Thai style motorcycles sidecars

[Kenny202]

Please firstly, rather than the post turn into a bun fight about how dangerous etc these are....for now looking for advice from someone who may have had one of these things and some experience riding them..

 

Just had one of these built for a little business venture for the missus. Reputable manufacturer been around for 20 years. Attached to a late model Honda wave brakes everything tip top...standard fare. Mrs has had very little experience on one. I took it out for a ride this arvo and while I was not expecting it to be a nice smooth ride, felt like I was wrestling an uncontrollable pig. I understand very slow and careful driving required and it is nothing like a bike to drive but......Wrestling the thing around corners feels like your scrubbing 5mm of rubber off the tyres even at near standstill speeds. If you hit any potholes even at very low speed the front wheel seems to get the death wobbles. You need to keep a firm grip on the handlebars at all times to keep it under control. It fairly lightly made and we don't have a great deal of weight to put in it. Will it get better with a load or worse?

 

Would appreciate any advice from anyone has experience with one of these. I'm sure generally they must be ok or there wouldn't be tens of thousands of them getting around. Like I said this is a reputable maker and the bike is in near new nick. Is this what they are like? Am I up for a new front tyre every 2 months?

Any tips on the best way to drive and handle them appreciated.

[poanoi]

they are difficult to brake with,

but your issue with it wobbling has to do with front wheel alignment,

i was never a mechanic but i saw those guys who attached the sidecar to my bike

janked the front wheel to be aligned with the side car.

go to a mechanic or someone else who knows how its done,

you should be able to go 80 km/h before it start wobble.

ed" and again, dont drive fast or even semi fast on those things if you are going to have to brake.

also put a lot of grease on that wheel

if you are going to park it somewhere until needed, the wise guys uses aluminium wheels

Edited July 7, 2018 by poanoi

[OneMoreFarang]

I know that is takes some experience to operate these things, especially in corners.

 

I just had a look in YouTube and there seem to be a couple of interesting videos about them. That is where I would look for further information.

 

[Kenny202]

All good advice. I suspect the wobble which is intermittent maybe due to weight coming off the front wheel. Its quite an effort to turn the wheel coming into a corner when the weight is solidly over the front wheel but maybe in some instances weight is favouring the rear taking weight and control from the front wheel. I think when loading the cart a good idea to add heavier items to the front. As far as solid aluminium wheels definitely. Feels like so much stress on the front spoke wheels cornering they wont last long.

 

I love her to bits but in all honesty my main problem is the missus. I saw her pull out from the kerb at least 6 times today and neither looked, indicated nor checked her mirrors. She kept wandering off to the left hand side of the road nearly hitting parked cars or running off the road. I was behind her and had to beep her so many times it was like I had to wake her up to straighten the bike up. 15km an hour on clear stretches of road and bike wandering all over the road. People would understandably try and pass her and as she never looked once in her rear view mirror she wasnt aware. Might have another try tomorrow but may have to sell the thing. I see some jaw dropping acts of stupidity on the roads here everyday but she is another level again.

 

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[Kenny202]

they are difficult to brake with,
but your issue with it wobbling has to do with front wheel alignment,
i was never a mechanic but i saw those guys who attached the sidecar to my bike
janked the front wheel to be aligned with the side car.
go to a mechanic or someone else who knows how its done,
you should be able to go 80 km/h before it start wobble.
ed" and again, dont drive fast or even semi fast on those things if you are going to have to brake.
also put a lot of grease on that wheel
if you are going to park it somewhere until needed, the wise guys uses aluminium wheels

Do u mean align the front wheel on the bike or the sidecar wheel? I dont know if there is any alignment on a Wave front wheel? I do think ur right tho. There is an alignment issue somewhere

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[poanoi]

36 minutes ago, Kenny202 said:

Do u mean align the front wheel on the bike or the sidecar wheel? I dont know if there is any alignment on a Wave front wheel? I do think ur right tho. There is an alignment issue somewhere

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i'm not a mechanic so i'm not sure what they really did,

but i saw they were janking with the front wheel to align it with the side car,

i think anyone who attach side cars for a living will know exactly what to do.

it looked like they first made the front wheel point in the direction of the side car wheel,

and then janked the handle bar to be aligned with the front wheel in a 90 degree angle.

also, you need a firm hand when you drive at speed, but now is many years since i drove with a side car so my memory isnt to be entirely trusted

Edited July 7, 2018 by poanoi

[KhaoYai]

Without looking at the bike I'd say you have a weight transfer issue - the sidecar is possibly taking the weight off the bike's front wheel. If its adjustable try leaning the bike a little towards the sidecar slightly.  Also, I notice there appears to be some form of clamp holding the sidecar to the rear grab rail.  That's going to screw up your rear suspension.

 

However, in general, if you've never ridden a bike with a sidecar on before, they behave very differently to a solo - especially lightweight bikes.

Edited July 7, 2018 by KhaoYai

[OneMoreFarang]

8 hours ago, Kenny202 said:

All good advice. I suspect the wobble which is intermittent maybe due to weight coming off the front wheel. Its quite an effort to turn the wheel coming into a corner when the weight is solidly over the front wheel but maybe in some instances weight is favouring the rear taking weight and control from the front wheel. I think when loading the cart a good idea to add heavier items to the front. As far as solid aluminium wheels definitely. Feels like so much stress on the front spoke wheels cornering they wont last long.

 

I love her to bits but in all honesty my main problem is the missus. I saw her pull out from the kerb at least 6 times today and neither looked, indicated nor checked her mirrors. She kept wandering off to the left hand side of the road nearly hitting parked cars or running off the road. I was behind her and had to beep her so many times it was like I had to wake her up to straighten the bike up. 15km an hour on clear stretches of road and bike wandering all over the road. People would understandably try and pass her and as she never looked once in her rear view mirror she wasnt aware. Might have another try tomorrow but may have to sell the thing. I see some jaw dropping acts of stupidity on the roads here everyday but she is another level again.

 

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Are you sure you want to make that thing better?

 

Seriously, it sounds for me that your missus is the bigger problem. Just imagine for a moment that bike would be perfect. What would she do?

Probably she would still not look at the road or the mirrors and probably she would try to ride it as fast as possible. What could possibly go wrong?

 

If that thing never works then she can't use it and probably that is the easiest way to keep her safe and alive.

[lucifer666]

I can't tell from the picture, but, does it have a shock absorber ?

[thaiguzzi]

16 hours ago, Kenny202 said:

Would appreciate any advice from anyone has experience with one of these. I'm sure generally they must be ok or there wouldn't be tens of thousands of them getting around. Like I said this is a reputable maker and the bike is in near new nick. Is this what they are like? Am I up for a new front tyre every 2 months? 

I'm a big sidecar man . Love them to bits. My favourite are rigid outfits - rigid rear frame and rigid sidecar wheel - only suspension being the front forks. The things i could do on my 650 Triumph outfit..... but i digress.....

 Your problems will mainly be "toe in". Google it or YouTube it, should be plenty out there. Obviously front & rear wheels on the m/c need to be straight and in line. The side car wheel needs to toe in a couple of degrees towards the bike. Where it is in relation to the front/rear wheels also affects things. This will all be done by how the chair is attached to the bike.

Suggest taking it back to the original shop explaining the handling problems or finding someone else.

A well set up outfit is a joy to behold and a poorly set up one is a dangerous vehicle. H/bars should not waggle. Note also L/H and R/H turns are completely different, and need a different mental & physical  application.

Good luck & persevere.

Edit - no you should not be scrubbing out a front tyre every 2 months. Sidecar outfits like to run a hard squarish profile rather than a modern radial.  Hence the outfit (toe in) is not set up right. Also make sure the spokes are in tip top condition. Not neccessary for a mag alloy wheel if everything is in good order.

Edited July 8, 2018 by thaiguzzi

[Kenny202]

Got a bit of weight in the side car now, albeit not a lot and I must say a huge difference. Its nearly enjoyable to drive :-)
Alignment is great...drives straight as a die...just get a bit of a shock sometimes when the sidecar wheel hits a rut or something...feels like ur going to tip although I know at normal speed near impossible.
Spot on about the left and right turns too. Definitely smoother around lh corners if u accellerate slightly.

One thing I did notice after coming back from the Sidecar manufacturer, the air in the tyres all about 15 - 20 PSI. I normaly run 32. Did the guy intentionally deflate the tyres ie: do you have more or less air in your tyres when running a sidecar?

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[thaiguzzi]

# Sidecar on the left as in your photo, R/H corners should be much easier and faster and safer than L/H corners.

    R/Handers are the fun ones.

    L/Handers without weight in the chair are the dodgy / hair raising ones.

# I would run your normal tyre pressures of 32 all round.

# Sounds like you're getting the hang of it. Once you are confident, they can be great fun (unlike trikes.....).

[scubascuba3]

Doesn't sound right at all. How about taking it to a friendly garage that will check it and correct it. I wouldn't blame the wife just yet until the bike is fixed

[Tug]

I agree with Thaiguzzie toe in is the issue riding A bike with a (hack)slang for sidecar is different will bear towards the car on exceleration and try to overtake when breaking that being said they can be fun your wife not looking for traffic is not good please take care!!  I miss my urals gear up 2 wheel drive with reverse was great off road but to slow for the freeways here in the USA 62 mph was the fastest contunious speed as per the factory heck even the big rigs are doing 70 in the slow lane lol

[OneMoreFarang]

I just found this video on my recommended list in YouTube.

Some inspiration for you and your wife ?

 

 

[Kenny202]

Totally got the weight distributed right now and it is quite fun to drive. On a nice flat road drives straight and true but so many roads here cambered this way and that. I would hate to have to stop the thing quickly...particularly in the wet. I reckon it would piroet down the road with the thin cheese cutter wave tyres :-(

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