Diving accident: British backpacker is stuck in a hospital in Thailand unless she raises £60,000 to fly home

[KneeDeep]

18 minutes ago, hobobo said:

I couldn't find anywhere in the story that she dived into a hotel swimming pool. A couple of photos in the original article show her with friends at some rock-pools near a waterfall. I am not defending the insurance company at all, it is merely to state that rock pools are not of uniform depth.

 

Agreed. I saw no mention of hotel swimming pool. So quite likely a rock pool.

[scubascuba3]

 

 

 

 

That is just nonsense.

 

It's actually quite a good policy. The fact is that any good policy needs to have sensible exclusions or people would just take the mick.

 

I use Insure & Go and I read the fine print. Nothing dodgy within. 

 

There likely is more to this story. There appears to be no mention of an appeal and if successful whether monies will be returned.

 

Perhaps because she came up against a very obvious exclusion that won't play too well to the GoFundMe crowd. Who knows? Perhaps we'll know more later.

 

You say you've read the fine print, how could they not cover her diving into a swimming pool? Scuba diving will be covered, swimming will be covered. Unlikely to be drunk daytime doing open water training.

 

Personally i think some insurance companies deny the claim, what have they got to lose except rare bad publicity like this one

 

[KneeDeep]

35 minutes ago, Dick Crank said:

You never want to insure with a small place like http://www.insureandgo.com a big claim can put places like this out of business. Go with large reputable companies like Allstate.

 

Many of them have fine print that excludes just about every common claim, maybe leaving open some valid but not too common claimable situations.

 

for example, any alcohol (excluded), speeding (excluded), illness happened after accident (excluded) etc etc. even on covered situations the coverage is open to interpretation that can be skewed each way depending on how they want to go.

 

Insure & Go are not a "small place". Why would you post such nonsense without first checking the facts?

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mapfre

 

Quote

MAPFRE posts revenues of 27.98 billion euros for 2017, up 3.3 percent, with earnings topping 700 million euros

 

https://noticias.mapfre.com/en/mapfre-revenues-2798-billion-topping-700-million/

 

 

You are just making it up as you go along.

[KneeDeep]

9 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

 

 

 

 

 

You say you've read the fine print, how could they not cover her diving into a swimming pool? Scuba diving will be covered, swimming will be covered. Unlikely to be drunk daytime doing open water training.

 

Personally i think some insurance companies deny the claim, what have they got to lose except rare bad publicity like this one

 

 

 

Because likely it wasn't a hotel swimming pool......

As I stated, there is likely more to the story than published.

Scuba Diving only if qualified unless you purchase the extra premium.

 

There may be dodgy insurance companies out there, I wouldn't say that Insure and Go are one of them. They certainly are not perfect, but I would say that there is more to the story.

Edited December 14, 2018 by KneeDeep

[chainarong]

This matter if correct needs to be raised in the Commons , Place this Insurance company into the headlines and embarrass, the bad publicity will bring them back to earth with a thud, diving into a pool is a reckless act so is walking down Piccadilly. 

[Kadilo]

Used Insureandgo before and they tucked me up as well......long story but at the time they were a relatively new company from my area and all looked good. Turned out they were a bunch of Cowboys. Never again. 

 

Its because of companies like these so many choose rightly or wrongly not to bother as it gives the whole industry a bad name. 

[KneeDeep]

9 minutes ago, chainarong said:

This matter if correct needs to be raised in the Commons , Place this Insurance company into the headlines and embarrass, the bad publicity will bring them back to earth with a thud, diving into a pool is a reckless act so is walking down Piccadilly. 

 

Nonsense. Perhaps you should re-read before making such ludicrous statements. 

As aforementioned, this may not be a hotel style swimming pool. So calm down and wait for the facts.

[KneeDeep]

11 minutes ago, Kadilo said:

Used Insureandgo before and they tucked me up as well......long story but at the time they were a relatively new company from my area and all looked good. Turned out they were a bunch of Cowboys. Never again. 

 

Its because of companies like these so many choose rightly or wrongly not to bother as it gives the whole industry a bad name. 

 

Tell us about it. 

[gerritkaew]

why so many people from the UK have problems with insurance when traveling somewhere??

[KneeDeep]

4 minutes ago, gerritkaew said:

why so many people from the UK have problems with insurance when traveling somewhere??

 

They don't read the T&C.....

[KneeDeep]

13 minutes ago, Donaldo said:

Well, it certainly looks like this girl got a bad deal in every respect. I looked up the review on the insurer "Insure and Go", and was appalled at the companies feedback. I actually read some of the comments. This is a company that should be put out of business asap. You always get the odd one off unsatisfied customer, but this sounds like an outright scam company.

 

Sorry, but just more knee jerk nonsense.

 

https://www.trustpilot.com/review/insureandgo.com seems to show a high percentage of Excellent and Great reviews.

 

 

That didn't stop you from posting ludicrous statements.

 

[KneeDeep]

I would argue that we have the best and most reasonably priced travel insurance in the world.

There are a plethora of providers out there, so it pays to peruse the T&C.

I simply do not agree that Insure and Go are one of the baddies. 

 

I slipped on some wet stairs ten years ago and they paid out for everything concerned without a quibble. Similarly made a claim recently and whilst there was some terrible communication problems between all parties concerned, they covered everything and paid compensation for the inconvenience suffered.

 

So I have actual experience, as opposed to just knee jerk reactions to half stories that lead to GoFundMe pages.

[scubascuba3]

 
 
Because likely it wasn't a hotel swimming pool......
As I stated, there is likely more to the story than published.
Scuba Diving only if qualified unless you purchase the extra premium.
 
There may be dodgy insurance companies out there, I wouldn't say that Insure and Go are one of them. They certainly are not perfect, but I would say that there is more to the story.

The story says swimming pool. With scuba diving you don't have to be qualified but you have to be with a qualified instructor.

Basically she could have just been swimming and dived in. Scuba diving is a red herring. No one dives in head first with scuba gear

[scubascuba3]

 
Sorry, but just more knee jerk nonsense.
 
https://www.trustpilot.com/review/insureandgo.com seems to show a high percentage of Excellent and Great reviews.
 
 
That didn't stop you from posting ludicrous statements.
 

Don't fall for that trustpilot nonsense. They ask for reviews as soon as you've purchased at a point where everyone is happy and most give 5*. Try filtering on those that claim and you will see a low star rating, most likely 1* to 3*. Report back

[mommysboy]

1 hour ago, steve73 said:

Sorry, I'm going to have to disagree with you here.

I would consider diving head first into a pool without first checking the depth is reckless (even if others are doing the same).  Lack of a sign is no excuse... but even if she saw depth markers (showing, say 2m), then an incorrectly performed dive could still result in a head or spinal injury.

When it's dark it can be very difficult to correctly asses the depth of a pool.  How many times have you seen "No Diving" signs around a kiddies paddling pool for, example... but at night it may be difficult to determine whether the pool is 0.5m or 1.5m.

To me, diving into an unknown pool without first checking the depth (and knowing that you are trained & capable of performing a flat dive), would be the same as crossing a busy road with looking in either direction.

This was very much a case of a holiday recreational activity- very low risk- that went awfully wrong.

 

You give an example of someone crossing the road without care. As far as I'm aware that person would still be covered because it was not an intentionally reckless and the same goes with this young lady.

[KneeDeep]

3 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

 

 

The story says swimming pool. With scuba diving you don't have to be qualified but you have to be with a qualified instructor.

Basically she could have just been swimming and dived in. Scuba diving is a red herring. No one dives in head first with scuba gear

 

 

 

You see? Even you aren't paying attention to the small print. Swimming pool can still mean Rock-pool and all of the pictures indicate a rock pool.

 

Secondly, the Insurance T&C states Qualified. You would have known that if you checked the policy document. You can be unqualified if you take the extra premium.

 

That's the issue here, that people don't peruse the T&C until they actually need the insurance. Then they complain when it doesn't do what they want it to do.

They imagine that because they deigned to actually purchase insurance in the first place, that it should automatically cover them for everything.

 

I don't blame the girl at all. Just a horrible accident. The insurer has the discretion to show good will or perhaps a complaint to the Ombudsman will be successful.

 

But this silly blaming of the insurance company is bordering on unthinking childishness.

 

Perhaps something got lost in translation with the investigator on site. We don't know all of the facts. But 'reckless' sounds like a rock pool as opposed to a hotel swimming pool.

 

 

 

 

[Joe Mcseismic]

2 hours ago, Orton Rd said:

Never engage in wreckless activity in a third world country, I never even drive here, never been in the sea, never been on a motorbike and never had protection free sex. You could not pay me to go in a swimming pool here, dive or bungee jump. If people want to do it up to them, but don't start moaning when it goes tits up please, pay for yourself.

What an interesting and exciting life you must lead.........

[KneeDeep]

3 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

 

 

The story says swimming pool. With scuba diving you don't have to be qualified but you have to be with a qualified instructor.

Basically she could have just been swimming and dived in. Scuba diving is a red herring. No one dives in head first with scuba gear

 

 

 

You see? Even you aren't paying attention to the small print. Swimming pool can still mean Rock-pool and all of the pictures indicate a rock pool.

 

Secondly, the Insurance T&C states Qualified. You would have known that if you checked the policy document. You can be unqualified if you take the extra premium.

 

That's the issue here, that people don't peruse the T&C until they actually need the insurance. Then they complain when it doesn't do what they want it to do.

They imagine that because they deigned to actually purchase insurance in the first place, that it should automatically cover them for everything.

 

I don't blame the girl at all. Just a horrible accident. The insurer has the discretion to show good will or perhaps a complaint to the Ombudsman will be successful.

 

But this silly blaming of the insurance company is bordering on unthinking childishness.

 

Perhaps something got lost in translation with the investigator on site. We don't know all of the facts. But 'reckless' sounds like a rock pool as opposed to a hotel swimming pool.

 

 

 

 

[VBF]

I haven't read every post here, and I'm NOT an apologist for Insurance companies, NOR am I connected with any, other than as a customer, BUT I use the same company (Insure and Go) and this year, in Pattaya, I got ear infections, probably from a swimming pool but will never know for sure.

 

On the recommendation of a Thai friend, i went to a local clinic who gave me the meds to sort it all out satisfactorily  - total cost approx 2000 Baht for which I got receipts. On my return to UK I claimed it from I&G and it was paid in full about 6 weeks later. (I have a "no excess" endorsement on my policy)

 

They have, in the past, paid out when I was forced to rush back to UK on the death of my Mother.

 

The ONLY reason I mention this is to put the other side of the story to balance the negative comments about insurance companies.  

Edited December 14, 2018 by VBF

[mommysboy]

1 hour ago, hobobo said:

I couldn't find anywhere in the story that she dived into a hotel swimming pool. A couple of photos in the original article show her with friends at some rock-pools near a waterfall. I am not defending the insurance company at all, it is merely to state that rock pools are not of uniform depth.

I wondered about that too, but assumed it was a swimming pool and that the photos were taken on another day.

 

Update Edit: https://inews.co.uk/news/backpacker-gofundme-broken-neck-thailand-stranded-pay-60000-fly-back-to-uk/

 

'Sophie Wilson had always dreamt of travelling the world – but was injured just a week into her trip after she dived into a swimming pool and misjudged its depth.'

 

 

Edited December 14, 2018 by mommysboy

[KneeDeep]

17 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

This was very much a case of a holiday recreational activity- very low risk- that went awfully wrong.

 

You give an example of someone crossing the road without care. As far as I'm aware that person would still be covered because it was not an intentionally reckless and the same goes with this young lady.

 

That's because you are utilising a singular interpretation of swimming pool.

 

....and you would be wrong with the road crossing. If one was drunk(and therefore negligent) one perhaps would not be covered either.

 

Insurance isn't just there to save idiots from themselves.

 

On the other hand, she does state that other people did the dive safely, so assume it would be safe for her.

 

So perhaps there are grounds for appeal, if there is not still more to the story.

[mommysboy]

14 minutes ago, KneeDeep said:

 

 

You see? Even you aren't paying attention to the small print. Swimming pool can still mean Rock-pool and all of the pictures indicate a rock pool.

 

Secondly, the Insurance T&C states Qualified. You would have known that if you checked the policy document. You can be unqualified if you take the extra premium.

 

That's the issue here, that people don't peruse the T&C until they actually need the insurance. Then they complain when it doesn't do what they want it to do.

They imagine that because they deigned to actually purchase insurance in the first place, that it should automatically cover them for everything.

 

I don't blame the girl at all. Just a horrible accident. The insurer has the discretion to show good will or perhaps a complaint to the Ombudsman will be successful.

 

But this silly blaming of the insurance company is bordering on unthinking childishness.

 

Perhaps something got lost in translation with the investigator on site. We don't know all of the facts. But 'reckless' sounds like a rock pool as opposed to a hotel swimming pool.

 

 

 

 

'Swimming pool can still mean Rock-pool'

 

Eh!

 

A pool could mean any small, enclosed body of water.

 

A swimming pool surely means a pool designed for swimming in.

 

A rock pool also means what it says.

 

 

[mommysboy]

1 minute ago, KneeDeep said:

 

That's because you are utilising a singular interpretation of swimming pool.

 

....and you would be wrong with the road crossing. If one was drunk(and therefore negligent) one perhaps would not be covered either.

 

Insurance isn't just there to save idiots from themselves.

 

On the other hand, she does state that other people did the dive safely, so assume it would be safe for her.

 

So perhaps there are grounds for appeal, if there is not still more to the story.

I didn't say anything about being drunk, neither did you.

 

I would suggest that 99% of normal people when reading the term swimming pool will picture a man made structure at a hotel or sports centre that is rectangular in shape, filled with water, and with its walls painted in aqua blue.

 

Accidents by their very nature result often from error of judgement or lack of due care. They occur in every day activities because people are doing every day things and may be relaxing.

[KneeDeep]

2 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

'Swimming pool can still mean Rock-pool'

 

Eh!

 

A pool could mean any small, enclosed body of water.

 

A swimming pool surely means a pool designed for swimming in.

 

A rock pool also means what it says.

 

 

 

What are you going on about?

You can swim in a rock pool. Many people do so and dive into them from a height. If you can swim in it, you can call it a pool for swimming.

If it were in England, you might expect that they would use the exact terminology, But it isn't England, so they used what they used. 

Remember that this is an article leading to a GoFundMe page, so don't expect critical reporting.

Chances are it wasn't a hotel swimming pool, as none of them in Pai will have high diving boards.

[mommysboy]

2 minutes ago, KneeDeep said:

 

What are you going on about?

You can swim in a rock pool. Many people do so and dive into them from a height. If you can swim in it, you can call it a pool for swimming.

If it were in England, you might expect that they would use the exact terminology, But it isn't England, so they used what they used. 

Remember that this is an article leading to a GoFundMe page, so don't expect critical reporting.

Chances are it wasn't a hotel swimming pool, as none of them in Pai will have high diving boards.

What am I going on about?

 

That a swimming pool is a specific structure and appeared in the news report.

 

Well this :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swimming_pool

[GroveHillWanderer]

20 minutes ago, KneeDeep said:

Swimming pool can still mean Rock-pool and all of the pictures indicate a rock pool.

The Oxford English dictionary definition says that a swimming pool is "an artificial structure for swimming in." All the other dictionaries I can find also indicate some kind of man-made structure built for swimming. There is the term 'water pool' which can mean either a natural or a man-made pool but I have never heard of a naturally-occurring rock pool being referred to as a swimming pool.

 

Yes, there are pictures of the person in question standing on rocks near what appear to be a couple of different waterfalls and one picture shows what might be rock pool (though it might just be part of the stream) but there is no suggestion that this is where the accident occurred.

[KneeDeep]

9 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

Clause says "Scuba diving (qualified, max 30 metres) under 14 days (see Note 1 above)" 

That is very poor insurance cover, i wouldn't use Insure and Go. Scuba diving is a red herring anyway, she had no scuba gear on and it was a swimming pool. So basically should be treated as swimming and not diving. I think she'd win in a court case

 

You also didn't respond about your tripadvisor guff, falling for those ratings is schoolboy error

 

 

 

 

 

Respond? I haven't seen anything to which I need to respond. 

 

TripAdvisor? I don't know anything about TripAdvisor. Perhaps you have got yourself confused.

 

As to the cover, again I would disagree. The cover is adequate for the normal traveller. For £20 more for a year, an unqualified person will be covered.

 

Show me a better consumer policy. InsureandGo offer a decent product. I know because I am actually insured with them and have been for many years.

So I don't need to depend on external reviews and dodgy half stories leading to GoFundMe appeals.

[KneeDeep]

19 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

I didn't say anything about being drunk, neither did you.

 

I would suggest that 99% of normal people when reading the term swimming pool will picture a man made structure at a hotel or sports centre that is rectangular in shape, filled with water, and with its walls painted in aqua blue.

 

Accidents by their very nature result often from error of judgement or lack of due care. They occur in every day activities because people are doing every day things and may be relaxing.

 

Do you swallow everything you read hook line and sinker?

It might be a rectangular swimming pool or it might not. There may have been a 'no diving' sign or there might not. 

 

Walking across the road negligently can include being drunk.

Bored of your semantics. There is a reason why the insurance company has rejected the claim and you are not privy to it.

So rather than trying to apportion blame, why not wait for more facts?

 

I do business with the insurance company involved, so I have some experience. The only connection you have is from an article in the 'i'. So let's give it a rest for now, eh?

 

 

[KneeDeep]

1 hour ago, scubascuba3 said:

1 hour ago, KneeDeep said:

 
Sorry, but just more knee jerk nonsense.
 
https://www.trustpilot.com/review/insureandgo.com seems to show a high percentage of Excellent and Great reviews.
 
 
That didn't stop you from posting ludicrous statements.
 

Don't fall for that trustpilot nonsense. They ask for reviews as soon as you've purchased at a point where everyone is happy and most give 5*. Try filtering on those that claim and you will see a low star rating, most likely 1* to 3*. Report back

 

Your figures are simply made up. That is all there is to it.

 

 

 

[scubascuba3]

 
Your figures are simply made up. That is all there is to it.
 
 
 

You've not even looked so you have no idea. You've fallen for the ratings, simple as that. Check the ratings relating to claims and report back