Update: New Thai immigration rules for income!

[ParadiseLost]

40 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Of course you can. It is for you to live on not to stay in a bank.

This is the benefit as opposed to 'seeding' for 4 months in the case of marriage extensions. (Three months prior and one month under consideration).

[SooKee]

 

One of the things that may end up being interesting about this is it seems the different Thai banks tend to have different code references that they use, and print out in their Thai bank books, to reflect an incoming international funds transfer. And, there are quite a large number of different Thai banks that extension applicants might be using to receive their funds.

 

I kind of wonder if the Immigration officers are going to end up knowing and being able to recognize just what are and aren't the acceptable transaction codes in the various banks' bank books.  Or, in a simpler world, are they just going to look for a history of 40K or 65K monthly deposits into your Thai bank account, and not obsess over the details of those deposits.

 

 

I wouldn't be at all surprised if they did just that. They can either make the job harder for themselves or easier. Easy would be statement - check, 12 X 65k plus deposits (or MAYBE Total tx / 12) - check. Done. Next.

 

WRT TransferWise, given that Kasikorn (not sure about other banks) is now using a descriptive code that includes the word international I'd be very surprised if TI will look beyond that.[mention=55970]Pib[/mention] made the point that they won't be interested in documents that don't come from a Thai bank. Insofar as statements are concerned that'd be right, if they want any further clarification though they can examine whatever they want, just as in some cases they have asked to see proof of income source beyond the embassy letters. Nothing to say any of what they might consider has to come from Thailand, indeed, it most likely wouldn't.

 

The issue of changing banking relationships is the main reason I won't be running after a BKK Bank account, at least not yet. Relationships change (as they did with HSBC when customers started getting hit with excessive intermediary fees). Be just my luck to have them change target bank after trawling round to open an account with BKK.

 

 

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[jmcet]

11 hours ago, onera1961 said:

It seems they take it from ATMs.

So what about an ATM withdrawal and subsequent deposit to Thai bank account and produce the ATM receipts (220 Baht fee) and as a backup a copy of bank statement showing the ATM transaction? Also thousands of Baht per month with foreign based credit cards? Just saying.

I know on one extension using embassy letter I was questioned as to how I supported myself and produced ATM receipts. All was good.

I will ask on my next 90 day at the end of the month...

[mlmcleod]

I am afraid that they will sell ice cream in Hell before I transfer my retirement funds to a Thai bank every month.  I have completely free checking now and my bank picks up all the ATM charges  regardless of where I withdraw my cash.

[ParadiseLost]

9 minutes ago, crazyk said:

thai wife or gf who's trying to fxxk you to death

Haha I thought that's why they were here!

[zydeco]

19 minutes ago, Danthai said:

Why worry about that. That's normal. I get two government pensions, both paid on different days. One end of month. SS 3rd of month. Doubt immigration will even care or be that picky. 

Because their paperwork says every month, according to earlier posters. Two deposits in August and zero in September is not every month. Yes, it's normal for those of us receiving US SS. But explain it to some paperwork bound Thai Immigration officer.

[ParadiseLost]

1 hour ago, eggers said:

If this report is correct, why does Thai Immigration make something that is relatively simple, complicated??? Why??  

The simple approach would be to say, have to show have an ANNUAL income of at least 780,000Bht..(65,000 x 12)

Simple!!  

That way, how often the pension payment is transferred is irrelevant!!

Surely, the important thing is to show have sufficient income to support yourself: not how often it's paid!! 

But, no, the bureaucrats have to complicate the matter!! 

In fact they do have a simple alternative - you can move 800k into your account here over 9 months. If you live on less, next year you only have to move the shortfall - over 9 months again.

Edited January 5, 2019 by ParadiseLost

[Lovethailandelite]

Just now, zydeco said:

Because their paperwork says every month, according to earlier posters. Two deposits in August and zero in September is not every month. Yes, it's normal for those of us receiving US SS. But explain it to some paperwork bound Thai Immigration officer.

Perhaps your I/O will be sympathetic.....Perhaps they won't. The system was never going to take in to account personal circumstances.

[zydeco]

1 minute ago, Lovethailandelite said:

Perhaps your I/O will be sympathetic.....Perhaps they won't. The system was never going to take in to account personal circumstances.

This isn't personal circumstances. It is for everyone relying on the monthly income transfer from US Social Security. Everyone last year receiving direct deposit into Bangkok Bank got two in August and zero in September.  Not just me.

[Jim7777]

41 minutes ago, david555 said:

I can not make your economy's …,but with a more than medium pension I would say that with 1 temporary extension your way , it would be easy to get enough for further ext based on married to Thai at 400 k , so more simple same as ret ext  on the 800 K 

Only the combination method is amputated as now the complementary monthly sum must be proven during the past year ,.... as before only with the letter it was like a credit line as money coming in future period ...that is gone as that was my reserve plan B m for sudden fin. problems

I'm sorry but I don't quite understand what you mean here I'm just having trouble understanding the way you write.  In my situation I'm retired military on a monthly pension based on retirement and permanent disability so I make almost $5,000 U.S. Dollars a month total between $4 and 5 thousand a month so I do really really well here financially being retired.  I'm retired but I'm on a marriage visa because I'm younger than 50 and my wife is a Thai citizen originally.  I have a lot of savings in the states but I'm not going to transfer more than $2 or $3 thousand dollars a month into my Thai bank account because you never know how the currency exchange will fluctuate.  From month to month I'll either gain or lose a little bit because of the exchange rate fluctuations, a little bit because I only transfer $2 or $3 thousand dollars a month on a MONTHLY BASIS I definitely wouldn't want to use the lump sum option.  In my situation I make a pretty large monthly pension paid in monthly payments for the rest of my life plus survivors benefits for my wife if anything ever happens to me.  So in my situation the monthly income option is best and it's really easy to prove even without that income affidavit.  In fact knowing what I know now I'm actually glad the income affidavits are going away because it's going to save me a trip to the embassy in Bangkok every year which is a long drive for me and a lot of us.  Instead I just go visit my local Bangkok bank branch once a month the day after my monthly wire transfers post to my account and just get the credit advice print out which proves where my wire transfers originated.  

 

Here's how I explained it to Joe and this should simply it:

 

It's super easy with Bangkok bank just get a credit advice print out from them every single month throughout the year after your monthly wire transfers post to your Bangkok bank account.  That's what I've started doing last month and I just got one for this month printed out yesterday in fact I just make sure that I get those print outs from Bangkok bank once a month the day after my monthly wire transfer posts to my Bangkok bank account.  

 

Trust me the credit advice print out verifies everything you need perfectly, your name, account numbers for both your bank in the states and your local Thai bank account, the amount of the wire transfer, and even the name of your bank in the states where your wire transfer originated.  That credit advice print out every month should be perfect for proving that your wire transfer originated from your home bank in the states or wherever abroad.  

 

Although my guess is that immigration will probably want to see that in some sort of formal letter from the bank but at least we know that information is on record at Bangkok bank and regardless I'm still gonna continue to have them printed out at Bangkok bank every month at least for my own personal records.  If immigration asks me for something else from my local bank in 2020 then I'll get whatever they want but for now I really think the credit advice print out every month looks perfect as far as verifying everything that immigration will require regarding monthly income verification.  I already got my current extension for 2019 till February 2020 so now I'm just trying to make sure that I'm prepared for January 2020 when I do it again.  Or maybe I'll do it early again next year in late December 2019 if they'll let me do early again next year.    

 

Obviously everyone is different but for me the monthly income option works best.  

[Danthai]

I think the immigration officers are smart enough and have seen enough pensions data to know they are often paid on different dates for the upcoming month. Worry when you apply. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 hours ago, SooKee said:

all that is up until the most recent one, done at the end of last month.  That one shows up as 'International Trade and Factoring Centre' and shows a transaction ID.

 

I gather, you're talking about how the most recent transfer was listed on your bank statement.  Out of curiosity, how was that latest transaction coded in your recipient Thai bank book, as that's presumably what Immigration is going to be looking at first and predominantly?

 

[sometimewoodworker]

19 hours ago, jackdd said:

19 hours ago, GinBoy2 said:

Now it's official

It's not official (yet), currently it's only hearsay

Maybe semi official.

 

SWMBO said in a short call the documents under are probably what has been discussed.

Not being a Thai reader I don't know and didn't have enough time to get the details.

 

[zydeco]

4 minutes ago, Danthai said:

Worry when you apply

You mean when it's too late to do anything about it, because the alternative 800K locked up for three months period option is gone and you have a couple of weeks to pack everything up and get out of the country? Sorry, it is precisely these sorts of details that are important. Otherwise, retirement extensions are going to be a lottery based on the desk you are sent to.

[sfokevin]

54 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

One of the things that may end up being interesting about this is it seems the different Thai banks tend to have different code references that they use, and print out in their Thai bank books, to reflect an incoming international funds transfer. And, there are quite a large number of different Thai banks that extension applicants might be using to receive their funds.

 

I kind of wonder if the Immigration officers are going to end up knowing and being able to recognize just what are and aren't the acceptable transaction codes in the various banks' bank books

My bet is that the Thai banks will come up with a letter (similar to the 800k letter) that summarizes the foreign monies transferred in in the last 12 months...

 

Of course there will be a fee for this ????

Edited January 5, 2019 by sfokevin

[Spidey]

2 minutes ago, zydeco said:

You mean when it's too late to do anything about it, because the alternative 800K locked up for three months period option is gone and you have a couple of weeks to pack everything up and get out of the country? Sorry, it is precisely these sorts of details that are important. Otherwise, retirement extensions are going to be a lottery based on the desk you are sent to.

Exactly the reason that I will be going down the 800k baht in a Thai bank account route this year. Whatever evidence you provide, too easy for an individual IO to reject your extension application.

 

And then you're snookered!

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

 

1 hour ago, TPI said:

I don't think it matters where the money comes from just so long as it appears in your account!

 

The preliminary indications are that Thai Immigration is going to want to see the 40K or 65K monthly xfers coming from OUTSIDE Thailand for those not working in Thailand.  But to what extent they're going to police that and just what kinds of bank coding will and won't be accepted remains unknown for now.

 

[Spidey]

1 minute ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

 

The preliminary indications are that Thai Immigration is going to want to see the 40K or 65K monthly xfers coming from OUTSIDE Thailand for those not working in Thailand.  But to what extent they're going to police that and just what kinds of bank coding will and won't be accepted remains unknown for now.

 

I suspect that, at the end of the day and from previous experience, that will be interpreted by different offices differently and by individual IOs differently. 

 

In future, applying for your visa extension will be like playing the casino.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 hours ago, Jim7777 said:

But anyway the answer to your question is get a credit advice print out from your Thai bank every month and it totally verifies where your wire transfer originated from, the amount, account numbers of both your home bank account and your Thai bank account, your name as long as the transfer was made under your name, and even the name of your bank in the states or wherever your home bank is.

 

Whether any given Thai Immigration officer, after looking at your Thai bank book, is also going to want to wade thru a pile of a dozen monthly bank credit advice letters with the details of one's various transfers is a question that remains unknown for now.

 

I think the best that can be said right now is, bank credit letters MIGHT end up being useful and accepted by Immigration. But I'd say it's equally possible that they won't be interested in looking at such things and will make their determination solely on what they see in one's Thai bank book.

 

The only truth is right now, no one really knows. And I think it would be wrong, at this point, to promise that bank credit letters are going to be a sure solution to the various problems arising here.

 

Edited January 5, 2019 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 hour ago, eggers said:

If this report is correct, why does Thai Immigration make something that is relatively simple, complicated??? Why??  

The simple approach would be to say, have to show have an ANNUAL income of at least 780,000Bht..(65,000 x 12)

Simple!!  

That way, how often the pension payment is transferred is irrelevant!!

Surely, the important thing is to show have sufficient income to support yourself: not how often it's paid!! 

But, no, the bureaucrats have to complicate the matter!! 

 

It's because they want to keep their jack boot hard on your (and our) necks.... Isn't that obvious by now?

 

[sfokevin]

1 hour ago, Jim7777 said:

It's super easy with Bangkok bank just get a credit advice print out from them every single month throughout the year after your monthly wire transfers post to your

Presently my funds transferred from my US brokerage account thru BK Banks NY Branch shows up on my statement saying “International Transfer”... BK Bank will issue a formal statement of account activity for 200 baht showing all activity including these transfers... the one glitch is that BK Bank transaction history seems to be 6 months (My Kasikorn account seems to have the same 6 month limit)... My branch officer said a full year could be ordered and comes from the main office on Bangkok and takes several days... My guess is that they will hopefully move to a 12 month history...

 

Edited January 5, 2019 by sfokevin

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

37 minutes ago, jmcet said:

So what about an ATM withdrawal and subsequent deposit to Thai bank account and produce the ATM receipts (220 Baht fee) and as a backup a copy of bank statement showing the ATM transaction? Also thousands of Baht per month with foreign based credit cards? Just saying.

I know on one extension using embassy letter I was questioned as to how I supported myself and produced ATM receipts. All was good.

I will ask on my next 90 day at the end of the month...

 

I think it would be great if Immigration would accept ATM withdrawal receipts for monthly income. But I seriously doubt that's going to end up being allowed.  Especially since at least on my ATM receipts printed out here in Thailand, there's no indication whatsoever of exactly where the funding account is located, only an account number.

[ukrules]

20 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

The preliminary indications are that Thai Immigration is going to want to see the 40K or 65K monthly xfers coming from OUTSIDE Thailand for those not working in Thailand.  But to what extent they're going to police that and just what kinds of bank coding will and won't be accepted remains unknown for now.

Is there anything, anywhere that says the income must come from outside Thailand ?

 

I'm going to be very surprised if this is the case.

[ParadiseLost]

19 minutes ago, Spidey said:

In future, applying for your visa extension will be like playing the casino.

Beg to differ - I have won at casinos before.

 

More akin to Russian Roulette I think.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

22 minutes ago, sfokevin said:

My bet is that the Thai banks will come up with a letter (similar to the 800k letter) that summarizes the foreign monies transferred in in the last 12 months...

 

Of course there will be a fee for this ????

 

They might, but I don't think that's part of their standard written repertoire right now, fee or no fee.

 

Account balance letter, yes.  Yearlong summary detailing source of 12 monthly fund transfers, not yet....

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

18 minutes ago, Spidey said:

I suspect that, at the end of the day and from previous experience, that will be interpreted by different offices differently and by individual IOs differently. 

 

In future, applying for your visa extension will be like playing the casino.

 

I'm afraid it's entirely possible your prediction will end up coming true, at least at various Immigration offices around the country, when it comes to acceptance of monthly bank transfers.

 

Consistency is NOT their forte!

[elviajero]

2 hours ago, TPI said:

I don't think it matters where the money comes from just so long as it appears in your account!

I does matter. It’s meant to be foreign income. That has always been the situation, but because the embassy letters/affidavits didn’t specify the source of income some people could get away with declaring any income source.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

5 minutes ago, ukrules said:

Is there anything, anywhere that says the income must come from outside Thailand ?

 

I'm going to be very surprised if this is the case.

 

That's what the OP here says, along with various subsequent postings relating to the supposed DRAFT Immigration order that's in the works (but not yet made public or official). The outside Thailand part, obviously, only applying to those who are NOT working in Thailand and able to document their Thai income via local tax returns. Such as anyone on a retirement extension presumably, where employment is not allowed.

 

Quote

In the future you will have to show 65,000 b going into a Thai bank account each and every month from your home country.

 

[wobalt]

If married go for the visa way problems solved


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[btw65]

What about people on marriage extension who have their pension paid into an overseas Bank fortnightly.  Which means some months are less than the necessary 40,000 monthly and others are more.