I just finished a 48 hour intermittent fast (IF)

[bkk6060]

I would say there is something wrong with the OP's fast report.

He did not lose enough weight a fast for 48 hours should result in about 3 kilo lose.

But maybe they are a very small person I guess.

[Destiny1990]

Ok i tried this about 2 years ago.

i first read a couple of books about it then started.

i followed the 8/16 program so i only ate 8 hours a day. Usually this was from 12:00 till 20:00.

i did this for about 6 week each day and yes i lost couple  kilos but there were downsides.

after 5 weeks i noticed i got less erections at night during my sleep and well so i stopped with that diet and went back to eating normally. So i never noticed about getting more testosterone or more growth hormones its rubbish because as i said i got less libido from doing this fasting diet.

Then this diet says its good to have ur belly make this rombling sounds craving for food just ignore it. So I thought it was good however after i went back to normal eating I all of sudden developed the worst stomach pain ever for days long i was even too much in pain to visit the doctor couldn’t even drive my car.

Doctor visited me gave me special stomach pills and slowly I recovered later I realized I somehow messed up my stomach flora for having it empty for too long.

This my experiences but those book only have positive stuff!!

[robblok]

9 hours ago, Destiny1990 said:

Ok i tried this about 2 years ago.

i first read a couple of books about it then started.

i followed the 8/16 program so i only ate 8 hours a day. Usually this was from 12:00 till 20:00.

i did this for about 6 week each day and yes i lost couple  kilos but there were downsides.

after 5 weeks i noticed i got less erections at night during my sleep and well so i stopped with that diet and went back to eating normally. So i never noticed about getting more testosterone or more growth hormones its rubbish because as i said i got less libido from doing this fasting diet.

Then this diet says its good to have ur belly make this rombling sounds craving for food just ignore it. So I thought it was good however after i went back to normal eating I all of sudden developed the worst stomach pain ever for days long i was even too much in pain to visit the doctor couldn’t even drive my car.

Doctor visited me gave me special stomach pills and slowly I recovered later I realized I somehow messed up my stomach flora for having it empty for too long.

This my experiences but those book only have positive stuff!!

Strange, the way you describe is how I have always eaten even since a child. Start at 9.00 and end eating at 17:00. Never had a problem. I would not really call it a fast. (some people do i don't see anything special about it).

 

As for having food cravings and hunger, i think most times you restrict food you will have this problem. This time its easier for me I still have hunger at times but not as much as before. 

[Destiny1990]

7 hours ago, robblok said:

Strange, the way you describe is how I have always eaten even since a child. Start at 9.00 and end eating at 17:00. Never had a problem. I would not really call it a fast. (some people do i don't see anything special about it).

 

As for having food cravings and hunger, i think most times you restrict food you will have this problem. This time its easier for me I still have hunger at times but not as much as before. 

Yeah could be just me. Actually my parents doing this too for decades they never breakfast and after dinner they stop to eat. They seem to be fine perhaps its just not for me.

i could consider the light version example only doing the 8/16 3 days a week. I did notice the diet did sharpens my brain function.

[JordanJones]

16 hours is the most I've done. I couldn't last 24 hours. People say it gets easier after a few goes though.

[robblok]

On 3/30/2019 at 4:09 PM, Destiny1990 said:

Yeah could be just me. Actually my parents doing this too for decades they never breakfast and after dinner they stop to eat. They seem to be fine perhaps its just not for me.

i could consider the light version example only doing the 8/16 3 days a week. I did notice the diet did sharpens my brain function.

I can fit 3 meals in my 8 hours, but I have always eaten like this.  I would not say its hard. But maybe if your used to a lot of snacking then its hard. My problem has always been drinking. I don't mean alcohol. But i like some flavor in my drinks. Trying to only take water is hard. Still I am trying.

[VincentRJ]

2 hours ago, JordanJones said:

16 hours is the most I've done. I couldn't last 24 hours. People say it gets easier after a few goes though.

Only 16 hours! That's equivalent to a dinner finished at 6 pm, and a breakfast started at 10 am the next day. That's not much longer than the regular fast that most people do every day. 

 

Of course fasting gets easier with practice. Whatever you do gets easier with practice, whether jogging, cycling, or playing the piano.

 

Start with 16 hours a few times. Progress to 24 hours a few times, then 36 hours a few times, then 48 hours, and so on. Easy peasy! ????

[Destiny1990]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

I can fit 3 meals in my 8 hours, but I have always eaten like this.  I would not say its hard. But maybe if your used to a lot of snacking then its hard. My problem has always been drinking. I don't mean alcohol. But i like some flavor in my drinks. Trying to only take water is hard. Still I am trying.

I took herbal teas sugarless.. i did ate lots in the 8 hours period. I was fine with the 16/8 diet especially  because its so easy to stick with it but as i said it caused physical problems so i ended it.

 

 

Edited March 31, 2019 by Destiny1990

[robblok]

4 minutes ago, Destiny1990 said:

I took herbal teas sugarless.. i did ate lots in the 8 hours period. I was fine with the 16/8 diet especially  because its so easy to stick with it but as i said it caused physical problems so i ended it.

 

 

I am quite pragmatical, if does not work for you like you say quit it.  You made the right choice. 

 

 

[WaveHunter]

I think how we eat is a learned behavior in a lot of ways, and a lot of that learned behavior is not particularly good.  The average Western person eats 3 meals a day out of habit and for social reasons, not based on metabolic need.

 

I think some famous and wise nutritionist once said "you should only eat when you are hungry".  I can't remember who it was, but I think it's real good advise!

 

Personally I usually only have one main meal per day, not necessarily by design but just based on when my appetite kicks in.  I'm only truly hungry around dinner time so that is when I have my one meal of the day.  Truth is, I just don't have an appetite until the end of the day.  So, essentially I pretty much fast 23 hours a day, every day.  I have been eating that way for years and don't feel the least bit deprived in any way whatsoever.  I'm healthy and productive, never feel hungry during the day or lacking in caloric energy at any time.  One meal a day meets all of my basic metabolic needs.

 

Of course when I'm engaged in strenuous physical activity like cycling or a workout in the gym, I make it a point to consume some carbs (fruits) prior to, and during the activity but only enough to offset the added deficit.  I don't measure calories or macronutrients; I just listen to my body to know how much is enough, and it works!

 

I just don't understand how some people claim that they can not function if they miss a single meal, or that they must consume breakfast every morning.  It makes no sense metabolically speaking.  I mean, the food you consumer at dinner time is stored as glycogen and is still with you the next morning when you get up, and it's still with you throughout most of the day, assuming you are not engaging in strenuous activity (i.e.: adding significantly to your basal metabolic rate).  If you are engaged in strenuous activity, you might need an extra few hundred calories or so; not a big meal, just maybe a few pieces of fruit. 

 

Maybe it just takes time for a person to unlearn the "3 square meals per day" mentality that we grew up with.  I think that's why it's not a bad idea for EVERYONE to fast from time to time; just to let you know that your body (and you) will do just fine without constantly shoveling food into it. ???? 

 

It might take a while to break the habit of eating too much due to ingrained habits and social customs since most people have lived with them for a lifetime, but like most habits, you can kick it if you want to, and the thing is...once you let your body determine when you should eat instead of your learned habits, you probably will never have to think about weight loss diets ever again, and you'll be living a happier life.

 

Just my 2 cents worth.

 

Edited March 31, 2019 by WaveHunter

[WaveHunter]

Before anybody jumps on me regarding my previous remark, "...If you are engaged in strenuous activity, you might need an extra few hundred calories or so; not a big meal, just maybe a few pieces of fruit. ..." what I am saying is that even if you are engaged in strenuous athletic activity, you may burn 500-700 calories per hour at the VERY most.  The average person spending an hour in the gym is probably going to burn a few hundred additional calories in total; that's basically an apple and a couple of bananas.  Obviously if you are doing a marathon or climbing to the top of a mountain you will need more ????

 

Edited March 31, 2019 by WaveHunter

[JordanJones]

I get hungry at 8pm. Going 24 hours is not easy. Do you chew gum or something? Hard to build muscle and fast at the same time.

[JordanJones]

6 hours ago, WaveHunter said:

If you are engaged in strenuous activity, you might need an extra few hundred calories or so; not a big meal, just maybe a few pieces of fruit. 

If you are lifting objects all day long you need way more than a few hundred calories. You are going to need an extra 1000 calories.

[VincentRJ]

2 hours ago, JordanJones said:

If you are lifting objects all day long you need way more than a few hundred calories. You are going to need an extra 1000 calories.

If you are a Sumo wrestler you'll probably be taking in as much as 20,000 calories a day. ????

https://www.lingualift.com/blog/what-sumo-eat-wrestlers-diet/

[robblok]

3 hours ago, JordanJones said:

I get hungry at 8pm. Going 24 hours is not easy. Do you chew gum or something? Hard to build muscle and fast at the same time.

For building muscle you need some insulin, that means carbs (everyone knows about protein but forgets about insulin). Also you need a more constant stream of proteins. It has been proven that low carb or fasting is NOT good for gaining muscle. You can keep muscle but for gaining it its nota good thing. 

[robblok]

9 hours ago, WaveHunter said:

I think how we eat is a learned behavior in a lot of ways, and a lot of that learned behavior is not particularly good.  The average Western person eats 3 meals a day out of habit and for social reasons, not based on metabolic need.

 

I think some famous and wise nutritionist once said "you should only eat when you are hungry".  I can't remember who it was, but I think it's real good advise!

 

Personally I usually only have one main meal per day, not necessarily by design but just based on when my appetite kicks in.  I'm only truly hungry around dinner time so that is when I have my one meal of the day.  Truth is, I just don't have an appetite until the end of the day.  So, essentially I pretty much fast 23 hours a day, every day.  I have been eating that way for years and don't feel the least bit deprived in any way whatsoever.  I'm healthy and productive, never feel hungry during the day or lacking in caloric energy at any time.  One meal a day meets all of my basic metabolic needs.

 

Of course when I'm engaged in strenuous physical activity like cycling or a workout in the gym, I make it a point to consume some carbs (fruits) prior to, and during the activity but only enough to offset the added deficit.  I don't measure calories or macronutrients; I just listen to my body to know how much is enough, and it works!

 

I just don't understand how some people claim that they can not function if they miss a single meal, or that they must consume breakfast every morning.  It makes no sense metabolically speaking.  I mean, the food you consumer at dinner time is stored as glycogen and is still with you the next morning when you get up, and it's still with you throughout most of the day, assuming you are not engaging in strenuous activity (i.e.: adding significantly to your basal metabolic rate).  If you are engaged in strenuous activity, you might need an extra few hundred calories or so; not a big meal, just maybe a few pieces of fruit. 

 

Maybe it just takes time for a person to unlearn the "3 square meals per day" mentality that we grew up with.  I think that's why it's not a bad idea for EVERYONE to fast from time to time; just to let you know that your body (and you) will do just fine without constantly shoveling food into it. ???? 

 

It might take a while to break the habit of eating too much due to ingrained habits and social customs since most people have lived with them for a lifetime, but like most habits, you can kick it if you want to, and the thing is...once you let your body determine when you should eat instead of your learned habits, you probably will never have to think about weight loss diets ever again, and you'll be living a happier life.

 

Just my 2 cents worth.

 

There is no problem with 3 meals a day IMHO losing fat on it easy. There is a problem with eating too much. For those of us who do exercise its better to eat multiple times a day to get more proteins to the muscle. Proteins don't store that well so one single meal would not be good. There is no need for eating every few hours like some bodybuilders do (some still seem super lean) but having your protein spread out over a few meals is good. 

 

Also never eat when your not hungry, many nutritionist also say eat before your hunger to not overeat. I tend to agree with it if im real hungry I overeat, if I eat before I am hungry not a problem. However i work with set meals so I always eat something similar so for me it does not really matter. I got a certain amount of food I eat each day and that is it. Hungry or not.

 

People should be able to delay one meal and still exercise its called metabolic flexibility. However I don't like doing it for other reasons.  Its all far more complicated and depends on far more variables then just a few. 

[WaveHunter]

5 hours ago, JordanJones said:

If you are lifting objects all day long you need way more than a few hundred calories. You are going to need an extra 1000 calories.

I added a note in that regard.  The smart way to figure out how many calories you really need per day is to figure out your basal metabolic rate which is pretty easy to do if you google it (BMR: the energy you need just to sustain life), and then compute the added calories you need for your specific physical activities through the day (again easy to find lists that show calories required for various activities; just google calories required for physical activities).  Most people will find that they require far fewer calories than they realize!

 

Naturally if you are very active physically you are going to need more calories than someone who sits at their computer all day, but my point is simply that most people assume they need far more calories than they really need, and they assume that there must be a steady supply of food intake throughout the day.  Both assumptions are why many people are overweight and why they feel the need to go on weight loss diets.

 

When you look at the calories burned for specific types of activity you see that they are far less than many people imagine.  What's more, your body stores consumed calories as glycogen and is available as fuel not just for a few hours but FAR longer.  On a metabolic basis, there is no real need to eat every few hours.  If you are used to eating that way, you may "feel" hungry after a few hours (especially if your diet is unusually high in carbohydrates) but that is learned behavior; it is not your body telling you that you need calories.

 

I think the two main causes of being overweight are 1) people have lost the ability to "listen" to their body's nutritional needs and instead adhere to learned behavior (eating three meals a day, social eating, etc.), and 2) not eating natural foods and instead eating processed foods tat are high in things like high fructose corn syrup (found in almost every processed food these days).  Processed foods with HFCS blunt the body's natural appetite signals

Edited April 1, 2019 by WaveHunter

[WaveHunter]

2 hours ago, robblok said:

There is no problem with 3 meals a day IMHO losing fat on it easy. There is a problem with eating too much. For those of us who do exercise its better to eat multiple times a day to get more proteins to the muscle. Proteins don't store that well so one single meal would not be good. There is no need for eating every few hours like some bodybuilders do (some still seem super lean) but having your protein spread out over a few meals is good. 

 

Also never eat when your not hungry, many nutritionist also say eat before your hunger to not overeat. I tend to agree with it if im real hungry I overeat, if I eat before I am hungry not a problem. However i work with set meals so I always eat something similar so for me it does not really matter. I got a certain amount of food I eat each day and that is it. Hungry or not.

 

People should be able to delay one meal and still exercise its called metabolic flexibility. However I don't like doing it for other reasons.  Its all far more complicated and depends on far more variables then just a few. 

I think most people that are concerned about getting enough protein for high stress activities over-estimate protein needs, and it's due to a lot of heavy marketing by the protein supplement industry. 

 

The rule-of-thumb MDR is 0.8 grams per kilogram of body weight, but a lot of recent research is indicating that may be far too high.  The recommendations of the protein supplement industry are far higher, and simply ridiculous IMHO.

 

Overdoing protein consumption will make you fat because the body treats excess protein the same way it treats excess carbs; they are converted to sugar and stored as body fat.  That is a fact.

 

As for frequency of meals, there's nothing wrong with eating several times a day per se, but IMHO I don't think there is a significant advantage.  I know it's a debatable point, especially concerning protein replacement after strenuous activity where muscles get damaged, but I'm not really so sure that's there's a difference between immediately consuming protein after a workout, and consuming it a few hours later.  I know a lot of trainers insist that consuming protein immediately after a workout is crucial...I don't know the answer so maybe, maybe not.

 

I guess it boils down to personal preference really.  Personally I don't like strenuous aerobic activity on a full stomach, but somebody who does heavy weight lifting might feel differently.

Edited April 1, 2019 by WaveHunter

[robblok]

6 minutes ago, WaveHunter said:

I think most people that are concerned about getting enough protein for high stress activities over-estimate protein needs, and it's due to a lot of heavy marketing by the protein supplement industry. 

 

The rule-of-thumb MDR is 0.8 grams per kilogram of body weight, but a lot of recent research is indicating that may be far too high.  The recommendations of the protein supplement industry are far higher, and simply ridiculous IMHO.

 

Overdoing protein consumption will make you fat because the body treats excess protein the same way it treats excess carbs; they are converted to sugar and stored as body fat.  That is a fact.

Your not getting what I was saying, your body can't handle it when all the protein gets from one meal. It will then not use it for muscle but convert it so it can be burned.  If you get all of your protein from one meal like you do its just sub optimal for building muscle. 

 

I was not arguing how high protein needs are that is a totally different debate and depends on what kind of exercise you do. 

 

And overdoing it on fat or protein or carbs all results in the same thing extra bodyfat.

Edited April 1, 2019 by robblok

[WaveHunter]

5 minutes ago, robblok said:

Your not getting what I was saying, your body can't handle it when all the protein gets from one meal. It will then not use it for muscle but convert it so it can be burned.  If you get all of your protein from one meal like you do its just sub optimal for building muscle. 

 

I was not arguing how high protein needs are that is a totally different debate and depends on what kind of exercise you do. 

 

And overdoing it on fat or protein or carbs all results in the same thing extra bodyfat.

OK...good point ????  That's what I was getting at when I said that excess protein gets stored as fat, so that's a good point.  If you feel the need for a lot of protein in your diet (i.e.: for activities that really break down muscle (i.e.: weightlifting) than spreading protein intake out over several meals would make sense since the body can only assimilate so much protein at a given time before it starts getting converted to sugar.

Edited April 1, 2019 by WaveHunter

[WaveHunter]

I love good debate...that's how you learn ????

 

[robblok]

1 minute ago, WaveHunter said:

OK...good point ????  That's what I was getting at when I said that excess protein gets stored as fat, so that's a good point.  If you feel the need for a lot of protein in your diet (i.e.: for activities that really break down muscle (i.e.: weightlifting) than spreading protein intake out over several meals would make sense.

Yes that was the point, not going to argue about how much protein. That is a totally different debate and depends on if your weightlifting or not. Its been proven that higher levels of protein will give more muscle buildup. How much is good.. no clue I do know that I am higher then 0,8 but under 1,5 per kg of body-weight most of the time. (far lower as what protein sellers want me to use)

 

I am not too obsessed about it, but what i have read is that the body can only handle so much protein at one time for building muscles, the rest get converted like you said. So if you want to make good use of the protein it pays to spread it out a bit. 

 

Though if your on steroids (high levels) your protein syntheses increases too and then again you can use more proteins then normal. 

 

[WaveHunter]

2 minutes ago, robblok said:

Yes that was the point, not going to argue about how much protein. That is a totally different debate and depends on if your weightlifting or not. Its been proven that higher levels of protein will give more muscle buildup. How much is good.. no clue I do know that I am higher then 0,8 but under 1,5 per kg of body-weight most of the time. (far lower as what protein sellers want me to use)

 

I am not too obsessed about it, but what i have read is that the body can only handle so much protein at one time for building muscles, the rest get converted like you said. So if you want to make good use of the protein it pays to spread it out a bit. 

 

Though if your on steroids (high levels) your protein syntheses increases too and then again you can use more proteins then normal. 

 

The "protein sellers" are EVIL ????.  I hate their ads showing some ripped bulky dude flexing his muscles while downing a can of protein drink.  It's so ridiculous, yet they just rake in the cash!

[WaveHunter]

18 minutes ago, robblok said:

...Though if your on steroids (high levels) your protein syntheses increases too and then again you can use more proteins then normal. ...

 

We're off topic now but I've actually wondered about that.  I mean, I know that most steroids do in fact increase protein synthesis but if they do that, could it not stand to reason that you'd need less dietary protein instead of more while using them?  I actually googled to try and get an answer but could not find any information.  Probably not, but still wonder about it.

 

Also...I don't think it has to be "high" levels of steroids.  Oxandrolone, for instance is one of the most mild steroids, and is used in AIDS patients to prevent muscle wasting, and at standard clinical dosages of only 20mg per day protein synthesis is increased markedly.

Edited April 1, 2019 by WaveHunter

[robblok]

4 minutes ago, WaveHunter said:

We're off topic now but I've actually wondered about that.  I mean, I know that most steroids do in fact increase protein synthesis but if they do that, could it not stand to reason that you'd need less dietary protein instead of more while using them?  I actually googled to try and get an answer but could not find any information.  Probably not, but still wonder about it.

 

Also...I don't think it has to be "high" levels of steroids.  Oxandralone, for instance is used in AIDS patients, and at standard low dosages of only 20mg per day increases protein synthesis markedly.

No you need more, it does create the extra protein syntheses from nothing it needs external protein to fulfill the demand of the extra syntheses.

 

Same that weightlifting increases protein syntheses then you need more too. Body can't create the building blocks from nothing. 

 

I read about this a few things and everyone agreed on this one. So if one uses steroids for muscle growth and wants to use it optimal then add protein. The rest get converted and stored as you said but only after what is needed has been taken away. 

 

 

[WaveHunter]

Just now, robblok said:

No you need more, it does create the extra protein syntheses from nothing it needs external protein to fulfill the demand of the extra syntheses.

 

Same that weightlifting increases protein syntheses then you need more too. Body can't create the building blocks from nothing. 

 

I read about this a few things and everyone agreed on this one. So if one uses steroids for muscle growth and wants to use it optimal then add protein. The rest get converted and stored as you said but only after what is needed has been taken away. 

 

 

Makes sense...building blocks.  You can't make something from nothing.  I guess the term "increased muscle synthesis" refers to speed of synthesis...you think??

[robblok]

7 minutes ago, WaveHunter said:

Makes sense...building blocks.  You can't make something from nothing.  I guess the term "increased muscle synthesis" refers to speed of synthesis...you think??

Yes it does speed and amount.

[brokenbone]

i found out by practice the habit vs need of eating,

i used to eat 6-8 meals a day just so i wouldnt

have to face the horror of starvation.

now i know i can make it on 1.5 meals a day and

dont even starve.

still miss the occasional strawberry cake tho,

but on karmic balance when its between fat mf,

sweat diet, or cake deficit, guess the cake just has to go

 

[4MyEgo]

On 8/8/2018 at 5:21 PM, simon43 said:

My 48 hour fast dropped my weight by about 1.5 Kg, which of course is dropping fat from many areas of my body, not just the abs region.

Sounds like a new adventure, one that I couldn't do as I love my food.

 

Why not just reduce your food intake depending on your age 59, weight, height, let's say reduce your daily intake from 2,500 calories per day to 1,500 calories per day over a week, that should see you drop a kilo, then adjust it to 1,900 calories for a week losing another half a kilo, adjust according to how you feel, noting to also only eat 40% carbs, 30% protein and 30% fats, and of course continue doing your cardio and weight training with a day off here and there.

 

I have been doing the above for 4 months, am the same age as you and have lost 8kg, not pushing myself as hard as you say you are, but a black coffee first thing in the morning and onto the treadmill for between a 20 to 40 minute workout burns the stored fat throughout the day.

 

You say you have lost 13 kilos over 18 months, that seems to be a long time for little weight loss in my opinion, you also have to trick your body, pigging out one day per week, also throw in a whey shake after weight training and don't forget to do your squats and planks, they help to strengthen your core.

 

My testosterone level is in the just below normal range for my age 58, i.e. it should be 552, but is 5.08 and I am fine with that as muscle building for me is going well considering my age and testosterone level, you can also purchase over the counter tablets to increase your testosterone levels, so I am told, but don't know how effective they are.

 

I think fasting would be a great way to give your stomach and digestive system a break every now and again, but also believe there are other ways to do it from what you eat, also consuming a lot of water.

 

I am no expert and still in my early stages of losing weight and building muscle, feeling and looking better than I have in 30 years, although a little sore in some muscle areas after a workout, but the whey shake sorts that out I have found, as they say, no pain, no gain.

 

Very interesting topic, cheers

 

 

[WaveHunter]

22 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

My testosterone level is in the just below normal range for my age 58, i.e. it should be 552, but is 5.08 and I am fine with that as muscle building for me is going well considering my age and testosterone level, you can also purchase over the counter tablets to increase your testosterone levels, so I am told, but don't know how effective they are.

Just keep in mind that “normal” levels of testosterone and “optimal” levels can be considered two different things entirely.  Consider this chart:

It shows the Total Testosterone levels of men in the bottom five and ten percentiles as well as the Testosterone levels of the men in the top 95%.  It's based on a general male population cross-sectional study I found.  Naturally, I shoot for the 95th percentile. ????

 

Also note that “testosterone pills” are a scam.  The only effective delivery mode is injectable, or transdermal (though vastly less effective than injectable).

Edited April 1, 2019 by WaveHunter