Passport Seized Overstay

[imcagr]

7 minutes ago, BestB said:

Actually no, cops were very nice, so was the court This is just how Thai legal system works

I have no idea what happens if you hide passport, but i am guessing would be sitting in the cells until either you die or they find it, as without your passport they can not proceed to file any charges or take you to court or deport you, so cells it is

 

Yes but not having my passport my "case" could become a useless problem for the, so could it be a bigger chance that they accept some cash and let me go (of course in case of petty crime, not if I killed a monk ?).

 

 

[BestB]

Just now, imcagr said:

 

Yes but not having my passport my "case" could become a useless problem for the, so could it be a bigger chance that they accept some cash and let me go (of course in case of petty crime, not if I killed a monk ?).

 

 

Yes, however you may find any cash settlements are done prior to reaching police station. 

 

Once in police station and paperwork began, if cash settlement was to be reached it would be with many zero's ?

[imcagr]

1 minute ago, BestB said:

Yes, however you may find any cash settlements are done prior to reaching police station. 

 

Once in police station and paperwork began, if cash settlement was to be reached it would be with many zero's ?

 

Thank you, good to know !

If you don't mind saying, here on PM, can I know why you were not able to clear this case this way ? It's always interesting to know when it is not possible to pay our way out...

 

 

 

 

[BestB]

Just now, imcagr said:

 

Thank you, good to know !

If you don't mind saying, here on PM, can I know why you were not able to clear this case this way ? It's always interesting to know when it is not possible to pay our way out...

 

 

 

 

They were not interested because case came from Tourist police, so lots of paperwork was already done.

 

Tourist police were not interested at all (later in private they hinted that they worry about Bangkok checking or coming down on them)

 

Saying that, RTP, while could not drop it, were very "helpful" to make it smoother for a small donation

 

Also papers sent to court were very nicely worded, because of the donation, so the bond was about 1/3 of what it should have been

[Ks45672]

15 minutes ago, imcagr said:

 

 

Sorry but did you do something so bad that they wanted to F your life or you just met the worst MTF at the cops kennel ?!

 

And then they just gave up and didn't make more problems ?

 

So crazy that this kind of things can happen. If caught for anything I will try to hide my passport as long as possible, and only after being sure that they won't let me go for a brown enveloppe, I will give them my passport. What is the worst that can happen if I don't give my passport, they will keep me in a cell until I give it ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

They have a right to ask your identity and I think normally you will have to call someone to bring your passport to the station 

 

They have never not accepted alternative id from me but if they insisted on original passport the obligation is likely on me to produce it

 

 

[imcagr]

7 minutes ago, Ks45672 said:

They have a right to ask your identity and I think normally you will have to call someone to bring your passport to the station 

 

They have never not accepted alternative id from me but if they insisted on original passport the obligation is likely on me to produce it

 

 

 

ok, but if I show them that I have a valid passport and a visa on my phone, is it really worth the hassle to find my passport or would it be easier to get a donation and let me go faster... ?

 

 

 

[Ks45672]

There was a thread here a couple of month back people might remember 

 

 Euro guy iirc with his face covered in tattoos was asked on the street for id and he said its back at the condo, the police accompanied him back to get it and found a few oz of  weed there so he's probably in jail now..... 

 

[imcagr]

Just now, Ks45672 said:

There was a thread here a couple of month back people might remember 

 

 Euro guy iirc with his face covered in tattoos was asked on the street for id and he said its back at the condo, the police accompanied him back to get it and found a few oz of  weed there so he's probably in jail now..... 

 

 

Oh really, so sad for the guy, but anyway people are not jailed for weed in Thailand anymore it seems.

If I was the guy I would not have showed to any cop where I live and anyway they have to right to go inside a private home.

 

 

 

[BestB]

2 minutes ago, Ks45672 said:

There was a thread here a couple of month back people might remember 

 

 Euro guy iirc with his face covered in tattoos was asked on the street for id and he said its back at the condo, the police accompanied him back to get it and found a few oz of  weed there so he's probably in jail now..... 

 

2 different cases . One is if you asked by police to show passport and another if you arrested 

[Ks45672]

13 minutes ago, BestB said:

2 different cases . One is if you asked by police to show passport and another if you arrested 

Yes, granted its a different case but whether arrested or just randomly detained, I  have to prove my identity to satisfy the police officer, even thais are supposed to carry an Id

 

Heres the gentleman I was referring to :

 

[BestB]

1 minute ago, Ks45672 said:

Yes, granted its a different case but whether arrested or just randomly detained, I  have to prove my identity to satisfy the police officer, even thais are supposed to carry an Id

 

Heres the gentleman I was referring to :

 

Sorry I did not mean it in that way.

 

what I meant was, if jusy randomly stopped and asked for passport or caught up in the middle of raid , copy or a photo may well be acceptable . However if arrested to be charged, then they want original passport.

 

so say, driving through a check point, copy be fine but caught drink driving and taken to station , only original 

[The manic]

54 minutes ago, imcagr said:

 

Oh really, so sad for the guy, but anyway people are not jailed for weed in Thailand anymore it seems.

If I was the guy I would not have showed to any cop where I live and anyway they have to right to go inside a private home.

 

 

 

Anymore!? In the old days it was much more relaxed. Now the anti drug laws are more strictly enforced and reinforced with searches and urine tests.

[Tchooptip]

6 hours ago, thurien said:

 

those who made you minus your passport will heftily hinder you to rush anywhere...

5555 you are a funny man,  ? really  555 (again)...

but OP never said he was not free... you do not care about OP but just tried to make people laugh, sorry OK I understand 

[NCC1701A]

1 hour ago, imcagr said:

but anyway people are not jailed for weed in Thailand anymore it seems.

is this correct? you mean arrested but not jailed? or go to court and fine only?

[imcagr]

3 minutes ago, NCC1701A said:

is this correct? you mean arrested but not jailed? or go to court and fine only?

 

For sure the fine is usually less than 5000 when someone is caught with some weed.

Only cops want more, but if you are not in hurry it seems that you do not have to give them what they want ?

 

 

[Ks45672]

14 minutes ago, BestB said:

Sorry I did not mean it in that way.

 

what I meant was, if jusy randomly stopped and asked for passport or caught up in the middle of raid , copy or a photo may well be acceptable . However if arrested to be charged, then they want original passport.

 

so say, driving through a check point, copy be fine but caught drink driving and taken to station , only original 

My Only experience  is been arrested once  after a fight in the mid 2000's and all I had on me was a Thai licence and an atm card

 

Spent a night in the cells and we had to sort it out in the morning

 

They asked me to pay 5k for a window that got broken in the chaos, we haggled and they agreed on 2500  because I think they believed  me but someone still had to pay for the owners window ? 

 

Maybe it's not the same in every station but the police were polite and professional, more than I expected 

 

Before anything formal one  brought me outside for coffee and a smoke and asked what happened, how long you been in Thai, you married etc etc

 

I didn't  get tortured, electrocuted or beaten up like  some of the stories that you read so nothing exciting happened

 

After the paperwork was done , I was allowed to go out to the atm and  get cash and they didn't even bother to come with me..... 

 

Finally Left the station on a handshake and good terms so relatively lucky.... ? 

 

 

 

[mstevens]

12 hours ago, manchega said:

if very sticky situation the borders are porous laos cambodia burma

then go to embassy for emergency travel documents

And when you go to exit the country you entered illegally as there is no record in their computer system of you entering, you're going to have a big problem!

 

The problem is not so much exiting one country, but getting stamped in / entered in to the computer system of the next country so you can leave that country i.e. fly out from the airport without any issues.

Edited September 17, 2018 by mstevens

[Skeptic7]

18 hours ago, Just Weird said:

I don't believe that to be the case.  Why should they be if the overstay is beyond their control?   

You're making a huge error assuming logic and reason apply to anything here. While certainly most everyone would agree with your thinking...the reality is that T-his I-s T-hailand. Besides, if UJ says so...can pretty much take dat to the bank. 

Edited September 18, 2018 by Skeptic7

[Aroyaroy]

Get a lawyer to (a) ask police to permit you to travel and/ or extend your visa (b) document your case and reason you are overstayed so you have evidence to give immigration after your case is complete.

 

Should cost THB 5-10k.

[Scouse123]

22 hours ago, JackThompson said:

The police are not going to check the OP's passport's permitted-stay date, and initiate an extension on his behalf. 

Immigration in the future are not going to say, "Oh well, we see now that you had a court date, so will forgive your not applying for an extension in the past." 

It would be nice if either of the above 2 scenarios were realistic, but they aren't.  The OP must actively pursue obtaining an extension based on an ongoing court-case. 

 

 

Absolutely spot on!!   and I know because fell foul of this many years ago once!

 

I even went to Bangkok to complain and they said I had had ample time to go and explain my situation to immigration.

 

They didn't care that nobody had not informed me and the onus was on me to find out the workings of Thai immigration and the law.

[Scouse123]

14 hours ago, BestB said:

All depends what is happening with OP. Thai legal system works in a funny way.

 

I was in this kind of situation, had to go to court, court made a ruling, i had to pay bond and check back with court every week for 6 weeks. While this was happening, police held on to my passport.

 

Once i did my "time" court released me from any obligations and provided court paper, saying all complete.

 

Police still refused to return passport, i went back to court, court advised police has no reason to hold your passport BUT court can not do anything about that., but i can fill out a complaint form in police station

 

Went back to police, captain who was holding my passport, advised that matter is not finished yet and he is sending the case to prosecutors office for further actions.

 

Weird? you could say, considering i had already been to court and matter was closed,

 

So he supposedly sent the case to prosecutors office  and i have not heard anything from anyone since.

 

Each time i needed my passport to renew visa, captain gave it back to me providing i left a human deposit, ie person to stay in police station until i returned,

 

After having to borrow passport 5-6 times, he did not ask for human deposit and i do not know if forgot or whatever the reason, passport stayed with me.

 

 

BestB,

 

I agree with you partly as I too, many moons ago,(the year 2001) had a similar situation. I accept their procedures may have changed.

 

The only reason this differs to me is that it doesn't seem like this guys case is in the court yet.

 

When I had a court case, I had to leave my passport at the court, then when I was due to extend, an immigration officer was allocated, it ended up being the same one all the time. He would go to the court with me, take the passport, do the immigration paperwork, and return it to the court until the next time.

 

The onus was always on me to remember to go to immigration at the time it was due to expire.

 

However, this guys case is still at the police station, not the court or seems to be from what he is saying.

 

I have read your situation as well, and both cases strike me as a bit ' odd '  that the police can just hold your passport like this. I know those bastards are a law unto themselves.

 

Did they give you an official receipt? and did you consult a lawyer as to the legality of them doing this?

[ArranP]

I will fly to Kuala Lumpar to get Non-O and pay the overstay at the airport, should be no more than 7 - 14 days.

 

Anyone see a problem with that ?

[Scouse123]

2 minutes ago, ArranP said:

I will fly to Kuala Lumpar to get Non-O and pay the overstay at the airport, should be no more than 7 - 14 days.

 

Anyone see a problem with that ?

 

None,

 

If you have your passport back from the police station and no charges have been brought.

 

Once the case is in the courts, if it ends up there,  you need court permission and a letter from them to present to immigration as well.

[Just Weird]

20 hours ago, Ks45672 said:

At the time I was in the icu in a coma so yes (bedridden) , close to dead, full of morphine and not too worried about visa tbh.... ?

It was  months later I discharged myself against medical advice and tried to go sort out the visa with a letter from one of the Drs who did the surgeries that kept me alive 

Sorry to hear about your situation but thanks for confirming that, by definition, at the time you went to Immigration you weren't bedridden which was my point.

 

As I and some others have said, you cannot sort out an overstay with a retrospective doctor's letter, there is no provision for that.  

[ubonjoe]

7 minutes ago, ArranP said:

I will fly to Kuala Lumpar to get Non-O and pay the overstay at the airport, should be no more than 7 - 14 days.

No problem to leave from an airport.

If you mean applying for a non-o visa while you are there that might not happen. For one based upon marriage they want to see 400k baht in the bank.

Or do you mean a new 90 day entry from a multiple entry non-o visa.

 

[Just Weird]

19 hours ago, Suradit69 said:

If he isn't incarcerated, why would he be unable to go to an immigration office to explain the situation?  The passport may be out of his control but he could at least report to immigrations. Presumably he has some paperwork/receipt from the police.

What would be the point of going to Immigration to explain when he hasn't got his passport?  Do you think that he would get an extension stamped into...stamped into what?  But it's academic really because if someone is in the position as he described it he would not be liable for the overstay.

[Just Weird]

14 hours ago, imcagr said:

 

So we are clearly explaining you that you are wrong, but you keep arguing ? For which reason ? At the end you will still be wrong !

Why will I still be wrong?  Because you said so?

[Just Weird]

5 hours ago, Skeptic7 said:

You're making a huge error assuming logic and reason apply to anything here. While certainly most everyone would agree with your thinking...the reality is that T-his I-s T-hailand. Besides, if UJ says so...can pretty much take dat to the bank. 

Yes, I know and respect the scope of UJ's knowledge but that does not mean that every word he says is gospel or that he is infallible.  I happen to know that my assertion is fact.

[ubonjoe]

1 minute ago, Just Weird said:

I happen to know that my assertion is fact.

Show some proof of it. 

Immigration has no authority to waive a overstay or the fine for one. Try finding it here Immigration Act B.E. 2522 English translation .

[Scouse123]

11 minutes ago, Just Weird said:

Why will I still be wrong?  Because you said so?

 

No, not because imcagr said so.

 

You are wrong because that is not how the system works but you refuse to accept it and keep trying to apply western logic.

 

This is one of those times where the Thai police all stand by their positions in whichever branch of the police they are in.

 

The local police may have the passport but are not interested in his immigration status. The onus is all on him.

 

It is up to him to get the name of the officer who has the passport, his phone number, and any receipt or documents and take them to immigration and explain if this is not cleared he will go into overstay. That is the way forward and preferably with a Thai who holds some respect or a Thai lawyer, both to gain clarity and as a witness.

 

And the reason I know ' my assertion is fact '  is because I have been there, read the book and seen the film in 2001 with the Immigration authorities both in Pattaya and Bangkok.

Edited September 18, 2018 by Scouse123