Non-b Visa denied in Hong Kong

[Fatal1ty]

So, I had contact with lawyers in BKK which offered me a sponsorship visa for 3 month, ie. based on their company I got a set of documents.

 

Today I went into the Consulate in HK and tried to submit my application. The lady checked the docs and took them into another room. As she came back she said I cannot get the non-b visa and I should apply in my home country. I said the lawyer sent me here and she said, “yes it’s not your fault but we had this company already for some other guy and refused him”.

 

As it wasn’t very clear what she meant and she refused to tell me more I asked her what do now and if I can apply for tourist visa. She said she will try her best, went to other room again, came back and stated, “must go home country” and “you can get 30 day on arrival”. Great.

 

Reason for non-b is obviously setting up a company and for my “home country” - I don’t even have an address there.

 

I am a holder of a German passport with 1x 30 day on arrival and 1x non-o 90 days.

 

i really thought this HK was smooth, especially seeing all the Indians and whites getting some visa?! I mean why not even tourist visa... well could be that the supervise made already decision by denying and obviously applying for non-b and then wanting a tourist visa was off plan.

[impulse]

Did you have residency paperwork for living in HK?

 

[Fatal1ty]

14 minutes ago, impulse said:

Did you have residency paperwork for living in HK?

 

 

No, I was never in HK before. The lawyers send me to HK. 

[NanLaew]

17 minutes ago, Fatal1ty said:

 

No, I was never in HK before. The lawyers send me to HK. 

I lot of embassy's and consulates toe the line when their government mandates that they can only issue a visa to resident citizens of that country and/or aliens with some form of residential status for that country.

 

Poor due diligence by the Bangkok lawyers IMHO. Not unusual. Last year, I had a client's Bangkok lawyers willing to argue against the advice from the RTE Singapore that the paperwork they had provided had deficiencies. Luckily they listened to (my experienced) reasoning and simply re-issued their sponsoring letter with the information that RTE Singapore requested and even state as much on their web site. They had considered that specific wording unnecessary based on their 'vast experience' on doing the paperwork to support work-enabling visas.

 

There's lawyers, then there's other lawyers and then there's local embassies and consulates with their own preferences.

[elviajero]

1 hour ago, Fatal1ty said:

Reason for non-b is obviously setting up a company

You don’t need a non ‘B’ visa to set up a company.

[bkk6060]

I have heard HK consulate is one of the worst places in the world to get anything done.

Good luck I hope you get it straightened out.

 

[PoorSucker]

Did you have a WP3 confirming you have applied for work permit?

[BritTim]

18 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

I have heard HK consulate is one of the worst places in the world to get anything done.

Good luck I hope you get it straightened out.

My experience in recent years is that Hong Kong is an excellent place to apply for visas. I think the OP's lawyers had also seen that, and it was the reason for directing the OP there. It appears the Non B application was based on the false premise that the lawyers' company was offering the OP a job. Hong Kong deemed this, correctly, to be a bogus application, and refused to deal further with the OP on that basis.

[Mattd]

22 minutes ago, PoorSucker said:

Did you have a WP3 confirming you have applied for work permit?

He would not need one if the application was for a Non b for business purposes and not work.

[Norrad]

The embassy in Hong Kong is normally very polite and accommodating, but they are very strict when it comes to paperwork and carefully go through every document. That was my experience applying for a Non-B there for teaching.

 

That being said I'm sure they are a little bit racist to people of colour. An African-American, who was applying at the same time, was turned away when they checked his paperwork. I remember it clearly because he had a mountain of paperwork and I started to panic because I didn't have all the papers that he had. We were comparing our papers while filling in the application forms together.

[Mattd]

2 hours ago, impulse said:

Did you have residency paperwork for living in HK?

 

Although it does state that a HK / Macau residency permit is needed in the general requirements, there has been more than one report that others have been successful getting visas from HK who were not resident.

[PoorSucker]

31 minutes ago, Mattd said:

He would not need one if the application was for a Non b for business purposes and not work.

Then he has to apply in country where his original company is based.

[Mattd]

7 minutes ago, PoorSucker said:

Then he has to apply in country where his original company is based.

Which is quite possibly why he was refused in HK, unless, as BritTim thinks, the application was based on some bogus job, in which case he would need the WP.3 

[elviajero]

1 hour ago, BritTim said:

My experience in recent years is that Hong Kong is an excellent place to apply for visas. I think the OP's lawyers had also seen that, and it was the reason for directing the OP there. It appears the Non B application was based on the false premise that the lawyers' company was offering the OP a job. Hong Kong deemed this, correctly, to be a bogus application, and refused to deal further with the OP on that basis.

And it will continue to get less friendly as more people are recommended to go there.

 

I doubt the lawyer was offering a job, but sponsoring a non ‘B’ due to a ‘business connection’. It seems the lawyers dodgy practice is now known to the Consulate.

[ubonjoe]

Her are the requirements on the consulate website. I suspect you were lacking some of them.

Quote

1. Non-Immigrant Visa Category "B" (business and work) - Single, or (Multiple entries for Business only)

    1.1 An original letter of guarantee from the employer with authorized signature and Company Seal Stamp with details about the purpose of the visit to Thailand and a copy of the company registration. A copy of I.D. card of the authorized signatory is also required.

    1.2 A letter from the Thai Business Counterpart with authorized signature and Company Seal Stamp, stating the details about the visit to Thailand together with a copy of the Certificate of Company  Registration issued by the Thai authority. A copy I.D. card of the Company's authorized signatory is also required.

Source: http://www.thai-consulate.org.hk/web/3015.php?s=4262

[Fatal1ty]

3 hours ago, PoorSucker said:

Then he has to apply in country where his original company is based.

 

5 hours ago, NanLaew said:

I lot of embassy's and consulates toe the line when their government mandates that they can only issue a visa to resident citizens of that country and/or aliens with some form of residential status for that country.

 

Poor due diligence by the Bangkok lawyers IMHO. Not unusual. Last year, I had a client's Bangkok lawyers willing to argue against the advice from the RTE Singapore that the paperwork they had provided had deficiencies. Luckily they listened to (my experienced) reasoning and simply re-issued their sponsoring letter with the information that RTE Singapore requested and even state as much on their web site. They had considered that specific wording unnecessary based on their 'vast experience' on doing the paperwork to support work-enabling visas.

 

There's lawyers, then there's other lawyers and then there's local embassies and consulates with their own preferences.

 

I had been to two different lawyers and they both wanted to send me to HK because it is like ‘garantueed’ that I get a visa there.

[Fatal1ty]

5 hours ago, PoorSucker said:

Did you have a WP3 confirming you have applied for work permit?

 

I did not apply for a work permit. 

[Fatal1ty]

4 hours ago, PoorSucker said:

Then he has to apply in country where his original company is based.

 

3 hours ago, elviajero said:

And it will continue to get less friendly as more people are recommended to go there.

 

I doubt the lawyer was offering a job, but sponsoring a non ‘B’ due to a ‘business connection’. It seems the lawyers dodgy practice is now known to the Consulate.

 

Yes they were not offering a job but even stated in the letter that it is for looking forward to make business in Thailand. And the location of their company is only in Thailand. The officer in the HK consulate also said this in the beiginning, that I should go to the country where the company is located which I replied to that the company is in Thailand.

[Fatal1ty]

2 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

Her are the requirements on the consulate website. I suspect you were lacking some of them.

Source: http://www.thai-consulate.org.hk/web/3015.php?s=4262

 

Yes everything was in order.

[Maestro]

51 minutes ago, Fatal1ty said:

 

Yes everything was in order.

 

No, based on the information you provided in the opening post of this topic, everything was not in order.

 

You did not have a letter from your employer, a company outside Thailand, stating the purpose of your visit to Thailand on behalf of your employer. In fact, you are not employed by a company outside Thailand. Please see the first of the two documents Ubonjoe cited in this post, copied from the website of the Thai consulate in Hong Kong.

[Fatal1ty]

17 minutes ago, Maestro said:

 

No, based on the information you provided in the opening post of this topic, everything was not in order.

 

You did not have a letter from your employer, a company outside Thailand, stating the purpose of your visit to Thailand on behalf of your employer. In fact, you are not employed by a company outside Thailand. Please see the first of the two documents Ubonjoe cited in this post, copied from the website of the Thai consulate in Hong Kong.

 

Ah, I see what is meant now. Well, this would not have been a problem to produce. And why it is a fact that I am not employed by a company out of Thailand?! Yes I am but this company has nothing to do with my home country, it has in fact something to do with the purpose of doing business in Thailand, and then, nobody said that this is required. Not the lawyers, not the HK consulate. I asked the officer if the documents are ‘good’ and she replied ‘yes, but... home country’.

[Maestro]

1 hour ago, Fatal1ty said:

 

 

I had been to two different lawyers and they both wanted to send me to HK because it is like ‘garantueed’ that I get a visa there.

No doubt these lawyers were successful with this type of visa application in the past, but things are changing. I suspect that the Consular Department of Thailand's Ministry of Foreign Affairs has given the consulate in Hong Kong advice to stop issuing the non-B visa for travel to Thailand for the purpose of setting up a company. As another member has posted, a permission to stay based on entry with a non-B visa is not necessary for this purpose.

[Maestro]

5 minutes ago, Fatal1ty said:

 

Ah, I see what is meant now. Well, this would not have been a problem to produce. And why it is a fact that I am not employed by a company out of Thailand?! Yes I am but this company has nothing to do with my home country, it has in fact something to do with the purpose of doing business in Thailand, and then, nobody said that this is required. Not the lawyers, not the HK consulate. I asked the officer if the documents are ‘good’ and she replied ‘yes, but... home country’.

The consulate's requirement for application in your "home" country was inaccurate. It can be any country outside Thailand where your employer has its registered office or you have your permanent address.

 

Regarding the requirement to be employed by a company outside Thailand, if you were employed by a company inside Thailand to do business in Thailand, you would need a Thai work permit or receipt for your work permit application to apply for a non-B visa at a Thai consulate.

[Fatal1ty]

Well, to summarize the result: I will drop the idea of doing business in Thailand, I think it is too much hassle and if it’s already like that in the beginning. I won’t meet 10s of people to talk about business on a tourist exempt visa. What is your purpose of staying in Thailand... lying on the entry form, ‘tourist’, I think not a good idea.

 

i asked the lawyer for a refund of 10,000 thb, refused. No thank you.

 

Thanks for the replies so far.

[BritTim]

4 hours ago, Fatal1ty said:

Ah, I see what is meant now. Well, this would not have been a problem to produce. And why it is a fact that I am not employed by a company out of Thailand?! Yes I am but this company has nothing to do with my home country, it has in fact something to do with the purpose of doing business in Thailand, and then, nobody said that this is required. Not the lawyers, not the HK consulate. I asked the officer if the documents are ‘good’ and she replied ‘yes, but... home country’.

Unfortunately, the person speaking to you was not the person making the decision. That makes the explanation you were given necessarily a bit garbled. This is what I think occurred ...

 

Usually, someone getting a Non B visa to make visits to Thailand for the purpose of investigating business opportunities would be doing so from their normal place of residence (that would not be expected to be Thailand). There was nothing explicitly in the rules to disbar Hong Kong from giving you the visa, but they had prior experience with this legal firm, and considered the idea of your visiting the legal firm to investigate business opportunities implausible.

 

They saw it as a fraudulent application, and the person in charge would not issue you a tourist visa when it was already established that you wanted to enter Thailand to conduct business.

[SOTIRIOS]

...if immigration told you 'This law firm has tried this before and they were refused'....???

 

...sounds like you paid for services this law firm..... couldn't deliver...???

 

...to be polite about it...

 

...you don't mention how much you were charged....???

 

...maybe give others a 'heads up' about this... ???