UK voters should make final Brexit decision if talks with EU collapse: poll

[dunroaming]

So finally Hammond has come out and said it!  Economically the UK would be better off staying in the EU.  The next best option economically would be May's deal (well he would say that wouldn't he) where we would still be worse off but not as much as leaving with no deal. It should be said that Brexit is not just about the economy, it is political too and I guess being worse off financially is a price that many leavers are prepared to accept.

Edited November 28, 2018 by dunroaming

[aright]

9 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

So finally Hammond has come out and said it!  Economically the UK would be better off staying in the EU.  The next best option economically would be May's deal (well he would say that wouldn't he) where would still be worse off but not as much as leaving with no deal. It should be said that Brexit is not just about the economy, it is political too and I guess being worse off financially is a price that many leavers are prepared to accept.

DR I saw the same interview and I don't think you completed Hammond's statement. I paraphrase...…..Economically the UK would be better off staying in the EU but only slightly so, ……….there's not much in it.

That put's a different complexion on it as I saw it.    

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, Orac said:

 

 

She was a remainer.


“She moved abroad – first to Paris, where she worked for an NGO that was responsible for resurrecting Europe’s transport networks (she remains a huge supporter of Europe and calls Brexit ‘a tragedy’).”

https://www.tatler.com/article/baroness-trumpington-interview-2018-retiring-politics



Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

The Paris work was directly after WW2.  More recently, she was against further integration into the EU sinkhole. RIP.

Baroness Trumpington almost always voted against more EU integration

• https://www.theyworkforyou.com/peer/13538/baroness_trumpington/divisions?policy=1065

[AlexRich]

1 hour ago, Orac said:

 

 

She was a remainer.


“She moved abroad – first to Paris, where she worked for an NGO that was responsible for resurrecting Europe’s transport networks (she remains a huge supporter of Europe and calls Brexit ‘a tragedy’).”

https://www.tatler.com/article/baroness-trumpington-interview-2018-retiring-politics



Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

 

How amusing, given the previous comments. The closer the ties the less likely the conflicts ... as a WW2 veteran she’d have understood that.

[AlexRich]

32 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

So finally Hammond has come out and said it!  Economically the UK would be better off staying in the EU.  The next best option economically would be May's deal (well he would say that wouldn't he) where we would still be worse off but not as much as leaving with no deal. It should be said that Brexit is not just about the economy, it is political too and I guess being worse off financially is a price that many leavers are prepared to accept.

And the best way test that theory is to put it to the vote, a vote based on facts as opposed to false promises.

[nontabury]

2 hours ago, Orac said:

 

 

She was a remainer.


“She moved abroad – first to Paris, where she worked for an NGO that was responsible for resurrecting Europe’s transport networks (she remains a huge supporter of Europe and calls Brexit ‘a tragedy’).”

https://www.tatler.com/article/baroness-trumpington-interview-2018-retiring-politics



Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

 

O.K. I’m in a rush,so only had time to quickly scroll down the tatler interview. But where in this article does she say,she’s a huge supporter of Europe,calling Brexit a tragedy.

[dunroaming]

30 minutes ago, aright said:

DR I saw the same interview and I don't think you completed Hammond's statement. I paraphrase...…..Economically the UK would be better off staying in the EU but only slightly so, ……….there's not much in it.

That put's a different complexion on it as I saw it.    

OK let's clarify it a bit more.  What he said was that economically we would only be slightly worse off IF we went with May's deal.  He didn't say that we would only be slightly worse off with any other outcome, obviously he is trying to sell May's deal.  Considering May's deal doesn't deliver the Brexit people voted for it is hardly comforting is it?

[nauseus]

1 minute ago, nontabury said:

O.K. I’m in a rush,so only had time to quickly scroll down the tatler interview. But where in this article does she say,she’s a huge supporter of Europe,calling Brexit a tragedy.

It doesn't. See my post 10414.

[AlexRich]

This thread is about the prospect of a people’s vote, something that most would have thought impossible a few months ago ... with no parliamentary appetite for a no deal cliff exit and little prospect of an EU tweak that gets May’s plan through, it looks like that is where we are heading. How amusing. 

[Jip99]

9 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

This thread is about the prospect of a people’s vote, something that most would have thought impossible a few months ago ... with no parliamentary appetite for a no deal cliff exit and little prospect of an EU tweak that gets May’s plan through, it looks like that is where we are heading. How amusing. 

 

There must be a parliamentary appetite for no deal - the option being offered is May’s deal, or no deal.

[aright]

5 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

OK let's clarify it a bit more.  What he said was that economically we would only be slightly worse off IF we went with May's deal.  He didn't say that we would only be slightly worse off with any other outcome, obviously he is trying to sell May's deal.  Considering May's deal doesn't deliver the Brexit people voted for it is hardly comforting is it?

I agree he did not say that but he did say when questioned that his department had not done an analysis on any other outcome because there is only one deal on the table. I find that neither comforting or uncomforting...…..why would he do any other, than only support Mr's May's preferred option.    

 

[Orac]

18 minutes ago, nontabury said:

O.K. I’m in a rush,so only had time to quickly scroll down the tatler interview. But where in this article does she say,she’s a huge supporter of Europe,calling Brexit a tragedy.

 

It is a direct quote from the article that I cut and pasted - I can hardly read it for you.

[nontabury]

4 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

This thread is about the prospect of a people’s vote, something that most would have thought impossible a few months ago ... with no parliamentary appetite for a no deal cliff exit and little prospect of an EU tweak that gets May’s plan through, it looks like that is where we are heading. How amusing. 

The people’s vote took place in 2016, when the British people  Democratically voted to exit the E.u.  Since that date some remainers who are opposed to Democracy, supported by the establishment owed media, have carried out a campaign to overturn that very same Democratic decision.

 

 

I would like at this stage to apologize to all those remoaners who take offense at my continued reference to Democracy. It’s a failing I have. Once again I APOLOGIZE.

[Orac]

Duplicatr

Edited November 28, 2018 by Orac

[Orac]

Duplicate

Edited November 28, 2018 by Orac
Duplicate

[billd766]

3 hours ago, adammike said:

He hasn't forgotten his roots he did well because he had talent as an artist singer/writer/poet.like many of his generation myself included we left school at 15 with no qualifications, but the children of that generation got to university.The letter was not about him it was about the grandchildren of our generation.you seem to know the price of everything and the value of nothing,while I'm in cliche mode a little knowledge is a dangerous thing sums up more than a few on this thread.condescending c#=:s.

You seem to have summed yourself up very well in your last sentence and joined the motley crew of Remainers who cannot let a post go past without insulting somebody.

 

I also am of that generation who left school at 15 and went straight out to work and one reason I voted to leave was because of my grandchildren in the UK.

[mommysboy]

SNAFU.  

 

It isn't going to happen, but it would be much better if Brexit was knocked on the head.  Nobody is going to get what they want, and we will all be the poorer.

 

Maybe the subject is best revisited in 10 years time.

 

 

Edited November 28, 2018 by mommysboy

[AlexRich]

53 minutes ago, Jip99 said:

 

There must be a parliamentary appetite for no deal - the option being offered is May’s deal, or no deal.

Today. Watch how the ground moves after the deal is rejected, and Corbyn fails to get his election.

[AlexRich]

26 minutes ago, billd766 said:

You seem to have summed yourself up very well in your last sentence and joined the motley crew of Remainers who cannot let a post go past without insulting somebody.

 

I also am of that generation who left school at 15 and went straight out to work and one reason I voted to leave was because of my grandchildren in the UK.

You don’t like your grandchildren? 

[AlexRich]

55 minutes ago, nontabury said:

The people’s vote took place in 2016, when the British people  Democratically voted to exit the E.u.  Since that date some remainers who are opposed to Democracy, supported by the establishment owed media, have carried out a campaign to overturn that very same Democratic decision.

 

 

I would like at this stage to apologize to all those remoaners who take offense at my continued reference to Democracy. It’s a failing I have. Once again I APOLOGIZE.

Democracy is a never ending process, not a stopped clock, and this country is entitled to vote on the facts. A referendum decision can be overturned by another vote, indeed, it is the only democratic way of doing so. If someone voted leave no one is stopping them from voting for a no deal Brexit. 

 

I think we we are heading for a soft Brexit, May’s deal or another, or no Brexit at all. I can live with both.

[AlexRich]

55 minutes ago, nontabury said:

The people’s vote took place in 2016, when the British people  Democratically voted to exit the E.u.  Since that date some remainers who are opposed to Democracy, supported by the establishment owed media, have carried out a campaign to overturn that very same Democratic decision.

 

 

I would like at this stage to apologize to all those remoaners who take offense at my continued reference to Democracy. It’s a failing I have. Once again I APOLOGIZE.

Democracy is a never ending process, not a stopped clock, and this country is entitled to vote on the facts. A referendum decision can be overturned by another vote, indeed, it is the only democratic way of doing so. If someone voted leave no one is stopping them from voting for a no deal Brexit. 

 

I think we we are heading for a soft Brexit, May’s deal or another, or no Brexit at all. I can live with both.

[AlexRich]

55 minutes ago, nontabury said:

The people’s vote took place in 2016, when the British people  Democratically voted to exit the E.u.  Since that date some remainers who are opposed to Democracy, supported by the establishment owed media, have carried out a campaign to overturn that very same Democratic decision.

 

 

I would like at this stage to apologize to all those remoaners who take offense at my continued reference to Democracy. It’s a failing I have. Once again I APOLOGIZE.

Democracy is a never ending process, not a stopped clock, and this country is entitled to vote on the facts. A referendum decision can be overturned by another vote, indeed, it is the only democratic way of doing so. If someone voted leave no one is stopping them from voting for a no deal Brexit. 

 

I think we we are heading for a soft Brexit, May’s deal or another, or no Brexit at all. I can live with both.

[AlexRich]

So good I said it thrice.

[nauseus]

2 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

So good I said it thrice.

Like nag nag nag?

[bomber]

52 minutes ago, billd766 said:

You seem to have summed yourself up very well in your last sentence and joined the motley crew of Remainers who cannot let a post go past without insulting somebody.

 

I also am of that generation who left school at 15 and went straight out to work and one reason I voted to leave was because of my grandchildren in the UK.

but will your grandchildren be happy picking tatty's ?

[dunroaming]

1 hour ago, aright said:

I agree he did not say that but he did say when questioned that his department had not done an analysis on any other outcome because there is only one deal on the table. I find that neither comforting or uncomforting...…..why would he do any other, than only support Mr's May's preferred option.    

 

Precisely but he has also said that today that any deal will leave us worse off compared with staying in.  But this is not news because it was always accepted that we would be economically worse off after Brexit.

[Grouse]

7 hours ago, CanterbrigianBangkoker said:

...and clearly a neurotic old softy, who's sold out - completing the transformation from working class Manc lad to pro-globalist champagne socialist. Pretty quick to forget his working class routes - and of course the reasons for people, in a position once similar to his own, to vote the way they did, in both Lab and Cons constituencies. He's simply aiding and abetting the biased MSM, then rightfully admonishing May (not Tory voters), but simultaneously sneering at over half of his compatriots for precisely nothing. 

The Rochdale Cowboy I always correct.

 

You can not blame him that so many are moronic. 

 

I can't imagine Harding sneering at anything apart from a Yorkshire black puddin'puffin'

[beautifulthailand99]

41 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

Democracy is a never ending process, not a stopped clock, and this country is entitled to vote on the facts. A referendum decision can be overturned by another vote, indeed, it is the only democratic way of doing so. If someone voted leave no one is stopping them from voting for a no deal Brexit. 

 

I think we we are heading for a soft Brexit, May’s deal or another, or no Brexit at all. I can live with both.

No Brexit please and no more referendums please - enough is enough. 

[vogie]

1 minute ago, Grouse said:

The Rochdale Cowboy I always correct.

 

You can not blame him that so many are moronic. 

 

I can't imagine Harding sneering at anything apart from a Yorkshire black puddin'puffin'

Mike Harding can be quoted as saying that his "only regret that I wasn't born a Yorkshireman" But that probably can be said about most people.

[SheungWan]

22 hours ago, vogie said:

Do we still get our Norwegian Christmas tree if we leave with a no deal melvin.

Norway not in EU.