UK govt petitioned to reinstate proof of income letters for British expats in Thailand

[DILLIGAD]

I don't think so, even female prisoners who on their release have nowhere to stay are given a tent ! You're on your own if, like me, you've burnt your bridges, Hyde park in winter can be very cold [emoji25]

And even more dangerous thanks to a useless Mayor.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[blackhorse]

A couple of questions.  Does anyone know how many foreigners in Thailand are here on a retirement visa?
 
How many British are here on a retirement visa?
 
How many British use the income letter for their retirement visa?
 
Are any of these numbers big enough to generate a response from the British Embassy or Thai Immigration?  If the numbers are too small do they even care?

From another thread it was stated by the embassy that they processed 3000 letters a year. Not very many so it's no wonder there hasn't been more protests if that number is to be believed

[steve73]

I know a couple of Brits who rely solely on the UK state pension of 155GBP/wk, (around 28,000 bt per month), but keep the 800k in their account, only because they have been unable to get the required letter.    They have a pretty good way of life on that income - certainly not great, but much better than they could hope for in the UK without needing to sponge with additional benefits.

They realize that without keeping this cash buffer, they would not be able to remain here legally, and it does provide some emergency funds if required.

But they understand, without medical insurance (that would probably cost almost their entire state pension, even if they could find somewhere to get it) that one major medical emergency would probably exhaust this buffer, and they would have to return to the UK.

I'm sure many other Brits are in a similar position, and perhaps other nationalities who have made use of their embassy's "flexible" income proof requirements.

Low spending retirees doesn't make them "bad guys".

[Thaidream]

1 hour ago, sandyf said:

it is certainly not up to you to say what they should do or not do. They will do what they consider necessary to make processing extensions more reliable without increasing the workload.

It's not up to any of us to determine Thai Imm policy but most of the time- Foreign embassies and Imm work together in a co-operative way to solve issues. I will simply say that the current Imm Act of 1979 and the current Police Order- provides an income methodology for retirement/marriage  extension other than a lump sum in a Thai Bank. The income stream is monthly recognizing that some people do not have lump sums but have adequate income.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[soalbundy]

2 minutes ago, steve73 said:

I know a couple of Brits who rely solely on the UK state pension of 155GBP/wk, (around 28,000 bt per month), but keep the 800k in their account, only because they have been unable to get the required letter.    They have a pretty good way of life on that income - certainly not great, but much better than they could hope for in the UK without needing to sponge with additional benefits.

They realize that without keeping this cash buffer, they would not be able to remain here legally, and it does provide some emergency funds if required.

But they understand, without medical insurance (that would probably cost almost their entire state pension, even if they could find somewhere to get it) that one major medical emergency would probably exhaust this buffer, and they would have to return to the UK.

I'm sure many other Brits are in a similar position, and perhaps other nationalities who have made use of their embassy's "flexible" income proof requirements.

Low spending retirees doesn't make them "bad guys".

Indeed, my biggest expense apart from my step daughters university fees is health insurance for me and my family, it is considerable even though it is a Thai insurance, my healthy 11 year old son costs 24,000 Baht a year, mine is 68,000, wife, 28,000 step daughter 25,000, in the case of a medical procedure I have to pay up front and wait 4 months to be reimbursed, of course dentistry is not covered, school fees for the 'free' school system, land tax etc before we can eat, you need a good income in Thailand if you aren't single, 65,000 Baht would barely cover it.

[BONGOMAN]

I am an American and take exception to your Consulant making announcements for mine. This is a very bad decision and sets an unwanted series of actions in motion. I am here on a retirement Visa which I can generally extend for one year two times, but this requires an income verification letter here in Thailand. Without this I will now have to travel back to the US as I preffer not to deposit large sums of money in Thailand.

[Scouse123]

4 hours ago, salavan said:

Why should the British government do anything to help their subjects especially the much hated non residents

What a stupid, irrational sweeping statement!

 

Grow up.

[sandyf]

3 hours ago, Thaidream said:

It's not up to any of us to determine Thai Imm policy

But you tried to  -  "That is the job of the Imm Dept. " 

[sandyf]

3 hours ago, soalbundy said:

you need a good income in Thailand if you aren't single, 65,000 Baht would barely cover it.

Bit of a narrow minded view.

We have our own home and no dependent children so we can live reasonably well on under 30K a month. Lifestyle has quite a significant bearing on matters.

[sandyf]

4 hours ago, salavan said:

Why should the British government do anything to help their subjects especially the much hated non residents

People should remember that there is no more hostile environment to 'foreigners' than the UK.

Maybe you can remind us what a Thai national would be required to produce in order to remain in the UK year in year out without working.

[ginjag]

6 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Bit of a narrow minded view.

We have our own home and no dependent children so we can live reasonably well on under 30K a month. Lifestyle has quite a significant bearing on matters.

Agree,  I am single, 3 bed bungalow  6,500 baht month,  True vision/ wi fi 2,500 baht month,  Electric water 1,000 baht a month,    shopping at Tesco and local market for food,  home cooked,    I live on well under 20k,   (I not smoke or drink)   2 dogs  3 cats,  very happy, no Thai family begging.  

[soalbundy]

26 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Bit of a narrow minded view.

We have our own home and no dependent children so we can live reasonably well on under 30K a month. Lifestyle has quite a significant bearing on matters.

I can't afford a lifestyle. Just a small example of what happens but with different scenario's, never is there a month without some sort of bill, this month I have to make a partial payment for fertilizer, 25,000 Baht, then a last payment for this year on my health insurance, 28,000 Baht (it's 68,000 a year but I pay in installments) 8,000 Baht for food, 2,000 for petrol, 10,000 Baht as partial reparations for an accident that my estranged wife caused (2.5 million Baht in all) I live with the mother of my son. I'm now by 75,000, OK I have that. Next month the car has to be repaired, air-con and oxygen sensor, cost, I don't know, the bike needs a new exhaust,8,000 Baht, my youngest step daughter is taking extra tutorials to enter a military collage, she wants an officers patent in the navy, 4,000 Baht a month, just as my oldest step daughter has finished university (cost me a packet) I also have to talk to my dentist about an implant. It's swings and roundabouts, some can get by on little others not so much.

[David Walden]

9 hours ago, Wullie Mercer said:

Put this to the British Government instead of the issuing of letters which is a no go, this will also end up a no go. But will keep you busy while waiting for your flight home to reap the rewards waiting for you there.

Your logic is quite brilliant.  The same thing applies in Aus, but we are dealing with politicians now.  If your an Australian and live in Thailand they reduce your pension by about 8% stop your medical entitlement, the Govt. saves about $10,000 on medical costs per aged pensioner each year, almost free medicine and a whole lot of other things like free public transport, subsidised dental services.   In W.A. country pensioners get $600 of free petrol or taxi services as we don't get the big benefits of free public transport as in Perth, free driving licences, 50% discount of car registration fees reduced dog registration fees or big subsidies for public housing for pensioner who don't have a home of their own.  The list goes on but yes we are dealing with politicians now who spend on average 80% of their time trying to get re-elected.  They don't have time to listen to farangs in Thailand.  They would save much money by inviting us stay overseas with a modest reward but no, again we are dealing with politicians...Ahhh and this not Thailand....  Australian pensioner Farangs living in Thailand are saving the Govt a lot of money.

[blackhorse]

Agree,  I am single, 3 bed bungalow  6,500 baht month,  True vision/ wi fi 2,500 baht month,  Electric water 1,000 baht a month,    shopping at Tesco and local market for food,  home cooked,    I live on well under 20k,   (I not smoke or drink)   2 dogs  3 cats,  very happy, no Thai family begging.  

Why rent a 3 bedder?

[soalbundy]

6 minutes ago, blackhorse said:

58 minutes ago, ginjag said:

Agree,  I am single, 3 bed bungalow  6,500 baht month,  True vision/ wi fi 2,500 baht month,  Electric water 1,000 baht a month,    shopping at Tesco and local market for food,  home cooked,    I live on well under 20k,   (I not smoke or drink)   2 dogs  3 cats,  very happy, no Thai family begging.  

Why rent a 3 bedder?

park the two exhausted hookers

[David Walden]

10 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

park the two exhausted hookers

Give the man a break...park the girls in the other 2 bedrooms?  What's the world coming to.

[fullcave]

Why did they stop the service? 

[sambum]

44 minutes ago, fullcave said:

Why did they stop the service? 

Go back to Page 1!

 

[Baerboxer]

On 10/12/2018 at 11:48 AM, darksidedog said:

No great surprise there. Do very little and comment about the shrinking services even less.

In the meanwhile expats can apparently sink or swim on their own.

 

The consular section, operated by the Home Office, have been quietly outsourcing, stopping or trying to discourage use of their previous services for some time.

 

The Embassy section, operated by the Foreign Office, and who have local supervisory control, couldn't give a toss about most British citizens here. There brief is business, trade and representing Britain's foreign policy. 

 

As the consular section slowly disappears so will any interest in normal British citizens. Only the very wealthy, connected, "useful" ones will be patronized.

 

 

[sambum]

"I have  outlined my top three priorities in Thailand, which are about promoting a free and open society; building stronger  partnerships for mutual prosperity; and providing top-notch consular and embassy services to all who avail of them.”

 

Excerpt from a speech given by the British Ambassador to Thailand H.E. Brian Davidson on 07 September 2017.

 

Does anybody else have a feeling of porkies being spouted?

[The manic]

On 10/12/2018 at 8:58 AM, prakhonchai nick said:

 

I think you are correct there George. Minimum 6 months in the UK or no state pension payable -only those in the system will continue to receive.  And doubtful the UK will give more than a couple of years notice.

Wrong about needing 6 months in UK to receive pension. Maybe to receive increases.

[steve73]

"I think you are correct there George. Minimum 6 months in the UK or no state pension payable -only those in the system will continue to receive.  And doubtful the UK will give more than a couple of years notice."

 

I left the UK at age 47 to work overseas for a year or two, and then decided to remain in T/L as "retired".

As a result I have not accumulated enough years of NI to receive a full state pension, although I could voluntarily contribute an additional 9 years worth (a little under 9kGBP in total) to give me a full pension. 

Since I am still 9 years from reaching state retirement age, there is a high probability that by the time I get there they will have introduced some other "need to have lived in the UK for 2 years" rules like Australia now require, and so I have decided not to waste any more "good money after bad" that I can invest elsewhere. 

Don't be so sure that the UK will not consider ANY new rules to reduce their obligation to former tax/NI payers.

 

 

[CharlieH]

troll comment removed

[theoldgit]

If my wife wishes to visit the UK, and probably Schengen again from next year, amongst other things, she has to prove that her trip is affordable, this would usually be in the form of proof of her/my income and bank statements.

Whilst there isn’t a required amount required to prove affordability for a visit visa, there is a set amount of income or savings required in the unlikely event we were to relocate to the UK.

In both cases it’s her/us that need to supply the financial evidence directly to the UKVI, who will assess it, they don’t require that her evidence is authenticated by the Thai authorities.

I agree with Sandy that it’s up to the Thai authorities to decide what evidence they require, though apart from the insistence of various Immigration offices/officers, of having such a letter to add to their wad of papers, over the years I’ve often wondered why the evidence I’ve submitted every year, State and Civil Service Pensions, needs a letter from my Embassy to confirm they’ve seen them, for the most part individual IO’s I’ve dealt with have seemed more than capable of confirming my pension letters make my application compliant, of course some submitted evidence may be less straightforward.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[gunderhill]

On 10/13/2018 at 5:03 PM, soalbundy said:

park the two exhausted hookers

step up your game my man!

[theoldgit]

  The consular section, operated by the Home Office, have been quietly outsourcing, stopping or trying to discourage use of their previous services for some time.

The Consular Section is part of the FCO function, not the Home Office, the Home Office only have responsibility for the, significantly reduced, UKVI team.

The FCO do represent the UK’s foreign policy but not business and trade, that’s the remit of the Department of International Trade.

 

 

 

 

 

[sambum]

2 hours ago, fullcave said:

No need to wet your panties, mate. It was a simple question. If you don't care to answer then bugger off. 

 

No, I think you will have to do that. 

 

[Scott]

Inflammatory posts and replies removed.

 

[William C F Pierce]

On 10/12/2018 at 7:26 AM, prakhonchai nick said:

Forget the petitions. Look at the reasoning behind the decision.

 

Immigration require irrevokable proof that the foreigner does receive the income that is stated on the letter. The British Embassy are not able to provide that proof.

 

It is NOT the Embassies fault.

 

It is quite easy to fabricate a document for submission the the Embassy showing you are in receipt of £xxx, which is not true and it is highly likely this has been done on many occasions, giving rise to Immigration requiring proof rather than just a letter certifying the information given to them.

 

 

In this day and age, you would think the Embassy had access to the Government online services that contained the income details of the individual concerned. Not a lot of time involved via an Individuals NI number. A standard letter format from the Embassy would be recognised as standard for any applicant by the authorities.

[evadgib]

15 hours ago, William C F Pierce said:

In this day and age, you would think the Embassy had access to the Government online services that contained the income details of the individual concerned. Not a lot of time involved via an Individuals NI number. A standard letter format from the Embassy would be recognised as standard for any applicant by the authorities.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/guide-to-the-general-data-protection-regulation