my other stuff to be sent to me, he said something like, "Well you can come and discuss with Custom "police" but then they might arrest you"  He said it in a sort of humorous way, but I could see something like that actually happening, ya know?  Better to let it go, and just call it a learning experience to not do something so stupid in the future.

 

fair enough, but sadly i dont believe the destruction story at all unless the shipment was comprised of overripe cheese or something equally unappealing or unsaleable.

[rossd]

As far as I am aware "Ecigs" can be used in the UK through prescription.

[ChiangMaiLightning2143]

Not everything confiscated by Thai customs is actually destroyed. Promotions require an investment. I understand there is a spoils system.

[sirocco]

Hello Kohsamida,
no matter if you know the laws or not,
but no one is supposed to ignore them. .
  You should know that customs can keep your package up to 8 business days.
Sure, if we had found your electronic cigarette in your luggage,
  you would have returned your bags,
  but in exchange, you would have had a large fine and / or imprisonment.
If you go get your package, we will return your package,
  but in exchange, you will have a heavy fine and / or imprisonment.
Some countries are targeted, as well as online sales.
Do what you want.

[scorecard]

Perhaps reply to the e.mail you received and indicate that you now understand It's an illegal import and it has confiscated.

 

Then ask your question : 

 

'Can you please release the other legal items In the package to be delivered to the address indicated on the package'.  or whatever...

 

As mentioned by other posters I would not go personally or accompany a lawyer or agent to the actual customs office. Like in most countries there are always some government officials who love to 'eat' foreigners and Thais also.

 

Cost / benefit analysis:  you say the other items are normal things worth about US$350.

 

A Thai lawyer would probably cost around the same amount, an agent perhaps a little less, and there's probably a listed fee involved plus some tea money. Maybe they would interrogate the lawyer / agent for full details of your whereabouts, where you work etc., to follow up on the illegal smoking stuff.

 

Forget it, give up smoking (your own idea) and move along to another vice...

 

 

 

 

 

[Kohsamida]

10 minutes ago, scorecard said:

Perhaps reply to the e.mail you received and indicate that you now understand It's an illegal import and it has confiscated.

 

Then ask your question : 

 

'Can you please release the other legal items In the package to be delivered to the address indicated on the package'.  or whatever...

 

As mentioned by other posters I would not go personally or accompany a lawyer or agent to the actual customs office. Like in most countries there are always some government officials who love to 'eat' foreigners and Thais also.

 

Cost / benefit analysis:  you say the other items are normal things worth about US$350.

 

A Thai lawyer would probably cost around the same amount, an agent perhaps a little less, and there's probably a listed fee involved plus some tea money. Maybe they would interrogate the lawyer / agent for full details of your whereabouts, where you work etc., to follow up on the illegal smoking stuff.

 

Forget it, give up smoking (your own idea) and move along to another vice...

 

 

 

 

 

Already explored that option, as shared in a previous post on this thread, and with no luck.  However, I spoke today with a  highly regarded freight forwarder in Bangkok who I was in touch with a few weeks ago about another matter, and he is going to try and see if he can do something to help me since he has contacts within Thai Customs office at Suvarnabhumi, so perhaps there is hope.  Not holding my breath, but it made my day a little brighter ?

 

[Kohsamida]

17 hours ago, ukrules said:

So is Yaba.

Just curious, what is Yaba?

[Emmess]

17 minutes ago, Kohsamida said:

Just curious, what is Yaba?

Methamphetamine and caffeine tablets, to be had before driving your bus/lorry to another city.

[Kohsamida]

7 minutes ago, Emmess said:

Methamphetamine and caffeine tablets, to be had before driving your bus/lorry to another city.

Maybe THAT accounts for the crazy way Thai's handle their cars and motor bikes on the road.?   j/k?

[SooKee]

2 hours ago, Kohsamida said:

Maybe THAT accounts for the crazy way Thai's handle their cars and motor bikes on the road.?   j/k?

Oh they don't need anything to act crazy when driving, it sure ramps it up some though!!!

[Enoon]

6 hours ago, Kohsamida said:

Just curious, what is Yaba?

 

In Thailand it is a good idea to show "due diligence" in what you import into the country.

 

And also in what "medicine" you buy.

 

"due diligence".......don't forget that.

 

?

 

 

[Kohsamida]

For anyone curious about how this is playing out, I have a customs agent who is trying to help me get my parcel delivered (perhaps without the E-Cig), although he says for "something under the table" Customs will probably release it as well. 

 

"Something under the table" is NOT something" I'm willing to do.  I also contacted a local attorney who told me that Customs is NOT supposed to seize my entire package.  Rather, they are supposed to offer me an option to have the E-Cig returned to the shipper (at my expense) and to forward the remaining contents of the package to me!  If this were a bulk shipment of E-Cigs it would be a different story but this was one item obviously intended for personal use.

 

So, my hope is that the Customs Agent I'm working with can persuade Thai Customs to simply do the right thing, although I honestly doubt that Customs is going to do that.

 

We'll see.  In the meantime, my US shipper is filing an insurance loss claim on my behalf.  They have been very supportive of me in this whole mess.  Granted, I screwed up shipping the E-Cig in my package but the way Thai Customs is handling this is quite dodgy and suspect, to say the least.

[SooKee]

Appreciate you might feel a bit peeved by what Customs did but, essentially, Customs have done the right thing, an imported package contained prohibited items and they confiscated it.  Whether they are obliged to forward the rest of the goods I don't know, I would be surprised if they are.

 

The only 'dodgy' part is that they may be willing to let it go for something under the table (if indeed, once asked, they do), they shouldn't, but TIT and many problems are circumvented by paying the respective official off.  Otherwise I can't see how the Customs handling of this has been suspect or dodgy at all ?

 

If your agent is right you might find that what the official wants 'under the table' may not be very much.  The problem is your agent has said probably, so it sounds like the agent is not yet in contact with whoever might be able to assist.  In any event, I think you'd be safer just trying to arrange, if your agent can help, the forwarding of the non prohibited items, if it's not too late already. You just need to be careful the extent to which you dabble in this, if the worst comes to the worst Customs might ask to have a chat with you, and that could be very problematic.

[HooHaa]

On 6/1/2018 at 12:36 PM, rossd said:

As far as I am aware "Ecigs" can be used in the UK through prescription.

Apropos of absolutely nothing. 

[Kohsamida]

1 hour ago, SooKee said:

Appreciate you might feel a bit peeved by what Customs did but, essentially, Customs have done the right thing, an imported package contained prohibited items and they confiscated it.  Whether they are obliged to forward the rest of the goods I don't know, I would be surprised if they are.

 

The only 'dodgy' part is that they may be willing to let it go for something under the table (if indeed, once asked, they do), they shouldn't, but TIT and many problems are circumvented by paying the respective official off.  Otherwise I can't see how the Customs handling of this has been suspect or dodgy at all ?

 

If your agent is right you might find that what the official wants 'under the table' may not be very much.  The problem is your agent has said probably, so it sounds like the agent is not yet in contact with whoever might be able to assist.  In any event, I think you'd be safer just trying to arrange, if your agent can help, the forwarding of the non prohibited items, if it's not too late already. You just need to be careful the extent to which you dabble in this, if the worst comes to the worst Customs might ask to have a chat with you, and that could be very problematic.

I agree with most of what you say.  I do feel that something "dodgy has taken place since I have not been officially notified of anything whatsoever by Customs.  According to my (Thai) attorney I should have received a notice of seizure by now and I have received nothing. 

 

It leads me to believe the package was misplaced or pilfered while in Custom's possession. 

 

When I first inquired about the delivery delay, they could not locate the package by Tracking number and asked me to furnish not only name and address of sender and receiver, but also asked me to furnish a packing list.  That is highly irregular.

 

At this point, I'm writing the whole thing off to a "lesson learned"  If my agent can't sort this out for me.  I definitely agree with you as to opening up a can of worms by having Customs invite me in to discuss the matter further, so I'm pretty much done with the whole thing.

[Kohsamida]

2 hours ago, HooHaa said:

Apropos of absolutely nothing. 

Actually I think the poster was suggesting it might be something to investigate as to whether Thailand has a similar "loophole".  I doubt it, but it did make me wonder.  Fact is, the ban on E-Cigs here in Thailand has very little to do with health; it's a matter of money.  Thai officials are currently debating how best to tax their use, not whether or not they are safe.

 

Personally, I don't care.  I've wanted to quit using them for a while so this all is probably a blessing in disguise.  

[SooKee]

AFAIK you won't normally get a contact from Customs saying they've confiscated goods, if they contact you, you'd likely have a bigger problem.  Normally you will just use the postal tracking which will show something like 'International delivery failed', courier speak for confiscated.

 

I still don't think there's anything dodgy in what Customs did per se, the dodgy part might be whether the rest of your package (including the e-cig) get destroyed or make it into the home(s) of some lucky officials, but again TIT.

[Kohsamida]

7 minutes ago, SooKee said:

AFAIK you won't normally get a contact from Customs saying they've confiscated goods, if they contact you, you'd likely have a bigger problem.  Normally you will just use the postal tracking which will show something like 'International delivery failed', courier speak for confiscated.

Well, the attorney said it's a requirement for a form letter to go out anytime a seizure takes place.  As for tracking, the status has not changed in a month now.  The last track showed it entering Custom.  Nothing since.

 

Again, Im just writing it off as a "lesson learned".  It was a stupid mistake on my part.  My fault.

[SooKee]

Well, not going to debate the point further after this as it's a bit pointless but I previously worked a lot with shipping and courier companies involving shipping to Thailand, of all the people I know that have had similar problems, not one has ever received a Customs notice in the event of confiscation (which happens for all sorts of bizarre reasons, such as protectionism, as well as obvious ones like this) unless it was large consignments valued at thousands of dollars (and then they are interested in getting the duty) so I would suggest the practice of sending notices to individuals doesn't happen.  Your attorney may be right (I'm not sure the level of experience he/she has with importation procedures), maybe they are supposed to send notices, in my experience though it never happens.  Many things the authorities are supposed to do, like enforcing the law etc., they do it when it suits.  Good luck with getting the rest of the consignment, hope it works out ?

[Kohsamida]

23 minutes ago, SooKee said:

Well, not going to debate the point further after this as it's a bit pointless but I previously worked a lot with shipping and courier companies involving shipping to Thailand, of all the people I know that have had similar problems, not one has ever received a Customs notice in the event of confiscation (which happens for all sorts of bizarre reasons, such as protectionism, as well as obvious ones like this) unless it was large consignments valued at thousands of dollars (and then they are interested in getting the duty) so I would suggest the practice of sending notices to individuals doesn't happen.  Your attorney may be right (I'm not sure the level of experience he/she has with importation procedures), maybe they are supposed to send notices, in my experience though it never happens.  Many things the authorities are supposed to do, like enforcing the law etc., they do it when it suits.  Good luck with getting the rest of the consignment, hope it works out ?

Thanks for your insight.  As you inferred, this situation of mine has reached the point where further fretting is pointless.  It happened, and it's time for me to move on.  Im OK with that ?

[Kohsamida]

So...I have an interesting end to this saga with Customs regarding a box of consumer goods from amazon.com mailed to me back in May.  By the end of May when I still hadn't received it I enquired with Thai Post. 

 

They said that Thai Customs had seized my package containing over $400 of consumer goods on the grounds that the package included a $50 e-cigarette, and there was nothing I could do to remedy the situation; all the contents of the package were being seized and Customs would "dispose" of all the contents.

 

Now, four months later, the package has mysteriously arrived at my doorstep!  Even though the contents is valued at US$400, not one baht of duty was charged!  What's more, the box has not even been opened by Customs; my shipper's tamper-proof sealing tape is still intact.  So, I guess the only thing that alerted them to the e-cig is that it was listed on the declaration form.

 

Needless to say I am dumb-founded to receive it!  I'm not sure if the delivery was a blunder on their part or simply an act of kindness, or what!  All I know is it sure "made my day"!  It was kind of like having Christmas in August LOL!  

[ukrules]

Maybe someone will be along in a day or two to arrest you for importing an e-cigarette

 

I'm joking when I say this but this is Thailand so don't rule anything out.

[Kohsamida]

1 hour ago, ukrules said:

Maybe someone will be along in a day or two to arrest you for importing an e-cigarette

 

I'm joking when I say this but this is Thailand so don't rule anything out.

Don’t think that hasn’t crossed my mind ?  As you said though, this IS Thailand where both good and bad unexpected things occur.  I’m an optimist so I’ll assume it’s a good thing...for now ?

 

[ChiangMaiLightning2143]

Don’t worry about it. If it was a Sting operation you would already be locked down. Facing heavy fines and long sentence of Thai gaol. For something that is mainstream and sold openly in major economic power Countries.

[CeeGee]

Just looking at the e cig situation from another side.

Possible situation.I do not import an e cig but when I am in Thailand I buy one from the local market.Going home I arrive at the airport and at security the metal detector or x ray show the e cig in my hand luggage.Perfectly legal to take on plane(subject to rules battery etc), I am going through security not customs and if anything I am exporting the e cig.

 

Anyone encountered this? am I breaking any laws? can security do anything because as far as I can see the rules are only about importing or using.My interpretation of the rules is that it is illegal to import or use nothing about carrying or owning.